Population Decline and Low Birth Rates

[JohnDB]

No, I do not think so, married Christian couples should be encouraged from a biblical perspective to have children..

People can be taught about what God intended a marriage to be from a biblical perspective without laying on guilt.

If they feel guilty then maybe it is because they are not aligned with God's purpose for marriage.

If a Christian couple is hesitant to get married because it's too expensive...they are not going to necessarily have children.
Just the way things are.

If I thought that I was going to lose half or all of my income to marriage penalty taxes/loss of benefits....I would not be getting married or even entertaining thoughts of dating.

It's as simple as that.

 

[MsMediator]

Because of several things that you are NOT addressing.
Legacy descended people tend to understand how to function in a society in ways that are not obvious and how the environment of working and living should be. Something that immigrants do not understand.

Immigrants tend to behave in the manner and customs from the country they left (which was impoverished, war torn, and ruled by petty tyrants)

Live births are a way to overcome the immigrants that move here.

Wages, polite society, and understanding how the systems work and what is available to people are all becoming degraded by this rampant immigration. Not in a direct manner but in an indirect manner as often low skill jobs are way below the poverty line in wages and actually accepted by everyone as "that's just what they pay". But these low skill, low wage "jobs" are actually a result of immigrant ideals being actualized.

On top of this....
There currently exists a marriage penalty in our society and a fear of having children during our economic uncertain future. We all love children as long as we can afford them. Having children that you can't afford is viewed as "hell on earth" with such things as child support and unreasonable daycare costs.

We have an increasing scale for taxes....where a married couple will pay more taxes at higher rates due to having two incomes...again making children dependents viewed as too expensive to have despite the tax deductions/credits they provide.

If you receive government benefits....being married can greatly reduce or eliminate these benefits...and if a divorce happens then you must go through the two year process to re-apply for benefits again. Meanwhile you get to live in homeless shelters or under a bridge somewhere.

Marriage and children are just extremely expensive anymore. A three bedroom apartment shared between three incomes is easy...but between two incomes with extra expenses of daycare, diapers, formula, doctors and clothes....it's very scary.

What are legacy descended people?

 

[MsMediator]

I'm going to stir the pot a little.

Unless a couple can live on one income, they should not have children. IMHO, every child deserves a stay at home mother, and two parents.

There are not enough men who can provide this high income for all the women. This won't work unless men and women are kept separate and then women/girls are then arranged to marry older men when the men are finally able to support a family. However a lot of people live paycheck-to-paycheck nowadays.

 

[tourist]

Why do many Christians care about population decline and low birth rate? The world is eventually going to end (also in a bad way). I understand people caring about the state of the world, such as morality, war, crime, etc and trying to improve those issues. However, caring too much about population decline, to the point of bashing the unmarried/singles/those without children seems wrong. I think it also shows lack of faith in God. Thoughts?

My thoughts are in agreement with your thoughts in this regard.

 

[MsMediator]

Live births are a way to overcome the immigrants that move here.

Not a good reason to have kids.

 

[tourist]

why on earth would married believers trash their brothers and sisters for being single??

you're right, it shows a lack of faith that God knows what He's doing in their lives.

i just want to mention it takes a great deal of faith in God to have children, especially in this day. i'm very thankful for my kiddos making me a nana.

I bet that all of the grandchildren love Nana.

 

[tourist]

What are legacy descended people?

Native American Indians perhaps.

 

[HeIsHere]

If a Christian couple is hesitant to get married because it's too expensive...they are not going to necessarily have children.
Just the way things are.

If I thought that I was going to lose half or all of my income to marriage penalty taxes/loss of benefits....I would not be getting married or even entertaining thoughts of dating.

It's as simple as that.

Yes the government works against families, tis true.

 

[HeIsHere]

So it's okay to guilt MARRIED people because they don't have kids? Just because you are married means you have an OBLIGATION to make babies?

Sure am glad I'm single. That sounds rough.

What God has provided as a blessing in life you have defined as an obligation, tragic really.

 

[Lynx]

What God has provided as a blessing in life you have defined as an obligation, tragic really.

Sure kids can be a blessing.

Shaming married people who don't have kids? That's not anybody's business except theirs. Why guilt married people about not having kids?

 

[HeIsHere]

Sure kids can be a blessing.

Shaming married people who don't have kids? That's not anybody's business except theirs. Why guilt married people about not having kids?

Children ARE a blessing, there is nothing more to say.
The very fact that you keep changing words and using words like guilt and shame tells me that you are not in agreement with God's design for marriage and family, that is between you and God take it up with Him.

 

[Lynx]

Children ARE a blessing, there is nothing more to say.
The very fact that you keep changing words and using words like guilt and shame tells me that you are not in agreement with God's design for marriage and family, that is between you and God take it up with Him.

Ask Elijah what a blessing kids are.

 

[JohnDB]

What are legacy descended people?

People who have lived here for a generation.
It can be whatever original race as the USA is a melting pot of people....but they have already lived here and have assimilated to the American lifestyle. They speak, read, write, and function in American English moreso than in another language of their ancestry.

 

[JohnDB]

Not a good reason to have kids.

When immigrants outnumber the children being born in a nation....the nation will collapse...no longer be the same.
The immigrants will be the ones setting the agenda and governance.
And when they come from a country that is war torn, impoverished, little economic viability....but want to keep the cultural norms of that country....then the country they have moved to will become like the place they left.

 

[gb9]

When immigrants outnumber the children being born in a nation....the nation will collapse...no longer be the same.
The immigrants will be the ones setting the agenda and governance.
And when they come from a country that is war torn, impoverished, little economic viability....but want to keep the cultural norms of that country....then the country they have moved to will become like the place they left.

and that is what is happening in america, right here, right now.

 

[JohnDB]

and that is what is happening in america, right here, right now.

Correct....

So we need to adjust our tax structures and Social security programs. Stop taxing people and corporations into poverty. Restart our manufacturing economy. Increase our energy reserves.

The biggest problem is the political infighting and polarization.
Currently with the political climate we have half of the population is dismissed, canceled and targeted for vilification. (Hate farming)

Nobody wants to work out their differences. Instead they would rather argue, fight, and vilify their political opponents. Many in congress have given up doing anything except for insider trading since there will be nothing else to do. (Oppositional politics is the death of our nation).
Even the "Bipartisan" legislation is nothing more than thinly veiled attempts at getting everything one side wants and giving nothing in return. (IOW crap legislation)

We COULD start a slew of "pro-family" legislation. Destroy any marriage penalty. Increasing scale of tax breaks for multiple live births. (The more children the more tax breaks)
Tax breaks for daycare and their workers....make it more affordable than working in restaurants. Average barrista makes $25-30/hr but daycare makes $15-17? That can be fixed very easily.

Stop predatory child support seekers.
(Certain women will have multiple children by multiple fathers for their income garnishments....⅓ of all future earnings for the next 20+- years)

Place higher taxes on birth control. Tax these things much like alcohol, tobacco or whatever.

Any number of these things in coordination will change the way children are viewed and treated.

 

[MsMediator]

When immigrants outnumber the children being born in a nation....the nation will collapse...no longer be the same.
The immigrants will be the ones setting the agenda and governance.
And when they come from a country that is war torn, impoverished, little economic viability....but want to keep the cultural norms of that country....then the country they have moved to will become like the place they left.

I don't think anyone should be pressured to have kids for the state.

 

[JohnDB]

I don't think anyone should be pressured to have kids for the state.

No one should be pressured...
Not even suggesting that.

Just rewarded...and it's not for the state it's for creating personal families.

People aren't breeding stock. But if the government would do a 180⁰ turn of persecuting people for creating families it would be a nice change of pace.

 

[p_rehbein]

Population Decline and Low Birth Rates

(durn Global warming)

 

[MsMediator]

No one should be pressured...
Not even suggesting that.

Just rewarded...and it's not for the state it's for creating personal families.

People aren't breeding stock. But if the government would do a 180⁰ turn of persecuting people for creating families it would be a nice change of pace.

Yes, but not at the expense of singles. Families are already getting tax deductions, spousal benefits, and other benefits, as well as benefiting from shared living.