Rage and Anger.

[cinder]

@Jacobfaith isn't testing God. He's testing @Karlon

So we're going to assume that if Karlon doesn't come up with the right word / name that he's lying about his ability to hear from God rather than God has better things to do than performing magic tricks to settle petty squabbles between his children? God does not answer to us and anything that looks like we think we can manipulate God into doing what we say is pretty much the controlling spirit of witchcraft wearing its christian disguise.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

So we're going to assume that if Karlon doesn't come up with the right word / name that he's lying about his ability to hear from God rather than God has better things to do than performing magic tricks to settle petty squabbles between his children? God does not answer to us and anything that looks like we think we can manipulate God into doing what we say is pretty much the controlling spirit of witchcraft wearing its christian disguise.

@Jacobfaith doesn't know @Karlon. He's suppose to take Karlon's word as gospel?

​

You can't put anything on the Internet that's not true​

​

 

[seoulsearch]

I don't know if you're telling me the truth or not, so I'm going to test you.
I'm going to think of a name and if God does indeed speak to you, then you should be able to answer with the name I am thinking.
I'll give you 3 days.

Hi Jacob,

The thing is, God is His own person and speaks when He wants to, and only about what He wants to.

He COULD tell @Karlon the name you're thinking of, but even if he doesn't, that doesn't mean Karlon doesn't hear from God. God doesn't always oblige when people ask Him to provide proof of something (like hearing from him), whether for Karlon, or for you.

If you were giving that test to me, I would pass, because in my heart, I don't feel it's "just" testing me -- it's also testing God -- and basically asking Him to perform the shell game, and asking which cup the shell is hiding under.

God is more concerned with being God than proving to everyone who asks that people hear from Him.

Now of course, whether or what God would answer Karlon with the correct name is up to Him.

I understand exactly what you're saying though. I wrote a thread a while back in Family asking if people claiming to be modern-day prophets would still be so quick to "prophesy" if the Old Testament penalty -- death -- if their prophecies didn't come true.

A man came in and, seemingly ignoring everything I'd written, then went right ahead and wrote what he saw as a prophecy.

Cinder asked him, "Yes, but would you still be willing to give that if you knew you'd be executed if it didn't come true?" I haven't been back to check lately, but to my knowledge, the man never answered.

The reason I wrote that thread is because the last time the Rapture was "supposed" to happen, we had a lot of people here on the forum "predicting" it -- I think it was proclaimed to be September of 2025? When September passed, then they said something like, "Oh, well on the calendar Jesus followed, it would be October..."

But October 2025 has long gone.

Another time, we had a guy who wrote his own thread proclaiming all his "prophecies," adding to them when he believed he got "a Word from the Lord." I can't remember what happened but the thread was eventually closed -- which he was very upset about because he apparently saw himself as very important.

He even publicly offered the site administration money to open it back up. One person pointed out that a real prophet of God would probably not stoop to bribery to push their own prophecies.

Over the years on CC, we've seen a myriad of people claiming to be prophets and/or "hear from God", so I know why you would want to question whether someone does or not.

The Bible says we will know them by their fruit. I know that if I'm not sure if someone is really hearing from God, I look at the fruit they're producing and go from there.

But that's just me.

(I'm going to continue on another post.)

 

[seoulsearch]

I definitely agree that it's important to be cautious when people say they hear from God.

But just because God doesn't answer in the way they want, it also doesn't mean they don't hear from Him.

I already know I would fail @Jacobfaith's test because I've never experienced a time when I asked God, "Tell me what this other person is thinking so that I can prove I hear from you" -- and He's told me to answer that person with what they want to know just because they asked.

I was once part of a church that very much believed in hearing from God. But I saw a lot of misuse and misunderstand in the process.

I've had people "give me a word of knowledge from the Lord" that I would marry in 2 years, have 4 kids, etc. I've seen a friend be told she would marry a man with dark curly hair, so she turned down any guy who didn't fit that description because she was so afraid of "disobeying the Lord." If a guy with straight blond hair asked her out, she might not want to turn him down, but felt she had to or else she believed God would be angry with her.

She's never married. And if she COULD have married a great guy with a different hair color or texture, I sure hope God holds whoever that "prophet" was accountable.

The people at this church told me I had "prophetic tendencies" and were pushing me to take their "classes" on how to "walk into this gift." One woman suggested a computer game exactly like the one @Jacobfaith is asking of @Karlon. The game had a room with a hidden object, and you had to ask the Holy Spirit where it was.

Something in my own spirit did not like this at all. I felt like it was reducing God into an old gypsy in a tent, looking into a crystal ball, and asking Him to perform for me. The Bible tells us to FEAR the Lord (give Him due respect,) not to demand that He dance for us every time someone asks us to prove something.

I started trying to speak "words of knowledge" to others as I'd seen people at church doing. I told a woman at work that I believed that God was saying she was going to meet a man before the end of the month. She did -- but the situation turned out to be terrible, and I told God, "Yeah, I'm out. I don't want any of this."

Later I found out from people I believe had a lot more experience and discipline that it's advised never to give "prophecies" about "mates or dates," the birth of future children, etc.

Yes, God did this in the Old Testament, and I do believe it can still happen today, but I think it's so rare that yes, I would question anyone who tried to do so.

(Continued.)

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

What do you mean precisely when you say "God speaks to Christians"?
Are you saying you hear an actual audible voice of God or are you assuming God is trying to communicate something to you whenever something happens?

As far as I understand it, God only audibly speaks to his prophets, and if you're not a prophet of God then you're not going to hear his voice during this time frame.

I'd be very careful about assuming God is communicating things to you just because "X" happens, I'm not saying you can never take something as the "Finger of God" but It's very easy for something like assumption and presumption becoming a falsehood or a Heresy.

The Human mind is very good at filling in blanks with just anything.

My advice would be thorough study of scriptures- especially seeking to understand what it's trying to say and that should come around to the Hebrew and Greek, because I've seen people get things totally wrong and are way off.

1 John 4:1 — "Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God."

That's a command, not a suggestion.

So what you're doing is right. We don't know if that was God actually talking to him.

 

[Karlon]

I don't know if you're telling me the truth or not, so I'm going to test you.

I'm going to think of a name and if God does indeed speak to you, then you should be able to answer with the name I am thinking.

I'll give you 3 days.

get reading the Bible on this subject. research it yourself. matthew, deuteronomy & luke teach not to test the Lord God. that's what you are trying to do here. in the o.t. book of malachi, there is the only time in which God says to test him & see if he will not open the windows of heaven & pour out a blessing. i don't get involved with sorcery, witchcraft or spiritualism. you are entertaining the wrong meaning here on this subject. the H.S. has a personal relationship with each Christian that doesn't involve anyone else.

 

[Karlon]

What did He say to you, and when?
He's only spoken to me out loud once that I recall.

that's personal between the H.S. & me. i will tell you that many things He told me did come true & more are on their way.

 

[Karlon]

@Jacobfaith doesn't know @Karlon. He's suppose to take Karlon's word as gospel?

​

You can't put anything on the Internet that's not true​

​

you speak the truth. you are a fine Christian lady, 2ndTimeIsTheCharm.

 

[Karlon]

Hi Jacob,

The thing is, God is His own person and speaks when He wants to, and only about what He wants to.

He COULD tell @Karlon the name you're thinking of, but even if he doesn't, that doesn't mean Karlon doesn't hear from God. God doesn't always oblige when people ask Him to provide proof of something (like hearing from him), whether for Karlon, or for you.

If you were giving that test to me, I would pass, because in my heart, I don't feel it's "just" testing me -- it's also testing God -- and basically asking Him to perform the shell game, and asking which cup the shell is hiding under.

God is more concerned with being God than proving to everyone who asks that people hear from Him.

Now of course, whether or what God would answer Karlon with the correct name is up to Him.

I understand exactly what you're saying though. I wrote a thread a while back in Family asking if people claiming to be modern-day prophets would still be so quick to "prophesy" if the Old Testament penalty -- death -- if their prophecies didn't come true.

A man came in and, seemingly ignoring everything I'd written, then went right ahead and wrote what he saw as a prophecy.

Cinder asked him, "Yes, but would you still be willing to give that if you knew you'd be executed if it didn't come true?" I haven't been back to check lately, but to my knowledge, the man never answered.

The reason I wrote that thread is because the last time the Rapture was "supposed" to happen, we had a lot of people here on the forum "predicting" it -- I think it was proclaimed to be September of 2025? When September passed, then they said something like, "Oh, well on the calendar Jesus followed, it would be October..."

But October 2025 has long gone.

Another time, we had a guy who wrote his own thread proclaiming all his "prophecies," adding to them when he believed he got "a Word from the Lord." I can't remember what happened but the thread was eventually closed -- which he was very upset about because he apparently saw himself as very important.

He even publicly offered the site administration money to open it back up. One person pointed out that a real prophet of God would probably not stoop to bribery to push their own prophecies.

Over the years on CC, we've seen a myriad of people claiming to be prophets and/or "hear from God", so I know why you would want to question whether someone does or not.

The Bible says we will know them by their fruit. I know that if I'm not sure if someone is really hearing from God, I look at the fruit they're producing and go from there.

But that's just me.

(I'm going to continue on another post.)

truly informative. a teaching posting from seoulserarch again!

 

[cinder]

@Jacobfaith doesn't know @Karlon. He's suppose to take Karlon's word as gospel?

​

You can't put anything on the Internet that's not true​

​

The point is that the test is an invalid one. Not that claims other people make should be automatically accepted. But you can't really prove or disprove another person's testimony about their subjective experience.

 

[Karlon]

I definitely agree that it's important to be cautious when people say they hear from God.

But just because God doesn't answer in the way they want, it also doesn't mean they don't hear from Him.

I already know I would fail @Jacobfaith's test because I've never experienced a time when I asked God, "Tell me what this other person is thinking so that I can prove I hear from you" -- and He's told me to answer that person with what they want to know just because they asked.

I was once part of a church that very much believed in hearing from God. But I saw a lot of misuse and misunderstand in the process.

I've had people "give me a word of knowledge from the Lord" that I would marry in 2 years, have 4 kids, etc. I've seen a friend be told she would marry a man with dark curly hair, so she turned down any guy who didn't fit that description because she was so afraid of "disobeying the Lord." If a guy with straight blond hair asked her out, she might not want to turn him down, but felt she had to or else she believed God would be angry with her.

She's never married. And if she COULD have married a great guy with a different hair color or texture, I sure hope God holds whoever that "prophet" was accountable.

The people at this church told me I had "prophetic tendencies" and were pushing me to take their "classes" on how to "walk into this gift." One woman suggested a computer game exactly like the one @Jacobfaith is asking of @Karlon. The game had a room with a hidden object, and you had to ask the Holy Spirit where it was.

Something in my own spirit did not like this at all. I felt like it was reducing God into an old gypsy in a tent, looking into a crystal ball, and asking Him to perform for me. The Bible tells us to FEAR the Lord (give Him due respect,) not to demand that He dance for us every time someone asks us to prove something.

I started trying to speak "words of knowledge" to others as I'd seen people at church doing. I told a woman at work that I believed that God was saying she was going to meet a man before the end of the month. She did -- but the situation turned out to be terrible, and I told God, "Yeah, I'm out. I don't want any of this."

Later I found out from people I believe had a lot more experience and discipline that it's advised never to give "prophecies" about "mates or dates," the birth of future children, etc.

Yes, God did this in the Old Testament, and I do believe it can still happen today, but I think it's so rare that yes, I would question anyone who tried to do so.

(Continued.)

"mates & dates" , sophunnneee!

 

[Karlon]

The point is that the test is an invalid one. Not that claims other people make should be automatically accepted. But you can't really prove or disprove another person's testimony about their subjective experience.

not only that, if i did guess the right name, no one would know if he would be truthful & say, "yes, you are right"!

 

[seoulsearch]

I apologize for taking over your thread @Jacobfaith but I wanted to demonstrate that God speaks differently to different people.

Answering your thread right now is exactly how He speaks to me, and I can't explain it -- He puts impressions on me, kind of like when you know someone very well and you know what they'd say in that situation. And He also brings stories to my remembrance that I feel I should share. I have a strong feeling it's from God when I can't ignore it and just go do something else.

I have never heard the audible voice of God and while I certainly wouldn't turn it down, I'm pretty sure He doesn't speak that way to me because I'd be terrified (it would take some getting used to.)

Rather, these are some of the ways God "speaks" to me:

* While I grew up in a loving, Christian home, so many people have not -- and they need to talk about it. All my life, people have been opening up to me about the abuses they've been through. It became so regular that God seemed to send me a sign:

I would get these shooting flashes of pain across my abdomen, like lightning ripping through my body. I came to know that God was telling me, "I'm sending you someone else, get prayed up, and get ready." And sure enough -- a co-worker, someone at church, someone online, a friend's parent -- God would cross my path with someone who really wanted to talk.

Interestingly, one of the women I talked to said that during a time when she felt God was healing her of past abuse, she felt lightning flashes of pain through her abdomen as well. I prayed that this would be a sign that God would touch the people He sent me to listen to in a healing way they'd never experienced before.

* I was taking a Bible class at church, and God told me to pray for the class leader. I was very nervous, because he was much older than me -- and I wasn't worried about him being creepy at all, because he was a great Christian teacher -- but I was concerned it might be seen as disrespectful.

After class, (so in public but far away from the others, so on one could hear,) I told him I felt God had asked me to pray for him. And I didn't even really know what it was about until I started praying.

I told the man I was envisioning a large tree -- and it had been knocked over. But there were still little roots that needed to be dug out so nothing leftover would grow again. I told him, the tree is a big challenge in your life, and because there are still little roots trying to grow, you think you've failed -- but God is saying He knows the tree was knocked over, and that you're dealing with the roots, and He wants you to be encouraged that you have not failed at all -- God is giving you a victory, step by step.

The man told me this was very accurate and thanked me.

What I didn't tell him is that I believe (99.9%) that God was telling me the "big tree" in his life was a battle with pornography. I wasn't out to embarrass, shame, or criticize him, so I did not say a single word about that. I wanted to edify him and encourage him to keep up the good fight.

Now, why would God tell me something so personal about someone else? I believe God was testing me, seeing how I would try to preserve the man's dignity -- and I also believe He was telling me that He was going to ask me to pray for many others with the same problem.

And I always know that I could be WRONG.

I ALWAYS leave room for the fact that I could be mishearing, misunderstanding, or just plain messing up, and I tell people that as well. I told this man, "If NOTHING I'm saying applies or makes sense, PLEASE tell me so I can go back to God for correction and get better." But the man told me the prayer was spot-on -- without ever naming what it was.

This is something I look for when deciding to who to pay attention to as well. If they don't leave room for the fact that they could be wrong, and if they don't seem open to correction when needed, I'm much more cautious about anything they have to say.

(Continued.)

 

[seoulsearch]

truly informative. a teaching posting from seoulserarch again!

Thank you for the kind words!

I greatly appreciate this, but heavens no, I don't want to ever been seen as a teacher, I'm too rowdy for that kind of responsibility!!

Rather, I just try to share personal stories and hope that others can relate to something in them...

And that it encourages them to go to God themselves about the things going about in their own lives.

 

[2ndTimeIsTheCharm]

The point is that the test is an invalid one. Not that claims other people make should be automatically accepted. But you can't really prove or disprove another person's testimony about their subjective experience.

The Bible said to test the spirits. You don't want him to even try and see if that was really God talking to Karlon?

All the people who've actually encountered God fell to their knees trembling in awe and overwhelm in the Bible. That's not what Karlon is conveying. It's like they are just having some tea and coffee with each other.

 

[Karlon]

I apologize for taking over your thread @Jacobfaith but I wanted to demonstrate that God speaks differently to different people.

Answering your thread right now is exactly how He speaks to me, and I can't explain it -- He puts impressions on me, kind of like when you know someone very well and you know what they'd say in that situation. And He also brings stories to my remembrance that I feel I should share. I have a strong feeling it's from God when I can't ignore it and just go do something else.

I have never heard the audible voice of God and while I certainly wouldn't turn it down, I'm pretty sure He doesn't speak that way to me because I'd be terrified (it would take some getting used to.)

Rather, these are some of the ways God "speaks" to me:

* While I grew up in a loving, Christian home, so many people have not -- and they need to talk about it. All my life, people have been opening up to me about the abuses they've been through. It became so regular that God seemed to send me a sign:

I would get these shooting flashes of pain across my abdomen, like lightning ripping through my body. I came to know that God was telling me, "I'm sending you someone else, get prayed up, and get ready." And sure enough -- a co-worker, someone at church, someone online, a friend's parent -- God would cross my path with someone who really wanted to talk.

Interestingly, one of the women I talked to said that during a time when she felt God was healing her of past abuse, she felt lightning flashes of pain through her abdomen as well. I prayed that this would be a sign that God would touch the people He sent me to listen to in a healing way they'd never experienced before.

* I was taking a Bible class at church, and God told me to pray for the class leader. I was very nervous, because he was much older than me -- and I wasn't worried about him being creepy at all, because he was a great Christian teacher -- but I was concerned it might be seen as disrespectful.

After class, (so in public but far away from the others, so on one could hear,) I told him I felt God had asked me to pray for him. And I didn't even really know what it was about until I started praying.

I told the man I was envisioning a large tree -- and it had been knocked over. But there were still little roots that needed to be dug out so nothing leftover would grow again. I told him, the tree is a big challenge in your life, and because there are still little roots trying to grow, you think you've failed -- but God is saying He knows the tree was knocked over, and that you're dealing with the roots, and He wants you to be encouraged that you have not failed at all -- God is giving you a victory, step by step.

The man told me this was very accurate and thanked me.

What I didn't tell him is that I believe (99.9%) that God was telling me the "big tree" in his life was a battle with pornography. I wasn't out to embarrass, shame, or criticize him, so I did not say a single word about that. I wanted to edify him and encourage him to keep up the good fight.

Now, why would God tell me something so personal about someone else? I believe God was testing me, seeing how I would try to preserve the man's dignity -- and I also believe He was telling me that He was going to ask me to pray for many others with the same problem.

And I always know that I could be WRONG.

I ALWAYS leave room for the fact that I could be mishearing, misunderstanding, or just plain messing up, and I tell people that as well. I told this man, "If NOTHING I'm saying applies or makes sense, PLEASE tell me so I can go back to God for correction and get better." But the man told me the prayer was spot-on -- without ever naming what it was.

This is something I look for when deciding to who to pay attention to as well. If they don't leave room for the fact that they could be wrong, and if they don't seem open to correction when needed, I'm much more cautious about anything they have to say.

(Continued.)

if we all could establish the faith of the centurion who says, "i tell him to go & he goes, this man to come & he comes". Jesus said, "i have not seen such great faith".

 

[Karlon]

Thank you for the kind words!

I greatly appreciate this, but heavens no, I don't want to ever been seen as a teacher, I'm too rowdy for that kind of responsibility!!

Rather, I just try to share personal stories and hope that others can relate to something in them...

And that it encourages them to go to God themselves about the things going about in their own lives.

certainly. you are caring.

 

[Karlon]

The point is that the test is an invalid one. Not that claims other people make should be automatically accepted. But you can't really prove or disprove another person's testimony about their subjective experience.

totally invalid!

 

[cinder]

The Bible said to test the spirits. You don't want him to even try and see if that was really God talking to Karlon?

All the people who've actually encountered God fell to their knees trembling in awe and overwhelm in the Bible. That's not what Karlon is conveying. It's like they are just having some tea and coffee with each other.

If karlon had pulled the "god told me to tell you" thing then yeah test away. When karlon says this is how God speaks to me but he doesn't speak to everyone that way, what exactly are we testing? Especially when most people's experience of hearing from God is God directing their own personal lives, how is anyone on the internet supposed to test that in another person?

 

[seoulsearch]

When it comes to correction...

Growing up steeped in church and church culture, I have found that everyone and their mother will try to speak words of correction to me -- and I understand that.

But something I realized over the past several years is that many of those people didn't care if I became more like Christ -- they wanted me to be more like THEM, and follow the way THEY thought a believer should be.

Every person, no matter how obedient to God they are, has an emphasis on something either God has put on their heart or that they have come to see as "the most important thing." But just because it's most important to them does not mean that God is also calling me to see that as the most important thing.

Now of course, if I do something like try to say, "I think God wanted me to ask if you'd like prayer for..." -- if I'm wrong about, I want the person to correct me, 100%, so I can get better.

But when it comes to people always trying to correct me in general (such as what I should be concentrating on over other things, whether I'm are REAL Christian, etc.,) God told me years ago, "When it comes to deep correction (judging the heart and soul of who you are,) I want you to listen to the ones who have shown that they are willing to bleed WITH you."

In other words, I don't pay much attention to haters or those who don't know me, because the people in my life who know me -- and they have indeed bled with me through hard times -- don't hold back when it comes to standing up to me either.

I have a friend who doesn't care if it's his own mama, he's going to tell it like it is, and he doesn't hold back -- even if you don't talk to him for 6 month before God goads you into admitting that was right. (Guess which side of the coin I was on in that situation!)

So all I'm trying to say is, of course, take everything to God. Ask Him to speak to you, ask Him to open your understanding when you read the Bible and devotionals, and ask who you should listen to when it comes to knowing Him more -- both through encouragement and correction.

I've had many times when I've been told not to speak about this or that -- but I do anyway when I feel God wants me to. This is why I chose the title "OutWrite Trouble" -- when trouble comes to the forum, I generally feel that my way to respond to it is to keep writing (communicating.)

I used to write a lot of threads in Singles about healing from sexual abuse, because I felt that's what God was telling me to write about at the time. I wasn't so sure. I knew it was so personal, that most people wouldn't answer, and that was fine -- but I didn't want to make people uncomfortable.

I can't remember the specific title, but there was one time I wrote such a thread, back when I used to also hang out in the live chat regularly.

One night while I was there, a young man whose profile said he was 19, came in and said, "Thanks for the thread, Seoulsearch." I wrote, "You're very welcome!" He replied, "Peace," then left the room, and I never saw him again. I'd never seen him on the forum. Maybe he just hung out in other areas than I did, I don't know. But I wouldn't have known he was there except for him stopping in say hi.

After that, I knew God was telling me, with some of the things He puts on my heart to write (most of my threads are just my own fluff, but sometimes God puts something very strongly on me to write about,) and it doesn't matter if a single person doesn't answer.

Because even if all that happens is that one person reads it, it might mean an awful lot to that one person. And even if no one reads, it's just practice for other things God might want me to write about.

Now I realize, other people might not believe that I hear from God -- and that's their own right.

I can plainly say that I would fail your "Does this person really hear from God" test, @Jacobfaith, and miserably at that.

Do I believe I hear from God?

Yes, I do. NOT perfectly, of course!! I'm always learning, always fumbling, but always trying to get back up and do things better the next time. And I know God knows that.

And I guess that's why it's called faith -- believing without having any real proof to give anyone, but knowing in your heart, even if it's just between you and God, if you can't prove it anyone else -- that it's still very real.

May God bless you in our search for Him, @Jacobfaith.