Rage and Anger.
- Thread starter Jacobfaith
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
We are instructed by the apostle John of our Lord Jesus Christ to not believe every spirit- but to test them to see whether they are from God.
I'm not exactly framing someone as a lair, unless indeed they are lying to me, but rather why would the Lord speak to someone and not to me, but first we need to establish that it is so that the Lord is truly speaking to this person as well as I said before: as far as I understand it, God only audibly speaks to people who are his prophets and does nothing apart from them.
And if scripture says so, then why would it be anything different?
So asking for the name I am thinking of is a sure fire way, because if I ask "What has our Lord said?" then what is to stop anyone from making something on the spot and for me to not know it?
No, it has to be something that only I know and the Lord would know, and if the Lord truly speaks to this person, then they would tell me what I know but only by God telling them first, then I will know they are telling the truth.
I'm not exactly framing someone as a lair, unless indeed they are lying to me, but rather why would the Lord speak to someone and not to me, but first we need to establish that it is so that the Lord is truly speaking to this person as well as I said before: as far as I understand it, God only audibly speaks to people who are his prophets and does nothing apart from them.
And if scripture says so, then why would it be anything different?
So asking for the name I am thinking of is a sure fire way, because if I ask "What has our Lord said?" then what is to stop anyone from making something on the spot and for me to not know it?
No, it has to be something that only I know and the Lord would know, and if the Lord truly speaks to this person, then they would tell me what I know but only by God telling them first, then I will know they are telling the truth.
Hi Jacob faith, I think you are wise to test the spirits as the Apostle John instructed.
However, the method John laid out in scripture is not the method you are using to test @Karlon. Can you give us a scripture reference for this specific test you are using?
Can you let us know which scripture you are referring to here as well?
Don't get me wrong, I'm super skeptical of anyone who calls themselves a prophet so I get where you're comng from, I'm just trying to follow your biblical reasoning.
Actually the Lord is the One Who said that and He did so through the writings of the Apostle John.
John was not the one deciding what he was going to write. The Lord told him what to write through the Holy Spirit.
The Bible says to test the spirits. It doesn't say to require miracles on demand.
But requiring miracles on demand is a good indicator that can be used to test a person's spirit, and see if it is of God or not. Hmm...
God tells different things to different people, if He wanted ALL of us to know, He'd say it loud so that EVERYONE can hear.
Jesus was the last (of the Jewish) prophets that He spoke to and through and so everyone takes His word for it, or what we read of the Bible.
If you want to get into 'latter day saints' or prophets like Muhammed, well that's a completely different religion.
Prophecy if I suppose for edification of others but God can speak to you personally/individually on matters pertaining to you alone, that are not really anyone else's business.
I remember the guy who wrote this book when I was in a Christian Writers group. https://thefreedomdiaries.co.nz/
I mean you can read it for yourself if you are angry enough.
Of course everyone wants to know about a husband, (or wife) kids and job. That's all what anyone wants out of life, right? You could go to a psychic for your future...or you could go to God.
Ha well in my experience He doesn't say anything about that to me. He just cares about me being a daughter and that's enough. And also, when I write things down in my own diary, its just things like 'garden club nite' or 'wacky wednesday' or 'cancel Hello Kitty'
Jesus was the last (of the Jewish) prophets that He spoke to and through and so everyone takes His word for it, or what we read of the Bible.
If you want to get into 'latter day saints' or prophets like Muhammed, well that's a completely different religion.
Prophecy if I suppose for edification of others but God can speak to you personally/individually on matters pertaining to you alone, that are not really anyone else's business.
I remember the guy who wrote this book when I was in a Christian Writers group. https://thefreedomdiaries.co.nz/
I mean you can read it for yourself if you are angry enough.
Of course everyone wants to know about a husband, (or wife) kids and job. That's all what anyone wants out of life, right? You could go to a psychic for your future...or you could go to God.
Ha well in my experience He doesn't say anything about that to me. He just cares about me being a daughter and that's enough. And also, when I write things down in my own diary, its just things like 'garden club nite' or 'wacky wednesday' or 'cancel Hello Kitty'
Thank you for sharing your experiences with Hello Kitty Island Adventures. It was cool that you got to play the DLCs too. I'm fully convinced now that this is a really fun game to play. I just have to save up for it....
indeed, true. clarification is: 2nd Timothy 3:16 & 17 & 2nd Peter 1:20 & 21!
It's also to protect @Karlon. If the spirit talking to him isn't the Holy Spirit, we need to get him away from it. The Holy Spirit and the Bible don't contradict each other - He wrote it after all.
Is the reason Karlon is being singled out for a "test" is because he said he hears God's audible voice, and that seems too fantastical to believe?
I've known one other person who claimed to have heard God's voice, and I have no doubt he did. I was in a church that believed in the five-fold ministry (recognizing 5 different offices,) and this man was said to be a prophet. This was one guy I came to have no doubts about, as his word of knowledge for my parents launched them into a ministry that lasted something 20 years.
But the reason I would question if someone like that hears from God is because they're claiming to have words for other people, or about prophecies we all need to listen to (like predicting the end of the world.) I might have missed it, but I haven't seen Karlon claiming to give words of knowledge or telling us when the Rapture will occur.
I'm going to take a stab in the dark, and if I'm wrong, I hope everyone knows by now I don't have a problem with being factually corrected.
Jacob's entire thread is about drowning in rage and anger. He said that if God can talk to Karlon, then God can talk to Jacob, too -- so it's not just about Karlon, it's also about Jacob wanting and believing that if one person has the right to hear from God, then God needs to pony up and start talking to Jacob too.
I might be wrong, but it's coming across as a demand from not only Karlon, but from God. Jacob is saying, "Ok, God, if you talk to this guy, then I expect you to talk to me too."
In my experience, putting demands on God does not end well, but that's just me.
And even for believers who do say they hear from God, I do not believe any of us hear or interpret everything perfectly (God speaks to us in His perfection, but we as sinful people don't always understand it correctly.)
It also has to be understood that the condition of one's heart has a lot to do with how, when, and if God speaks.
I've known people consumed with alcohol, drugs, pornography -- but they expect God to speak to them, because He's speaking to everyone else. They're jealous of anyone claiming to have a close relationship with God, because they assume God is making their life better, so why isn't God doing that for them? And so they lash out any anyone saying they hear from God.
A heart filled with rage and anger is not the best stage on which to hear God clearly -- even through someone else.
I was exactly the same way.
(Continued.)
I've known one other person who claimed to have heard God's voice, and I have no doubt he did. I was in a church that believed in the five-fold ministry (recognizing 5 different offices,) and this man was said to be a prophet. This was one guy I came to have no doubts about, as his word of knowledge for my parents launched them into a ministry that lasted something 20 years.
But the reason I would question if someone like that hears from God is because they're claiming to have words for other people, or about prophecies we all need to listen to (like predicting the end of the world.) I might have missed it, but I haven't seen Karlon claiming to give words of knowledge or telling us when the Rapture will occur.
I'm going to take a stab in the dark, and if I'm wrong, I hope everyone knows by now I don't have a problem with being factually corrected.
Jacob's entire thread is about drowning in rage and anger. He said that if God can talk to Karlon, then God can talk to Jacob, too -- so it's not just about Karlon, it's also about Jacob wanting and believing that if one person has the right to hear from God, then God needs to pony up and start talking to Jacob too.
I might be wrong, but it's coming across as a demand from not only Karlon, but from God. Jacob is saying, "Ok, God, if you talk to this guy, then I expect you to talk to me too."
In my experience, putting demands on God does not end well, but that's just me.
And even for believers who do say they hear from God, I do not believe any of us hear or interpret everything perfectly (God speaks to us in His perfection, but we as sinful people don't always understand it correctly.)
It also has to be understood that the condition of one's heart has a lot to do with how, when, and if God speaks.
I've known people consumed with alcohol, drugs, pornography -- but they expect God to speak to them, because He's speaking to everyone else. They're jealous of anyone claiming to have a close relationship with God, because they assume God is making their life better, so why isn't God doing that for them? And so they lash out any anyone saying they hear from God.
A heart filled with rage and anger is not the best stage on which to hear God clearly -- even through someone else.
I was exactly the same way.
(Continued.)
I was literally born (adopted) into church culture. The first Sunday my parents got me from the airport, they had me in church.
I went to Christian schools, was part of every Christian activity my whole life. Did it make me a better Christian than anyone else? No, absolutely not, but it made me very familiar with God's Word and what He commands. I did my best to be the "good girl" my whole life. I wasn't into partying, never tried drugs, never smoked, stayed away from alcohol, kept to myself.
I expected to be like my parents, marrying young and staying together forever.
So a few years later when my then-husband left for his girlfriend, my heart became a dark cloud of pain, and as Jacob described in his opening post, a cesspool of rage and anger. Before my husband left for good, I had come home one day from school and work -- a "normal" day -- and realized half the house was gone. My then-husband had packed up his things and left while I was working.
I understand rage and anger. I was furious, and even more than that, I was hurt beyond belief that I had tried my best to "play by God's rules" -- and yet THIS had happened. Yes, I knew about free will and the troubles of this life and all the good platitudes we're told by Christians when we're going through horrible times, but I had done all I could do -- and I felt like the church, and God, had lied to me all my life.
And if God was talking to other people and doing all these wonderful things for them, THEN HE CERTAINLY OWED ME. What He could do for other people to fix THEIR lives, then He'd BETTER do that for me too!!
Such was my thinking at the time. And I actually expected God to speak to me in that arrogant, hateful state.
And then one day, He did.
I was at the beginning of another miserable day, and I happened to have that day off, which was the worst thing possible then, because it left me alone with my own bitter thoughts. I pulled the blanket over my head because at that time, my main coping mechanism was to try to sleep as much as possible.
And in a moment I'll never forget, God "spoke" to me, clear as day. I didn't "hear" a voice. But something came to my heart that was unmistakable: "I didn't create you to be miserable. Now -- GET UP!"
I was shocked, and didn't want to believe it was Him. All our lives we are told about a loving God. I thought if God was going to speak to me, He was going to say something like, "I'm so sorry you're going through this. I know he hurt you, and he was wrong. It's going to be ok, and I have someone else for you."
NO.
What God REALLY wanted me to do was to talk out of my own self-pity and continue to keep going on, day by day even when I didn't see a point. In many ways, for a long time, that made me even angrier, because it felt like there was no love behind it -- I was just a thing for God to use, like everyone else, and I hated that.
This might not be how God deals with everyone, but for me, God definitely chose tough love, not syrupy lines of everything I wanted to hear.
So when someone feels they've hit rock bottom in their life, I'm guessing they might be in a similar pattern. They're filling their mind and heart with destructive things, but they believe they have RIGHTS, dang it all, and GOD OWES THEM for their trouble.
They expect God to say all soft, loving things to them, like how sorry He is that people have hurt them, and how they deserve better, and how He has a successful life, joy, happiness, a loving significant other, and everything they could ever want -- they just have to believe. In some cases, He might do that. I've heard of some in which He has.
But what if God speaks to you, and it's NOT what you want to hear, but the exact opposite?
What if God says to you, "Get up off your self-pitying butt, put away the things that are blocking your from me (like rage and anger,) and follow Me (in service to other people)"?
How would a message like that from God be received? I know it's the one He had for me.
Jacob, I am praying that you will hear from God in a way that you can never deny.
But it's up to God as to how He wants to handle such a prayer request, and no one can force God's hand.
What happens if God DOES choose to speak to you in a way you can't ignore?
And are you willing to accept and obey whatever it is He says -- even if it's something you DON'T want to hear?
I went to Christian schools, was part of every Christian activity my whole life. Did it make me a better Christian than anyone else? No, absolutely not, but it made me very familiar with God's Word and what He commands. I did my best to be the "good girl" my whole life. I wasn't into partying, never tried drugs, never smoked, stayed away from alcohol, kept to myself.
I expected to be like my parents, marrying young and staying together forever.
So a few years later when my then-husband left for his girlfriend, my heart became a dark cloud of pain, and as Jacob described in his opening post, a cesspool of rage and anger. Before my husband left for good, I had come home one day from school and work -- a "normal" day -- and realized half the house was gone. My then-husband had packed up his things and left while I was working.
I understand rage and anger. I was furious, and even more than that, I was hurt beyond belief that I had tried my best to "play by God's rules" -- and yet THIS had happened. Yes, I knew about free will and the troubles of this life and all the good platitudes we're told by Christians when we're going through horrible times, but I had done all I could do -- and I felt like the church, and God, had lied to me all my life.
And if God was talking to other people and doing all these wonderful things for them, THEN HE CERTAINLY OWED ME. What He could do for other people to fix THEIR lives, then He'd BETTER do that for me too!!
Such was my thinking at the time. And I actually expected God to speak to me in that arrogant, hateful state.
And then one day, He did.
I was at the beginning of another miserable day, and I happened to have that day off, which was the worst thing possible then, because it left me alone with my own bitter thoughts. I pulled the blanket over my head because at that time, my main coping mechanism was to try to sleep as much as possible.
And in a moment I'll never forget, God "spoke" to me, clear as day. I didn't "hear" a voice. But something came to my heart that was unmistakable: "I didn't create you to be miserable. Now -- GET UP!"
I was shocked, and didn't want to believe it was Him. All our lives we are told about a loving God. I thought if God was going to speak to me, He was going to say something like, "I'm so sorry you're going through this. I know he hurt you, and he was wrong. It's going to be ok, and I have someone else for you."
NO.
What God REALLY wanted me to do was to talk out of my own self-pity and continue to keep going on, day by day even when I didn't see a point. In many ways, for a long time, that made me even angrier, because it felt like there was no love behind it -- I was just a thing for God to use, like everyone else, and I hated that.
This might not be how God deals with everyone, but for me, God definitely chose tough love, not syrupy lines of everything I wanted to hear.
So when someone feels they've hit rock bottom in their life, I'm guessing they might be in a similar pattern. They're filling their mind and heart with destructive things, but they believe they have RIGHTS, dang it all, and GOD OWES THEM for their trouble.
They expect God to say all soft, loving things to them, like how sorry He is that people have hurt them, and how they deserve better, and how He has a successful life, joy, happiness, a loving significant other, and everything they could ever want -- they just have to believe. In some cases, He might do that. I've heard of some in which He has.
But what if God speaks to you, and it's NOT what you want to hear, but the exact opposite?
What if God says to you, "Get up off your self-pitying butt, put away the things that are blocking your from me (like rage and anger,) and follow Me (in service to other people)"?
How would a message like that from God be received? I know it's the one He had for me.
Jacob, I am praying that you will hear from God in a way that you can never deny.
But it's up to God as to how He wants to handle such a prayer request, and no one can force God's hand.
What happens if God DOES choose to speak to you in a way you can't ignore?
And are you willing to accept and obey whatever it is He says -- even if it's something you DON'T want to hear?
What if, what God really wants to tell most people, including the most devout Christians, is:
"Turn away from your pet sins that you've been hanging on to for so long (because everyone has them.) I'm willing to forgive if you're willing to start genuinely repenting. Then as we work on your sins, I want you to follow and obey Me, even though you won't want to. And if you choose to cling on to your sins, as you keep doing, I will have no choice but to discipline you, as a Father disciplines His children."
How many people would eagerly sign up to hear God if they knew THAT was going to be the message?
I'm guessing the line wouldn't exactly be around the block.
But yet, I'm also guessing that this is what He wants to tell a lot of people today -- including myself -- and that's why so many "don't hear from God."
It's not that God doesn't want to speak.
And it might not even be that God isn't speaking -- He might be telling people that personally, in addition to telling us all of these things already in his Word (disobedient children generally need to be reminded -- frequently.)
It's just that people want God to be like the world, which tells us we all deserve rewards and positive reinforcement just for being alive.
I personally believe that a lot of people either can't hear from God because of things they're choosing, or do hear from Him but reject what He really has to say.
They think God's a Magic 8 Ball and if they just keep shaking it up long enough, and with the right combinations, God will eventually tell them all they want to hear and more.
If the Bible is any indication, that expectation will not go well.
But, this is just what I believe.
"Turn away from your pet sins that you've been hanging on to for so long (because everyone has them.) I'm willing to forgive if you're willing to start genuinely repenting. Then as we work on your sins, I want you to follow and obey Me, even though you won't want to. And if you choose to cling on to your sins, as you keep doing, I will have no choice but to discipline you, as a Father disciplines His children."
How many people would eagerly sign up to hear God if they knew THAT was going to be the message?
I'm guessing the line wouldn't exactly be around the block.
But yet, I'm also guessing that this is what He wants to tell a lot of people today -- including myself -- and that's why so many "don't hear from God."
It's not that God doesn't want to speak.
And it might not even be that God isn't speaking -- He might be telling people that personally, in addition to telling us all of these things already in his Word (disobedient children generally need to be reminded -- frequently.)
It's just that people want God to be like the world, which tells us we all deserve rewards and positive reinforcement just for being alive.
I personally believe that a lot of people either can't hear from God because of things they're choosing, or do hear from Him but reject what He really has to say.
They think God's a Magic 8 Ball and if they just keep shaking it up long enough, and with the right combinations, God will eventually tell them all they want to hear and more.
If the Bible is any indication, that expectation will not go well.
But, this is just what I believe.
I would take no for an answer
Just to know I heard You speak
And I'm wondering why I've never
Seen the signs they claim to see
A bunch of special revelations
Meant for everybody but me
Maybe I don't really know You
Or maybe I just simply believe
indeed, totally, the Holy Spirit speaks to me. i know how to discern the spirits as 1st John chapter 4 teaches. for anyone doubting the Holy Spirit really speaks to you, read John 3:33, 16:3, 14:26, Romans 8:26 & you can throw in 1st John 3:20-22.It's also to protect @Karlon. If the spirit talking to him isn't the Holy Spirit, we need to get him away from it. The Holy Spirit and the Bible don't contradict each other - He wrote it after all.
Sister Seoul is so right
God spoke that way to me too. He's the only one who can correct me, I won't listen to anyone else lol!
He just wants us to be good people. We by ourselves aren't good people. We need His help.
Really we do need to ask for His help. Or cry for it. Sometimes we may not actually know what to do, Only He can tell us what He wants us to do. What God wants us to do, and what we desire, may be different things.
It is like the potter and the clay. We can't tell God what to do.
God spoke that way to me too. He's the only one who can correct me, I won't listen to anyone else lol!
He just wants us to be good people. We by ourselves aren't good people. We need His help.
Really we do need to ask for His help. Or cry for it. Sometimes we may not actually know what to do, Only He can tell us what He wants us to do. What God wants us to do, and what we desire, may be different things.
It is like the potter and the clay. We can't tell God what to do.