Based on research I just posted, you can blame Rome for creating amillennialism as a SYSTEM.
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I am not an amill and amill is not a system it is a faulty interpretation.
Based on research I just posted, you can blame Rome for creating amillennialism as a SYSTEM.
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I am not an amill and amill is not a system it is a faulty interpretation.
Ot shadowsIt does not make sense to "telescope" old testament tribes into the future.
There is no divide between the tribes of Judah and Ephraim anymore, nor do people know to which one they belong.
It is not possible to make reconciliation between tribes that no longer exist.
When you get to the next chapter (Ezekiel 38) there is a list of old Testament tribes involved:
MAGOG - Syria and southern Scythia, center of the Seleucid Empire (confirmed by Pliny, Josephus, and Grotius).
MESCHECH - Moschi, a Scythian tribe of North-Central Armenia; later called Cappadocians in the New Testament.
TUBAL - Thobelites, Scythians of eastern Armenia and northern Syria, later called Iberians in the New Testament.
PERSIA - A well-known nation that was located in today’s Iran.
ETHIOPIA - The African nation.
LIBYA - The northern African nation.
GOMER - A tribe of central Armenia, later called Galatians in the New Testament.
TOGARMAH - A tribe of southwestern Armenia, later called Phrygians in the New Testament.
SHEBA - Arabic tribe
DEDAN - Arabic tribe
TARSHISH - The northern Mediterranean coastal peoples stretching from Italy to Spain. Later, a seaport in Spain.
Some of these tribes continues into the early NT, and Persia Ethiopia and Libya have some sort of modern representation, but to "telescope" the whole lot into the future along with OT warfare, weapons and burying practices would be prophetic monkeying.
That does not mean it all has no relevance to the present and future, but relevance does not mean a repeat of the exact same thing.
“And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see. And I saw, and behold a white horse: and he that sat on him had a bow; and a crown was given unto him: and he went forth conquering, and to conquer.”Thank you! I don't know why the postmilennialists insist the first seal is Jesus.... When it is Jesus opening the seals of judgment, is He unleashing Himself???
These people just have zero understanding about Bible prophecy and I can't understand why anyone would be a postmillennialist.
I am not an amill and amill is not a system it is a faulty interpretation.
There is no replacement covenant of God, in that the Jew is replaced by the Christian as the people of God. The Jew can also repent and be grafted in again to the holy Israel and nation of Jesus Christ.The preacher is Dr James Tour. He is a brilliant scientist, a fervent evangelist and knowledgeable about Israel's place in God's plan and purpose. It is quite long, but well worth hearing. Replacement people don't listen. You will have to change your minds if you do.
You wont see me posting for a while because I have concussion from reading "and historicism" lolYes, I am quite familiar with this information.
This is what it comes down to for me and I think it reasonable to view it this way.
Covenant theology, preterism, partial preterism and historicism, ( I will concede) are reasonable conclusions if one picks up the Bible and reads for oneself.
A person has to be taught dispensationalism (except for the ones who found a way to create it as a system) and it is a system completely based on clever eisegesis.
But isn't interesting to look atThis has turned into quite the history lesson.
It even pre-dates the reformation. When the Roman Church split between East and West - as in the Eastern Orthoodox and Roman Catholic West, the eastern pope would call the Western Pope the anti-ChristObviously, the idea that Protestants thought that the Pope is tied to the Anti-Christ has been circulating around a lot longer than even I thought.
In my understanding of the 144000 it makes sense, and in yours it does not.We see the tribes again in Revelation 7 and Revelation 14.
But isn't interesting to look at![]()
In my understanding of the 144000 it makes sense, and in yours it does not.
***THE*** (definite article singular) man of sin aka THE little horn is the anti-Christ of Revelation.So Clarence Larkin is admitting that the school of thought that he follows came about to rid the Papacy of the stigma of being called the Anti-Christ. But I guess thats where the money was.
The Dragon has already been identified explicitly as Satan:“and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat [throne], and great authority.”
So Revelation's chain is:Revelation 12:9 — “that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan...”
Thus worship of the Beast is simultaneously connected with worship of Satan.“And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast...”
and even more explicitly:Luke 22:3 — “Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot...”
That gives us an actual biblical category in which Satan personally enters and controls a human being.John 13:27 — “And after the sop Satan entered into him.”
Antichrist:John 17:12 — “none of them is lost, but the son of perdition...”
That verbal parallel is very striking.2 Thessalonians 2:3 — “that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition.”
Greek:2 Thessalonians 2:9
“Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders.”
meaning approximately:κατ᾽ ἐνέργειαν τοῦ Σατανᾶ
kat' energeian tou Satana
and:Revelation 13:3 — “one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed...”
and:Revelation 13:12 — “the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.”
Revelation 13:14 — “the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.”
Revelation 11:7 — “the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit...”
Revelation 17:8 — “the beast... shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition.”
Oh you are NOT going to like this doctrine my RT friend. Nor will @HeIsHere , @Beekeeper , @WayneNSO , @Pilgrimshope et alMaybe they can blame Jesus for marrying born again newly purified wife. Not adulterous who refuse to leave her idols.
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The text does not say that God would make the covenant with a future entity called the Church. It names the covenant parties directly: the house of Israel and the house of Judah.“Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah.”
— Jeremiah 31:31
And Jeremiah immediately ties this promise to Israel’s continued national existence:“I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts... and they shall be my people.”
— Jeremiah 31:33
That statement is devastating to replacement theology. God deliberately anchors the covenant to the permanence of Israel as a nation.“If those ordinances depart from before me... then the seed of Israel also shall cease from being a nation before me for ever.”
— Jeremiah 31:36
But the fact that the Church presently receives New Covenant blessings does not mean the Church has become the covenant’s original covenant party.“This cup is the new testament [covenant] in my blood.”
— Luke 22:20
The Gentiles do not become the root. They benefit from the root.“Boast not against the branches... thou bearest not the root, but the root thee.”
— Romans 11:18
He immediately connects this future salvation of Israel with covenant fulfillment:“blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. And so all Israel shall be saved.”
— Romans 11:25–26
That is covenant language applied to Israel after the present Gentile ingathering.“For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.”
— Romans 11:27
Acts 15 addresses the same issue. The controversy is whether Gentiles must undergo circumcision and enter Judaism in order to be saved. The apostolic answer is no: God is taking from the Gentiles “a people for his name” (Acts 15:14). Yet James immediately cites the prophets concerning the future restoration of David’s fallen tabernacle. Gentile salvation does not erase Israel’s promises.“Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.”
Through Christ they have now been “made nigh by the blood of Christ” (v. 13).“aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise.”
— Ephesians 2:12
Mumbo jumbo Arnold who?Oh you are NOT going to like this doctrine my RT friend. Nor will @HeIsHere , @Beekeeper , @WayneNSO , @Pilgrimshope et al
But, it is true nevertheless. So get a grip and hold on tight, your quaint little ideology is about to collapse around you.
Arnold Fruchtenbaum’s dispensational position is straightforward: Israel is the ***covenantal possessor*** of the New Covenant promised in Jeremiah 31. The Church participates in its spiritual blessings, but the covenant itself was made with national Israel and Judah.
Jeremiah could hardly be more explicit:
The text does not say that God would make the covenant with a future entity called the Church. It names the covenant parties directly: the house of Israel and the house of Judah.
The same passage describes Israel’s future national restoration:
And Jeremiah immediately ties this promise to Israel’s continued national existence:
That statement is devastating to replacement theology. God deliberately anchors the covenant to the permanence of Israel as a nation.
The prophets say the same thing elsewhere. Ezekiel 36 promises Israel cleansing, a new heart, the indwelling Spirit, and restoration to “the land that I gave to your fathers” (Ezek. 36:24–28). Ezekiel 37 joins Israel and Judah, restores them to the land, places David over them, and promises an everlasting covenant. These are not descriptions of the Church replacing Israel. They are promises of Israel’s future national and spiritual restoration.
The New Testament does not cancel this.
At the Last Supper, Christ established the basis of the New Covenant through His blood:
But the fact that the Church presently receives New Covenant blessings does not mean the Church has become the covenant’s original covenant party.
Paul makes this distinction remarkably clear. In Romans 11, Gentile believers are depicted not as replacing Israel, but as wild olive branches grafted into blessings rooted in Israel’s covenantal promises. Paul explicitly warns Gentiles:
The Gentiles do not become the root. They benefit from the root.
Paul then states that Israel’s present hardening is temporary:
He immediately connects this future salvation of Israel with covenant fulfillment:
That is covenant language applied to Israel after the present Gentile ingathering.
Acts follows the same pattern. The earliest believers were Jewish. The great surprise was not that Israel had somehow ceased to exist as God’s covenant nation, but that Gentiles were also being granted salvation apart from becoming Jews.
Peter is astonished in Acts 10 when the Holy Spirit falls upon Gentiles. In Acts 11:18 the Jewish believers respond:
Acts 15 addresses the same issue. The controversy is whether Gentiles must undergo circumcision and enter Judaism in order to be saved. The apostolic answer is no: God is taking from the Gentiles “a people for his name” (Acts 15:14). Yet James immediately cites the prophets concerning the future restoration of David’s fallen tabernacle. Gentile salvation does not erase Israel’s promises.
Ephesians 2 is also frequently misunderstood. Gentiles had once been:
Through Christ they have now been “made nigh by the blood of Christ” (v. 13).
Notice the direction of movement. The Gentiles were originally strangers to Israel’s covenants. Through Messiah they now share spiritual blessings that previously lay outside their covenantal position.
This is exactly Fruchtenbaum’s distinction:
Israel is the possessor of the New Covenant.
The Church is a present beneficiary of its spiritual blessings.
The Church enjoys forgiveness, regeneration, justification, and the indwelling Spirit because Christ’s blood ratified the New Covenant. But that does not transfer the covenant from Israel to the Church or annul the national promises made to Israel.
The New Covenant was promised to Israel, ratified by Messiah, spiritually participated in by the Church, and will ultimately be fulfilled nationally in Israel when Israel turns to her Messiah.
That preserves the plain meaning of Jeremiah 31, Ezekiel 36–37, Romans 11, Acts 10–15, and the entire prophetic framework.
The Gentiles were not substituted for Israel.
They were graciously brought near to blessings flowing from Israel’s Messiah and Israel’s covenants.
“Know ye not, brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,) how that the law hath dominion over a man as long as he liveth? For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.”Maybe they can blame Jesus for marrying born again newly purified wife. Not adulterous who refuse to leave her idols.
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