Some thoughts on the Sabbath...
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Jesus declared himself to be Lord of the Sabbath, and he wasn't talking about a day of the week.
If the Sabbath is not the 7th day of the WEEK God made Holy at creation then what is it? and where is that explained?
There is a third alternative. Paul rested on Saturday, but didn't teach the Gentiles to rest on a day of the week.
So you are saying there is not One narrow way, there are two or more, and they are all different?
Christ only revealed ONE Narrow WAY, but some how now there are many? That is confusion to me and what about Timothy?
he is half Greek, half Hebrew, does that mean he can choose which one of the ways he will follow or even move back and forth?
They were living under the Mt. Sinai covenant.
I was under the impression all 12 apostles preached, taught and lived by the New Covenant, the one Christ preached and taught them for 3 1/2 years and sent them out to preach.
Again how is it possible there are many ways ---how could followers of Christ be of ONE mind and yet so divided?
I do like to play with words, but that doesn't mean I am not serious.
The debate centers on obedience to the so-called fourth commandment in the Mosaic Law. The member asked me whether I committed adultery. The question rests on an incorrect assumption. It is believed that because the commandment against adultery proscribes an immoral act and the fourth commandment is listed among the Ten Commandments, it necessarily prescribes a moral act.
I didn't make an argument; I stated the obvious. God commanded Israel to remember the Sabbath Day by resting on Saturday. He didn't command Gentiles to rest on Saturday.
The fact that I don't commit adultery is beside the point. Gentiles don't need laws to do the right thing. I do right for the sake of righteousness. I do good for the sake of goodness. I don't commit adultery because it is wrong to break a covenant. It is wrong to break a promise. It is wrong to be unfaithful. I don't need to put myself under the law to do the right thing.
If I am obligated to keep the fourth commandment because all the laws are the same, then I am obligated to eat kosher, keep the festivals, etc. But all of the laws are NOT the same as Jesus said. Some laws are weightier than others. Matthew 23:23 Jesus also said that the Sabbath was made for man, which strongly implies that the Sabbath Day is therapeutic for all mankind. And so, if a Gentile Christian wishes to rest on a Sunday in order to honor his Lord, then he is honoring the Father also.
Remember, Jesus declared himself the Lord of the Sabbath, speaking of the kingdom as it will be in the next age. Our Sabbath rest will come in the next age when we will finally be free of sin.
Galatians 4
21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.
21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law?
22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23 But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.
27 For it is written, Rejoice, thou barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband.
28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise.
29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.
30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman.
31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.
You have some explaining to do , I’m listening
its Spirit verses flesh
Thanks for taking the time to express your view , what denomination do you adhere to ? There are so many and hard to tell . A question I have if the gentiles participate in the Sabbath is that ok ? Some did . Some gentiles like Ruth fully adopted the Israeli law and all . So how can it not apply to them . Jesus said If ANY man serve me , let him follow me . This is inclusive of Gentiles if you read the context of John ch 12 . The gentiles went to the synagogue on the Sabbath to hear the word of God by Apostle Paul in Acts . Just a few examples of Gentiles participating .
You are saying gentiles and for that matter everyone should be able to decide what is right and wrong. that is a frighting thought. I have met folks that think everything I own should be theirs.
We are temporary life forms made by our Creator, Our Creator has a purpose in making man and He alone has the right to tell man what is right and what is wrong.
Christ gave the choice to Adam and Eve and of course they choose to decide what is right and what is wrong and mankind has followed that mistake for the last 6000 years.
all I need to do is look at the condition of this world and I can see man is not capable of doing what is right even though God has told us which is which.
all 10 carry the penalty of death thus equal. there is no commandment to eat Kosher, not eating unclean meat is a Statute, but there is to keep the Feasts of God, they are commanded assemblies like the Sabbath.
According to those who thought they kept the law even though Jesus corrected them many times,
Jesus broke the Sabbath, and they sought to kill Him for that reason, as well as for blasphemy.
Jesus broke the Sabbath, and they sought to kill Him for that reason, as well as for blasphemy.
I agree that self-rule is frightening and I also agree that God alone has the right to determine right from wrong. And given the state of man's heart and his propensity for doing wrong, I would never argue against the rule of law, which is Biblical. My argument is with the category error Sabbatarians make, treating the Mosaic covenant code as if it were identical to the universal moral law grounded in creation and conscience.
We must maintain the distinction between civil law (the legal codes of nations) and universal moral law (the enduring obligations grounded in God’s character and creation). Confusing the two is a category error that leads to moral and theological distortion.
The Fourth Commandment functions more like civil‑covenantal law than like a universal moral law. In the structure of the Sinai covenant, the Sabbath command operates as a national sign, a civic institution, and a constitutional marker for Israel—not as a universal moral norm binding all humanity.
On the other hand, the Tenth commandment is purely moral. The Tenth commandment can't be adjudicated in a civil court, which tells you immediately that it does not function like a civil law at all. In other words, we can see that not all commandments are the same kind of thing.
The command came to the Israelites in Ex 20, but that does not mean the sabbath was not always there for all people.
You are making presumptions when you claim that it was only for Jews.
9 Of the 10 commandments are kept by Gentiles today and people don't argue about not lying or steeling, but the sabbath is not accepted and people find every excuse to throw this one command out.
Why ? It is inconvenient and might mean sacrifice of people's time.
But if you love God nothing is to hard.
It is really a blessing
Judaizers are people that persist on keeping all of the laws, rites and ceremonies given to Israel.
We are told that these were to point to the Messiah. Christ is the substance of these shadow rites. When Christ came and died these shadows died and ceased. The transgression of the moral law made the shadowy system necessary. At the the death of Christ, (which the shadows were pointing to from Adams time), these offerings were abolished.
Not the law of God that defines sin. The moral law is still pointing out sin today. But Christ is our high priest in heaven not the earthly system set up to point to Christ's coming ministry.
2Ki 21:8 Neither will I make the feet of Israel move any more out of the land which I gave their fathers; only if they will observe to do according to all that I have commanded them, and according to all the law that my servant Moses commanded them.
Col 2:13-17
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
We are told that these were to point to the Messiah. Christ is the substance of these shadow rites. When Christ came and died these shadows died and ceased. The transgression of the moral law made the shadowy system necessary. At the the death of Christ, (which the shadows were pointing to from Adams time), these offerings were abolished.
Not the law of God that defines sin. The moral law is still pointing out sin today. But Christ is our high priest in heaven not the earthly system set up to point to Christ's coming ministry.
2Ki 21:8 Neither will I make the feet of Israel move any more out of the land which I gave their fathers; only if they will observe to do according to all that I have commanded them, and according to all the law that my servant Moses commanded them.
Col 2:13-17
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it. 16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
The problem with the sabbath was it was given to Israel as law.
Codified law as seen in Exodus 24.
Meaning, there was an attached death penalty for it's transgression.
The Gentile nations were never under the codified law in Exodus 24.
This is where the wheels fall off in your interpretation.
It's not difficult to read the former covenant and identify the parties that were included.
John 6 v For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven , and giveth life unto the world .
John 3 v 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world ; but that the world through him might be saved.
Romans 3 v 19 Now we know that what things soever the law Saith , it Saith to them who are under the law : that every mouth may be stopped, and all the WORLD may become guilty before God . Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight : for by the Law is the knowledge of sin . 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested , being witnessed by the law and prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference. For all have sinned , and come short of the glory of God . Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus .whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood , to declare his righteousness for remission of sins that are past , through the forebearance of God ; To declare , I say , at this time his righteousness: that he might be just , and justifier of him which believeth in Jesus . Where is boasting then ? It is excluded. By what law ? Of works ? Nay but buy the law of faith . Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law . Is he the God of the Jews only ? Is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes of the Gentiles also . Seeing it is one God , which shall justify the circumcision by faith , and the uncircumcision through faith . Do we make void the law through faith ? God forbid : yea we establish the law .
The law is for Jew and gentiles as so is Gods Salvation. May God bless his word .
John 3 v 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world ; but that the world through him might be saved.
Romans 3 v 19 Now we know that what things soever the law Saith , it Saith to them who are under the law : that every mouth may be stopped, and all the WORLD may become guilty before God . Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight : for by the Law is the knowledge of sin . 21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested , being witnessed by the law and prophets; Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference. For all have sinned , and come short of the glory of God . Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus .whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood , to declare his righteousness for remission of sins that are past , through the forebearance of God ; To declare , I say , at this time his righteousness: that he might be just , and justifier of him which believeth in Jesus . Where is boasting then ? It is excluded. By what law ? Of works ? Nay but buy the law of faith . Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law . Is he the God of the Jews only ? Is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes of the Gentiles also . Seeing it is one God , which shall justify the circumcision by faith , and the uncircumcision through faith . Do we make void the law through faith ? God forbid : yea we establish the law .
The law is for Jew and gentiles as so is Gods Salvation. May God bless his word .
Sin is the transgression of the law.
Regardless of race or gender. Sin = death.
Did God need to give a written codified law to Adam and his children?
God talked to them and we do not know exactly what was said.
The standard of sin does not change. God does not change in moral standards.
God does not say it is not sin to lie one day and it is sin the next.
Keeping the sabbath holy is an unchanging standard from the start. This standard does not change.
God's moral standards don't change.
God is Love.
Rom 13:8-10
8 Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. 9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.
Love for God is in the first 4 commandments.
Mat 22:36-40
36 Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 38 This is the first and great commandment. 39 And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. 40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
These laws including the Sabbath was there from the start.
Colossians 2:12-17
King James Version
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.
King James Version
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;
15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days:
17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ.