The essential characteristics of the Biblical Jesus

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
BrotherJustin said:
It seems I don't know what faith is at this point...

for it looks like we have various definitions of 'faith' on the discussion board.
Click to expand...


Frankly, most people don't know what faith is.

Most just ride on the modern definition that it must be blind and without merit.

But....the Biblical definition has always had faith as pertaining to rock-solid truth and conviction...culminating in the Triune Creator.

So...don't let anyone belittle you when you tell them you are taking the Holy Bible on 'faith'.... :)
 
Bowman said:
You are shooting from the hip, again.

Try actually studying the Greek behind the passages that you posited.

You are still attempting to blend-in a modern definition of faith with the Biblical definition – which has always had the meaning, even in the OT, as ‘acting upon established Truth’.

Biblical Faith is an action.

This action of ‘having’, (echōn) is in the sense of ‘wearing’ according to the Greek - which you could have very easily surmised had you bothered to look.

Furthermore, The Trinity is expressed in numerous locations in the Arabic of the Koran, should you ever want to go there...
Click to expand...

Well thank you for the attack, that always makes a person cuddle up to your suggestions after that. Have you ever studied the word reconcile. or exhort? Just to keep the facts straight I have studied the Qur'an, and you are off base by a mile. They do not teach anything but God as His own entity apart and not in the whole of the Triune Godhead. Secondly, my simple question for you would lye in the simple Question Jesus asked many, "Who do you say Jesus is?" Without starting with text to suggest someone elses reasoning for different possibilities. You say you are not loyal to the Bible, or the Qur'an thus, where inlays your inside track to truth based on the scale of Jesus Christ being Lord and king and the only way to the Father, not to mention the way, the truth, and the life?? I have not quite understood your purpose here. But I would as a brother ask you to consider your tone with me, and as a man I would also ask you to consider your tone with me. If you knew me, you would not say, try actually doing (anything).You simply don't know what it is I have done. You are close on one note though, the hip is close to the heart, I am shooting from what lives within it.
 
Last edited:
Bowman said:
Frankly, most people don't know what faith is.

Most just ride on the modern definition that it must be blind and without merit.

But....the Biblical definition has always had faith as pertaining to rock-solid truth and conviction...culminating in the Triune Creator.

So...don't let anyone belittle you when you tell them you are taking the Holy Bible on 'faith'.... :)
Click to expand...

Might I ask what faith is according to your inside-track? Let us examine your truth of faith over Jesus' shall we? Faith in active opposition to common sense is mistaken enthusiasm and narrow-mindedness, and common sense in opposition to faith demonstrates a mistaken reliance on reason as the basis for truth. The life of faith brings the two of these into the proper relationship.

Common sense and faith are as different from each other as the natural life is from the Spiritual, and as impulsiveness is from inspiration. Nothing that Jesus Christ ever said is common sense, but is revelation sense, and is complete, whereas common sense falls short. Yet faith must be tested and tried before it becomes real in your life. "We know all things work together for good...." (Romans 8:28), so that no matter what happens, the transforming power of God's providence (or God's protective care) transforms perfect faith into reality. Faith always works in a personal way, because the purpose of God is to see that perfect faith is made real in His Children. Is this close to your faith definition Bowman? Faith is the entire person in the right relationship with God, thru the power of the Spirit of Jesus Christ. "Who do you say that I am," to whom do you attribute your life by?' Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit, are the only way to the Fathers wisdom, but by it it is given freely as we seek with all our hearts. What is modern faith as you put it? blind without merit? Without merit really?
 
Last edited:
slave said:
Well thank you for the attack, that always makes a person cuddle up to your suggestions after that. Have you ever studied the word reconcile. or exhort? Just to keep the facts straight I have studied the Qur'an, and you are off base by a mile.
Click to expand...

I have studied Koranic Arabic for two decades.

Your knowledge of Koranic Arabic may fill a thimble, at best...



They do not teach anything but God as His own entity apart and not in the whole of the Triune Godhead.
Click to expand...

You seem to be confusing islam with the Koran.

The two are separate entities.

This would be like a Christian asking a Jew for his interpretation on the Tanak.

The Koran, most assuredly, confirms the Biblical Trinity...




Secondly, my simple question for you would lye in the simple Question Jesus asked many, "Who do you say Jesus is?"
Click to expand...

Jesus is my God and my Savior.





Without starting with text to suggest someone elses reasoning for different possibilities. You say you are not loyal to the Bible, or the Qur'an thus, where inlays your inside track to truth based on the scale of Jesus Christ being Lord and king and the only way to the Father, not to mention the way, the truth, and the life?? I have not quite understood your purpose here. But I would as a brother ask you to consider your tone with me, and as a man I would also ask you to consider your tone with me. If you knew me, you would not say, try actually doing (anything).You simply don't know what it is I have done. You are close on one note though, the hip is close to the heart, I am shooting from what lives within it.
Click to expand...


You have drawn an unwarranted inference due to my knowledge of the Koran.

I'm an Orthodox Trinitarian Christian who just happens to also know the Koran just as well as my own scriptures...
 
slave said:
Might I ask what faith is according to your inside-track? Let us examine your truth of faith over Jesus' shall we? Faith in active opposition to common sense is mistaken enthusiasm and narrow-mindedness, and common sense in opposition to faith demonstrates a mistaken reliance on reason as the basis for truth. The life of faith brings the two of these into the proper relationship.

Common sense and faith are as different from each other as the natural life is from the Spiritual, and as impulsiveness is from inspiration. Nothing that Jesus Christ ever said is common sense, but is revelation sense, and is complete, whereas common sense falls short. Yet faith must be tested and tried before it becomes real in your life. "We know all things work together for good...." (Romans 8:28), so that no matter what happens, the transforming power of God's providence (or God's protective care) transforms perfect faith into reality. Faith always works in a personal way, because the purpose of God is to see that perfect faith is made real in His Children. Is this close to your faith definition Bowman? Faith is the entire person in the right relationship with God, thru the power of the Spirit of Jesus Christ. "Who do you say that I am," to whom do you attribute your life by?' Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit, are the only way to the Fathers wisdom, but by it it is given freely as we seek with all our hearts. What is modern faith as you put it? blind without merit? Without merit really?
Click to expand...


Again...

You are taking your definition of 'faith' from a Webster's Dictionary!

If you want to apply 'faith' to the Holy Bible, then you must look at how the word is defined and used in scripture.

You don't strike me as an individual well versed in the original languages....you are more interested in putting together a 'smart-sounding' English sentence, than actually studying the word.
 
In the Lord's Prayer, is 'forgive us our trespasses' or 'forgive us our debts' more accurate?

Is there a difference? If so, is this difference important?
 
BrotherJustin said:
Forgive us our sins, as we forgive those who sin against us?
Click to expand...

in Matthew it's 'debts' (literally in the Greek, i think)

in Luke it's 'sins'. (again, literally)

when we sin, we incur a debt. we owe a death (that's the 'wages of sin')

if we refuse to forgive, it's like we hold an obligation against someone. we won't forgive the debt another incurred.
our sin debt has been forgiven and paid for in Christ.
so we have the ability to forgive others. we needn't hold a debt to anyone's account, just as our debt isn't held against us.

does that make sense? at all?? lol
 
psychomom said:
in Matthew it's 'debts' (literally in the Greek, i think)

in Luke it's 'sins'. (again, literally)

when we sin, we incur a debt. we owe a death (that's the 'wages of sin')

if we refuse to forgive, it's like we hold an obligation against someone. we won't forgive the debt another incurred.
our sin debt has been forgiven and paid for in Christ.
so we have the ability to forgive others. we needn't hold a debt to anyone's account, just as our debt isn't held against us.

does that make sense? at all?? lol
Click to expand...

Yes Ma'am! Thank you :)

Bowman said:
Yup!

Small potatoes compared to the next request in the prayer, to be delivered from Satan!
Click to expand...

"Small potatoes" ;) 'I dig' your idioms, Bowman -- learning some new ones from you!
 
Bowman said:
Again...

You are taking your definition of 'faith' from a Webster's Dictionary!

If you want to apply 'faith' to the Holy Bible, then you must look at how the word is defined and used in scripture.

You don't strike me as an individual well versed in the original languages....you are more interested in putting together a 'smart-sounding' English sentence, than actually studying the word.
Click to expand...

Do you know what my name means Bowman? Daniel means "God is my judge," I like that name because it soothes me to know my judgement will be fair, and not unjust. I am still asking what your point is in this thread? If you are all about the trinity what is your conflict in just supporting the Bible? You do realize Scripture says all are included in heaven if we but believe and receivet? So, why must we look to the Qur'an at all? What flaming arrow burns inside of you to promote such need over what is already complete in Scripture? You have been ignorant of me, why should we believe then you have any inside track to a "newness" of God over everyone whom has followed Scripture to judgment; or of God's insight to include it in the gospel? What are your revelations that add to Scripture, my guess would be that you couldn't answer that specific question forthrightly because it would make vulnerable things not wanting to be exposed.

One common tactic Satan uses to deceive people is to claim new revelations that aren't in the Bible. His bag of tricks includes written "revelations" like the book of Mormon, the Urantia book and the Qur'an. It also includes direct Spiritual revelations like the alleged Marian apparitions. These Extra-Biblical revelations are often very seductive because they offer alleged secret Knowledge that wasn't revealed in the Bible. Books like the Urantia book are even more seductive because of their elaborate, in-depth expose' of the Spiritual world and they alleged Universes beyond our own.

What most people who get caught up in these cults don't realize is who they're matching wits with. Hence, my concern here for people, "And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus." (Philippians 4:7). Most of us like to think we've got reasonably good instincts and that we're pretty good at spotting a phony. We probably can do a pretty good job when matching wits with most other people. Perhaps that gives us a false sense of security that we mistakenly vthinkalso applies to matching wits with the Spiritual world. The problem is when we try to match wits with Satan, he's going to win all of the time if we try to go it alone. It is vital that we live in the wake of righteousness; a right relationship with God, that will, in its wake, guard our hearts and minds. Anything outside of that premise is a doctrine of the anti-god. We must be attentive to the demonic realm being able to play Scripture like a fiddle. They do offer peace, but delusional peace, false peace that can only be maintained for a time.

But God has not left us defenseless against this kind of trickery. He gave us everything in the Bible to separate the wheat from the chaff.

"Ye shall not add unto the Word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you." (Deuteronomy 4:2).

"What thing soever I command you, observe to do it: thou shalt not add there to, nor diminish from it. (Deuteronomy 12:32).

"Every Word of God is pure: He is a shield unto them that put their trust in Him. Add thou not unto His Words, lest He reprove thee, and thou be found a liar."

".....and keep those things which are written therein: For the time is at hand." (Revelations 22:18-19).
 
Last edited:
psychomom said:
in Matthew it's 'debts' (literally in the Greek, i think)

in Luke it's 'sins'. (again, literally)

when we sin, we incur a debt. we owe a death (that's the 'wages of sin')

if we refuse to forgive, it's like we hold an obligation against someone. we won't forgive the debt another incurred.
our sin debt has been forgiven and paid for in Christ.
so we have the ability to forgive others. we needn't hold a debt to anyone's account, just as our debt isn't held against us.

does that make sense? at all?? lol
Click to expand...

Nicely said! Sin is a being; that of the likes of Satan, the anti-god. Sins are the result in us that house this disposition, for by it He (Satan) has over-ruling authority in us to create sin in us, which in time we will to do, this is called the sins, or fruit of sin.
 
Last edited:
C.S. Lewis's preface to Mere Christianity comes to mind:

"I hope no reader will suppose that "mere" Christianity is here put forward as an alternative to the creeds of the existing communions—as if a man could adopt it in preference to Congregationalism or Greek Orthodoxy or anything else. It is more like a hall out of which doors open into several rooms. If I can bring anyone into that hall I shall have done what I attempted. But it is in the rooms, not in the hall, that there are fires and chairs and meals. The hall is a place to wait in, a place from which to try the various doors, not a place to live in. For that purpose the worst of the rooms (whichever that may be) is, I think, preferable.

It is true that some people may find they have to wait in the hall for a considerable time, while others feel certain almost at once which door they must knock at. I do not know why there is this difference, but I am sure God keeps no one waiting unless He sees that it is good for him to wait. When you do get into your room you will find that the long wait has done you some kind of good which you would not have had otherwise. But you must regard it as waiting, not as camping. You must keep on praying for light: and, of course, even in the hall, you must begin trying to obey the rules which are common to the whole house. And above all you must be asking which door is the true one; not which pleases you best by its paint and paneling.

In plain language, the question should never be: "Do I like that kind of service?" but "Are these doctrines true: Is holiness here? Does my conscience move me towards this? Is my reluctance to knock at this door due to my pride, or my mere taste, or my personal dislike of this particular door-keeper?"

When you have reached your own room, be kind to those Who have chosen different doors and to those who are still in the hall. If they are wrong they need your prayers all the more; and if they are your enemies, then you are under orders to pray for them. That is one of the rules common to the whole house."
​

I look at Bowman's view as another room. Just as I do with Mormonism--and pretty much all religious sects.
 
slave said:
Do you know what my name means Bowman? Daniel means "God is my judge," I like that name because it soothes me to know my judgement will be fair, and not unjust.
Click to expand...

Your judgment?

You have some serious theological comprehension issues, brother.

Don't you yet know that the Righteous are NOT judged? Only the unrighteous are judged.

If you think that you are going to be judged, then that means that you think you are not going to Heaven...


John 5.24 -29

Truly, truly, I say to you, The one who hears My Word, and believes the One who has sent Me, has everlasting life, and does not come into judgment, but has passed out of death into life. Truly, truly, I say to you that an hour is coming, and now is, when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God, and the ones hearing will live. For even as the Father has life in Himself, so He gave also to the Son to have life in Himself. And He also gave authority to Him to execute judgment, for He is the Son of Man.Do not marvel at this, for an hour is coming in which all those in the tombswill hear His voice. And they will come out, the ones having practiced good into a resurrection of life; the ones having done evil into a resurrection of judgment.
 
slave said:
I am still asking what your point is in this thread? If you are all about the trinity what is your conflict in just supporting the Bible?
Click to expand...

Perhaps it is time for you to read the OP....as it specifically calls-out for Koranic characteristics of Jesus vs. Biblical ones...




You do realize Scripture says all are included in heaven if we but believe and receivet?
Click to expand...


Show us....





So, why must we look to the Qur'an at all? What flaming arrow burns inside of you to promote such need over what is already complete in Scripture? You have been ignorant of me, why should we believe then you have any inside track to a "newness" of God over everyone whom has followed Scripture to judgment; or of God's insight to include it in the gospel? What are your revelations that add to Scripture, my guess would be that you couldn't answer that specific question forthrightly because it would make vulnerable things not wanting to be exposed.
Click to expand...

Try reading the OP, for the first time...

 
slave said:
One common tactic Satan uses to deceive people is to claim new revelations that aren't in the Bible. His bag of tricks includes written "revelations" like the book of Mormon, the Urantia book and the Qur'an. It also includes direct Spiritual revelations like the alleged Marian apparitions. These Extra-Biblical revelations are often very seductive because they offer alleged secret Knowledge that wasn't revealed in the Bible. Books like the Urantia book are even more seductive because of their elaborate, in-depth expose' of the Spiritual world and they alleged Universes beyond our own.

What most people who get caught up in these cults don't realize is who they're matching wits with. Hence, my concern here for people, "And the peace of God, which transcends all understanding, will guard your hearts and minds in Christ Jesus." (Philippians 4:7). Most of us like to think we've got reasonably good instincts and that we're pretty good at spotting a phony. We probably can do a pretty good job when matching wits with most other people. Perhaps that gives us a false sense of security that we mistakenly vthinkalso applies to matching wits with the Spiritual world. The problem is when we try to match wits with Satan, he's going to win all of the time if we try to go it alone. It is vital that we live in the wake of righteousness; a right relationship with God, that will, in its wake, guard our hearts and minds. Anything outside of that premise is a doctrine of the anti-god. We must be attentive to the demonic realm being able to play Scripture like a fiddle. They do offer peace, but delusional peace, false peace that can only be maintained for a time.

But God has not left us defenseless against this kind of trickery. He gave us everything in the Bible to separate the wheat from the chaff.

"Ye shall not add unto the Word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you." (Deuteronomy 4:2).

"What thing soever I command you, observe to do it: thou shalt not add there to, nor diminish from it. (Deuteronomy 12:32).

"Every Word of God is pure: He is a shield unto them that put their trust in Him. Add thou not unto His Words, lest He reprove thee, and thou be found a liar."

".....and keep those things which are written therein: For the time is at hand." (Revelations 22:18-19).
Click to expand...


Satan was bound at The Cross....thus, any deception would be coming from his demons and not a direct affront from him.

Secondly, the authors who penned the Koran state very plainly that they merely copied the Holy Bible and converted it into Arabic.....so, with an offer like this, it is in our best interest to see how it was done.

Right now.....you are buying, big time, into the Islamic lie...
 
Bowman said:
Secondly, the authors who penned the Koran state very plainly that they merely copied the Holy Bible and converted it into Arabic.....so, with an offer like this, it is in our best interest to see how it was done.
Click to expand...

the claim that the koran is a copied and converted-into-arabic christian bible looks outlandish to me... but, I like to keep an open mind, so I'm willing to check it out.

this is where the verification issue comes up. if I check the two translations at

https://carm.org/quran-4

I find writing that sounds very biblical in many places... but a few key differences, imo.


but I think Bowman says these aren't good translations.

so, I need url's (since this is an intenet forum) that will support the claim.

without other sources, I have to go with the two at carm.org, which don't support the claim.
 
slave said:
Nicely said! Sin is a being; that of the likes of Satan, the anti-god. Sins are the result in us that house this disposition, for by it He (Satan) has over-ruling authority in us to create sin in us, which in time we will to do, this is called the sins, or fruit of sin.
Click to expand...

Nonsense.

Satan has had no authority over anyone since The Cross.

Satan is bound right now.

First, you buy into the Islamic lie.....and now you give more power to Satan than what he deserves!

 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom
Back