The False Doctrine Most Professing Christians are unaware of.

[eternally-gratefull]

First it is not because of simple disagreements he or me have put anybody on ignore, and to claim or act like it was is to ignore the fact on why it was done.

I have 4 people on ignore because of belittling, demeaning, and unedifying statements/words spewed toward me, and even though giving these few people the chance to stop with their tactic's along with the multiple false allegations they would not stop and evening now still slither behind the back and talk about me. Which is against the Word of God !!!

He put you on ignore (I saw what went down) because even though he stated his point with you, you still came back and falsely claimed him to be a legalist who believes the whole 613 written ordinances of the Mosaic law has to be upheld for salvation. He has never said that and multiple times has refuted that in his own posts, and even liked my posts that was refuted that allegation as well.

I have had disagreements with him as well but I am not on ignore because I don't pass false allegations on him, nor do I do it to any of you. But that mud slinging seems to come at us instead of letting things go and understanding the truth.

I have broken down how I believe, teach, and preach multiple times yet a very few still continue saying things on me that is false and that I have never said. For that they are on ignore and will stay on ignore !!!

Just me is a legalist. ben proved it, as have so many others

 

[peacefulbeliever]

I was wondering if that was the only thing that the stranger affiliated with Israel had to adhere to. The scripture is obviously true, then as physical, and now (through the New Covenant) spiritual, by killing the sin. Here is scripture for you to better understand my thoughts.

And all the men of his city shall stone him with stones, that he die: so shalt thou put evil away from among you; and all Israel shall hear, and fear. Deuteronomy 21:21

Therefore remove sorrow from thy heart, and put away evil from thy flesh: for childhood and youth are vanity. Ecclesiastes 11:10

Wash you, make you clean; put away the evil of your doings from before mine eyes; cease to do evil; Isaiah 1:16

Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you. 2 Corinthians 6:17

I can see where all these are related - but I still see it as "literal" - the foreigner, stranger, sojourner to the Isrealites are unbelievers . . . which relates with 2 Cor. 6:17.

Ecc. and Isaiah have more to do with putting away evil from the flesh which would be equivalent to our renewing our minds and walking by the Spirit.

Things in the OT and in the NT SHOULD relate to each other because the NT brings to light the OT.

 

[BenFTW]

First it is not because of simple disagreements he or me have put anybody on ignore, and to claim or act like it was is to ignore the fact on why it was done.

I have 4 people on ignore because of belittling, demeaning, and unedifying statements/words spewed toward me, and even though giving these few people the chance to stop with their tactic's along with the multiple false allegations they would not stop and evening now still slither behind the back and talk about me. Which is against the Word of God !!!

He put you on ignore (I saw what went down) because even though he stated his point with you, you still came back and falsely claimed him to be a legalist who believes the whole 613 written ordinances of the Mosaic law has to be upheld for salvation. He has never said that and multiple times has refuted that in his own posts, and even liked my posts that was refuted that allegation as well.

I have had disagreements with him as well but I am not on ignore because I don't pass false allegations on him, nor do I do it to any of you. But that mud slinging seems to come at us instead of letting things go and understanding the truth.

I have broken down how I believe, teach, and preach multiple times yet a very few still continue saying things on me that is false and that I have never said. For that they are on ignore and will stay on ignore !!!

You did a bad job of observing that conversation if you think that's where it ended. Look here: http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...away-some-his-own-sayings-29.html#post2282614

He even 'liked' that post. We disagreed on how one becomes sanctified in our walk. I said I don't believe it happens through observing the law, but through renewing our minds. You are bearing false witness.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Just me is a legalist. ben proved it, as have so many others

I prefer the term, law cultist.

 

[just-me]

Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. Romans 16:17

I quote this for all to recognize those who demand that certain parts of the word of God are against other parts of His own word, and refuse to comprehend that all of God's words work perfectly, and everlastingly together with no spiritual contradiction.

If those of us who desire to edify each other do this, then the divisive people can talk to the wall, to the wind, and even gossip amongst themselves about those of us who have ignored them, and the people who sincerely want to grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ can start (for once without interference) doing that without divisive interference.

What do you say folks? It might even teach the divisive to repent of their actions, being a "wakeup" call to that end, and be forgiven and ultimately included. If they are eventually sorry for their unwarranted actions, they always have the option to PM and ask for forgiveness, and we will give it because all of God's word is relevant to us.

 

[BenFTW]

First it is not because of simple disagreements he or me have put anybody on ignore, and to claim or act like it was is to ignore the fact on why it was done.

I have 4 people on ignore because of belittling, demeaning, and unedifying statements/words spewed toward me, and even though giving these few people the chance to stop with their tactic's along with the multiple false allegations they would not stop and evening now still slither behind the back and talk about me. Which is against the Word of God !!!

He put you on ignore (I saw what went down) because even though he stated his point with you, you still came back and falsely claimed him to be a legalist who believes the whole 613 written ordinances of the Mosaic law has to be upheld for salvation. He has never said that and multiple times has refuted that in his own posts, and even liked my posts that was refuted that allegation as well.

I have had disagreements with him as well but I am not on ignore because I don't pass false allegations on him, nor do I do it to any of you. But that mud slinging seems to come at us instead of letting things go and understanding the truth.

I have broken down how I believe, teach, and preach multiple times yet a very few still continue saying things on me that is false and that I have never said. For that they are on ignore and will stay on ignore !!!

Also this: http://christianchat.com/bible-discussion-forum/122303-how-spot-legalist-11.html#post2285752

Clearly he didn't like I addressed him in another thread. I agreed to disagree within a particular thread, meaning end of discussion. I didn't say I would stop addressing him all together in every thread. He misunderstood me.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. Romans 16:17

I quote this for all to recognize those who demand that certain parts of the word of God are against other parts of His own word, and refuse to comprehend that all of God's words work perfectly, and everlastingly together with no spiritual contradiction.

If those of us who desire to edify each other do this, then the divisive people can talk to the wall, to the wind, and even gossip amongst themselves about those of us who have ignored them, and the people who sincerely want to grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ can start (for once without interference) doing that without divisive interference.

What do you say folks? It might even teach the divisive to repent of their actions, being a "wakeup" call to that end, and be forgiven and ultimately included. If they are eventually sorry for their unwarranted actions, they always have the option to PM and ask for forgiveness, and we will give it because all of God's word is relevant to us.

You've got a slight public relations problem...

 

[BarlyGurl]

I don't really know what you mean by "follow Hebrew roots"... I follow Christ, who interestingly enough was HEBREW. Paul, the apostle to the gentiles... was also HEBREW, a Roman Citizen and a well educated PHARISEE. Maybe you can help me out and explain what mean in a more detailed manner?

 

[just-us-2]

We have had reasonable discussion. He then became unreasonable and ignored me because I addressed him on a completely different thread (from the one we were having a pleasant discussion on) and he accused me of, for all intents and purposes, "stalking" him. Apparently he can't handle the truth, or too many rebuttals... he ends up folding, unfortunately. I enjoyed our discussions, but it must have been too much for him to bare.

I doubt it was 'too much for him to bare' - he can bear a lot and I have watched him be far more patient discussing things with people than I would be. But then, I seem to have a reputation in cc for being nasty and impatient so who am I to say?

I do know that if one approaches him on his same level - meaning not coming across as if he is an idiot or you (not you personally) act as if he is all messed up because he disagrees with what you believe, that he can put MUCH time and effort into communication - REAL communication with a person.

 

[just-me]

I can see where all these are related - but I still see it as "literal" - the foreigner, stranger, sojourner to the Isrealites are unbelievers . . . which relates with 2 Cor. 6:17.

Ecc. and Isaiah have more to do with putting away evil from the flesh which would be equivalent to our renewing our minds and walking by the Spirit.

Things in the OT and in the NT SHOULD relate to each other because the NT brings to light the OT.

The strangers are actually in relation to us, being Gentiles, both then and now.

The foreigner, stranger, and sojourners had to believe as Israel did in order to belong to the ranks, (spiritual circumcision, if you will), all being governed by God's commandments. The stranger also received he same judgment as Israel when they all (collectively) rebelled against those God given instructions. There was, and is no difference in relation to Paul's teachings. Nevertheless, outside of that, the gist of your post is absolutely correct.

Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile;But glory, honour, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile:" Romans 2:9-10

God has always judged the Jews and Gentiles alike, who were/are together as one body according to their actions, either for Him or against Him, even in the Old Covenant.

 

[BenFTW]

I doubt it was 'too much for him to bare' - he can bear a lot and I have watched him be far more patient discussing things with people than I would be. But then, I seem to have a reputation in cc for being nasty and impatient so who am I to say?

I do know that if one approaches him on his same level - meaning not coming across as if he is an idiot or you (not you personally) act as if he is all messed up because he disagrees with what you believe, that he can put MUCH time and effort into communication - REAL communication with a person.

Which him and I were doing. Then he bailed out, randomly and put me on ignore. He got defensive, for whatever reason.

 

[KennethC]

You did a bad job of observing that conversation if you think that's where it ended. Look here: http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...away-some-his-own-sayings-29.html#post2282614

He even 'liked' that post. We disagreed on how one becomes sanctified in our walk. I said I don't believe it happens through observing the law, but through renewing our minds. You are bearing false witness.

No I am not bearing false witness as the link you gave was to one of your own posts, that he turned around and stated his stance once again right after that where he clearly said studying and believing the law does not put one under it.

That also was not the end of the conversation as the communicating still went on from here !!!

You must learn to read what a person is actually saying besides just seeing what you want to, because there is a physical aspect of the law (written ordinances) and a spiritual aspect of the law (moral standards).

The physical written ordinances have no bearing on true born again believers, but the spiritual meanings and aspects do have things that apply. Even the Lord Jesus showed that love, mercy, and forgiveness was shown in the law, but this was overlooked by the Pharisees and the Jews who focused only on the written ordinance aspect.

To say no morals apply in the new covenant for believers then you can go and throw out walking in love as not needed, but love is called the greatest command to be kept. And it is a command not a suggestion !!!

Walking in love is shown in the NT to keep, uphold, and establish the teachings of the Lord in our lives, not abolish His teachings !!!

I seen you come back and still slap that physical law keeping on him for salvation

 

[peacefulbeliever]

There is no contradiction because you are using two scriptures talking about separate things...........

Hebrews 6:4-8, 10:26-31 is talking about those who are disobedient by continuing in or falling back to a life of willful deliberate sinning.

1 Corinthians 3:12-15 is speaking on the faithfulness of the believer and how much they have done in the faith in the Lord's name.

The only times contradictions gets started up is by misapplying scriptures that are completely not speaking on the same issue.

It is speaking of "works" that I have built upon the foundation of Christ:

works either gold, silver, precious stones = obedience
works either wood, hay, stubble are burnt up = disobedience
everyone goes before the judgment seat of Christ for the work done in this body, whether good (obedience) - gold, silver, precious stones, remain
or bad (disobedience) - wood, hay, stubble are burnt up but he, himself, is saved

Please everyone - I am not saying it is okay to sin for it is NOT - or better said it is BEST for us to be in obedience than in disobedience. Remember we all sin and fall short . . . .

 

[just-me]

You told 'me' in a post that I haven't read, yet you won't tell me to my face here? OK. That tells me you're a sabbath keeper.

You said this in the thread you linked to below:



The HR movement is not a church or an organization, but a current of ideas that various groups and people believe. So far from the questions I've asked you, your beliefs align with HR ideas.

I gave you my answer and even the link. Why do you refuse to read it? I was answering your post, thinking you were interested. Your post was 99. My post was 101. Why did you post if you failed to continue to read the thread? That was only 2 days ago. Here it is again. Take some initiative man. Please. Here. Read it, then stop it. Please. Have some decency.

http://christianchat.com/bible-disc...rnacles-light-new-covenant-6.html#post2289100

 

[just-us-2]

Which him and I were doing. Then he bailed out, randomly and put me on ignore. He got defensive, for whatever reason.

It could well have been a misunderstanding.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

I don't really know what you mean by "follow Hebrew roots"... I follow Christ, who interestingly enough was HEBREW. Paul, the apostle to the gentiles... was also HEBREW, a Roman Citizen and a well educated PHARISEE. Maybe you can help me out and explain what mean in a more detailed manner?

Sounds like you have leanings that way too...

 

[peacefulbeliever]

This is what I was talking about when I said that the sincere, even if they are unlearned, are not separated from the Body of Christ. The ones who knowingly refuse to abide by parts of the Word they find inconvenient or unpleasant are excluded from the Body of Christ - and that I truly believe.

Does this answer my questions?

What do you believe it means to be "born again of the Spirit"? When someone is born again, they are "partakers of the divine nature", does God take that nature back from man when he fails to WALK by the "owner's manual"? Does God stop being a Father? Does God annul the "legal adoption papers"? Am I saying that it is okay to live a sinful life after coming to God? NOPE Every born again believer should strive to obey "the owner's manual".

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Do you believe Christ died to remove the sacrificial system, but not the rules and regulations, and that we remain under the Mosaic Law minus the requirement of sacrifices?

That's Hebrew Roots

 

[BenFTW]

It could well have been a misunderstanding.

Hopefully it gets resolved. Ignoring others is close minded, I am not harassing him. If he felt that way, it was not my intention.

 

[just-us-2]

Does this answer my questions?

What do you believe it means to be "born again of the Spirit"? When someone is born again, they are "partakers of the divine nature", does God take that nature back from man when he fails to WALK by the "owner's manual"? Does God stop being a Father? Does God annul the "legal adoption papers"? Am I saying that it is okay to live a sinful life after coming to God? NOPE Every born again believer should strive to obey "the owner's manual".

God doesn't "undo" or take back - at least I don't think so. My belief is this: God knows all - He is omniscient - so He knows when a person is experiencing a 'false conversion' and therefore, He doesn't need to 'take back' from man when he fails to WALK by the "owner's manual" and certainly doesn't stop being our Heavenly Father. We agree then. I also believe that every (truly) born-again believer should have a burning desire inside to obey the "owner's manual".