The Gospel Of Our Lord Jesus

[Journeyman]

For an unforgiven person (unforgiven by God) to forgive another is like a beggar to give another beggar $10,000...he just doesn't have it within his resources. I believe this is the essence of ...

And when He had said this, He breathed on them and *said to them, "Receive the Holy Spirit. "If you forgive the sins of any, their sins have been forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they have been retained." John 20:22-23 (NASB)

I was pointing out the fact that before we were saved, we understood the concept of forgivness and forgave people who did something to us that they shouldn't have.
Of course the Holy Spirit knows whether someones repentance is genuine and so imparted Him to the Apostles.

or the Spirit searcheth all things 1Cor.2:10

 

[crossnote]

I was pointing out the fact that before we were saved, we understood the concept of forgivness and forgave people who did something to us that they shouldn't have.
Of course the Holy Spirit knows whether someones repentance is genuine and so imparted Him to the Apostles.

or the Spirit searcheth all things 1Cor.2:10

My point was that our forgiveness held no weight before we were saved, even if we understood somewhat what forgiveness entails.
Or, what does it profit an unsaved man if he forgives the whole world (each time he is offended) but loses his own soul?
(You can't forgive your way to heaven).

 

[PennEd]

It is through what Christ did for us that the Father forgives. It is then the Father who forgives, grace is of the Father not of Christ. We would have no forgiveness without Christ, it has always been so. But it is not Christ who forgives, but the Father.

Matthew 9:6
New King James Version
6 But that you may know that the Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins”—then He said to the paralytic, “Arise, take up your bed, and go to your house.”
Jesus can’t forgive sins, and it’s not His Grace you say....
Luke 7:48
New King James Version
48 Then He said to her, “Your sins are forgiven.”

Luke 5:20
New King James Version
20 When He saw their faith, He said to him, “Man, your sins are forgiven you.”

2 Corinthians 8:9
New King James Version
9 For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich.

2 Corinthians 13:14
New King James Version
14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Spirit be with you all. Amen.

 

[Journeyman]

My point was that our forgiveness held no weight before we were saved, even if we understood somewhat what forgiveness entails.
Or, what does it profit an unsaved man if he forgives the whole world (each time he is offended) but loses his own soul?
(You can't forgive your way to heaven).

Jesus told people,

Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven Lk.6:37

And this us how the Eternal Lord lived in his human body. Paul said,

God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. Rom.5:8

Most believers don't realize the gravity of that statement. But if we look at , Rom.5:7, which is the same as Lk.6:27-35, it becomes clear that Paul is saying

while mankind abused God in flesh (we were yet sinners), Jesus endured all of it (Christ died for us).....instead of seeking retribution, lashing out at, killing his enemies. How great is our Lord!

 

[Journeyman]

Crossnote,
Someone just recently showed me that passage from Paul that way and I thought I'd share it with you.

 

[Journeyman]

Matthew 9:6
New King James Version
6 But that you may know that the Son of Man has power on earth to forgive sins”—then He said to the paralytic, “Arise, take up your bed, and go to your house.”
Jesus can’t forgive sins, and it’s not His Grace you say....
Luke 7:48
New King James Version
48 Then He said to her, “Your sins are forgiven.”

Luke 5:20
New King James Version
20 When He saw their faith, He said to him, “Man, your sins are forgiven you.”

2 Corinthians 8:9
New King James Version
9 For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich.

2 Corinthians 13:14
New King James Version
14 The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Spirit be with you all. Amen.

Amen!

The LORD ismerciful and gracious, slow to anger, and plenteous in mercy. Psa.103:8

 

[crossnote]

Crossnote,
Someone just recently showed me that passage from Paul that way and I thought I'd share it with you.

Which passage?

 

[Journeyman]

Which passage?

Rom.5:8

 

[crossnote]

Paul is saying

while mankind abused God in flesh (we were yet sinners), Jesus endured all of it (Christ died for us).....instead of seeking retribution, lashing out at, killing his enemies. How great is our Lord!

Ok, that would be His passive obedience (the suffering He endured), but remember, there is also His active obedience (His love towards God His Father and towards man). ALL His obedience (both passive and active) were put to our account (imputed) as a free gift received by faith in Jesus Christ.

For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Romans 5:19

 

[Journeyman]

Ok, that would be His passive obedience (the suffering He endured), but remember, there is also His active obedience (His love towards God His Father and towards man). ALL His obedience (both passive and active) were put to our account (imputed) as a free gift received by faith in Jesus Christ.

For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Romans 5:19

 

[Forcemyhand]

John 14:6-7, “יהושע said to him, “I am the Way, and the Truth, and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me. If you had known Me, you would have known My Father too. From now on you know Him, and have seen.”



2 John 1:9-11, “Everyone who is transgressing and not staying in the teaching of Messiah does not possess the Mighty One. The one who stays in the teaching of Messiah possesses both the Father and the Son. If anyone comes to you and does not bring this teaching, do not receive him into your house nor greet him, for he who greets him shares in his wicked works.”

 

[Journeyman]

Ok, that would be His passive obedience (the suffering He endured), but remember, there is also His active obedience (His love towards God His Father and towards man). ALL His obedience (both passive and active) were put to our account (imputed) as a free gift received by faith in Jesus Christ.

For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.
Romans 5:19

Yes, but Paul is saying many are made righteous by a faith that humbly follows Jesus. Paul's teachings have been mangled into dogma that was never intended by him. Paul never meant that since the law makes us aware of our sinfulness, "there's nothing we can do to be saved." Jesus never taught that his righteousness is imputed to people who don't do what he says.

 

[crossnote]

Yes, but Paul is saying many are made righteous by a faith that humbly follows Jesus.

Where does Paul say that?
Rather he says...
Romans 4:9-10 (KJV) Cometh this blessedness then upon the circumcision only, or upon the uncircumcision also? for we say that faith was reckoned to Abraham for righteousness. How was it then reckoned? when he was in circumcision, or in uncircumcision? Not in circumcision, but in uncircumcision.
and as I mentioned...
Romans 5:19 (KJV) For as by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

Paul's teachings have been mangled into dogma that was never intended by him.

This seems to be your opinion. Can you clarify? Which teachings?

Paul never meant that since the law makes us aware of our sinfulness, "there's nothing we can do to be saved."

No, but he says this...
Romans 3:20 (KJV) Therefore by the deeds of the law there shall no flesh be justified in his sight: for by the law is the knowledge of sin.

Galatians 2:16 (KJV) Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Galatians 3:22 (KJV) But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

Jesus never taught that his righteousness is imputed to people who don't do what he says.

Here is what Jesus/Holy Spirit taught Paul regarding that...

Romans 4:4-7 (KJV) Now to him that worketh is the reward not reckoned of grace, but of debt. But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness. Even as David also describeth the blessedness of the man, unto whom God imputeth righteousness without works, Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

Otherwise you are turning the GIFT of salvation into something we do.

 

[Journeyman]

Where does Paul say that?

Crossnote,
I don't want to detract from the focus of this thread. With your permission, I'll reprint your last post entirely tomorrow in a new thread entitled, "Paul's Writings". Is that ok?

 

[crossnote]

Crossnote,
I don't want to detract from the focus of this thread. With your permission, I'll reprint your last post entirely tomorrow in a new thread entitled, "Paul's Writings". Is that ok?

Sure thing. But the Title of this thread is The Gospel of Jesus Christ. What I posted was central to the Gospel as revealed to Paul by Jesus Christ for the Gentiles.

Romans 16:25-26 NKJV
[25] Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began [26] but now made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith-

Perhaps tomorrow you can also define what you mean by "The Gospel of Jesus Christ".

 

[John146]

Yes, but Paul is saying many are made righteous by a faith that humbly follows Jesus. Paul's teachings have been mangled into dogma that was never intended by him. Paul never meant that since the law makes us aware of our sinfulness, "there's nothing we can do to be saved." Jesus never taught that his righteousness is imputed to people who don't do what he says.

Christ's righteousness is imputed to the believer. It's a one shot deal. No works are involved to get it, and no works are involved to keep it. Once you are placed in Christ, made a new creature, born again, there's no undoing who you are.

 

[crossnote]

Christ's righteousness is imputed to the believer. It's a one shot deal. No works are involved to get it, and no works are involved to keep it. Once you are placed in Christ, made a new creature, born again, there's no undoing who you are.

You never heard that we are saved by works? ...His Work! LOL

 

[Journeyman]

Crossnote and John146,
I defined what the gospel of our Lord is in the OP. It was my mistake to take a statement by Paul and relate it to a statement made by Jesus, because now this thread is turning into "What did Paul mean", instead of what Jesus said and did without controversy. There are many things Jesus said and did that we all agree on, so please lets just leave it at that here. I'll create the thread for Pauls writings later today.

 

[crossnote]

Crossnote and John146,
I defined what the gospel of our Lord is in the OP. It was my mistake to take a statement by Paul and relate it to a statement made by Jesus, because now this thread is turning into "What did Paul mean", instead of what Jesus said and did without controversy. There are many things Jesus said and did that we all agree on, so please lets just leave it at that here. I'll create the thread for Pauls writings later today.

Just curious, do you believe there are two Gospels? One that saves and one that...?

 

[FlyingDove]

The Gospel - Good News - Good Tidings.

Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words: GOSPEL
In the NT it denotes the "good tidings" of the Kingdom of God and of salvation through Christ, to be received by faith, on the basis of His expiatory death, His burial, resurrection, and ascension,

The Gospel - Good News - Good Tidings of Jesus the Christ:
1 Cor 15:
1 Moreover, brethren, "I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you", which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
(NOTE: "I declare unto you the GOSPEL which I/Paul preached to you")

2 "By which also ye are saved", if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
(NOTE: "By which also ye are saved")

3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how """that Christ died for our sins""" according to the scriptures;
(NOTE: Is "that Christ died for our sins". Paying sins required wage/price =Death. See Rom 6:23-A)

4 And """that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day""" according to the scriptures:
(NOTE: "that Jesus was buried/proof he died. And that Jesus rose again the third day/ Father's receipt, sins payment received % accepted)

Recap: "the gospel which I preached unto you" "by which you are saved" is "that Christ died for your sins" "that he was buried" and that he rose again the 3rd day")

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
(NOTE: By GRACE we are saved thru faith)

Titus 2:11 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
(NOTE: GRACE has a name = Jesus!)

Rom 5:
1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
(NOTE: Justified = Judicially declared righteousness by a sovereign creator God)

2 By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand, and rejoice in hope of the glory of God.
NOTE: We access God's GRACE/Jesus sin payment, thru faith placed in Jesus faithful/obedient sin atoning work) Amen