The perennial Acts 2.38 confusion .
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It doesn't have to mention Water like Paul said he wished everyone Spoke in Tongues. Not everyone does. Had God called you to Preach and Teach, you wouldn't be an obvious keyboard warrior lacking knowledge!
I'm just a little more precise on the word of God ,than I used to be . I too used to read without discernment.
My point was, before I received a phone call pertaining to a Member of the Church, was that these men are charged with the Teachings and Preaching they pass onto their flock. And dying /being buried in Christ has been both by Water example and Spiritual in meaning. I just want to know how you've eliminated the Water from being [buried] like Christ? I agree there is a Spiritual meaning behind it, but it happens in a physical sense through Water.
Amen!
We all grow in God and the Word becomes clearer and more precise in our daily walk.
But you've eliminated one of the focus points that Christ Himself fulfilled. He Died/Buried/Resurrected by Water Baptism to kick off His Earthly Ministry before He literally Died/Buried/Resurrected Spiritually.
No . You've picked up some false teaching there. There's no water in Romans . Come on Romans is about soteriology. It would be there explicitly.
The problem is your usage of man made categories which are just that, man made and not Biblical.
I've showed you from scripture . Let's look together. Lets see if we see any H2o .
Eph 1 ( The same author as Romans )
13¶In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
14Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
( No splashy splashy there to be saved )
1 cor 1.21 . Let's see what pleases God . Surely obedience through water? Let's see .
21For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
Absent.
How about Romans as we said before ?
Surely this is the place to be sure ?
8But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
Completely dry here .
I don't find what you are saying ?
Colossians 2: 12
being buried with Him in the immersion, in which you also rose with [Him] through the faith of the working of God, who raised Him out of the dead.
Romans 6:3
Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
Romans 6:4
We were therefore buried with Him through baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may walk in newness of life.
Again your assuming splish splash . But its bone dry .
11¶In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ:
12Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him THROUGH the faith of the OPERATION OF GOD , who hath raised him from the dead.
13And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;
When you see the word ' baptism ' in those verses , Its referring to this.
¶For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.
13For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
The baptism of Colossians 2:12 is by “the operation of God” who raised Christ from the dead, not “the operation of the pastor or evangelist” who immerses the subject in water. Saving baptism is Spirit baptism. Water baptism is a figure of this saving baptism.
There's several forms of Baptism, Water-Spirit are just 2 of them. But the act of dying and being buried has always been Water Baptism. The act of Salvation and filled with the Holy Spirit is Spiritual Baptism. No one DIES and is BURIED in Spiritual Baptism. That act is through Water Baptism.
Buried with Christ in Baptism (6:4a)
"We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death...." (6:4a)
The term "buried with" in verse 4 is a compound verb, sunthaptō from sun-, "with" + thaptō, "to bury someone."97 G.R. Beasley-Murray observes that the text does not say: buried like him, but buried with him, that is, "we were laid with him in his grave in Jerusalem. So, too, the death he died on the cross was our death, also." In some places Paul speaks of Christ's death as our substitute. However, here he speaks of Christ as our representative. His death as our representative was accepted as our death, so that when he died, we died. 98
Paul uses the images of both burial and rising to life as he speaks of baptism both here and in a related passage (Colossians 2:12). This imagery is clearly tied to baptism by immersion. Being immersed or dipped into the water carries the image of burial. Coming up out of the water following baptism carries the image of resurrection, rising out of one's grave to new life.
"We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death...." (6:4a)
The term "buried with" in verse 4 is a compound verb, sunthaptō from sun-, "with" + thaptō, "to bury someone."97 G.R. Beasley-Murray observes that the text does not say: buried like him, but buried with him, that is, "we were laid with him in his grave in Jerusalem. So, too, the death he died on the cross was our death, also." In some places Paul speaks of Christ's death as our substitute. However, here he speaks of Christ as our representative. His death as our representative was accepted as our death, so that when he died, we died. 98
Paul uses the images of both burial and rising to life as he speaks of baptism both here and in a related passage (Colossians 2:12). This imagery is clearly tied to baptism by immersion. Being immersed or dipped into the water carries the image of burial. Coming up out of the water following baptism carries the image of resurrection, rising out of one's grave to new life.
Precious friend, truth be known, I used to believe this visual {by sight?}
symbolism, but kept digging and searching God's Word Of Truth, and FOUND:
Only trouble is with symbolic interpretation is that, as the "baptismal
regenerationists" told us, water MUST "be INFERRED" for it "to fit" Into
Romans 6! And, Then, THERE IS NO symbolism, at least not in U.S. protestant traditions! In South America {Contrary to your "water symbolizes crucifixion"},
THEY do, as they "carry crosses, and mutilate themselves" to symbolize:
Rom_6:6 "Knowing this, that our old man is Crucified With HIM..."
Even you, my Precious friend, would "raise hands in horror"
at such a practice In the church, right?
So sorry, Only The Holy Spirit Of God Can BAPTIZE {Identify} one {spiritually},
Into The Death, Burial {THREE Days! *}, And Resurrection, AND Place them Into
The {Spiritual} Organism, The Body Of CHRIST, Seated In The Heavenlies!
Physical water has no such spiritual powers = It IS "The OPERATION Of God!"
Thus, Under GRACE, {where we SHOULD ( "...walk by faith, NOT by sight:.. )
(2_Cor_5:7 KJB!), symbolism FAILS, But God's ONE Baptism supercedes/
replaces the OT "ritual of water," for the "priesthood of Israel" {see #'s
4, 9, and 10 here: 12 baptisms }, being found in God's NEW Message Of:
The Preaching Of JESUS CHRIST, According To The Revelation Of The MYSTERY!
The Gospel Of The PURE GRACE/MERCY Of God! = ONE apostle, Paul!!
Not to be Confused With, BUT:
Rightly Divided (2_Timothy_2:15 KJB!) From “Things That DIFFER!”:
God's Other Program of prophecy/law for The TWELVE tribes of
ISRAEL, with TWELVE apostles, and the gospel of the kingdom.
So, yes, there are a FEW of us stuck in "dual gospels," because
we FIND them BOTH In God's Word Of Truth, BUT we DO NOT
"marry" them TOGETHER INTO one {causing MASS Confusion}!:
God's Approval/TWO Different Gospels
* q: How does "holding one for a second under water symbolize" burial,
When Jesus HIMSELF Said:
Mat 12:39 "But He answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas:
Mat 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth."
Good-bye symbolism? "( we walk by faith, NOT by sight: )," Correct?
+
"raise hands, Again, in horror"?:
About tradition of "immersion" = How is putting young/middle-aged women
into the baptistry Any DIFFERENT than the world, that has wet T-shirt contests
at UNgodly liquor establishments? Did Not COMMAND us to:
"Be NOT conformed to the world" (Romans 12 : 2 KJB!)? God's OPERATION, Or:
man's symbolism? I believe all KNOW "my" choice by now, Correct?
Be Blessed!