The sabbath cults - making an idol of the sabbath.

[Grandpa]

Where does it say in the bible that resting in Christ takes the place of the Sabbath?

Hebrews 4:9-10
[SUP]9 [/SUP]There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
[SUP]10 [/SUP]For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.

What rest?

Matthew 11:28-29

[SUP]28 [/SUP]Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

[SUP]29 [/SUP]Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

Galatians 3:21-22

[SUP]21 [/SUP]Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law.
[SUP]22 [/SUP]But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

Galatians 3:24-25

[SUP]24 [/SUP]Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

[SUP]25 [/SUP]But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

We were all under the law, the shadow, until we come to Christ. But when we come to Christ, by faith, we are under the Light. We have come out from the shadow. The shadow had its glory but it was not as glorious as the Lord Jesus Christ who came to save us from condemnation and death.

Hebrews 7:12 For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.

Hebrews 7:18-19

[SUP]18 [/SUP]For there is verily a disannulling of the commandment going before for the weakness and unprofitableness thereof.

[SUP]19 [/SUP]For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God.


The change in the law is not for those who are still working at it. The change in the Law is for those who have come to Christ and have seen His Work in them. One person can't just tell another person that they aren't under the law and they should quit working at it. Something has to happen. The Lord Jesus Christ has to change you and you have to be aware of this change before you know that you aren't under the law, and its condemnation, anymore. If you are double minded and don't quite believe that the Lord Jesus Christ has changed you then you will attempt to establish your own righteousness and "obedience" through your understanding of the law. If you are working at the law in a physical way, as the people who practice Judaism do, your understanding is a carnal understanding. You haven't come to the Wisdom and Knowledge of Our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. You haven't recieved rest. Or you have become entangled again in the yoke of bondage, against the warnings of Galatians...

 

[Elin]

God have mercy on this sick and twisted people that say abiding in the government of our Creator is a cult. Give us the grace and wisdom to know the truth from a lie.

Does that include the wisdom of the Creator in Mt 22:31-33; Heb 7:11-12, 18-19, 8:13; Ro 13: 8, 9, 10, etc.?

 

[KohenMatt]

If Jesus picked corn on Sabbath, then i think its ok for me to pick corn on Sabbath. Jesus said if our donkey falls in a ditch on Sabbath, to pull it out. Then if my donkey falls in ditch on Sabbath i will pull it out. Have a wonderful Sabbath.

And there's nothing wrong with those, as there were so Sabbath restrictions on those.

 

[Elin]

When someone does what the Lord wants him to do, he is an idolator. While if another follows the dogmas dreamed up by fleshy minds, he is a believer in good standing. Yes, there is a spirit of delusion upon the earth causing those who loved evil to believe lies. This, of course does not apply to those who are ignorant of what they are doing, so please do not come back with some kind of accusation that I judge others to condemnation. This too would be a lie.

What the Lord wants him to do is believe the revelation of the Son spoken in these last days (Heb 1:1-2)
through the NT writers, where we find Mt 22:37-40; 1Co 9:20-21; Heb 7:11-12, 18-19, 8:3; Ro 13:8-10, etc.

 

[Elin]

I love these threads!
It brings people who never read their Bibles and just listen to provfessional hypnotist Jesuits who run their church, and gather them to see what God really says.

Homework for you Bible readers.
(those who do not read and study, it wont matter what you do, you WILL take the mark of the beast)

Look up all the Bible verses on OBEDIENCE to Gods word
now
look up and see if SABBATH is in the word of God

then find me one text that says we should not longer keep the Sabbath but we should worship on sunday
and then show me the text that says God will bless those who keep the changed day.

Heb 7:18-19, 8:3.

Now find me the text that says God is Trinity.

no one but pagan Roman Babylon sun worshippers worshipped on the day of the sun before 321
after 321 Constantine the demon possessed king
passed a law to have the WORLD worship on sunday and that aall who
JUDAIZE and follow the BIBLE INSTEAD should be killed.

that is where sunday came from

You don't know the NT.

 

[Elin]

Sounds good in print (ISLAGIATT) but there are three minor problems...

1) Christ was not raised from the dead on Sunday.

2) The Bible NOWHERE suggests Sunday worship.

3) The New Testament shows no examples of sunday worship.

If you check into history, you find that you can thank Constantine and the Council of Nicea for legislating Sunday worship.

You really don't know the NT!

 

[john832]

Heb 7:18-19, 8:3.

Now find me the text that says God is Trinity.


You don't know the NT.

OK, how about showing us in the New Testament where it says NOT to keep the Sabbath, but rather to keep the first day of the week.

 

[Elin]

OK, how about showing us in the New Testament where it says NOT to keep the Sabbath, but rather to keep the first day of the week.

Heb 4:4-12, 7:18-19, 8:3; Mt 22:40; Ro 13:8, 9, 10, etc.

How about showing us in the NT where it says God is not Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

 

[KohenMatt]

Heb 4:4-12, 7:18-19, 8:3; Mt 22:40; Ro 13:8, 9, 10, etc.

How about showing us in the NT where it says God is not Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

All of those verses speak of something greater (which there is).

None of them say to not celebrate the Sabbath.

 

[Elin]

All of those verses speak of something greater (which there is).

None of them say to not celebrate the Sabbath.

You do not understand that a shadow is unnecessary when you have the reality of it?

Is the reality of it not enough?

Therein is the problem.

 

[KohenMatt]

You do not understand that a shadow is unnecessary when you have the reality of it?

Is the reality of it not enough?

Therein is the problem.

Is the reality enough for what?

 

[MidniteWelder]

Is the reality enough for what?

...forever

 

[KohenMatt]

...forever

But what is it enough for, forever?

Enough for Salvation?
Enough for righteousness?
Enough for Dinner?

 

[MidniteWelder]

But what is it enough for, forever?

Enough for Salvation?
Enough for righteousness?
Enough for Dinner?

Good question KohenMatt,

Jesus already came
Jesus is Lord of the sabbath
With the establishment of the Old Testament Law, the Jews were constantly "laboring" to make themselves acceptable to God.
But that's the thing, they placed the word higher than the author of the word.
Placing Faith in the law instead of Faith in the lawmaker...
The final Authority the one who can change the law or repeal the law.
In a word you could suggest it was more bible idolatry.
Weird kind of paradox I know, but still true on its own way.
Because we weren't to make mosaic law higher than the Law of Love.

We see Christ kept all the commandments except broke the Sabbath commandment, gathering food on the sabbath which was forbidden.
Why keep the other 9 as well even when one fellow asked, what must I do to inherit the kingdom...
Jesus' reply was ....keep the commandments, but the Sabbath was not mentioned.
Jesus is the Sabbath, and when Jesus said the son of man is Lord of the Sabbath.
He noted something else and said.
The Sabbath was made for man.
To keep the Sabbath holy does this mean to keep Christ holy in our hearts and minds?
To not ridicule blaspheme or put him back on the cross again by taking for granted his sacrifice for our mercy.

In the OT they thought their labors and efforts granted them access to heaven.
We hear people of today saying..The Law doesnt Save,
Every time I hear this I stop and think...yeah duh
When did it ever?
It never did to begin with.
It was following God that did, it was always following God by Faith and not by sight.
We are shown that we are saved in the NT the very same as Abraham was saved in the OT and accredited to him as righteousness and accounted as perfect by the Lord himself.
His Faith.
And as Elin has mentioned because of Abraham's blind faith in God he obeyed without question.
The New Covenant...Lol to me makes it appear as if Christ reworded what people didn't understand.
And merely took away instant judgement in favor of being judged at a later date.
Because we do all get judged later don't we? We're not so special to think we are exempt from the great white throne judgement day.
Instead of getting stoned to death now...we're granted mercy and a chance to change and repent.
The principles of God still hold the same.
Accountability was not taken away....we still will have to answer for every word we have spoken.
If there is nothing to abide by, no guideline
What are we accountable to?
what do we get judged by?
Christ said he didn't come to abolish the law but to fulfill it.

I can see Christ fulfilled the Sabbath rest.
Paul said we're not under the law, we UPHOLD THE LAW
We uphold it by the same way Christ did
We live it.
Since we as humans are so dull, (as Jesus put it ) we need something to be accountable to.

From what I see,

When Christ gave up the Ghost he said it is finished and all his labors were complete.
With the New covenant we no longer have to labor for salvation, even though what is...
...EXPECTED of us is to make ourselves a living sacrifice unto him.

When God was finished with creation he rested on the seventh day from his labors
Christ after performing the ultimate sacrifice, was sat down and rested at the right hand of God
—ceased from His labor of atonement because there was nothing more to be done, ever.
Satan didn't have justification to kill Christ because there was no sin in Christ. Although when Christ was crucified it bit the devils plan in the butt because Jesus then released sin from death.
While Christ's body was in the grave Christ's spirit took back the keys of hell and death from Satan.
This aspect of what Christ did for us is a very important factor because it shows Satan did(past tense) have this power until Christ took it away from him and changed everything.

Because of what He did, we no longer have to "labor" in law-keeping in order to be justified in the sight of God. Jesus was sent so that we might rest in Him and in what He has provided.

The previous sacrifices were offered in leading up to the ultimate sacrifice of Christ on the cross, who "after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever no further sacrifice was necessary since you can't improve upon perfection.

(I'm sure God didn't like we saw it of no consequence to slaughter his animals to atone for our sins
to make an innocent thing pay for what we've done
until it turned into such a desensitized ritual that they started selling your prepaid atonement sacrificial doves at the temple turning Gods house into a den of thieves.
Robbing from God what was suppose to be holy.
Sacrifice was not reduced to nothing more than a ritual.
For instance always keep the Sabbath Holy and it was no longer.
The sacrifices meant nothing to them except for as a means justification and excuse to keep on sinning.
They had no remorse which God had hoped they would at least feel bad for the sacrifice of sins.
when Christ came and they killed him as the innocent one instead of accepting accountability for themselves.
He was the ultimate sacrifice.
and then they finally felt bad. Even Judas
but in a similar way we are not to view Christs sacrifice in paying for our sins to use as an excuse to sin
so by we keep the sabbath holy
lest we are putting Christ back on the cross again turning back into thieves trying to rob what we want for ourselves taking for granted the mercy God provided without cost.
When a friend sacrifices of themselves for your sake, how much do you appreciate that?
And when God makes a sacrifice, a holy and perfect one, how much more should we.

​

​

Our rest is in him...forever

 

[Allin]

The sabbath was given to nation of Israel, the sabbath cults claim this was a creation ordinance which is highly debatable.

What is not debatable is the position of a Christian - dead the the Law:

(Gal 2:19 KJV) For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God.


(Rom 7:4 KJV) Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God.

And just in case there is any confusion about which law a Christian is dead to Paul tells us exactly which Law he's speaking of:

(Rom 7:7 KJV)............for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

So clearly the law of Moses is in view when Paul states we are dead to it.

The sabbath cults claim "you Christians keep nine but omit the fourth" - that may be so but keeping the "nine" in itself is also a denial that a Christian is DEAD to the law.

Not one of these sabbath cults can explain how a Christan can be dead to the law and alive to it at the same time by attempting to keep it.

Neither can they explain how they can be married to Christ and Moses at the same time - ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another. This is either bigamy or adultery - take your pick.

(1 Tim 1:7 KJV) Desiring to be teachers of the law; understanding neither what they say, nor whereof they affirm.

(1 Tim 1:8 KJV) But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

(1 Tim 1:9 KJV) Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

The sabbath promoters are proclaiming themselves to be "lawless and disobedient".

The sabbath promoters are proclaiming that the "ministration of death" has now become the "ministration of life" in Christ.

(2 Cor 3:7 KJV) But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

(2 Cor 3:8 KJV) How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

(2 Cor 3:9 KJV) For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

(Gal 6:2 KJV) Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

I agree. I think one of the reasons we were given the Law first is because we understand law all too well. Almost everything is law now: do this, don't do that. I used to go to Sabbath churches with my parents when I was younger. Summer camp was where we had the least amount of 'laws', and the ones we had (like sneaking out at night, etc.) we broke. "Bear one another's burdens and so fulfill the Law of Christ" or the Law of Love. It's always easier to fulfill the Law rather than keep doing it with no end in sight.

 

[Hoffco]

No matter who we are we all need the laws of God to live a good peaceful life, to have a government that is "full of liberty and justice for all" is based on the ten Com. of God. Please stop fighting God. Love Hoffco

 

[Allin]

No matter who we are we all need the laws of God to live a good peaceful life, to have a government that is "full of liberty and justice for all" is based on the ten Com. of God. Please stop fighting God. Love Hoffco

I didn't read all the posts here, but I think everyone agrees that we need the laws and the Ten Commandment (which are to the unsaved 'Laws of Conscience'). There are different types of laws, so when that isn't explained, people can be saying the same things and end up arguing for not knowing it. The Law is good because God made it, but bondage because of or from the Law isn't good. Paul said, "You, being dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He has made alive together with Him, having forgiven you all trespasses, having wiped out the handwriting of requirements that was against us, which was contrary to us. And He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross" (Col. 2). That's talking about the Law; but the key words there are <that the handwriting> "was against us" and "was contrary to us". So, the Law is good; but when it causes bondage, it becomes bad. Though Paul was talking about one kind of Law there (the Old Covenant), this same passage fits any other laws (spiritual, physics, etc.) that are in place and that, though good, can be against us (e.g. 'what goes up must come down' is a good law... until it causes hurt and then it is "against us" in that instant or has a bad outcome though still a good law). Many different kinds of Law; all Law is good, but even good laws can be "hostile to us"... except the Law that fulfills all these partial laws which is "the Law of Christ" or just Love.

 

[Hoffco]

But, God says the law gives our liberty and justice and happiness. Please don't say, God's laws cause bondage. AND, the "conscience of lOST men is not the ten commands. the conscience can be,,"i must kill my neighbor because of my custom. But custom can be very very wrong. Love Hoff

 

[KohenMatt]

We see Christ kept all the commandments except broke the Sabbath commandment, gathering food on the sabbath which was forbidden.

Actually, Jesus didn't break it. The Sabbath forbid gathering. Jesus and His disciples were eating. The Pharisees however saw it differently.

Why keep the other 9 as well even when one fellow asked, what must I do to inherit the kingdom...
Jesus' reply was ....keep the commandments, but the Sabbath was not mentioned.

Just because Jesus didn't mention it here doesn't mean He was saying not to do it at all. He didn't need to reiterate everything because He(God) had already instructed it in the OT. Unless God says not to do something, you keep doing it.

In football terms, "Play till the whistle blows."

In the OT they thought their labors and efforts granted them access to heaven.
We hear people of today saying..The Law doesnt Save,
Every time I hear this I stop and think...yeah duh
When did it ever?
It never did to begin with.
It was following God that did, it was always following God by Faith and not by sight.
We are shown that we are saved in the NT the very same as Abraham was saved in the OT and accredited to him as righteousness and accounted as perfect by the Lord himself.
His Faith.

If the Law was never intended to save, and Abraham was saved by belief, then why does Paul spend so much time telling the Pharisees the Law doesn't save? Because they falsely thought it did. If it was never intended to save, yet God keeps telling His people to do it, He's saying that it doesn't conflict with grace.

Christ said he didn't come to abolish the law but to fulfill it.

I can see Christ fulfilled the Sabbath rest.
Paul said we're not under the law, we UPHOLD THE LAW
We uphold it by the same way Christ did
We live it.
Since we as humans are so dull, (as Jesus put it ) we need something to be accountable to.

Just a small clarification, Jesus didn't just say He fulfilled it, He told His disciples to do the Law and to teach others to do it as well. We can't just spiritualize the Law when Jesus said to do it as well.

From what I see,

When Christ gave up the Ghost he said it is finished and all his labors were complete.
With the New covenant we no longer have to labor for salvation, even though what is...
...EXPECTED of us is to make ourselves a living sacrifice unto him.

When God was finished with creation he rested on the seventh day from his labors
Christ after performing the ultimate sacrifice, was sat down and rested at the right hand of God
—ceased from His labor of atonement because there was nothing more to be done, ever.
Satan didn't have justification to kill Christ because there was no sin in Christ. Although when Christ was crucified it bit the devils plan in the butt because Jesus then released sin from death.
While Christ's body was in the grave Christ's spirit took back the keys of hell and death from Satan.
This aspect of what Christ did for us is a very important factor because it shows Satan did(past tense) have this power until Christ took it away from him and changed everything.

Because of what He did, we no longer have to "labor" in law-keeping in order to be justified in the sight of God. Jesus was sent so that we might rest in Him and in what He has provided.

The previous sacrifices were offered in leading up to the ultimate sacrifice of Christ on the cross, who "after He had offered one sacrifice for sins forever no further sacrifice was necessary since you can't improve upon perfection.

(I'm sure God didn't like we saw it of no consequence to slaughter his animals to atone for our sins
to make an innocent thing pay for what we've done
until it turned into such a desensitized ritual that they started selling your prepaid atonement sacrificial doves at the temple turning Gods house into a den of thieves.
Robbing from God what was suppose to be holy.
Sacrifice was not reduced to nothing more than a ritual.
For instance always keep the Sabbath Holy and it was no longer.
The sacrifices meant nothing to them except for as a means justification and excuse to keep on sinning.
They had no remorse which God had hoped they would at least feel bad for the sacrifice of sins.
when Christ came and they killed him as the innocent one instead of accepting accountability for themselves.
He was the ultimate sacrifice.
and then they finally felt bad. Even Judas
but in a similar way we are not to view Christs sacrifice in paying for our sins to use as an excuse to sin
so by we keep the sabbath holy
lest we are putting Christ back on the cross again turning back into thieves trying to rob what we want for ourselves taking for granted the mercy God provided without cost.
When a friend sacrifices of themselves for your sake, how much do you appreciate that?
And when God makes a sacrifice, a holy and perfect one, how much more should we.

​

​

Our rest is in him...forever

And I agree with just about everything you said here. Obedience to the Sabbath or Law cannot, and never was intended to earn salvation. So if folks are following the Law for that purpose, then they're works are useless. But just because some people misinterpreted the Law and it's purpose doesn't mean it is done away with completely. It still serves a purpose for us today, and we are still told to follow it, just not for salvation's sake.

 

[Hoffco]

SIN makes bondage, breaking God's holy laws make bondage , not keeping God's laws, If it were not for sin, our sal. would be by law keeping. as Paul argues. Love. Hoff