Tired of church...

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ijustwanttheTruth said:
Is it just me? or are the majority of churches nowadays just a big show.

i think i know why unbelievers hate church. i think it all seems really phoney. it seems like a bunch of people performing. it's a formula. the music and the standing and the clapping and the sitting down and the skit and the sermon. it's all the same. where's the power in it?

i went to church this week for the first time in a long time. i have been to so many churches in my life and maybe i'm a little bit on the jaded side. but. here are some of my observations from this service:

the worship is LOUD.
thoughts: ok. why does the music have to be deafening to be powerful? why do we need the drums and the electric guitars and the volume all the way up? Does not God's presence supersede the excitement of a rock concert? why do we need music behind a prayer to emphasize it? can't we ever just shut up and let God show up?

observation number 2. the pastor is loud.
why do so many men feel the need to shout in order for their point to be heard? why do we hire some man and pay him every week in tithes to come up with some sort of inspirational speech? why can't a group of believers merely come together and read from the word and each speak what they hear the spirit of God saying?

in a room that small? we wouldn't even need a sound system. we would be heard just speaking normally. but no. they plug in the microphone and turn up the volume so loud. why?!

and people. PLEASE. church is not a place for your cell phones. turn them off. stop filming in the middle of worship! this is not a video for you to share on fb. this is supposed to be a private relational moment between creator God and His beloved ones. filming is completely inappropriate unless there is some preexisting media outlet that has been agreed upon to share with the world. THIS. IS NOT A SHOW.

why do we need dorky programs and christmas pageants and entertaining clips? if i wanted entertainment, i would turn on my tv! i am SO churched out. can't we ever just put a stop to the noise? can't church just be a place for believers to come and hear from God? why is it such a show? and why are there 23 fake plants on that stage?

are they decorating for me? are they decorating for God?
i am SURE that their motives for these things are good. but the atmosphere it produces is one where i am extremely uncomfortable. 'SOMEBODY SHOUT 'TIMETABLE!''
'turn to your neighbor and give them your best 'unripened fruit' face!'

why? who are you trying to impress? do me a favor and save your Christianese. save your speeches. keep your voice at conversational volume and if you have something to say. just say it normally and let the power be in what God is doing. not in some emotionally manipulative showy performance.

i think i am too intelligent for a typical sunday service. i see right through everything. and unless it's the power and the presence of God....i just cannot be pleased.
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HONESTY IS THE BEST POLICY TELLING GOD HOW YOU FEEL. I AGREE WITH YOU 110 %. THERE WILL BE THAT SMALL QUIET SERMON FROM THE HOLY SPIRIT THAT WILL MINISTER TO YOU ABOUT IT. THEN YOU WILL KNOW WHERE TO GO, AND WHAT TO DO. TRUST THE ONE SHEPARD WHO WILL LEAD YOU TO HIM.
 
Every church I've been to is like that (and I've been to quite a few). I'm tired. It seemed wrong. Routine. Lifeless. I'm just done.


I'm home now, having Jesus as my teacher, and the bible my study guide.
 
PANCAKES said:
Every church I've been to is like that (and I've been to quite a few). I'm tired. It seemed wrong. Routine. Lifeless. I'm just done.


I'm home now, having Jesus as my teacher, and the bible my study guide.
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THAT. is awesome <3 i think i am gonna start regularly doing sermons online. bc there are teachers i respect. and i do not know them in person. but church as a whole? oy. i have tried too many times. and i have not found what i'm looking for. here's to finding God wherever He may be found!

cheers!
 
If you like your sermons online then obviously there ARE pastors and churches that are good. Some are like that, some are not, however, if you are limited by location for a good church why not both the sermons online for yourself as you like, and church as a place to go for fellowship and serving other christians?
 
ijustwanttheTruth said:
Is it just me? or are the majority of churches nowadays just a big show.

i think i know why unbelievers hate church. i think it all seems really phoney. it seems like a bunch of people performing. it's a formula. the music and the standing and the clapping and the sitting down and the skit and the sermon. it's all the same. where's the power in it?

i went to church this week for the first time in a long time. i have been to so many churches in my life and maybe i'm a little bit on the jaded side. but. here are some of my observations from this service:

the worship is LOUD.
thoughts: ok. why does the music have to be deafening to be powerful? why do we need the drums and the electric guitars and the volume all the way up? Does not God's presence supersede the excitement of a rock concert? why do we need music behind a prayer to emphasize it? can't we ever just shut up and let God show up?

observation number 2. the pastor is loud.
why do so many men feel the need to shout in order for their point to be heard? why do we hire some man and pay him every week in tithes to come up with some sort of inspirational speech? why can't a group of believers merely come together and read from the word and each speak what they hear the spirit of God saying?

in a room that small? we wouldn't even need a sound system. we would be heard just speaking normally. but no. they plug in the microphone and turn up the volume so loud. why?!

and people. PLEASE. church is not a place for your cell phones. turn them off. stop filming in the middle of worship! this is not a video for you to share on fb. this is supposed to be a private relational moment between creator God and His beloved ones. filming is completely inappropriate unless there is some preexisting media outlet that has been agreed upon to share with the world. THIS. IS NOT A SHOW.

why do we need dorky programs and christmas pageants and entertaining clips? if i wanted entertainment, i would turn on my tv! i am SO churched out. can't we ever just put a stop to the noise? can't church just be a place for believers to come and hear from God? why is it such a show? and why are there 23 fake plants on that stage?

are they decorating for me? are they decorating for God?
i am SURE that their motives for these things are good. but the atmosphere it produces is one where i am extremely uncomfortable. 'SOMEBODY SHOUT 'TIMETABLE!''
'turn to your neighbor and give them your best 'unripened fruit' face!'

why? who are you trying to impress? do me a favor and save your Christianese. save your speeches. keep your voice at conversational volume and if you have something to say. just say it normally and let the power be in what God is doing. not in some emotionally manipulative showy performance.

i think i am too intelligent for a typical sunday service. i see right through everything. and unless it's the power and the presence of God....i just cannot be pleased.
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i love your truth seeking opinion, the reason people make a show is because they think loud words and movements make more of a point, i think its funny to watch lol. i like the music sometimes but i have limit, i thought any second i was going to bleed out of my ear and then people would say i was possessed by the devil.
 
lol! if i could for one second, actually make the noise stop and change the way they operate i would go. if i thought my opinion mattered to them. but i have a hunch, they are gonna keep doing things the way they do them. spending money on things they don't need to, and painting country christmas plays and organizing silly events and yelling at the top of their lungs for no reason at all. i just can't take it. lol. i really feel it's not benefitting the church body as a whole to continue operating this way. but they clearly think they have something worth performing for.


Blain said:
i love your truth seeking opinion, the reason people make a show is because they think loud words and movements make more of a point, i think its funny to watch lol. i like the music sometimes but i have limit, i thought any second i was going to bleed out of my ear and then people would say i was possessed by the devil.
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Col 3:16 -
"Let the word of Christ dwell in you richly as you teach and admonish one another with all wisdom, and as you sing psalms, hymns and spiritual songs with gratitude in your hearts to God."

Heb 10:25 -
"Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another--and all the more as you see the Day approaching."

I just want to encourage you to keep attending church. It's so important that we fellowship with other Christians. I've been through a lot of trials, but I was able to overcome them with the support of my church family. If you don't like showy churches, find a smaller church with softer music. There are good churches out there, because God is always moving. He will lead you.
 
This is a very interesting place for me to stumble across tonight. I made a note in my journal today that the Christian Church has become an infomercial. I say this in love, but I have been visiting and speaking at about eight different churches of various denominations during the past few weeks. Seeing the different styles and personalities of each church combined with the conversations of my non believing 20 year old son (Who was raised in a pew) got me thinking. 4,200 religions. 2,870 cataloged deities. Evolution taught in school. Mass media influence. It's one heck of a tough sale. You have to convince a non believer that out of all of those choices, you have the enough expertise to have not only chose the right path but you have to be an expert on why all of the other options are wrong. Not one human can do that. Jesus is the only one qualified to make that sale. We get them in the building and tell them to confess with their mouth that they believe what we just tried to sell them. Sometimes, granted, divine intervention will take place and there will be no denying the presence of God. Most of the people I know, including myself made the "just in case" prayer and faith slowly trickled in like an IV with a kink in the hose. I think we are missing the boat. It says, "Seek and you will find me." That is how my faith grew. I think the public feels the sale.
 
Sad and disappointing Churches might seem nowadays but I don't think you're making yourself right by saying Church is not the place for you. ;)

From what you've observed you can't find that in the Church I'm in. We are simple believers having a solemn service. We gather together for fellowship, prayer, hymnal singing accompanied by piano and guitar. We don't have a loud pastor simply because we don't have a pastor. Who feed us with the word of God? Well... we are so well fed. We do have our elders who explain the Scriptures better but all of us are encouraged to speak, believing each of us have different annointing, giving testimonies and sharing the word of God and then the bread and wine in the end that's how our normal Sunday service works.

Does this make the Church I'm in better than the others? I don't think so! We might not have all those that you've written but I can add even more negative observation to it. And the worst thing, division happened twice in the Church I'm in and what makes it even worst? My Mom who joined the other group when the 2nd division happened just recently. Should I get discouraged? Should I stop going to Church? Should I just locked myself in the room and just listen to all these sermons online?... NEVER!

I'll say those that you've mentioned are just minor prob in the churches and there are even deeper problem than that. And I don't even think a perfect simple church exist. If God showed you all those maybe He wanted you to do something on it not choosing to stay in your house instead. If you find a church where the teachings are purely based in the Bible then stay there, if the pastor is too loud I don't think it's disrespectful to ask a favor and say to lower the volume down. I seriously would do that if I happened to be in a church like that. If they won't listen, well... I'm persistent :D and I'm sure there are a lot who would join my request too. God said, there's a lot of work to do in His field but only few workers I guess one reason for that is a lot of Christians chose to hide themselves in their house and that's even more disappointing.
 
maybe try small churches i found one with mostly old people in it, they are wise and have serene music and teachings. the church is small but not corrupted by nowadays ways of loud words and music and making lots of movments. it doesnt have those fancy colored lights and t.v. screens the pastor just stands and teaches its epic
 
You gave my post a like the other day. I don't know where you live, but if you are close to Delaware, e-mail me and I can let you attend ours and see how we do it. You can organize one of your own, maybe.
 
i completely and wholeheartedly concur 100%. people don't want to be bought. everything today is an advertisement and we are sick of it. we are sick of being 'PERSUADED' and 'COAXED' to do something. i think possibly church hopping as i have done and seeing the different manner different churches maintain is part of why i can't take it anymore. it's different and yet it's all the same. (i have known a FEW decent churches in my time)

but we feel it. they feel it. the sale. the push. the self-help book come to life on how to handle life with Jesus. i don't think He's meant to be the punchline. and i don't think He's meant to be the merchandise. and HE SURE ISN'T MEANT TO BE THE ENTERTAINMENT!



Butchie said:
This is a very interesting place for me to stumble across tonight. I made a note in my journal today that the Christian Church has become an infomercial. I say this in love, but I have been visiting and speaking at about eight different churches of various denominations during the past few weeks. Seeing the different styles and personalities of each church combined with the conversations of my non believing 20 year old son (Who was raised in a pew) got me thinking. 4,200 religions. 2,870 cataloged deities. Evolution taught in school. Mass media influence. It's one heck of a tough sale. You have to convince a non believer that out of all of those choices, you have the enough expertise to have not only chose the right path but you have to be an expert on why all of the other options are wrong. Not one human can do that. Jesus is the only one qualified to make that sale. We get them in the building and tell them to confess with their mouth that they believe what we just tried to sell them. Sometimes, granted, divine intervention will take place and there will be no denying the presence of God. Most of the people I know, including myself made the "just in case" prayer and faith slowly trickled in like an IV with a kink in the hose. I think we are missing the boat. It says, "Seek and you will find me." That is how my faith grew. I think the public feels the sale.
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jangel said:
if the pastor is too loud I don't think it's disrespectful to ask a favor and say to lower the volume down. I seriously would do that if I happened to be in a church like that. If they won't listen, well... I'm persistent :D and I'm sure there are a lot who would join my request too. God said, there's a lot of work to do in His field but only few workers I guess one reason for that is a lot of Christians chose to hide themselves in their house and that's even more disappointing.
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you're cute. i like you.
but it's not JUST about the volume. it's definitely about the WAY the pastor is delivering his speech. it's like he's been through some pastor training module that taught him when to raise his voice, what choice corny phrases to use, when to ask for an 'AMEN!' and when to ask the audience to interact with each other. i don't want to shout 'FRUIT' bc he told me to.

it just. feels. fake.

this post wasn't made asking for advice. i will not go 'find a church' on my bicycle. lol. i am merely venting bc i sense something horribly wrong as a whole in the body of Messiah and i wanted to know if i was the only one who feels it. i hate church. i cannot find God there. hence. i will not go. i do however have a bible study i love to go to and that i will return to in about 3 months. but for now...i am here and i have made my decision.
 
EPIC.

......
Blain said:
maybe try small churches i found one with mostly old people in it, they are wise and have serene music and teachings. the church is small but not corrupted by nowadays ways of loud words and music and making lots of movments. it doesnt have those fancy colored lights and t.v. screens the pastor just stands and teaches its epic
Click to expand...
 
not to mention that the sermon is this cookie cutter sunday school thing i have heard my entire life and it doesn't make it any more powerful. the messages just feel so trite and man-made. EXACTLY like an essay someone did the night before to turn into college and spoken with passion.
 
i'm totally gonna shut up eventually. but also. i was thinking.
i had the privileged of seeing the pastor both up on stage as well as in a personal setting with his family. and i really wished he had spoken to us in the same manner. like we were family or friends that he was just talking to. like people. and not like he was trying to convince us of something or sell us the bible verse of the day.

ya know? if he had just talked normally i would be able to hear him and respect him. but because he thinks that the way to deliver a sermon is the same way you deliver a commercial. i can't not close that out. that top notch car salesman tone. i can't listen to that with an open heart.
 
The last church I attended was very much theatrical and dramatic. I felt like I was at a musical instead of church, all the monitors and lights and glam were almost too much to handle. To top it off, they didn't even have a pastor present for the sermon, he was broadcast via satellite from another church location. The band was loud, the environment seemed stale with lukewarm believers (I am not judging, this is just how I felt). There was no fellowship before or after the sermon that I noticed. I asked if there were any sort of bible studies or fellowship during the week and found that there was nothing. People show up for a half hour, video-broadcasted sermon, watch 15 minute concert, pay their "admission" and leave.

What is wrong with this picture?
 
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