Tithing Question

[OFM]

YOU GIVE ON YOUR NET ON WHAT U HAVE NOT ON WHAT YOU DO NOT HAVE THEN I GIVE AS A FREE WILL BLESSING OFFERING UNTO THE LORD ON MY TAX RETUN.amen

 

[A-Omega]

Any Law given in the OT continues into the NT unless God states otherwise. The fact that you or others cannot show any verse showing tithe has been stopped by God then it continues into the NT. You can call me names but that is a fact.

3 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.


If you are trying to keep the law and have broken it one area you are cursed with eternal damnation. Period. So how are you doing in keeping all the laws? Did you slaughter your lamb for Passover this year? Did you inspect it and roast it in accordance with Scriptures? If not, you are cursed before God. Have you done your weekly sacrifices for your sins? How many of the laws are you keeping 100% faithfully.

 

[A-Omega]

YOU GIVE ON YOUR NET ON WHAT U HAVE NOT ON WHAT YOU DO NOT HAVE THEN I GIVE AS A FREE WILL BLESSING OFFERING UNTO THE LORD ON MY TAX RETUN.amen

How did you come to this conclusion on gross vs. net? From scripture? Are you also tithing your food? Your new clothes? The tithe is 10% of all your increase, not just money.

Also who is the Levitical priest you are giving it to? Because God is clear that the tithes are only for those who are by blood, Levites who have been appointed to work in the temple.

See how this leads down a road where you are just picking and choosing what you want to obey from Scripture and adding to God's Word where you feel it's convenient?? I urge you to reconsider beloved. You wrote your post above as if it's Bible doctrine when it's just unbiblical opinion.

 

[Nautilus]

Then you need to do some study of the OT and the tithing system in relation to the priesthood then you will have a better understanding of that text.

I didn't know I was jewish or a member of the hebrew roots cult. But i'll try to look into the OT after I learn everything relevant God has to teach us in the NT.

 

[Laodicea]

3 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you?
2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.
7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.
8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.
9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.
10For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them.


If you are trying to keep the law and have broken it one area you are cursed with eternal damnation. Period. So how are you doing in keeping all the laws? Did you slaughter your lamb for Passover this year? Did you inspect it and roast it in accordance with Scriptures? If not, you are cursed before God. Have you done your weekly sacrifices for your sins? How many of the laws are you keeping 100% faithfully.

You have no Idea what you are on about. The Law that Paul is talking about is the ceremonial Law. We are saved by grace through faith and faith establishes the Law.
Romans 3:31
(31) Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

 

[Laodicea]

I didn't know I was jewish or a member of the hebrew roots cult. But i'll try to look into the OT after I learn everything relevant God has to teach us in the NT.

Galatians 3:29
(29) And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Don't you know that the NT is a revelation of the OT.

 

[A-Omega]

You have no Idea what you are on about. The Law that Paul is talking about is the ceremonial Law. We are saved by grace through faith and faith establishes the Law.
Romans 3:31
(31) Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

If you are trying to keep the law and have broken it one area you are cursed with eternal damnation. Period. So how are you doing in keeping all the laws? Did you slaughter your lamb for Passover this year? Did you inspect it and roast it in accordance with Scriptures? If not, you are cursed before God. Have you done your weekly sacrifices for your sins? How many of the laws are you keeping 100% faithfully??

 

[eternally-gratefull]

In your studies get to know a little bit about the household of God, the local church and the work of the ministry and then, maybe, you can see and understand from divine viewpoint the purpose of giving tithes and offerings to Christ, the head of the church, who is a priest forever after the order of Melchezidek and has made us kings and priests as well. Many believers understand this and practice their faith and have not been fooled or confused in any way with the purpose of tithes and offerings.

1. The house of God is no longer a physical thing, it is spiritual in nature. The NT church did not meet in expensive extravagent buildings, they meet in each others homes. The so called "house of God did not come until the roman church took over the pegan temples and made them houses of God. Not to say there is nothing wrong with building physical churches. But that is not how it was first done, it did not come till years later. so the tithe was never for that in the NT Church.
2. As you said, WE are kings and priests. the main word being priests. Since the tithe was to go to ALL priests, (Not just the high priest) and levites doing the work of God. then we too should be RECIEVING the tithe, not giving it. According to OT law.
3. There were no "offerings" in the OT CHurch according to law. there was just "Tithe", the church twisted things and tries to add the word offering and make it anything given ABOVE the tithe. there is no scriptural support for this though.
4. Maybe it is you who needs to study? Come out of your religion and your tradition and see how it really was.

I wonder what our Jewish friends think of tithes and offerings and where they practice this kind of activity in giving to God as they obey the commandments.

you mean our jewish friends who are still following law and Not God?

BTW _ Your not a fool, which means that when you call a brother a fool you are telling Him that He has not been redeemed, has no understanding nor does He worship the living God. I don't think that is your case, do you, even though you may have a foolish understanding in this area of tithes and offerings, I wouldn't call you a fool.

Well my friend. To me, your the one with the foolish understanding of this basic principle of Giving. Your trying to place us all under law. and this is dangerous. People should not give out of duty or command, but out of the heart, This is what the NT taught. The jews in the OT gave out of duty, because they were commanded to give.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

With regard to this day and age, that brings up a rather pertinent point:

Does a 10 % tithe mean ten percent of your gross earnings (before taxes) - or rather ten percent of your net income (i.e., "take-home" pay). There is a difference, you know.

Your right, A huge difference. Something to consider is the tithe was considered the TAX of the jewish state. They ended up later having to pay tax to the romans, above their tithe, yet this was their fault because they sinned against God, it is not the way it was supposed to be.

I guess we are punished as a church even though we are not paying taxes because of sin we committed?

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Any Law given in the OT continues into the NT unless God states otherwise. The fact that you or others cannot show any verse showing tithe has been stopped by God then it continues into the NT. You can call me names but that is a fact.

That is a fact in your mind. There are MANY laws of the jewish tradition which God did not state we no longer have to do, Yet it is obvious we no longer do them.

The fact tha in no place in the NT are we told to tithe, But simply give as his heart desires proves the tithe is no longer valid. It states plainly, if a man wishes to give 5 % and his heart does not tell him to give more, He is honoring God and God will recieve his offering and not judge him as leaving 5% out.

It also says we are not to give reluctantly, or out of compulsion. but we should set aside the first day of the week as we have prospered (no percentage given, so the only truthfull amount we are given as per the NT is "give as a man's heart desires" which could be any amount.)

A person who is not giving much as a new believer will give MORE as they mature in Christ, as they realize what they have is not their own, and they become less self centered and more God centered. A person on the other hand who is new to the church, Who is commanded to TITHE even though they may not be able to afford it (their net earnings after uncle sam, utilities, house and car payments, grocery bills etc is less than 10%) they on th eother hand are placed under law, and are giving (if they do at all) above what they are able. And will never come to the point they give out of the gracefulness of their heart. But ALWAYS out of duty.

There is a huge difference in the two types of people I describes and HOW they give. and the heart attitude in which they give!

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Leviticus 27:30
(30) And all the tithe of the land, whether of the seed of the land, or of the fruit of the tree, is the LORD'S: it is holy unto the LORD.

Tithe belongs to God it does not belong to us. What we give in offering is not tithe so the verse you quoted is not referring to tithe but offering.

So do you give God the seed of the land and the fruit of the tree? Because in the passage you just used, that is the defenition of the tithe given. it is NOT MONEY, no where in this passage does it show the tithe to be MONEY.

1 Corinthians 9:14

(14) Even so hath the Lord ordained that they which preach the gospel should live of the gospel.

To live of the the gospel is referring to tithe. As I said the OT already has the tithe and unless you can show a text in the NT that says God has given us the tithe which belongs to Him then we are to still return tithe.

Because tithe does not belong to us but, God then not to return tithe is to rob God.

So the gospel includes tithing? So your saying whoever does not tithe has not obeyed the gospel and is not saved?

I know you do not believe this. But the true interpretation is this is what you just said. The gospel (and all of it) it what makes us right with God, If tithing is part of the gospel. then it is required to be made right with God.

Think before you post my friend.

 

[fretslide]

You have no Idea what you are on about. The Law that Paul is talking about is the ceremonial Law. We are saved by grace through faith and faith establishes the Law.
Romans 3:31
(31) Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

I want to thank you for your comments which are causing me to study more. I always like to examine my beliefs to make surre they are in line with scripture, so bless you for that.

While I was studying Romans 3 to check the context of your scripture quote, I confirmed something you may be interested in

Rom 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
Rom 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Rom 3:29 Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:
Rom 3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

So Paul seems to think that the law that is established by faith is actually the law of faith, not the law of works, and being mindful of your Godly admonition that us sinful people who refuse to be brought back under the law of works "have no idea what we are on about" I thought I'd check it out to make sure.

Thank you for providing so many scriptures that confirm the law of works is not in effect anymore.

 

[Graybeard]

I want to thank you for your comments which are causing me to study more. I always like to examine my beliefs to make surre they are in line with scripture, so bless you for that.

While I was studying Romans 3 to check the context of your scripture quote, I confirmed something you may be interested in

Rom 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.
Rom 3:28 Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Rom 3:29 Is he the God of the Jews only? is he not also of the Gentiles? Yes, of the Gentiles also:
Rom 3:30 Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.
Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

So Paul seems to think that the law that is established by faith is actually the law of faith, not the law of works, and being mindful of your Godly admonition that us sinful people who refuse to be brought back under the law of works "have no idea what we are on about" I thought I'd check it out to make sure.

Thank you for providing so many scriptures that confirm the law of works is not in effect anymore.

yet....


Jas 2:14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food,
Jas 2:16 and one of you says to them, "Depart in peace, be warmed and filled," but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit?
Jas 2:17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
Jas 2:18 But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.
Jas 2:19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble!
Jas 2:20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?
Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar?
Jas 2:22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect?
Jas 2:23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, "ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS ACCOUNTED TO HIM FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS." And he was called the friend of God.
Jas 2:24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

yet....


Jas 2:14 What does it profit, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister is naked and destitute of daily food,
Jas 2:16 and one of you says to them, "Depart in peace, be warmed and filled," but you do not give them the things which are needed for the body, what does it profit?
Jas 2:17 Thus also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead.
Jas 2:18 But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.
Jas 2:19 You believe that there is one God. You do well. Even the demons believe—and tremble!
Jas 2:20 But do you want to know, O foolish man, that faith without works is dead?
Jas 2:21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar?
Jas 2:22 Do you see that faith was working together with his works, and by works faith was made perfect?
Jas 2:23 And the Scripture was fulfilled which says, "ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS ACCOUNTED TO HIM FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS." And he was called the friend of God.
Jas 2:24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.

What does this have to do with the subject at hand?

James is not telling us if we do not do all the works of the law or any law we are lacking faith. He is condemning those who have absolutely zero works.

If one says he has faith (he makes a proclamation that he does have faith) But has no works (he has not shown a changed life. He is not doing the things God said his children would do, and he is not showing ANY fruits of repentance) Can his faith save him? in other words, is it salvic faith?

What is james answer?

Thus faith with out works is dead. What is a dead faith? is it any faith at all? A dead body has no life. A dead faith has no life either. If f aith is dead, there is no salvation because a dead faith is no faith at all.

James goes on to warn, even demons believe, Belief alone is not enough. One myst trust fully out of a sincere repentance to be saved, Those who do this WILL show works, as Paul said in eph 2: 9 - 10.

 

[Shaije]

First of all, if you are taking your time to read this I want to thank you! Second of all, here is my question: Can your Time volunteering at local soup kitchens, feeding the homeless, as well as distributing food at local food banks count towards your tithing(As in doing God's work)? I was recently asked this question from someone very close and could not give her a definite answer pertaining to this question. This particular person has no job so giving money is out of the question. Thanks once again, HeartChristian!

Some will Not like this, but....traditional/old test tithing was the Law, therefore it was for the Jew. Not the gentile. However, this does not mean that we don't "give." But we are under Grace, not the Law. You friend "giving" her time is DEFINITELY an offering to the Lord. She gave "WHAT she HAD." James 1:27 says...Pure and undefiled religion before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their trouble, and to keep oneself unspotted from the world.

 

[Graybeard]

What does this have to do with the subject at hand?

James is not telling us if we do not do all the works of the law or any law we are lacking faith. He is condemning those who have absolutely zero works.

If one says he has faith (he makes a proclamation that he does have faith) But has no works (he has not shown a changed life. He is not doing the things God said his children would do, and he is not showing ANY fruits of repentance) Can his faith save him? in other words, is it salvic faith?

What is james answer?

Thus faith with out works is dead. What is a dead faith? is it any faith at all? A dead body has no life. A dead faith has no life either. If f aith is dead, there is no salvation because a dead faith is no faith at all.

James goes on to warn, even demons believe, Belief alone is not enough. One myst trust fully out of a sincere repentance to be saved, Those who do this WILL show works, as Paul said in eph 2: 9 - 10.

I was addressing fretsides's comment...that's all

 

[fretslide]

I was addressing fretsides's comment...that's all

The difference is that James is referring to the good works that you would expect to see in a person who has been redeemed as they now live out their life for Christ and are displaying the fruits of the Spirit. He is reminding us that a live and active faith in Christ will always produce fruit in the form of voluntary good works as an expression of our gratitude (including voluntary giving).

I was not referring to the voluntary good works that James is referring to, my pervious posts are referring to the law of works as in the Mosaic/ Levitical old covenant law system which was compulsory and included animal sacrifice, dietry regulations and tithing among other things.

Hope that clears up the confusion