So lets edify them to see truth then so they can grow in The finished work of the cross
True Born Again Christians Have Eternal Security
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So lets edify them to see truth then so they can grow in The finished work of the cross
This world has taught many things that are not true, like if one sins they need more forgiveness when that is untrue because there is no frogiveness with out the shedding of blood and chjrist wasthe last shedding along with the last sacrifice
Nowhere in the word after the death, burial and resurrection is there anywhere to found any more forgiveness to executed to anyone after the death of Christ on the cross of Christ
And this world has swallowed this lie that they need more forgiveness after they came to belief when there is nowhere for this to be found in the word.
So by this lie that a lot have recieved and beleive this to be truth, can't pass from death to life because they are too busy trying to keep forgiven by asking for more and more being totally aware of whether they will sin or not and thus continue in their sin not seeing that by thinking about sin that this is exactly what has trapped them into it
Galatians 6:8For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life.
Radius I see you this way as not taking advantage of such a great Salvation
Hebrews 2:3how shall we escape if we neglect so great a salvation, which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed to us by those who heard Him,
And you are just growig in grace learning and maturing as you grow in more and mnore trust in our living Savior Jesus Christ yes?
Christ is the only one here on earth sinless born of a virgin Mary born a life-giving Spirit, came and did nothing or said nothing unless his Father said to in 100% dependance on Father which by the cross is for us to become by belief in him but this will not happen until one comes to the resurrected Christ after agreeing with Christ that all sins are forgiven at the cross period than one goes to new life in the Spoirit where only God the Father can be worshipped and where no sin can occur
John 4:23But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him.
John 4:24God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”
Every single believer, no matter what state they are in presently, through their experience, has the assurance of salvation that started when they believed upon the name of Christ. To believe otherwise is to have a faith that is apostate from the truth and from the cross of Christ. Woe to that man who has changed the truth into a lie.
Originally Posted by sinless
Yes Homeward baby believers need to mature
Im all for edification, but we have also been called to rebuke and correct.
When you make a thread or post, that is meant for edification, and the sin lovers jump in defending their sin they need to be rebuked and corrected
P
psychomom
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tell me...do you serve as a servant in any other capacity?
or is it your job merely to create divisions and show yourself oh, so holy to those who are not yet as advanced as you?
your shallow sin concept makes me feel sick, and if you had any clue just how wretched sin is in God's eyes I hope you wouldn't be so cavalier about your own 'perfection'.
since this is a thread about the eternal security of the believer, may I safely assume you condition security on your own resistance to sin? (yeah...I hear what you 'say', but I also hear what you say---subtext, right?)
is that why you felt it necessary to jump in here?
I'd love to see you speak about something else, if it's possible for you to do so.
I'd love to see you respond to the Gospel's commands regarding seeing a brother in sin, and restoring such a one,
but that won't happen since I don't see your life. (and you see none of ours)
I wonder what a spirit of gentleness looks like in you.
Because if we've seen it.......
There CANNOT be edification with sin in the picture... SIN IS SEPERATION,
Only SAINTS... that already stoipped sinning can be perfected and edified into the Body of Christ... EPH 4.
PLEASE get this.... there is no sin in love and no love in sin...
There is no sin in His light and no sinner in the light... God removes sin before HE ADDS YOU TO THE BODY OF PERFECTION..
Only SAINTS... that already stoipped sinning can be perfected and edified into the Body of Christ... EPH 4.
PLEASE get this.... there is no sin in love and no love in sin...
There is no sin in His light and no sinner in the light... God removes sin before HE ADDS YOU TO THE BODY OF PERFECTION..
LOL Sinless I do not see myself living defeated or in victory. I see myself living for the beloved treasure that is the lords heart. If there is anything i am wrong about then i will humble myself before the lord, but i know that no one man can live their entire lives without sinning. Everyone here has been trying to enlighten to on your belief, everyone here has been either a lamp shining in the darkness or a person covering the lamp because they do not like the light. Many people do not welcomed the light when it is presented because it reveals their hearts.
You can't leave out pointing the sinner, whether a Christian or not, to the Lord Jesus Christ. For it is going to take his mercy and grace through the cross to deal with the sinner and his sin. God has already removed sin when he bore our sin upon his body on the cross and now if we sin as a Christian, we must learn to receive grace and in the strength of that grace we put the sin away by faith. In the midst of my worse bout with sin I can reckon myself to be dead to sin because of the cross. Putting the sin of the flesh away is by reckoning myself dead to it and that is how we repent through grace. We can repent because the sin was crucified on the cross and though I am guilty of sin I reckon on what Christ did to my sin. That will set me free from sin having dominion over me and I can then walk by faith in what Christ has done for me, as sin and for sin. Eternal security allows the sinner to be able to receive from God what he needs to be free from the power of sin and at the same time never lose his standing with God that was established by faith when he believed upon the Son.
This is speaking of people who were believing they had to be circumcised and keep the law of Moses to be saved. Not about those who were obey Jesus through the empowerment of Holy Spirit
This is quite a lot you said, but just to make it clear.... what is a SAINT? Where is a saint in God's eyes? I mean God did call us to be saints... what does that mean? What is a SAINT?
You all talk about a put away sin... Can we put away sin 100%? You all talk of a struggle against sin... How long does that struggle last? Does it EVER end in your belief? Jesus said he came to destroy the works of satan... who is the tempter, and what is his work? If Jesus destroyed the works of satan for me, did he fail to destroy some works?
Come on people, who saves us? And how well does He save? You all talk about the putting the sin away... IF you put it away and go get it again, you did not put it away, and it is NOT DEAD for you.... Dead means GONE FOREVER... Every time you commit a sin you REWAKEN it? That is NOT DEAD....
Dead sin is DEAD for you and you for that sin... YOU CANNOT DO IF YOU ARE DEAD... If you died off ALL sin God's Spirit is the NEW CREATURE IN YOU and HE CANNOT SIN.. 1 John 3:9.
Starfield our salvation is not determined upon whether we persevere in the faith. In 2 Timothy 4:3, the Bible tells us of a time when Christians will not endure sound Doctrine. Yet those Christians are still saved. The Bible in another passage, in 1 Timothy 4:1, the Bible also says that some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils. Read it. That's what the Bible clearly says. And those two passages of Scripture which I gave you is focusing on mainly Christians. But I do not see anywhere in that passage where it shows the Christian losing his salvation. That's because true Born again Christians are eternally secure.
And in 1 Timothy 4:13, Paul commanded Timothy to give attendance unto reading, exhortation, and to doctrine until he came. Are most Christians doing that today? Do you think a Christian who seriously studies the Scriptures and gives attendance to Bible doctrine will be prone to being deceived and misled by apostates like Billy Graham and false prophets like Joel Osteen? No, he won't. Why? because he has studied the word of God, he gets the word of God in his heart. And unlike the Charismaniacs, he cares about Bible Doctrine. He can endure sound Biblical Doctrine. So if you do not want to get messed up by the falling away, the apostacy, and false teachings today, then make sure you stay in God's word, the perfect King James Bible.
A Christian's salvation is not dependent on whether or not he continues in the faith.
11It is a faithful saying: For if we be dead with him, we shall also live with him:12If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:13If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself. - 2 Timothy 11:13 (King James Bible)
If a Christian denies Christ by not standing for Him and His word, that Christian will be denied a reign in the coming Millennial Kingdom when Jesus Christ will be physically reigning on the Throne from Jerusalem. Do you see the context Starfield? If we suffer as in suffering for Christ, we shall reign with Him. That is in the Millennial Kingdom. No suffering for Christ, no reign in the Millennial Kingdom.
Now notice what the next verse says: If we believe not, yet he abideth faithful: he cannot deny himself. So if a Christian gets so carnal and departs from the faith and stops believing, he is still a part of the Body of Christ because Christ cannot deny Himself. That Christian is still a child of God. He can't lose his salvation because he is part of the Body of Christ, he is bone of His Bone and flesh of His flesh (Again, see Eph. 5:30). You have got to be dispensational Starfied when you approach the Holy Scriptures.
And those passages you gave do not teach that a believer can become lost again. That is what you are reading into the passages with your private interpretation. You have to compare Scripture with Scripture. Let me ask you Starfield, was the Prodigal Son a Christian or was he a Jew?
Remember, you have to keep things in context. You say Romans 8:29 is only for those who remain stedfast in the faith okay where does it teach that in Romans 8:29? Could you show me?
What you are teaching is works salvation Starfield. If our salvation can be lost, then our salvation is based on our works and not on the power of God to keep us. But our salvation is not based on our works.
If the keeping your salvation was dependent on you, you would have lost it long ago. And if my salvation was dependent on whether or not I persevered in the faith, or on my ability grow in sanctification everyday, or just in my own ability in general, then my salvation would have been lost a long time ago as well! The keeping of salvation is not up to us. It is God who keeps us by His power (See 1 Peter 1:5).
You have to rightly divide the word of truth (2 Tim. 2:15).
Well I agree with you that Sanctification is something that is definitely not to be ignored. But Sanctification and Salvation are two different things. Sanctification comes after salvation. And sanctification determines our fellowship with the Lord while on this earth but it does not affect our salvation. And that verse you quoted from Hebrews 12:4 is clearly talking about your testimony among other people. If we don't live holy and sanctified lives before the Lord, then the lost world won't see the Lord Jesus in us, and our testimony among the lost world will be a poor one. That's what the passage in Hebrews 12 is mainly talking about. That's why just a few verses earlier Paul talks about the chastisement and correction which God gives to those of whom are His sons.
[SUP]5 [/SUP]And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:
[SUP]6 [/SUP]For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
[SUP]7 [/SUP]If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?
[SUP]8 [/SUP]But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.
[SUP]9 [/SUP]Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?
[SUP]10 [/SUP]For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.
[SUP]12 [/SUP]Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;
[SUP]13 [/SUP]And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.
[SUP]14 [/SUP]Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord: - Hebrews 12:5-14 (King James Bible)
Can you see the context Starfield? It is the correction and chastisement of the Lord that brings and yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness in our lives and it helps us grow in holiness and sanctification. What your saying basically is that if a born again Christian does not live a holy life or does not persevere in holy living, then he will not get into Heaven. But that's not what the Scripture is talking about. It's talking about our personal testimony among the lost world. That is what the Context in those Scriptures is teaching.
For the most part, I agree with you here in regard to what you said here about what will take place at the Judgment Seat of Christ.
That's a rather interesting view on the Judgment Seat of Christ. And again, I agree with you here to a good degree.
I also encourage you to listen to a sermon Brother Bryan Denlinger did on the Judgment Seat of Christ. It's a real good sermon on this topic. Here is the link:
http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?SID=522111445540
Again Starfield, no you are wrong on that point. No Christian will be thrown in Hell at the Judgment Seat of Christ. The purpose of the Judgment Seat of Christ is to determine the believers rewards and millennial inheritance. Can a Christian suffer loss at the Judgement Seat of Christ? Yes, that's what 1 Cor. 3:15 teaches. But it is not loss of salvation. It is loss of crowns, eternal rewards, and inheritance in the Millennial Earthly Reign & Kingdom. That's what the context says Starfield.
Yes I believe it is important to warn the believer about backsliding and falling into apostacy. I believe it is very important. But one thing you have to get Starfield, is that no true Born again Christian can lose their salvation. If they live a life of sin down here in this life, then they will have nothing to show for it in Eternity. There are many things a Christian can lose: his health, his money, his reputation, his testimony, his joy, the joy of his salvation, the assurance of his salvation ( not salvation itself but the ASSURANCE of salvation), his life, his rewards, his crowns, and his millennial inheritance. Basically the only thing a Christian cannot lose is his salvation.
It depicts a man who was converted but had problems in the flesh. It depicts the struggle between the Spirit and the flesh. It also illustrates for the believer the perspective and mental attitude they should have toward this kind of conflict that every born again believer will face in their life as they learn how to receive and grow in grace and not live in condemnation. The regeneration of Paul's life, when he received the Spirit, was what caused the conflict to take place, this is why he learned how to glory in the cross that crucified his flesh so that he could walk by faith in the Spirit and not according to the impulses and dictates of the flesh even when he did good. It all related to his body of sin and death and the fact that sin was still occupying the members of his own body. To mortify the deeds of the flesh the believer learns how to receive grace and put those things off as he puts on the Lord Jesus Christ and his righteousness. He may fail or have periods of failure but that does not change his standing with God but makes him realize his need for an abundance of grace.
in a loving manner, not in condemnation you if you really do beleive know this that the Love of God is spread about in ones new born again heart via the resurrection of Christ where new life is recieved by God the Father and this Love that is unnaturalto the Human Spirit of error is best described in 1Cor 13. From a human point of view we all are guilty of not having this type of love. But when born again in the Spirit of God by asking for thois from God we are born again with a new heart that is filled with the 1 cor. 13 Love