S
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
No the cloak of vengeance was not given to us.
You see Jesus wearing it at his return, after it being dipped in the blood of the martyrs.
Menacing thought having this wrapped around Christ, on his back when he comes with the glorified saints in full force behind Him.
S
Scribe
Guest
Have you seen a picture of the breast plate that Roman soldiers wore? There are museum pieces and also artist drawings.
See below:
I think much has been preached about the armor not having a back that was just made up based on ignorance and lack of diligent study to find out what the Roman Soldier armor looked like. Of course it covered the back. It was called the breast plate and so ignorant preachers assumed it just covered the breast and preached something about no back being covered because you are not supposed to run. Preach a whole 30 minutes on something Paul never talked about nor intended to teach.
My point is...How many other things are we thinking are true and thinking they are in the bible because of sermons we heard repeated through the years?
I dont know about Ephesians, but Isaiah says we're protected front to back!
the LORD will go before you,
and the God of Israel will be your rear guard. Isa.52:12
the LORD will go before you,
and the God of Israel will be your rear guard. Isa.52:12
L
Locoponydirtman
Guest
Ephesians 6:
10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.
11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
...
13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
...
18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;
Be strong in the Lord and in the power of His might ... then put on the whole armor of God ... then stand ... withstand ... stand ... pray ... watch
Believe me it matters.
I've seen God go before me and the enemies looking on in wonder how I got there.
I can assume my backside was covered as well because I was established there while those who hated me at first sight where displaced.
He prepares a table before me in the presence of my enemies.
Besides what was already stated, we should not have our back to the enemy but meet straightforward. The point being that we've done all to stand.
S
Scribe
Guest
What matters is that if one preaches that the armor did not have a back and that is because we are not supposed to turn our back on the enemy but the armor does have a back, what you are teaching is silly. Why take all the great things that could be preached from that passage and instead preach about the armor not having a back and then talk about not running, not turning your back, etc. What a bunch of wood, hay and stubble. It is not going to help anyone because it is just a bunch of imaginations rather than the WORD OF GOD which should have been preached. And yet somewhere in America this Sunday someone will preach yet another sermon about the armor not having a back.
When we see examples like this, things that get repeated that are not even correct, it makes me wonder how many things do people believe are in the Bible that are not there.
Can you think of some others?
Interesting - and I did a little research and you seem to be right . . .
So who started this thing that only the back is not covered with armor . . . ?
So if we have the armor on, but in fear turn and run, we are still protected! I like that! God is good!
Unlearning the junk is hard it requires a real humility of heart and mind.
Especially junk you build you world around for many years.
New wine in old wine skins requires a softening through the spirit first.
In the end it is all about knowing God for ourselves.
S
Scribe
Guest
If a preacher wants to preach a message about standing, or moving forward there are plenty of texts to use for that. Saying that the armor does not have a back which it most certainly did is not the way to go about using a text for your sermon. There is nothing in what Paul wrote in Eph 6 that suggest that your back is exposed. Not there so don't preach it.
I am not too harsh on those I hear teach it, because I know that many were persuaded by other preachers they heard and thought is was such a lively message to preach and they like to preach lively messages, however, I do think they should mature and learn that they will lose a significant portion of their audience who know better and will start second guessing everything the preacher is saying from then on. In other words, " I will have to fact check everything you tell me from now on" syndrome.
I believe the armour does have a back to it. That's why I said "besides what has already been stated." It was just a reminder.
S
Scribe
Guest
Well hold up now... lol. I am not suggesting that we should retreat! As far as a battle goes, there are people coming at you from every angle once you are in the midst of the fray and that includes behind, beside, infront and you are ducking and diving and slashing and weaving, and you need back armor as well as front armor, there is no running away involved in that melee. So having back armor does not make the roman soldier fearful or cowardly.
That being said, my point was 1) we should not preach from that text that we are not supposed to run and that is why it had no back armor. If you want to preach about standing and going forward in battle there are better texts to use than to make up a fact that is not even true and build a sermon on it. 2) How many things are we repeating from popular sermons that are not true, (fables, myths, legends, misquotes, etc)
L
lenna
Guest
haha
yet another reason to get your facts straight and not assume you know everything and don't need to study or keep things in context
yes
I am a stickler for that sort of thing and God willing will continue to be
actually though, I did know the breastplate had a back. I suppose one could say that other Christians have your back but sadly, not all that often the case
as to your last point, this is why we study, pray, study some more, pray some more and have the diligence to make ourselves aware of culture and other applicable historical facts
ignorance is not bliss and leads to all kinds of assumptions and errors and excess, not a popular fact around here for some
L
lenna
Guest
I never heard a sermon about the 'backless' armor
is it a denominational thing? just curious
S
Scribe
Guest
Not denominational. It is just been preached many times through the years. Probably from both denominational and non denominational but never from the well informed.
Yeah, I know you didn't say we should retreat!
Neither do I think we should retreat ever! . . .
But sometimes I have been fearful and run away from difficult things - and it is a comfort to know that "God has our back" - though in actuality it is also true that we have the armor on the back because we put it on (of course through God's power)!