What Advice/Information Were You Given That Has Completely Changed Over Time, or Just Not Worked for You?

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seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
14,940
4,581
113
#21
seoulsearch both those food pyramids are interesting.. but I think France should impose sanctions against the USA until we remove wine from the top. That is unfair to all those French vineyards and wineries!
I find in interesting because the government allegedly designed it that way to theoretically boost profits for American farmers, while saving the government money at the same time, by being able to give away cheaper foods on government assistance.

As could be expected, it's pretty much backfired -- though Scribe has me thinking about what any solid, scientific evidence was saying at that time.

I'm left wondering if the government saved any money at all -- I doubt it -- because I'm sure the American health crisis due to things like obesity, and all the health issues that come with it, is proving a cost several times over.
 
L

Live4Him

Guest
#22
* In what areas do you find yourself "going your own way" (doing things in a different way than you were taught or how everyone else is doing them?) How is it working out for you?

* If you have children or those who look up to you, what do you teach them about "following the rules" vs. trying their own ways of doing things?
I stopped "attending church" approximately 20 years ago, and it's working out perfectly fine for me. Although I believe in "church" in the way that it's described in scripture, I've never seen anything even remotely close to it in this world in my entire life. In my personal experience (I genuinely hope that other peoples' experiences are quite different than my own), churches are breeding grounds for heresy/false doctrine and are literally the most dangerous places that I've personally ever entered into in my life.

Again, how's it working out for me?

Perfectly fine.

I actually have a personal relationship with God and commune with him daily, AND I still fellowship with like-minded believers whom I've encountered throughout the years, but just not within "church" walls.

As far as my children are concerned, "church" has almost totally stripped them of any belief in God. When I was still married, their Mom would take them to different churches which were all CORRUPT. I warned my children of the same repeatedly, and my ex literally threatened me with legal action if I tried to keep my children from going to those "churches" with her. As it turned out, my children eventually figured out for themselves how corrupt those "churches" were AND how they were loaded with hypocrites. Now, I have the unenviable task of trying to help them to distinguish between who God truly is and those who grossly misrepresent him.

Anyhow, you asked...
 

cinder

Senior Member
Mar 26, 2014
4,327
2,359
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#23
I stopped "attending church" approximately 20 years ago, and it's working out perfectly fine for me. Although I believe in "church" in the way that it's described in scripture,
Church as it's described in scripture.... like the Corinthian church that was celebrating how free they were when they a case of incest in their midst until Paul set them straight? Or like in James where there were fights and quarrels among them because they were greedy and showed partiality to the rich? Or like the church in Acts where Ananias and Sapphira lied about how much they were giving so that they could look better in the eyes of people? Or the church in Galatia where they started listening to some impressive false teachers that were telling them they had to follow all the Jewish laws in order to be Christian? And then of course there are all those churches in Revelation that Jesus dictated letters to, to tell them how far off they had gotten?

Yeah people saying things like this is becoming a pet peeve of mine because it shows either a huge lack of Biblical literacy (has any church ever been exactly what "church is supposed to be"?) and / or a view that is so sucked into the philosophical ideal that the person in unable or unwilling to actually live out that philosophy in the "real world". Granted I don't know what churches you and your children were part of when you were attending church and there definitely are some pretty horrible churches out there, but a person would be pretty hard pressed to demonstrate from scripture that quitting church entirely is an option for those who are serious about following and obeying Jesus. Community is pretty integral to the worldview of all the writers of scripture.
 
L

Live4Him

Guest
#24
Church as it's described in scripture.... like the Corinthian church that was celebrating how free they were when they a case of incest in their midst until Paul set them straight? Or like in James where there were fights and quarrels among them because they were greedy and showed partiality to the rich? Or like the church in Acts where Ananias and Sapphira lied about how much they were giving so that they could look better in the eyes of people? Or the church in Galatia where they started listening to some impressive false teachers that were telling them they had to follow all the Jewish laws in order to be Christian? And then of course there are all those churches in Revelation that Jesus dictated letters to, to tell them how far off they had gotten?

Yeah people saying things like this is becoming a pet peeve of mine because it shows either a huge lack of Biblical literacy (has any church ever been exactly what "church is supposed to be"?) and / or a view that is so sucked into the philosophical ideal that the person in unable or unwilling to actually live out that philosophy in the "real world". Granted I don't know what churches you and your children were part of when you were attending church and there definitely are some pretty horrible churches out there, but a person would be pretty hard pressed to demonstrate from scripture that quitting church entirely is an option for those who are serious about following and obeying Jesus. Community is pretty integral to the worldview of all the writers of scripture.
A Christian cannot "quit church entirely" because Christians ARE THE CHURCH.
 

seoulsearch

OutWrite Trouble
May 23, 2009
14,940
4,581
113
#25
I stopped "attending church" approximately 20 years ago, and it's working out perfectly fine for me. Although I believe in "church" in the way that it's described in scripture, I've never seen anything even remotely close to it in this world in my entire life. In my personal experience (I genuinely hope that other peoples' experiences are quite different than my own), churches are breeding grounds for heresy/false doctrine and are literally the most dangerous places that I've personally ever entered into in my life.

Again, how's it working out for me?

Perfectly fine.

I actually have a personal relationship with God and commune with him daily, AND I still fellowship with like-minded believers whom I've encountered throughout the years, but just not within "church" walls.

As far as my children are concerned, "church" has almost totally stripped them of any belief in God. When I was still married, their Mom would take them to different churches which were all CORRUPT. I warned my children of the same repeatedly, and my ex literally threatened me with legal action if I tried to keep my children from going to those "churches" with her. As it turned out, my children eventually figured out for themselves how corrupt those "churches" were AND how they were loaded with hypocrites. Now, I have the unenviable task of trying to help them to distinguish between who God truly is and those who grossly misrepresent him.

Anyhow, you asked...
Hi Live4Him,

Thanks so much for your post. Believe me, I understand what you are saying. Although I've almost always been part of a "regular" church, it's taken me this long to figure out that a vast number of people in churches aren't interested in helping people become more like God. They're interested in making people more like themselves.

If you don't know as much Scripture as they do, if you can't display your Bible knowledge like they do, if you aren't reading the same things or putting in as many hours or taking up the causes they want you to get involved in, then by golly, what's wrong with you??? People like this will tell you that there is just no way that you could possibly be a "true" Christian -- because you're not living up to their own personal standard of Christian living.

I'm thinking of a Bible class I once took in which the leaders were completely invested in healing, telling us that getting people healed is what would bring revival to the church. He quoted John 14:12 -- "Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in Me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these," -- then told us that if we weren't out there praying for people and getting them healed, we were (his exact quote) "Calling God a liar!!!"

Now I have no problem at all with people being passionate about what they believe in and what God has called them to, then trying to share their enthusiasm with others -- I think God calls us to do that.

But I have to draw a line when people overstep the boundaries by attempting to manipulate people to their causes through condemnation and guilt. How many people here have been told, whether blatantly or subtly, that they are being stubborn, stupid, lazy, or even an instrument of the devil if they aren't doing this, that, or the other, and without any acknowledgement that people are called to different things than they are? If this is the messenger's attitude, it's also where I immediately stop listening. I try my best to encourage people to go where God is calling them, but if they can't see that God might be calling me differently and then criticize me for not doing what they think I should be doing, I find no choice but to walk away -- and even run, often as fast as possible.

Unfortunately, I am someone who usually only thinks of good counterpoints to an argument long after the argument has happened. When this church elder told us that we were "calling God a liar" if we weren't getting people healed, I wish I would have thought to immediately reply with John 10:41 -- "Many came to Him saying, 'John (the Baptist) DID NOT perform a SINGLE miracle, yet everything John said about this Man (Jesus) was true and accurate," along with Jesus Himself saying in Matthew 11:11 -- "Among those born of women, there has not arisen one greater than John the Baptist."

I tell God all the time that one of theprimary reasons I read the Bible regularly isn't just to become closer to Him, but it's because I feel I need to do so as self-defense -- against Christians who insist that the only way a Christian should be is to be more like them!

I am very thankful that I have a few people I've met here on CC with whom I regularly talk to about our Bible studies and various Scriptures that we have been meditating on. I feel free to ask them questions without condemnation or judgment and I am immensely grateful for that. (But I'm still part of a local church because I personally feel that for myself, "I "need the extra accountability" to help "keep my attitude in line".) :D I'm sure that even my friends and especially my family will tell you that I need all the help I can get. :)

Live4Him, I particularly appreciate that you mentioned how your choice of spiritual growth has also influenced your children.

Please keep giving us regular updates on how you're all doing, as I find learning about others Christian's walks to be fascinating, as well as exremtely helpful.
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
24,799
8,103
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#26
I'm thinking of a Bible class I once took in which the leaders were completely invested in healing, telling us that getting people healed is what would bring revival to the church. He quoted John 14:12 -- "Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in Me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these," -- then told us that if we weren't out there praying for people and getting them healed, we were (his exact quote) "Calling God a liar!!!"
Anybody in ANY leadership position in a church should be very careful what we say in our official capacity, teaching a bible study, sunday school class, preaching a sermon, etc. People take what we say to heart, because it's supposed to be from a church authority figure. If we say something that doesn't line up with the Bible, we tell people something that will steer them wrong.

But I have to draw a line when people overstep the boundaries by attempting to manipulate people to their causes through condemnation and guilt. How many people here have been told, whether blatantly or subtly, that they are being stubborn, stupid, lazy, or even an instrument of the devil if they aren't doing this, that, or the other, and without any acknowledgement that people are called to different things than they are? If this is the messenger's attitude, it's also where I immediately stop listening. I try my best to encourage people to go where God is calling them, but if they can't see that God might be calling me differently and then criticize me for not doing what they think I should be doing, I find no choice but to walk away -- and even run, often as fast as possible.
The Vulcans have an interesting ideology (yes, yes, I know Star Trek is fiction... it's a good ideology anyway) called IDIC - Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations. They respect that not everybody is exactly like anybody, and (for the purpose of the fictional Star Trek universe) that not every sentient species is like every other. So although they value logic highly, they acknowledge that it takes more than just Vulcans to make a functional galaxy.

Personally I disagree with what a lot of people decide a lot of the time. But I'm a nerd and they are not. I disagree with a lot of what my pastor decides. But that's why he's the pastor and I'm not - I don't have nearly the patience with people that he has, and I would be a lot more efficient with church decisions, and a lot of people would get really ticked off at me and leave the church.

So I (usually) try to keep my mouth shut about decisions people make that I think are wrong. And I (usually) try to keep in mind that it's a real good thing everybody in the world is not just like me, and it's even a good thing that I'm not like everybody else. It takes all different kinds of people to make a balanced world.

Actually that's where a lot of misinformation comes from, so this post IS on topic after all. Yay! :cool: "It works for me so it has to work for you" is the cause of a lot of advice that doesn't help at all.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
23,460
7,173
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#27
People always wish others were more like themselves, I think everyone does it to some extent
Mothers do it to their daughters. Teachers do to their students. Fathers do it to their sons. Married couples do it to each other.

But the fact is, people have minds of their own and free will and you cannot force people to grow up, think like you do, or even agree with you all the time.

You can suggest, or persuade, or train but you just cant make someone just do what you want and they do it without thinking,
The child whos parents tells them what to do and the child who defiantly says MAKE ME has a point.

Even Gods commandments in the Bible could not MAKE the Israelites behave. The only way a person can do anything at all is if their heart is in it. And a heart is changed only by the grace of God.
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
24,799
8,103
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#28
Here's some VERY wrong advice I've heard from a lot of people:

"Just be happy and concentrate on the bright side and your life will be all roses and rainbows! Don't let life get you down! Overcome with positive thinking!"

"Here's a little song I wrote
You might want to sing it note for note
Don't worry
Be happy
When the blues have got you down
Turn that frown upside down
Don't worry
Be happy"

LIES! Has nobody ever read Proverbs 25:20?

"I've heard it said, don't worry, be happy
Things will all work out in the end
Nice advice, but it doesn't solve my problems
They always find me again
I need more than sweet, simple sayings
When my life's reeling out of control"

I don't know how anybody else's private universe works, but here in my world sometimes life just really sucks. Sometimes I have to be sad and just get through life until it is better. And sometimes I have to actually solve my own problems instead of blithely being positive and counting on them to fix themselves.
 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
23,460
7,173
113
#29
about oudated information...

Being a librarian its one of my ongoing jobs to weed and refresh the collection BECAUSE information does become out of date, especially in non-fiction.

The worst thing about my job is when I do this and older people insist that every single book we should keep. But what about younger people, they wont read the books they did that are not even relevant to them. and we dont have space to keep them all. They then make a big fuss about some books that nobody has ever taken out in ten or more years that we have to keep every single item, even if it says 'todays christian living in the 1990s'

Just makes my job harder.
 

kinda

Senior Member
Jun 26, 2013
3,634
1,426
113
#30
Well, I had advice like, don't get married until your 30, or never get married. I seemed to like the latter advice now, it came from a married man, who said this, in front of his wife. No joke.

Even though I don't want to get married, I will say this, the most important thing is what's upstairs. The brain, personality, morals, faith, and things like these. The biggest pitfall of relationships for men I think is looks. Woman's looks probably have blinded more men, than men would care to admit.

Looks fade over time, but personality will be there forever, for better, or for worse. I would say, this would be good advice for woman, as well as for men. Woman tend to be impressed with money and power, and men tend to impressed with how a woman looks. This is just my opinion.

Just imagine being married for money, but disliking your spouse, once the charm of the new life style has gotten stale. Also, imagine being married for looks, and after 20 years, those looks are just a fading memory. Looks and money are not to be looked down upon, both are important to some extent, but they shouldn't be the major factor in deciding a soul mate.

If I had to rate these characteristics in order from most important to least, it would be....

1. Intelligence, faith, and personality. The brain
2. Wealth. Quality of life
3. Looks. Attractiveness.


1617502842910.jpeg

Did someone mention chocolate yet?


 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
23,460
7,173
113
#31
yea I thought there ought to be an age restriction on marriage
You can only get married in your 30th year. It ought to be thats the ONLY year you can get married. Like you know how jewish boys have their bar mitsvahs only when they turn 13. It should be like that.
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
24,799
8,103
113
#32
yea I thought there ought to be an age restriction on marriage
You can only get married in your 30th year. It ought to be thats the ONLY year you can get married. Like you know how jewish boys have their bar mitsvahs only when they turn 13. It should be like that.
Raising the age of consent to 30 would certainly cut down on the number of babies produced...

OR

Raising the age of consent to 30 would certainly make the cases of statutory rape skyrocket.

Given the proclivities of many young people you know, which would you bet on?
 

zeroturbulence

Senior Member
Aug 2, 2009
24,574
4,262
113
#33
Hi Everyone,

I was thinking of putting this in the Miscellaneous or Family Forum, but figured I'd try it here.

The other day, my mom and I were talking about how the current diet and nutrition advice is the exact opposite of what we had been taught. I grew during the "It's the Fat That Makes You Fat!" era, and so my mom dutifully tried to keep us away from anything that had fat. Things such as fat-free milk were a staple in our household, and I'm sad to say that I know first-hand about the existence of fat-free cheese (I'm pretty sure it's a perfect substitute for plastic.) The fat-in-food-phobia got so crazy that it led to things like bags of jelly beans bragging on the front of the label that they were "A Fat-Free Food!" (My mom was also against sugar, so try as they might, those colorful beans held no sway over her grocery purchases.)

These days, I am floored that we are given the exact opposite advice ("Fat is GOOD!!! You should be RUNNING on fat!!") and found it mind-boggling to watch a nutritional information video the other day that encouraged viewers to "eat a full steak, and don't forget to include the gristle, because it's a natural source of collagen!" I'm having a very tough time trying to accept the exact opposite of what I was taught growing up, and the thought of eating an entire strip of gristle actually makes me nauseous (but this is just me -- kudos to anyone who can chomp a huge hunk of gristle right on down, AND finds it beneficial!)

This had me wondering what kind of nutrition advice the mass experts will be doling out in another 20 years, and if the pendulum will again swing in the direction of yet another extreme.

It also had me thinking about how I was taught at different times in my life that things HAD to be done a certain way, and because of that, I could never seem to do them, and would just give up. A few examples include sewing ("You MUST use certain tools and you MUST use these specific techniques,") Bible reading (the "Bible in a Year" was popular at the time, but it never worked for me -- I just have to read straight through,) and writing (I'm told I hold all my writing instruments "incorrectly" -- resting it on the 4th finger instead of the 3rd, but every time I've tried that, it just feels unnatural and uncomfortable to me.)

I think one of the challenges of being single is that we are trying to figure out on our own what principles are mandatory (Christian living, for example,) and in what areas there might be some leeway, and that we have to find our own way of doing some things in a world that changes its mind from year to year.

I would like to know:

* What advice, rules, or guidelines have you observed or been given that were changed over time? How did you adjust to these changes? Did you find them to be for the better, or for the worse? (This can apply to any area of living: diet, lifestyle, sports, hobbies, Bible study, child-rearing, etc.)

* In what areas do you find yourself "going your own way" (doing things in a different way than you were taught or how everyone else is doing them?) How is it working out for you?

* If you have children or those who look up to you, what do you teach them about "following the rules" vs. trying their own ways of doing things?

These are just a few of the many questions this topic could ask, so feel free to tell your own story in your own way. And I know both marrieds and singles struggle with these things, so both are invited to answer. I was just thinking though that. singles often lack an outsider's perspective to help us decide if what we're doing is working or not.

Basically, I'm just wondering if other people have had the same experience of being taught something all their life, then having that information redacted/changed, and what they to adjust. I'd also like to hear about people who were taught to do things in a way that didn't work for them, which made then want to give up. But once they found a method or teacher who understand that they had to do things a little differently, it changed everything.

Looking forward to reading your stories! :)
When I was little I heard someone say "Don't pick up any wooden nickels" At that age I didn't know it was just a figure of speech. We lived in a very old house and one day I actually found a wooden nickel wedged between some steps. I was afraid to keep it because of what I heard, but it was so neat that I held onto it anyway. I kept it for awhile but didn't keep track of it and it got lost somehow. Anyway, that nickel would be worth about $6 today. So if you find a wooden nickel, keep it!

 

Lanolin

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
23,460
7,173
113
#34
My mum likes to look at issues of Healthy Food magazine.

I think its rubbish, and have never made any food from the recipes in it but its full of articles where every headline is saying this and that food is healthier than something else, and the ads are always of new 'food products' saying how healthy they are even though its just on the packaging.

Someone reading this magazine would just be paranoid about eating anything. It also goes overboard on the weight thing saying this helps you lose weight but theres no chart or anything saying what weight you need to be in it. and then all the servings are for 4 people or something and of course if you make it for four people thats fine but if you just eating an entire portion meant for 4 people of COURSE you are going to gain weight.

Solution? dont be greedy and share your food!
 
T

TheIndianGirl

Guest
#35
One thing I've observed is that most guys do not prize virginity (it is no longer a dealbreaker), which is contrary to what I heard as a child that this issue is a dealbreaker for guys.
 

Lynx

Folksy yet erudite
Aug 13, 2014
24,799
8,103
113
#36
My mum likes to look at issues of Healthy Food magazine.

I think its rubbish, and have never made any food from the recipes in it but its full of articles where every headline is saying this and that food is healthier than something else, and the ads are always of new 'food products' saying how healthy they are even though its just on the packaging.
"You should be careful reading those health magazines. You might die of a misprint."
- Samuel Clemens quote (slightly modified for modern magazines.)

Those health magazines print what they think their readers want to read, not what is best for their readers to read. So it's always all about "this is the new superfood that will magically make you healthy!" and "This new diet will make you thin!"

Once at a church yard sale there was a whole stack of Woman's World magazines. I glanced at the table and something instantly caught my eye: Every front page was advertising a different miracle diet. And every issue the diet was different... although eventually some of them seemed to come back around in another issue. ("New" South Beach Diet, anyone?) I was left wondering, if any given diet is so wonderful, why do they keep recommending a different one on the next issue?