What can I do to change my wifes hostility towards me?
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What you said about her seeing people and they were after her, or stalking her, but no one was actually there:
I used to lead a ladies Bible study, and one woman said she had depression. Then she brought up almost the same thing you mentioned. This woman was very fat, not pretty. At least not for a man to follow her around. That's when I started thinking about delusions. I clicked that this woman, with her flat affect and paranoia was schizophrenic, and I blurted it out loud, which was wrong of me. I apologized and kept her secret, but she said I was right, that she had schizophrenia, diagnosed and treated by a psychiatrist.
So schizophrenia is another term you might want to research! Not that I can diagnose her, even if I was qualified, without seeing her. Just thinking of different things that might be causing her actions.
I used to lead a ladies Bible study, and one woman said she had depression. Then she brought up almost the same thing you mentioned. This woman was very fat, not pretty. At least not for a man to follow her around. That's when I started thinking about delusions. I clicked that this woman, with her flat affect and paranoia was schizophrenic, and I blurted it out loud, which was wrong of me. I apologized and kept her secret, but she said I was right, that she had schizophrenia, diagnosed and treated by a psychiatrist.
So schizophrenia is another term you might want to research! Not that I can diagnose her, even if I was qualified, without seeing her. Just thinking of different things that might be causing her actions.
I am not a psychiatrist, but I have done one to one counselling. I've studied mental health a lot, dug into it deeply in a course for my Master's degree. I also ran a bipolar group for 5 years. Let me tell you, that was a steep learning curve.
Besides, I wasn't diagnosing her at all! I was just throwing out various diagnoses to match the symptoms the OP described. Ultimately, the psychiatrist, not even a psychologist or counsel can give a diagnosis for the mentally ill. But those other people can help a lot, in working through emotional and mood issues or paranoia and delusions.
I was just responding to the fact that the OP had diagnosed his wife with bipolar disorder, which were not the symptoms she was exhibiting. And that is a disease I do know a lot about, including drugs used and life strategies in how to live with someone with bipolar disorder.
Perhaps get to know some of us long timers in this forum before you start casting stones? Especially when you have 1 post to your credit in this forum/and that is you misreading me for what I said and attacking me!
It would be appreciated if you would read the post correctly and stop lashing out! Talk about worse than Twitter! Lol
Besides, I wasn't diagnosing her at all! I was just throwing out various diagnoses to match the symptoms the OP described. Ultimately, the psychiatrist, not even a psychologist or counsel can give a diagnosis for the mentally ill. But those other people can help a lot, in working through emotional and mood issues or paranoia and delusions.
I was just responding to the fact that the OP had diagnosed his wife with bipolar disorder, which were not the symptoms she was exhibiting. And that is a disease I do know a lot about, including drugs used and life strategies in how to live with someone with bipolar disorder.
Perhaps get to know some of us long timers in this forum before you start casting stones? Especially when you have 1 post to your credit in this forum/and that is you misreading me for what I said and attacking me!
It would be appreciated if you would read the post correctly and stop lashing out! Talk about worse than Twitter! Lol
I was going to write a last post about the abuse the OP is living in, but you covered it very nicely.
Marc is a man, who is in a relationship which is abusive. I help facilitate a group for abused women for a year, and have taken courses in counselling abused women. But it was always mentioned that being abused is not exclusive to women. Many men can be abused, by controlling, selfish women. So much of what the OP says reads like a manual on counselling abuse victims. That's something else the OP should look into.
After all I have read on this thread from so many men, including you, Scribe, is how abuse of men is rampant. In my last church, I was a member of a committee to find needs we could help with in our community as part of our local missions outreach. I interviewed the director of the women's counselling group in town, and she said she really wanted me to understand that they were flooded with abused men, and finding services for them was difficult. This was a very upper middle class community, a bedroom community for a nearby big city. And many wives were brutalizing their husbands.
Abuse is always wrong. And I think the testimonies here are a witness that women can be abusers, just as much as men. I think women get physically battered more, but the control and power over victims is the same in any relationship gone wrong.
(Sorry, I should have stopped writing back in the beginning!)
Marc is a man, who is in a relationship which is abusive. I help facilitate a group for abused women for a year, and have taken courses in counselling abused women. But it was always mentioned that being abused is not exclusive to women. Many men can be abused, by controlling, selfish women. So much of what the OP says reads like a manual on counselling abuse victims. That's something else the OP should look into.
After all I have read on this thread from so many men, including you, Scribe, is how abuse of men is rampant. In my last church, I was a member of a committee to find needs we could help with in our community as part of our local missions outreach. I interviewed the director of the women's counselling group in town, and she said she really wanted me to understand that they were flooded with abused men, and finding services for them was difficult. This was a very upper middle class community, a bedroom community for a nearby big city. And many wives were brutalizing their husbands.
Abuse is always wrong. And I think the testimonies here are a witness that women can be abusers, just as much as men. I think women get physically battered more, but the control and power over victims is the same in any relationship gone wrong.
(Sorry, I should have stopped writing back in the beginning!)
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S
It is informative to hear from someone with real experience in this. I thought of writing a book on the subject to help those men who are desperately seeking answers as I was when I was going through that daily horror. I probably will someday after I have more years of experience helping people as a pastor.
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I knew someone once who was behaving very oddly and I just couldn't make sense of it. And then I read up about Borderline Personality disorder and the beahaviours fit her to a tee.
I'm not about to label her though but it just helps me know what Im dealing with and to know its not anything to do with ME.
The other one thats hard to live with for many is narcissistic personality. This one can be quite extreme and for many the best thing to do is have no contact, but thats not always possible in family situations.
FYI both the above conditions are NOT bipolar disorder. Bipolar disorder is very different. The OPs wife does not fit with those symptoms. I know because I used to suffer from it. Thank God Jesus set me free.
if you want to know what bipolar disorder is I can explain but please do not confuse the manic depression (its former name) with a personality disorder or even schizophrenia.
I'm not about to label her though but it just helps me know what Im dealing with and to know its not anything to do with ME.
The other one thats hard to live with for many is narcissistic personality. This one can be quite extreme and for many the best thing to do is have no contact, but thats not always possible in family situations.
FYI both the above conditions are NOT bipolar disorder. Bipolar disorder is very different. The OPs wife does not fit with those symptoms. I know because I used to suffer from it. Thank God Jesus set me free.
if you want to know what bipolar disorder is I can explain but please do not confuse the manic depression (its former name) with a personality disorder or even schizophrenia.
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Hi Mark,
My wife is also Asian. She is from Indonesia.
A lot of things you say are things probably a lot of us who are married can relate to if we cherry pick the worst moments of arguments. Is she pretty nice most of the time? Maybe it is hard to tell while you are separated.
I've got three approaches to this topic, three categories of life experience that might help you.
Being Understanding During Hormonal Cycles
One is prayer. My wife also prays, quite a bit, studies the Bible a lot, and is very dedicated to the Lord and has been since I met her. We've had some arguments at times. She could get very argumentative during PMS, sometimes really depressed, too, after an argument. After a while, I noticed if she was in a certain mood just not to argue and ignore what she said, not that I was always successful at not being pulled into it. And she'd get all depressed about how our marriage was 'always' like this, and blame me for being so hard to deal with, during her argumentative time, from my perspective. If your wife gets like that, if you can learn not to get drawn into the argument, take a step back, and think of her like a child or like someone you are observing, that might help. You don't argue with the child who throws a tantrum, or you shouldn't. Just tell her calmly she is not being reasonable and you refuse to argue with her, or speak kind words of comfort. Patting my wife on the back and saying, "I'm sorry you feel like X" worked a time or two. But then she says, "You are just saying that because you make me feel better." There is no one trick that helps if she's going through some kind of emotional cycle like that. Just be understanding and do not let it offend you. I just thought in my head, "Don't argue with the PMS."
Gladly, thankfully, these mood swings seem to have become rare with age. My wife is in her '40's now, so that could be it. It could also be grace, spiritual maturity, and answers to prayer.
If your wife gets like this many weeks out of the month, hormones may not be the issue, but some of the advice above may not apply. Be the adult. If she gets unreasonable, point out what she is doing that is unreasonable. If she puts her hands on her hips, point out that that looks disrespectful... that sort of thing. Tell her you can discuss it when she calms down and stops [insert bad behavior, accusing, name calling, etc.] You can call her out for being out of line without joining her in the argument or activity. You can also remind her that you are good to her, and she says those bad things about you, etc.
See Part 2
My wife is also Asian. She is from Indonesia.
A lot of things you say are things probably a lot of us who are married can relate to if we cherry pick the worst moments of arguments. Is she pretty nice most of the time? Maybe it is hard to tell while you are separated.
I've got three approaches to this topic, three categories of life experience that might help you.
Being Understanding During Hormonal Cycles
One is prayer. My wife also prays, quite a bit, studies the Bible a lot, and is very dedicated to the Lord and has been since I met her. We've had some arguments at times. She could get very argumentative during PMS, sometimes really depressed, too, after an argument. After a while, I noticed if she was in a certain mood just not to argue and ignore what she said, not that I was always successful at not being pulled into it. And she'd get all depressed about how our marriage was 'always' like this, and blame me for being so hard to deal with, during her argumentative time, from my perspective. If your wife gets like that, if you can learn not to get drawn into the argument, take a step back, and think of her like a child or like someone you are observing, that might help. You don't argue with the child who throws a tantrum, or you shouldn't. Just tell her calmly she is not being reasonable and you refuse to argue with her, or speak kind words of comfort. Patting my wife on the back and saying, "I'm sorry you feel like X" worked a time or two. But then she says, "You are just saying that because you make me feel better." There is no one trick that helps if she's going through some kind of emotional cycle like that. Just be understanding and do not let it offend you. I just thought in my head, "Don't argue with the PMS."
Gladly, thankfully, these mood swings seem to have become rare with age. My wife is in her '40's now, so that could be it. It could also be grace, spiritual maturity, and answers to prayer.
If your wife gets like this many weeks out of the month, hormones may not be the issue, but some of the advice above may not apply. Be the adult. If she gets unreasonable, point out what she is doing that is unreasonable. If she puts her hands on her hips, point out that that looks disrespectful... that sort of thing. Tell her you can discuss it when she calms down and stops [insert bad behavior, accusing, name calling, etc.] You can call her out for being out of line without joining her in the argument or activity. You can also remind her that you are good to her, and she says those bad things about you, etc.
See Part 2
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Part 2,
I hope this testimony will help you.
Pregnancy, Prayer
My wife and I had a couple of little spats, against when she was probably 'hormonal', where she got just a bit snippy toward me, and once when I was sick and kept waking her from sleep from help, and a time or two when she was sick, during over two years of marriage. Otherwise, it was pretty much Honeymoon time for two years, living in Indonesia. Then she got pregnant. I was busy saving data on a computer before flash drives, onto disks and stuff, while she was packing boxes. It made her angry that I wasn't packing the boxes. I had an order in which to do things, and data was first for me. Anyway, that got her angry. Then it was like months of disrespect and irritability. Then post-partum was worse. Lot's of arguments that made no sense, getting angry and then crying over nothing. We'd had this pre-birth class at the hospital-- highly recommended-- which warned us about post-partum, momma bear instincts to protect the baby in ways that don't make sense. It played out in our marriage.
Somehow, the disrespect, irritabilty, etc. died down. She wasn't having a good time, either. That was our first child. There are certain things that stress a marriage-- having a baby, moving house, moving overseas, unemployment, living with in-laws. I remember this list from when I was young. It was in a magazine article a friend discussed with me. That first pregnancy, I brought my wife to America to live for the first time to live in her in-laws house while I was unemployed. Poor woman! I did not realize it at the time. We've gone through times of marriage stress on extended stays with my parents.
Fast forward to child number 4. I am in grad school, employed, but earning just about enough to pay rent, living on student loans. So kind of like unemployment. We live in a small apartment in a new place, not a foreign country from the US, but different. My wife gets this attitude toward me. Lots of disrespect, arguing about everything.
I was putting the dishes in the dishwasher, and she bumps me to the side, scolding me about how that wasn't the way to do it, thinking her way was the only way. I remembered thinking how disrespectful, and it occurred to me that I hadn't been praying for her about this attitude. I think God was dealing with me about being negligent in that area.
I said something really innocuous to her, not argumentative at all, and she stormed out of the room at my words. I can't remember what it was, just something that normally would not have caused a problem. I looked out the window and the van was gone! She'd never done this, but she drove to the home of an older Christian lady friend from church. The lady told her to call me. They talked at night. I said she could spend the night and be back in time to get the van home to take our oldest to school in the morning.
The Prayer
So I prayed for my while she was gone.
My wife recently told me about a lady from church. She'd gotten a word of knowledge about something specific from the woman's life, and the woman said that to her in conversation.
I remembered that. I told the Lord if he could talk to her about this other thing, He could talk to her about our marriage. I had six or seven things I prayed for. I pointed out to the Lord that wives are supposed to submit to their husbands. There were some things that went nowhere when I discussed them with my wife. I had wanted to tell my wife that I thought she was probably imitating patterns of anger that she saw her stepmom display toward her father. I'd never gotten that out in a conversation. I asked if that was the case, for the Lord to show that to her. I pointed out that Sarah submitted to Abraham, calling him Lord, and my wife did not embrace that concept in the way she treated me. She had been treating me with disrespect, not respect and submission. This was years ago. There were so many things I prayed. I wish I could remember all the details.
And then I prayed out of I John that if you pray according to His will, you know that you have them. I reminded the Lord that my wife was His daughter, and that it was not God's will for her to do certain things she had been doing, and that I knew it was His will that He obeyed these things according to Scripture. And I had this strong sense of faith, of knowing my prayer would be answered as I made this argument in prayer to the Lord.
But I was still amazed.
My wife was going to this program at church to help people out of past bondages. They listened to a speaker and then worked through a workbook with a leader at a table. So she comes home, and asks me to sit next to her on the coach. She wanted to talk.
Uh-oh, she wanted to talk. I did not feel like fighting again. But she had a pleasant demeanor. She started off saying, "You are a good husband." Wow, okay, this was different. Then she told me how she was at this meeting and the Lord spoke to her about several things. The 'table shepherd' asked them if they had an anger problem. If you have done X, you might have an anger problem. She thought, "I don't have a problem with anger." If you got angry at your husband at how he did dishes, you might have an anger problem. Then she remembered the way she acted when I did the dishes and started listening.
So then she said the Lord showed her.... and took me through about five of the specific things I'd prayed about-- points I had laid an argument before the Lord about, based on verses of scripture. She even said something about how she'd seen her step-mom treat her dad-- unprompted from me-- something I'd been wanting to talk to her about.
The thing is though, if I prayed a few sentences and had a few sentences of ideas about it, she had a page or two worth of insights of herself that she said the Lord spoke to her about. There were a couple of items, including the Sarah Abraham thing that she told me that the Lord spoke to her later, within several weeks of that first night, but those eventually were ticked off the list (metaphorically. I did not write my prayer as a list when I prayed it.) There were other things, about how she'd criticized me and the ways that it hurt me and the way I thought about myself or my relationship with God.. something along those lines. That rung true. I knew what she was talking about, but I didn't remember praying about that.
We moved. Moves are a time of stress where we might argue. She was as sweet as a sugar. Even after we moved, I'd see her occasionally standing around crying. I asked her why she was crying. She was regretting the way she treated me before. I told her I forgave her and reassured her. We would stay up talking until 2 AM, with that excitement we had when we were first dating talking on the phone. It was a really precious time in our marriage.
There have been times sense where I wished I could push a button and put her back in that mode. Maybe it can happen again when she prays with faith. She's matured and does not generally treat me with the disrespect I sensed during much of that pregnancy, but I am glad she doesn't stand around crying and feeling guilty.
My point is do not overlook the fact that God can actually fix problems like this in people. Especially in your case, as in mine, if you have a woman who spends time in prayer, who presumably at times asks God to change her character to make her more like Christ, the kind of stuff many devout Christians pray, who is open to God's working, and you are praying for some good changes for her, to make her more Christ-like. Just pray in faith.
I don't think any kind of secular marriage counseling, any kind of medical doctor in a white coat giving her or me pills could have done anything to transform our marriage like that.
I'm sure she prays for me. I can't remember that dramatic of a testimony. Of course, sometimes these types of prayers are answered in ways that might __seem__ mundane, but God still is at work.
I hope this testimony will help you.
Pregnancy, Prayer
My wife and I had a couple of little spats, against when she was probably 'hormonal', where she got just a bit snippy toward me, and once when I was sick and kept waking her from sleep from help, and a time or two when she was sick, during over two years of marriage. Otherwise, it was pretty much Honeymoon time for two years, living in Indonesia. Then she got pregnant. I was busy saving data on a computer before flash drives, onto disks and stuff, while she was packing boxes. It made her angry that I wasn't packing the boxes. I had an order in which to do things, and data was first for me. Anyway, that got her angry. Then it was like months of disrespect and irritability. Then post-partum was worse. Lot's of arguments that made no sense, getting angry and then crying over nothing. We'd had this pre-birth class at the hospital-- highly recommended-- which warned us about post-partum, momma bear instincts to protect the baby in ways that don't make sense. It played out in our marriage.
Somehow, the disrespect, irritabilty, etc. died down. She wasn't having a good time, either. That was our first child. There are certain things that stress a marriage-- having a baby, moving house, moving overseas, unemployment, living with in-laws. I remember this list from when I was young. It was in a magazine article a friend discussed with me. That first pregnancy, I brought my wife to America to live for the first time to live in her in-laws house while I was unemployed. Poor woman! I did not realize it at the time. We've gone through times of marriage stress on extended stays with my parents.
Fast forward to child number 4. I am in grad school, employed, but earning just about enough to pay rent, living on student loans. So kind of like unemployment. We live in a small apartment in a new place, not a foreign country from the US, but different. My wife gets this attitude toward me. Lots of disrespect, arguing about everything.
I was putting the dishes in the dishwasher, and she bumps me to the side, scolding me about how that wasn't the way to do it, thinking her way was the only way. I remembered thinking how disrespectful, and it occurred to me that I hadn't been praying for her about this attitude. I think God was dealing with me about being negligent in that area.
I said something really innocuous to her, not argumentative at all, and she stormed out of the room at my words. I can't remember what it was, just something that normally would not have caused a problem. I looked out the window and the van was gone! She'd never done this, but she drove to the home of an older Christian lady friend from church. The lady told her to call me. They talked at night. I said she could spend the night and be back in time to get the van home to take our oldest to school in the morning.
The Prayer
So I prayed for my while she was gone.
My wife recently told me about a lady from church. She'd gotten a word of knowledge about something specific from the woman's life, and the woman said that to her in conversation.
I remembered that. I told the Lord if he could talk to her about this other thing, He could talk to her about our marriage. I had six or seven things I prayed for. I pointed out to the Lord that wives are supposed to submit to their husbands. There were some things that went nowhere when I discussed them with my wife. I had wanted to tell my wife that I thought she was probably imitating patterns of anger that she saw her stepmom display toward her father. I'd never gotten that out in a conversation. I asked if that was the case, for the Lord to show that to her. I pointed out that Sarah submitted to Abraham, calling him Lord, and my wife did not embrace that concept in the way she treated me. She had been treating me with disrespect, not respect and submission. This was years ago. There were so many things I prayed. I wish I could remember all the details.
And then I prayed out of I John that if you pray according to His will, you know that you have them. I reminded the Lord that my wife was His daughter, and that it was not God's will for her to do certain things she had been doing, and that I knew it was His will that He obeyed these things according to Scripture. And I had this strong sense of faith, of knowing my prayer would be answered as I made this argument in prayer to the Lord.
But I was still amazed.
My wife was going to this program at church to help people out of past bondages. They listened to a speaker and then worked through a workbook with a leader at a table. So she comes home, and asks me to sit next to her on the coach. She wanted to talk.
Uh-oh, she wanted to talk. I did not feel like fighting again. But she had a pleasant demeanor. She started off saying, "You are a good husband." Wow, okay, this was different. Then she told me how she was at this meeting and the Lord spoke to her about several things. The 'table shepherd' asked them if they had an anger problem. If you have done X, you might have an anger problem. She thought, "I don't have a problem with anger." If you got angry at your husband at how he did dishes, you might have an anger problem. Then she remembered the way she acted when I did the dishes and started listening.
So then she said the Lord showed her.... and took me through about five of the specific things I'd prayed about-- points I had laid an argument before the Lord about, based on verses of scripture. She even said something about how she'd seen her step-mom treat her dad-- unprompted from me-- something I'd been wanting to talk to her about.
The thing is though, if I prayed a few sentences and had a few sentences of ideas about it, she had a page or two worth of insights of herself that she said the Lord spoke to her about. There were a couple of items, including the Sarah Abraham thing that she told me that the Lord spoke to her later, within several weeks of that first night, but those eventually were ticked off the list (metaphorically. I did not write my prayer as a list when I prayed it.) There were other things, about how she'd criticized me and the ways that it hurt me and the way I thought about myself or my relationship with God.. something along those lines. That rung true. I knew what she was talking about, but I didn't remember praying about that.
We moved. Moves are a time of stress where we might argue. She was as sweet as a sugar. Even after we moved, I'd see her occasionally standing around crying. I asked her why she was crying. She was regretting the way she treated me before. I told her I forgave her and reassured her. We would stay up talking until 2 AM, with that excitement we had when we were first dating talking on the phone. It was a really precious time in our marriage.
There have been times sense where I wished I could push a button and put her back in that mode. Maybe it can happen again when she prays with faith. She's matured and does not generally treat me with the disrespect I sensed during much of that pregnancy, but I am glad she doesn't stand around crying and feeling guilty.
My point is do not overlook the fact that God can actually fix problems like this in people. Especially in your case, as in mine, if you have a woman who spends time in prayer, who presumably at times asks God to change her character to make her more like Christ, the kind of stuff many devout Christians pray, who is open to God's working, and you are praying for some good changes for her, to make her more Christ-like. Just pray in faith.
I don't think any kind of secular marriage counseling, any kind of medical doctor in a white coat giving her or me pills could have done anything to transform our marriage like that.
I'm sure she prays for me. I can't remember that dramatic of a testimony. Of course, sometimes these types of prayers are answered in ways that might __seem__ mundane, but God still is at work.
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Part 3
Getting out of the arguing cycle.
My wife and I have gotten into argument cycles. We took a class at church once where we read 'Love and Respect' by Eggerich. He described it as a 'crazy cycle' where the husband doesn't show the wife love, so she doesn't show him respect, so he doesn't show her love. I'm not sure the love-respect model exactly captures it, but I think a couple can get into the argument cycle, where comments that normally would mean little somehow turn into arguments. Argument after argument.
We are vulnerable to it at times of stress, especially. Moving house is one of those times, and so is staying with in-laws. Those are times when my wife have gotten into these cycles. When I was unemployed, coming in from overseas, and crashing at my parents large house, with my family-- which made sense to me, because we hadn't seen them in so long-- that is stressful for her and the stress builds. I can understand the 'staying with in-laws' stress. Some of my stress comes from dip baths, squat toilest, sleeping on the floor and no A/C, but there is the social stress and the lack of the freedom of being in your own space. Having kids complicates it further.
Your wife may be stressed because you are separated. If a boyfriend cheated on her (had a girlfriend on the side) or she saw cheating among relatives, that may make her inclined to jealousy. You being away may make her scared you will cheat. Maybe she has known of expats in her country to cheat. My wife's dad, when he first found out she was interested in a white man, mentioned 'contract wives' to her. Expats he'd been around had done that. It's not even a thing in my country. Separation may cause stress.
So, when my wife and I have gotten into a cycle of arguing on a few occasions, here is how we got out of the loop. I tell her let's pray together. We pray and ask God for help in our relationship. We ask for forgiveness. I confess my sins and shortcomings to you without pointing out yours. You point out yours without pointing out mine. Then we forgive each other. She started out saying she doesn't want to pray, accusing me of insincerity, or of saying I will change but not changing (and I am thinking, she is blaming this on ___me__, with her attitude. But that's the way both of us have been thinking.)
Usually, in this 'crazy cycle' when she talks, it feels like it will lead to an argument, or like she is criticizing and complaining, and like she is draining the life out of me. She does not like being heard and that comes off as unloving or disrespectful to her.
So, on maybe three or four occasions in the past, I insisted we do this. We did it, and then we were at peace with one another. We could talk without it turning into an argument, enjoy talking to each other, and enjoy one another's company.
Another little tips is when one of you wants to point out of a flaw, problem, something the other did that you do not like, do it in a very careful manner. My wife did this when we first got married. "Honey, do you mind if I tell you something?" "Go ahead." "There is something you said to my parents that I did not like." or whatever it was. After we'd been married a while, she'd blurt it out, over and over for 30 minutes over some small thing. The careful way of presenting criticism, IMO, is better. Criticising to make oneself feel better to 'get it off your chest' is not as helpful as doing it with care to help the other person, in a way the other person can accept without feeling defensive or overwhelmed with criticism.
If you think this is helpful, you can copy your wife on it.
Getting out of the arguing cycle.
My wife and I have gotten into argument cycles. We took a class at church once where we read 'Love and Respect' by Eggerich. He described it as a 'crazy cycle' where the husband doesn't show the wife love, so she doesn't show him respect, so he doesn't show her love. I'm not sure the love-respect model exactly captures it, but I think a couple can get into the argument cycle, where comments that normally would mean little somehow turn into arguments. Argument after argument.
We are vulnerable to it at times of stress, especially. Moving house is one of those times, and so is staying with in-laws. Those are times when my wife have gotten into these cycles. When I was unemployed, coming in from overseas, and crashing at my parents large house, with my family-- which made sense to me, because we hadn't seen them in so long-- that is stressful for her and the stress builds. I can understand the 'staying with in-laws' stress. Some of my stress comes from dip baths, squat toilest, sleeping on the floor and no A/C, but there is the social stress and the lack of the freedom of being in your own space. Having kids complicates it further.
Your wife may be stressed because you are separated. If a boyfriend cheated on her (had a girlfriend on the side) or she saw cheating among relatives, that may make her inclined to jealousy. You being away may make her scared you will cheat. Maybe she has known of expats in her country to cheat. My wife's dad, when he first found out she was interested in a white man, mentioned 'contract wives' to her. Expats he'd been around had done that. It's not even a thing in my country. Separation may cause stress.
So, when my wife and I have gotten into a cycle of arguing on a few occasions, here is how we got out of the loop. I tell her let's pray together. We pray and ask God for help in our relationship. We ask for forgiveness. I confess my sins and shortcomings to you without pointing out yours. You point out yours without pointing out mine. Then we forgive each other. She started out saying she doesn't want to pray, accusing me of insincerity, or of saying I will change but not changing (and I am thinking, she is blaming this on ___me__, with her attitude. But that's the way both of us have been thinking.)
Usually, in this 'crazy cycle' when she talks, it feels like it will lead to an argument, or like she is criticizing and complaining, and like she is draining the life out of me. She does not like being heard and that comes off as unloving or disrespectful to her.
So, on maybe three or four occasions in the past, I insisted we do this. We did it, and then we were at peace with one another. We could talk without it turning into an argument, enjoy talking to each other, and enjoy one another's company.
Another little tips is when one of you wants to point out of a flaw, problem, something the other did that you do not like, do it in a very careful manner. My wife did this when we first got married. "Honey, do you mind if I tell you something?" "Go ahead." "There is something you said to my parents that I did not like." or whatever it was. After we'd been married a while, she'd blurt it out, over and over for 30 minutes over some small thing. The careful way of presenting criticism, IMO, is better. Criticising to make oneself feel better to 'get it off your chest' is not as helpful as doing it with care to help the other person, in a way the other person can accept without feeling defensive or overwhelmed with criticism.
If you think this is helpful, you can copy your wife on it.
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Part 4, Bonus-- Cross-cultural stuff
There probably have been a few arguments or hurt feelings that we had that were based in culture. I've done or said things that were okay in the US, but not in Indonesia. She told someone about me, "He doesn't know anything." She meant about the topic. In Indonesian, that does not mean I don't know anything, just that I did not know about a topic. In English, it came off as quite disrespectful. I informed her of that later. American humor can be rather cruel (e.g. "What do you call 50 lawyers buried up to their necks in sand? Not enough sand!") There are a lot of things that can get you in trouble cross-culturally.
I read something from an American husband who said he's wife got upset when she pointed at something and he did not get what she was saying. She'd point with her lips. I was married to my wife probably 15 years before I realized Indonesians pointed with her lips. I probably found that out from discussing that comment about Filipinos doing it with my wife. Since then, I have noticed her do it.
But overall, it does not seem, to me, that the cross-cultural thing is a big root of arguments in our marriage. I spent over a decade there, learned the language, know a bit about the culture, and she's lived in the US since she married me. So that might mitigate it. We also have some common values in our faith. I probably have a lot more in common in terms of values and ways of thinking with her than I would have if I'd married a random American woman off the street.
There probably have been a few arguments or hurt feelings that we had that were based in culture. I've done or said things that were okay in the US, but not in Indonesia. She told someone about me, "He doesn't know anything." She meant about the topic. In Indonesian, that does not mean I don't know anything, just that I did not know about a topic. In English, it came off as quite disrespectful. I informed her of that later. American humor can be rather cruel (e.g. "What do you call 50 lawyers buried up to their necks in sand? Not enough sand!") There are a lot of things that can get you in trouble cross-culturally.
I read something from an American husband who said he's wife got upset when she pointed at something and he did not get what she was saying. She'd point with her lips. I was married to my wife probably 15 years before I realized Indonesians pointed with her lips. I probably found that out from discussing that comment about Filipinos doing it with my wife. Since then, I have noticed her do it.
But overall, it does not seem, to me, that the cross-cultural thing is a big root of arguments in our marriage. I spent over a decade there, learned the language, know a bit about the culture, and she's lived in the US since she married me. So that might mitigate it. We also have some common values in our faith. I probably have a lot more in common in terms of values and ways of thinking with her than I would have if I'd married a random American woman off the street.
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I posted mine before I saw this. I agree with the point about staying calm and not participating in the arguing. Thankfully, my wife has not been one to hurl insults. We've never cussed at each other.
One thing I would disagree with, is since they are married, that he shouldn't say anything about leaving her or her making him leave her.
My wife mentioned divorce a few times when she was really upset. Of course, later she apologized. I've never threatened to divorce her. We are married. If we have an argument-- and we should always treat each other with respect-- but if there is an argument, it is something we work through, not something that ends the marriage.
This woman is afraid he is going to cheat on her and leave her, and threatening to leave her may not be good for the way she feels about the marriage. She needs to feel confident in their marriage, safe, and feel secure that she has a faithful husband. Threatening to leave does not help with that.
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I read this statistic that couples that pray together regularly have a less than 1% divorce rate. I think I actually tracked it down. The sample was not collected in a formal scientific way. It was a questionnaire of some sort at a Christian conference, but I think it had a reasonably large sample size. I just thought I would share that encouragement.
I posted to you in four different messages above, and did not tag you on all of them.
I posted to you in four different messages above, and did not tag you on all of them.
"What can I do to change my wifes hostility towards me?"
If you're truly serious about setting things straight and proving it to those around you . . . remove yourself from your home and do not return until you are able to conclusively describe how you have changed and can explain what it is that you plan to do to ensure that you do not fall back to old ways.
Remove yourself from the home? Yes. I made the mistake of shipping off a step-child to another state to attempt to grab her attention, as she was acting out in unbelievable ways. The truth is . . . is that I was abusing alcohol and unable to control my anger and emotions. I was supposed to be the leader of the home, but under the pressure, I showed that I had no maturity within me. But because I was ignorant, I farmed out my amazing step-daughter when in truth, it was me that needed to leave so that I would grow up and get my act together. I was a total hypocrite.
If you're truly serious about setting things straight and proving it to those around you . . . remove yourself from your home and do not return until you are able to conclusively describe how you have changed and can explain what it is that you plan to do to ensure that you do not fall back to old ways.
Remove yourself from the home? Yes. I made the mistake of shipping off a step-child to another state to attempt to grab her attention, as she was acting out in unbelievable ways. The truth is . . . is that I was abusing alcohol and unable to control my anger and emotions. I was supposed to be the leader of the home, but under the pressure, I showed that I had no maturity within me. But because I was ignorant, I farmed out my amazing step-daughter when in truth, it was me that needed to leave so that I would grow up and get my act together. I was a total hypocrite.
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M
Dear Lord, do I feel for you. I'm so sorry. All you can do is pray - so sorry that's all I have to offer. But the further away she pushes herself from you, the closer to God you need to be. Pray for her, pray that God will impress upon her what she's doing, and pray that God will work with your heart to better understand her.
God bless your heart!
God bless your heart!
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