What exactly is our soul?

[Genez]

I respect RBT's opinions, but IMO it makes no sense to divorce Gen. 1:26-27 from Gen. 2:7.
Nor does it make sense to view nothing as something other than God's invisible Self/Being.

And, same for your opinion as well.

 

[Genez]

*sigh* fallen man has a spirit. It is dead to God. Remember the Prodigal son? His dad said that the prodigal was dead. Obviously not in the sense of no longer existing. Likewise the human spirit when Adam disobeyed.

Run with that notion if you wish.

In the mean while.
Let go of my ankles, please.

 

[Genez]

Actually, we can know a lot, but you miss a qualification. I trust that you know what an apple tastes like. Now how would you describe the taste of an apple to someone who has never eaten one in such a way that they will know what an apple tastes like? It is an impossible task as we simply do not have the words necessary to express it. We can use words to give an approximation, but only an approximation, the words fall short.

But that is not what we are dealing with.
God chose Hebrew and Greek for good reason.

For example.... Alexander the Great conquered the world in a relatively short time.
Why? He devised the exactness of the Koine Greek.
It was designed to be exacting and clear as to have no commands or orders misunderstood.

For Alexander was dealing with an army that spoke a variety of dialects and languages.
He created one that was designed to be exacting and free of misinterpretation.
Later on... that koine became the Greek of most of the New Testament, but with a few exceptions.

 

[Genez]

*sigh* fallen man has a spirit. It is dead to God. Remember the Prodigal son? His dad said that the prodigal was dead. Obviously not in the sense of no longer existing. Likewise the human spirit when Adam disobeyed.

Threw this one into your intellectual garbage disposal and came up with reviving a 'good as dead' human spirit?

Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit gives birth to spirit. ​

You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You must be born ​

again.’ John 3:6-7​

Why can't you guys THINK with what it says!?

Spirit gives birth to spirit.​

​

That does not mean to revive something that became inert!

There is a reason the Church is in trouble today.
Being a Christian does not give us the license to declare something is truth because it feels good to think it.

There is a way that seems right to a man, but its end is the way of death. Prov 14:12​

​

.​

 

[GWH]

It is harmonized. Gen.1:27 speaks of God creating two human beings and Gen 2:7 speaks of Him forming the body for one of those human beings so they would express themselves in this world. (ie.living soul)

All is created by God. I would be careful saying "all is of God". It could be construed as pantheism.

Then why did you say "It is divorced because it uses two different Hebrew words"?

Yes, I am careful to say that omnipresence should not be construed as justifying pantheism,
because God manifested via the four physical dimensions is not personhood, so GW does not teach a Quadity.

 

[GWH]

And, same for your opinion as well.

Thanks, and ditto yours, too.

 

[Genez]

Thanks, and ditto yours, too.

This is reality we are dealing with.
Reality of our future that will be set into gold, silver, and precious stones for all eternity.
Not about sibling rivalry while Dad is in another room.
Let that sink in.

For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. ​

If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, ​

their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be ​

revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. If what has been ​

built survives, the builder will receive a reward. If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss ​

but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames. 1 Cor 3:11-15​

​

A special honored closeness to Him will be rewarded to some.
While others today choose closeness to others like themself.

I speak this way because God is fair and just.

 

[Genez]

I respect RBT's opinions, but IMO it makes no sense to divorce Gen. 1:26-27 from Gen. 2:7.

Oh yes there is a big difference!
Look how Genesis 2, begins.

Thus the heavens and the earth, and all the host of them, were finished. ​

And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He ​

rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. ​

Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested ​

from all His work which God had created and made.​

God rested from 'bara.'
Genesis 2 begins with God working with what had been created out from nothing in Genesis One.

Genesis 2 is not about the creation of man.
That took place in Genesis 1:26-27.

Genesis 2 was about God providing a material body for the created soul and human spirit of Adam.

You will remain being your soul when you are in your resurrection body.
This current body you have is not you. It is only a means for you.


.....

 

[sawdust]

Then why did you say "It is divorced because it uses two different Hebrew words"?

Yes, I am careful to say that omnipresence should not be construed as justifying pantheism,
because God manifested via the four physical dimensions is not personhood, so GW does not teach a Quadity.

If you noticed I used divorced in quotes as that was the language you used. Why you think Gen.1:26-27 is divorced from Gen.2:7? I don't know simply because they are speaking of the creation of man in it's stages.

 

[sawdust]

Then why did you say "It is divorced because it uses two different Hebrew words"?

Yes, I am careful to say that omnipresence should not be construed as justifying pantheism,
because God manifested via the four physical dimensions is not personhood, so GW does not teach a Quadity.

btw Did you mean to say quiddity in your last sentence because I'm really not sure what you are saying here.

 

[Genez]

btw Did you mean to say quiddity in your last sentence because I'm really not sure what you are saying here.

Years ago there was a book that had to do with, "How to influence people by using fancy language."

In the mean while.
Nothing ends up being understood as it should be.

"How to say nothing while seeming to know what you are talking about..."

I hate dealing with that type.

 

[GWH]

This is reality we are dealing with.
Reality of our future that will be set into gold, silver, and precious stones for all eternity.
Not about sibling rivalry while Dad is in another room.
Let that sink in.

For no one can lay any foundation other than the one already laid, which is Jesus Christ. ​

If anyone builds on this foundation using gold, silver, costly stones, wood, hay or straw, ​

their work will be shown for what it is, because the Day will bring it to light. It will be ​

revealed with fire, and the fire will test the quality of each person’s work. If what has been ​

built survives, the builder will receive a reward. If it is burned up, the builder will suffer loss ​

but yet will be saved—even though only as one escaping through the flames. 1 Cor 3:11-15​

​

A special honored closeness to Him will be rewarded to some.
While others today choose closeness to others like themself.

I speak this way because God is fair and just.

Amen. That is why I post the Christian creed repeatedly, hoping that it will sink in.
Ditto re the doctrine of MFW/God's justness and love.

 

[Genez]

I don't have the time or inclination to go into the reasons why your understanding is wrong. If you think that being a living soul is in the image of God who is Spirit, I can't help you.

When it says the Lord breathed into the nostrils the 'breath of life?"
The Hebrew shows it in the plural...

Breathed into the nostrils the "Breath of lives."

A living soul needs a human spirit!
The Lord breathed into the nostrils both soul and a human spirit!

Here! https://theexplanation.medium.com/h...l-breath-of-lives-in-genesis-2-7-e9819c072e60

grace and peace!

 

[GWH]

btw Did you mean to say quiddity in your last sentence because I'm really not sure what you are saying here.

I said Quadity, meaning God the Father, Son, HS and Creation. My full insight is that since the creation also manifests God (Gen. 1:1, Rom. 1:20, cf. John 1:1-3 & Psa. 33:6), in a sense God may be viewed as a “Quadity”. As Paul told the Athenians (Acts 17:28), “In Him we live and move and have our being.” God as Creation is throughout physical reality (called omnipresence aka “panentheism”). However, since this mode of revelation is impersonal, it has rightly been de-emphasized by most Christian denominations lest it lead to pantheism.

 

[GWH]

Oh yes there is a big difference!
Look how Genesis 2, begins.

Thus the heavens and the earth, and all the host of them, were finished. ​

And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He ​

rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. ​

Then God blessed the seventh day and sanctified it, because in it He rested ​

from all His work which God had created and made.​

God rested from 'bara.'
Genesis 2 begins with God working with what had been created out from nothing in Genesis One.

Genesis 2 is not about the creation of man.
That took place in Genesis 1:26-27.

Genesis 2 was about God providing a material body for the created soul and human spirit of Adam.

You will remain being your soul when you are in your resurrection body.
This current body you have is not you. It is only a means for you.


.....

How can you/why would you divorce Genesis 1 from 2 when Adam means man and Eve means mother of all living?!

IOW, I thought RBT's interpretation was interesting, but I decided the more obvious understanding makes more sense.
I will apologize to him in heaven if I am wrong.

 

[sawdust]

I said Quadity, meaning God the Father, Son, HS and Creation. My full insight is that since the creation also manifests God (Gen. 1:1, Rom. 1:20, cf. John 1:1-3 & Psa. 33:6), in a sense God may be viewed as a “Quadity”. As Paul told the Athenians (Acts 17:28), “In Him we live and move and have our being.” God as Creation is throughout physical reality (called omnipresence aka “panentheism”). However, since this mode of revelation is impersonal, it has rightly been de-emphasized by most Christian denominations lest it lead to pantheism.

I'm glad you clarified as I would never have got that from what you said. Thanks.

I take it Quadity is a word you have made up as I looked through a few dictionaries and couldn't find it.

 

[GWH]

I'm glad you clarified as I would never have got that from what you said. Thanks.

I take it Quadity is a word you have made up as I looked through a few dictionaries and couldn't find it.

Yes, I coined Quadity.
Do you agree that nothing exists outside of/separate from God/Being (I AM)?

 

[Genez]

How can you/why would you divorce Genesis 1 from 2 when Adam means man and Eve means mother of all living?!

IOW, I thought RBT's interpretation was interesting, but I decided the more obvious understanding makes more sense.
I will apologize to him in heaven if I am wrong.

I have not agreed with RBT about everything.
But, he is the only teacher I know that has admitted he had been wrong about something, and then corrected it.

Some of the things he said I thought was stupid. I still do.
But, he is still the best teacher I have ever had the honor to learn from.
And, add to that?
He studied all the time, and taught six nights a week without asking for money for his lessons!

God is faithful.
He has provided for all out legitimate needs.

I know a treasure chest when I see one.
Yet some complain because they got a splinter when opening it up.
A treasure that will afford us great liberty in Heaven to do and to be what gives God great glory.

Some have said...
Uhhh! I won't touch it.
It's a wooden box covered with dirt..

C'est la vie!

 

[sawdust]

Yes, I coined Quadity.
Do you agree that nothing exists outside of/separate from God/Being (I AM)?

I can agree with that. He is the source and sustainer of all things.

 

[GWH]

I have not agreed with RBT about everything.
But, he is the only teacher I know that has admitted he had been wrong about something, and then corrected it.

Some of the things he said I thought was stupid. I still do.
But, he is still the best teacher I have ever had the honor to learn from.
And, add to that?
He studied all the time, and taught six nights a week without asking for money for his lessons!

God is faithful.
He has provided for all out legitimate needs.

I know a treasure chest when I see one.
Yet some complain because they got a splinter when opening it up.
A treasure that will afford us great liberty in Heaven to do and to be what gives God great glory.

Some have said...
Uhhh! I won't touch it.
It's a wooden box covered with dirt..

C'est la vie!

Well, my main criticism was that he translated from both the original languages and from the King James language,
which seemed to bog at times.

My memory says that he graduated from DTS, and that Berachah was an independent Bible church,
but I cannot remember how strongly he taught dispensationalism.