What is the minimum beliefs needed to be a Christian

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Showing me another bible reference that contradicts Jesus' words doesn't clarify the issue, but rather muddies it. I know that in the book of John, Jesus make plenty of declarations that belief in him will earn eternal life. These things are *only* found in John... the "I am" declarations, the public admission of Godly origins, etc. In the other gospels, Jesus tries to keep it a secret, which would explain why he doesn't tell people to "believe in him". Nonetheless, even if he did say that belief would earn you eternal life (and I agree that he did, in the book of John), that still doesn't explain why he gave this answer about following the commandments that I referenced above.


The commandments follows belief. By the way when you read the story of the rich man about giving all his possessions away, you will notice the man asked Jesus "what good thing must I do to receive eternal life" instead of "how should one receive eternal life". Because the man thought you had to earn it through good works Jesus plainly replied to him about keeping the commandments perfectly. The man said he did, but Jesus then plainly told him, you lack spiritual fruit and love. But because the man didn't ask the question right, he got a different answer. The man thought he could earn salvation so Jesus replied to how one who thinks he is righteous can earn it. Which no one can.
 
If anyone knew how to attain eternal life, it would be Jesus himself... right? So what, upon being asked this very question, did Jesus say was the bare minimum?

Jesus said to follow the commandments. Then he said to give away all of your possessions and "follow him". Jesus said nothing about belief (because obviously you can't believe that Jesus died for your sins before he even did so), nor did he speak of faith.

The whole old and new testament talks about the promise of the messiah, Abraham had faith in the promise and it was counted to him for righteousness and Jesus often spoke of faith: Matt 8:10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel. 11And I say unto you, That many shall come from the east and west, and shall sit down with Abraham...
 
because obviously you can't believe that Jesus died for your sins before he even did so

Cha-ching!

Jesus tries to keep it a secret

Cha-ching!

Because if you don't experience things for yourself, you can't really know them.
 
I have been surprised by the sometimes heated debates between Christians. It got me wondering what is the common ground and what is needed for someone to be called a Christian

The list of beliefs I know of.

I suspect these are needed to be called a Christian.

Original Sin
Trinity
Jesus died for sins
Paul is an apostle of Jesus
Bible has no errors
No premarital Sex
Same Sex marriage is wrong

Additional beliefs a Christian may or may not have

Faith not works is salvation
Good works glorify God
Speaking in Tongues
Hell is not forever
God hates
Genesis is literal (Earth is less than 10,000 years old)
Future Sins forgiven
Praying to saints and Mary (Catholics)
Spiritual healing
Heaven reward is the same for everyone
No blood tranfusions
Smoking is a sin (form of Suicide)
All food clean


Mark 10:13
And they brought young children to him, that he should touch them: and his disciples rebuked those that brought them. 14But when Jesus saw it, he was much displeased, and said unto them, Suffer the little children to come unto me, and forbid them not: for of such is the kingdom of God. 15Verily I say unto you, Whosoever shall not receive the kingdom of God as a little child, he shall not enter therein. 16And he took them up in his arms, put his hands upon them, and blessed them.
 
Acts 2
37
Peter’s words pierced their hearts, and they said to him and to the other apostles, “Brothers, what should we do?”

38Peter replied, “Each of you must repent of your sins and turn to God, and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. 39This promise is to you, and to your children, and even to the Gentiles[SUP]h[/SUP]—all who have been called by the Lord our God.”
41Those who believed what Peter said were baptized and added to the church that day—about 3,000 in all.
 
I saw the title saying what is the minimal belief for a Christian. I found this a very interesting question and thought of only one thing. a Mustard seed. eventually our faith becomes a tree
 
True Christians are Trinitarian and thus worship the Creator as He has revealed Himself, Triune.

Nothing on your lists matters without worshipping God as Triune.

Period.

So as long as you get to church on Sunday you have yourself covered ?
 
So as long as you get to church on Sunday you have yourself covered ?
Absolutely not. church is good true but faith is about heart not a building. worshiping is not singing because your in church and everyone else is singing. if you are going to worship God do it out of your heart and how you want to, I do not sing in church because I am a bad singer. however I sing to him whenever I please when I am spending time with him and I even dance. if someone caught me on camera and put me on youtube I garauntee that would get more likes than someone posting a cute little baby on facebook. But I do this with him because I adore him and I don't need to sing in church to praise him nor do I need to go to church to have true faith.
 
Absolutely not. church is good true but faith is about heart not a building. worshiping is not singing because your in church and everyone else is singing. if you are going to worship God do it out of your heart and how you want to, I do not sing in church because I am a bad singer. however I sing to him whenever I please when I am spending time with him and I even dance. if someone caught me on camera and put me on youtube I garauntee that would get more likes than someone posting a cute little baby on facebook. But I do this with him because I adore him and I don't need to sing in church to praise him nor do I need to go to church to have true faith.

Cool but I think the laws could be summarised to two important commandments. This seems to have covered our dealings with God but not with people around us.
 
One of the things that is apparently required to be a Christian today is to make certain that you never speak of the Song of Solomon in any terms except the distantly spiritual, and never even hint that there may be a physical aspect to it.

Of course, I've never personally been able to accept minimalism as a lifestyle.
 
Showing me another bible reference that contradicts Jesus' words doesn't clarify the issue, but rather muddies it. I know that in the book of John, Jesus make plenty of declarations that belief in him will earn eternal life. These things are *only* found in John... the "I am" declarations, the public admission of Godly origins, etc. In the other gospels, Jesus tries to keep it a secret, which would explain why he doesn't tell people to "believe in him". Nonetheless, even if he did say that belief would earn you eternal life (and I agree that he did, in the book of John), that still doesn't explain why he gave this answer about following the commandments that I referenced above.

Jesus would NEVER keep secret the way to salvation.In reference to the the answer about commandments, the question posed to Him was "What are the greatest commandments?"
 
So as long as you get to church on Sunday you have yourself covered ?
Drett, since I care enough about you and want to make sure you know what Christianity really is in it's simplest form, Please watch this 10 minute video. It will answer all your questions.

We really do want you to make the decision to come to Christianity. We will not force you into it. All we wish is that you will come to that decision on your own. We are always here to assist you if you do decide to convert!

This message will change your life! - YouTube

This one is a special bonus I found that is really good. Just thought I'd put it in as well. The first video is the main one though!:p

Christ The Only Way-R.C. Sproul - YouTube



Also, for all you other Christians out there who have other people ask the same question as our brother Drett has done, feel free to share this with them as well. It's the best explanation I have heard!
 
True Christians are Trinitarian and thus worship the Creator as He has revealed Himself, Triune.

Nothing on your lists matters without worshipping God as Triune.

Period.
Wow.

Yeah, I'll bet you've won a lot of souls to Christ with that shtick.

I'm guessing there's a lot of people, children in particular,
who have believed in and received Christ as Savior,
but maybe don't understand or haven't gotten that far in their walk yet.

But thanks to you, I will now be able to explain to them how they're
not "true Christians" because some guy on the internet said so.
 
One of the things that is apparently required to be a Christian today is to make certain that you never speak of the Song of Solomon in any terms except the distantly spiritual, and never even hint that there may be a physical aspect to it.

Of course, I've never personally been able to accept minimalism as a lifestyle.
On a couples retreat a few years back we held a men's meeting
where the speaker was preaching on Song of Solomon.

The only part of his message I remember was his
declaration, and I quote, "That's talking about body parts!"

Got a lot of "amens".
 
Rather than going through all your points from the OP, I will just give you a "Plan of Salvation" I put together. It is addressed to a person, from me. Drett or anyone else who reads it and wants to know more, please PM me.

The Plan Of Salvation
Salvation is not about religion, but it is about a spiritual journey. I believe that for me, being a Christian means a relationship with God through Jesus Christ.

1. The first step is to realize how much God loves you.

  • Genesis 1:27 “So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
  • The reason God created man and woman – humanity, is that God is a God of love.
  • 1John 4:9-10 “This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. 10 This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins.”
  • John 4:8, 16 “God is love”
Do you know what God’s love is? It is perfect, and pure and true. And God ‘s love never fails.
*John 3:16 “For God so loved the world, He gave His one and old son, that whoever believe in Him, would not perish, but have everlasting life.
*Romans 5:8 “For God demonstrates His own love for us in this – that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us.”


2.But obviously there are many things not right with the world – the big things like war and hatred, but also the personal struggles we have, the depressions, the anxieties. We live in a world that was created perfectly by God. He says in Gen.1:31 that the world was ”good.” So where is that goodness now? Oh, we see it from time to time. A kind person, a caring word. But so many times, it is the twistedness and brokenness from wrong choices our ourselves and others. Sometimes just the boredom, and frustration, and wishing there was something more, something better.
Every single person has experienced this. The Bible is quite clear that we all have sin. But what is sin? Is it murder, or lying, or stealing? Or is it much bigger? In the Bible, the definition of sin is simple. It means, “missing the mark.” Have you ever felt you have missed the mark? I know my life was far from good and perfect. I had not only missed the mark of God’s perfection, I was downright miserable.

  • Isa. 53:6 –We are all like sheep who have gone astray.”
  • Romans 3:23 “For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.”
So if you are troubled, confused, unfocused, do you think you might have “missed the mark.”? God’s standard is perfection. On our own, we can never achieve this.

3. But Jesus came, and did a work for us, that we could never do. He lived a perfect life. He was obedient to the Father in Heaven, even to death on a cross. Because He knew it was God’s will. Jesus says:

  • John 10:10 “I have come, that they might have life and have it abundantly.”
  • John 14:6 “I am the way, the truth and the life, no man comes to the Father but by me.”
  • Acts 4:2 “There is no other name under heaven by which you may be saved.”
  • Eph. 1:7 “Jesus was the sacrifice for our sins. He was God, He was perfect, and He died in our place, for our sins.”
  • Hebrews 9:26 “Jesus appeared once for all for to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.”
  • 2 Cor. 5:18 “God, who through Jesus Christ reconciled us to himself.”

4. There are some basic steps to becoming a Christian. We need to:

  • Acts 16:31 “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved.”
  • Romans 10:9 “If you confess with your mouth Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart God raised him from the dead, you shall be saved.”
  • Finally, you need to repent of your sins. Acts 3:19 “Repent and turn again that your sins may be blotted out.

5. Then when you understand this, you need to make a decision. Do you want to know Jesus and the power of his resurrection?

  • 1 Peter 1:3 “Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who according to His great mercy has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead.”
The Message, which is the most modern translation, puts it this way:
1 Peter 1:3-5 “What a God we have! And how fortunate we are to have him, this Father of our Master Jesus! Because Jesus was raised from the dead, we've been given a brand-new life and have everything to live for, including a future in heaven—and the future starts now! God is keeping careful watch over us and the future. The Day is coming when you'll have it all—life healed and whole.”

So you need to make a decision.

I if you would like to pray with me right now, repeat after me:
“Heavenly Father, I have fallen short of your glory. I have sinned.
I confess that I have not always done the right things, or had the right results.
I believe that you are the Son of God, and you paid the price for my sins, and rose from the dead to prove that you have that power.
I want to live for you, and serve you. I want to know your joy, your peace, and the confidence that having you in my heart and life brings.
Please hear my prayer, and make me a member of the family of God. I thank you for this gift of salvation. In Jesus name I pray.

6. If you prayed this prayer, then welcome to the Family of God. There are many things you can do to learn and grow as a Christian. The amazing thing is the Creator of the universe will be there to help you, and to heal you, and to make you the confident, strong and happy person God created you to be.
When you make a new friend, you want to be with them, and do things with them. It is the same with God. You will want to pray – just talk to God and tell him all you are feeling – your hopes and dreams, your fears and hurts. God also left us a manual to help our lives work. The Bible. I would advise you to read John, and 1 John, then Matthew, Mark, and Luke and the rest of the New Testament. The Psalms in the Old Testament have really helped me, too. I read one or two every night.
So you need a modern translation of the Bible so you can understand what God is saying in his Word. A good church, and getting baptized as sign to show the change that has happened within you.
One last thing – while you take this step of faith, remember, that it is a free gift, and God offers it to everyone who wants it – everyone – no matter what they have done, or how bad or even good, they have been. And he gives us the power to change.
Eph. 2:8-10 “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— not by works, so that no one can boast. For we are God's workmanship, created in Christ Jesus to do good works, which God prepared in advance for us to do. “ New International Version.
Eph 2:7-10 “Now God has us where he wants us, with all the time in this world and the next to shower grace and kindness upon us in Christ Jesus. Saving is all his idea, and all his work. All we do is trust him enough to let him do it. It's God's gift from start to finish! We don't play the major role. If we did, we'd probably go around bragging that we'd done the whole thing! No, we neither make nor save ourselves. God does both the making and saving. He creates each of us by Christ Jesus to join him in the work he does, the good work he has gotten ready for us to do, work we had better be doing.” The Message.
 
On a couples retreat a few years back we held a men's meeting
where the speaker was preaching on Song of Solomon.

The only part of his message I remember was his
declaration, and I quote, "That's talking about body parts!"

Got a lot of "amens".

Muffled amens, no doubt.

There's always a possibility that they weren't talking about body parts and that they were members of the audubon deer watchers society.
 
John 6:47 "He who believes has eternal life." John's gospel is the only one that distinctly states it was written so that you can believe on Jesus and have life in His name (John 20:31). Everything else must be understood in light of this.
Many statements in the other gospels either assume this or go beyond this. Obviously Jesus wanted everyone to have life by believing in Him, but He also wanted His people to repent and turn to Him as their Messiah-King, He wanted His disciples to grow in their faith and be totally committed to Him, He wanted both Jews and Gentiles to recognize Him as the Son of God, He wanted to heal the lame, cleanse sinners, bring sight to the blind.
 
John 3:14 - 18
And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of man be lifted up: That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved. He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

John 6:27 - 40
Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed. Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent. They said therefore unto him, What sign shewest thou then, that we may see, and believe thee? what dost thou work? Our fathers did eat manna in the desert; as it is written, He gave them bread from heaven to eat. Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Moses gave you not that bread from heaven; but my Father giveth you the true bread from heaven. For the bread of God is he which cometh down from heaven, and giveth life unto the world. Then said they unto him, Lord, evermore give us this bread. And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst. But I said unto you, That ye also have seen me, and believe not. All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.
 
Accept the work of Jesus on the cross and His resurrection its that simple.
 
Cool but I think the laws could be summarised to two important commandments. This seems to have covered our dealings with God but not with people around us.

this is true, drett.
if i read you right, there's an implicit remark about christian hypocrisy:) particularly concerning these 2 great commandments.

but the reality is: no one has or does obey these 2 great commandments sufficiently to enter the Presence of the Almighty and not be condemned. not one. no one who identifies as a Christian, either.

not by our own works/behavior. it's out of the question.

the morally upstanding people who have ever lived still need their sins forgiven by Holy God, and only through the shedding of blood is there remission of sin. the sacrifice had to be perfect and without spot to be acceptable to God, for the forgiveness of sin.

there was only ONE who obeyed those 2 commandments (and all of them) perfectly, and that Man was Jesus of Nazareth.

only through faith in His perfect obedience will anyone be justified in the sight of God.

after being found not guilty (though we are guilty) - by trusting in God's OWN perfect provision - Jesus....THEN the new man who has been adopted and accepted by God (BY FAITH IN CHRIST, not SELF) will be transformed by the Spirit of God.

then the new man can and will desire to obey those 2 great commands - Love God and neighbor...because he has the Spirit in him, conforming and transforming God's NEW possession.

NO ONE will be justified before God through obedience to the Law because all men (ALL) have already sinned and fallen short. it is impossible to be saved through the Law since the Law was brought in to show us how far from God we are.

it is ONLY through faith and trust in His OWN Perfect Plan - which He Himself Planned perfectly before the world began, with every part performed FOR US, BY HIM, THROUGH CHRIST...because He is a Good and Merciful God.....Who needs to maintain His Perfect Justice also.

how can any man who has offended God and MUST pay the price for it be saved from His Justice?

only by God Himself, through His OWN means, accepted as free gift, to be received by faith, with thanksgiving.

is this a mystery to you? i know it seems like it because Islam teaches that man can only be accepted through obedience and good works, and that Islam's god will decide arbitrarily who will be saved. that justice is meted out according to the individual's performance. yet this is no justice at all....because in reality no one performs or obeys God ENOUGH.

the God of the Bible is ABSOLUTE. there is no sliding scale of righteousness according to the Law for justification and forgiveness (acceptance).

this is why Jesus Came.

John 3:16
For God loved the world in this way: He gave His One and Only Son, so that everyone who believes in Him will not perish but have eternal life.

that's how He loved the world.
in that way.

John 6:40
For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day."

John 6:39
And this is the will of him who sent me, that I shall lose none of all those he has given me, but raise them up at the last day.

John 6:44
"No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws them, and I will raise them up at the last day.


the question might be: is the Father drawing you to the Son?

Hebrews 12:25
See to it that you do not refuse him who speaks. If they did not escape when they refused him who warned them on earth, how much less will we, if we turn away from him who warns us from heaven?

the Hebrews got the warning - about not turning back to the Law for justification.

it's the deceitfulness of sin that keeps people in unbelief - from believing that Jesus Christ is the only Way to God.

Hebrews 3:12
The Dangers of Unbelief
12Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God. 13But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called "Today," so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin.

the deceitfulness of sin is a 2-part problem:

- believing that we have no sin (or that our sin is not enough to condemn us; or that our sin won't earn us the due penalty)

- believing that we can remain slaves to sin (which we previously denied we had) after salvation.

the order of salvation is:

1) agreeing with what God has said about our condition as children of Adam; and
2) understanding that God reconciled us to Himself through Christ...and that it is ONLY Christ's Work that is acceptable to God for justification from sin.


Romans 5:19
Death in Adam, Life in Christ
6You see, at just the right time, when we were still powerless, Christ died for the ungodly. 7Very rarely will anyone die for a righteous person, though for a good person someone might possibly dare to die. 8But God demonstrates his own love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

9Since we have now been justified by his blood, how much more shall we be saved from God’s wrath through him! 10For if, while we were God’s enemies, we were reconciled to him through the death of his Son, how much more, having been reconciled, shall we be saved through his life! 11Not only is this so, but we also boast in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.

Death Through Adam, Life Through Christ

12Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned—

13To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law. 14Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses, even over those who did not sin by breaking a command, as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.

15But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many! 16Nor can the gift of God be compared with the result of one man’s sin: The judgment followed one sin and brought condemnation, but the gift followed many trespasses and brought justification. 17For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!

18Consequently, just as one trespass resulted in condemnation for all people, so also one righteous act resulted in justification and life for all people. 19For just as through the disobedience of the one man the many were made sinners, so also through the obedience of the one man the many will be made righteous.

20The law was brought in so that the trespass might increase. But where sin increased, grace increased all the more, 21so that, just as sin reigned in death, so also grace might reign through righteousness to bring eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

...

the kind of righteousness for life and living here (per your post - obeying the 2 great commands for real) is a product of having already been accepted by God by faith in Christ - we are not only MADE righteous by decree though we are not, we are MADE to be righteous then through obedience by the working of the Spirit Who we receive as a GIFT:

For if, by the trespass of the one man, death reigned through that one man, how much more will those who receive God’s abundant provision of grace and of the gift of righteousness reign in life through the one man, Jesus Christ!


love zone