who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

throughfaith · Oct 17, 2020

Ephesians 1.3
3¶Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
For us who are in Christ Jesus ( Eph 1.1 ) we have been blessed with all SPIRITUAL blessings in heavenly places in Christ .
Seven of these blessings are named (1:4, 5, 6, 7, 9, 13, 14), and the expression “heavenly places” is mentioned four times in the epistle (1:3, 20, 2:6, 3:10; five if you count the “original Greek” for “high places” in 6:12)
We are seated “upstairs” at this moment (Eph. 2:6). Being “in Christ,” we are present before the throne (1 John 4:17), and as He could be in two places at the same time (John 3:13), so we now occupy two localities (1 Cor. 6:17; Eph. 2:6, 5:30).
We are joined to a Body whose Head is in Heaven. We share this heavenly position as part of the Body. We are “one Spirit” with a Spirit who fills the universe, and we are only “absent from the Lord” (2 Cor. 5: 1–10) in regard to our physical body. The statement of Ephesians 1:3 was plainly “spiritual blessings.” Nothing physical was mentioned in regard to “blessings.” Our physical blessing is future (1 Cor. 15:49–57), but we have already “gone home to glory” in the Spirit.
" This world is not our home "
Thoughts?

GraceAndTruth · Oct 17, 2020

throughfaith said:

I think you have carefully thought this position out.
I'm not sure what the main point is........I agree with your scripture references, but it would have helped me if you had made a theme with a couple of simple one-liners........before making your argument. You left me with nothing to debate!

Than again, it could be me who has missed the point. sorry.

Corban · Oct 18, 2020

throughfaith said:

Yes. The key to this POSITION of ours is because we are "IN Christ". The best way to understand this is where scripture uses the same concept. Let's take 1st Corinthians; "For as IN Adam all die, even so IN Christ shall all be made alive." As Adam walked this earth, because of God's natural Law in Genesis 1:11-12, where everything that has seed within itself will produce the same KIND, all men were IN Adam's LOINS. And when Adam sinned, his seed was changed forever, and he produced the same KIND as he was - fallen and headed for death (Rom.5:12).

Now, Christ, the first born of the creation (Col.1:15), is also the first-born of the new creature from the dead (Col.1:18). Now, according the Bible, "sin" (singular) is the cause of death (Rom.6:23), and Christ dies for the "sin" (singular) OF THE WORLD (Jn.1:29). This is not so that all men might be saved, but so that God has the judicial right to RAISE EVERY MAN FROM THE DEAD. So, as Christ rose from the dead, He "BECAME the life-giving Spirit" (1st Cor.15:45) and all men who would be raised from the dead where "IN HIS LOINS", just as Adam had all men who would ever live, then IN HIS LOINS.

So in Ephesians, God takes the view of ALL THOSE WHO WHERE IN CHRIST. But there is a difference here. It is not ALL MEN in this case. The matter in Ephesians is not resurrection, but the matter is THOSE WHO HAVE BECOME SONS OF GOD and who are eligible for the Kingdom. It is not John 1:29 which is in view here, but John 12:24 - where our Lord Jesus brings forth His OWN KIND - after a spiritual rebirth. So although we are ON EARTH; God's view is that our POSITION is IN Christ, and whatever privileges Christ, HEIR of ALL things, has, these privileges are ours too.

throughfaith · Oct 18, 2020

Corban said:

Yes. The key to this POSITION of ours is because we are "IN Christ". The best way to understand this is where scripture uses the same concept. Let's take 1st Corinthians; "For as IN Adam all die, even so IN Christ shall all be made alive." As Adam walked this earth, because of God's natural Law in Genesis 1:11-12, where everything that has seed within itself will produce the same KIND, all men were IN Adam's LOINS. And when Adam sinned, his seed was changed forever, and he produced the same KIND as he was - fallen and headed for death (Rom.5:12).

Now, Christ, the first born of the creation (Col.1:15), is also the first-born of the new creature from the dead (Col.1:18). Now, according the Bible, "sin" (singular) is the cause of death (Rom.6:23), and Christ dies for the "sin" (singular) OF THE WORLD (Jn.1:29). This is not so that all men might be saved, but so that God has the judicial right to RAISE EVERY MAN FROM THE DEAD. So, as Christ rose from the dead, He "BECAME the life-giving Spirit" (1st Cor.15:45) and all men who would be raised from the dead where "IN HIS LOINS", just as Adam had all men who would ever live, then IN HIS LOINS.

So in Ephesians, God takes the view of ALL THOSE WHO WHERE IN CHRIST. But there is a difference here. It is not ALL MEN in this case. The matter in Ephesians is not resurrection, but the matter is THOSE WHO HAVE BECOME SONS OF GOD and who are eligible for the Kingdom. It is not John 1:29 which is in view here, but John 12:24 - where our Lord Jesus brings forth His OWN KIND - after a spiritual rebirth. So although we are ON EARTH; God's view is that our POSITION is IN Christ, and whatever privileges Christ, HEIR of ALL things, has, these privileges are ours too.

Again lots to digest here . But appreciate .

Guojing · Oct 18, 2020

throughfaith said:

My initial thoughts about this topic

God's covenant with Israel was largely a physical one, they were promised financial prosperity, health, if they obey the covenant that God made with them. Abraham, Issac, Jacob, David and Solomon were all extremely rich for their time.
When Jesus came to Israel, he gave them a foretaste of how life would be in the promised kingdom, when he healed all who came to him, and even promised riches if they are willing to give up all to follow him.
At the end of the day, the physical blessings are to point to spiritual blessings for Israel. Jesus made that link clearest in Luke 6, after he fed the 5000 with physical food. 26 Jesus answered them and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Ye seek me, not because ye saw the miracles, but because ye did eat of the loaves, and were filled. 27 Labour not for the meat which perisheth, but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life, which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed. 35 And Jesus said unto them, I am the bread of life: he that cometh to me shall never hunger; and he that believeth on me shall never thirst. 47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life. 48 I am that bread of life. 49 Your fathers did eat manna in the wilderness, and are dead. 50 This is the bread which cometh down from heaven, that a man may eat thereof, and not die. 51 I am the living bread which came down from heaven: if any man eat of this bread, he shall live for ever: and the bread that I will give is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.
So Jesus was trying to point out to Israel not to be just contented with seeking him for physical needs like food and such, but to believe that he is their Messiah and promised son of God. That is the spiritual blessing that await them.
However, as you can also see, Israel ultimately rejected Jesus as their promised Messiah. By the time they stoned Stephen, Israel has now fallen in the eyes of God (Romans 11:11)
As a result of that fall, we gentiles can now partake in their spiritual blessings. We are now declared righteous in our spirit thru the death burial and resurrection of Christ. (1 Cor 15:1-4)

The confusion now that I am trying to resolve is, can we gentiles also partake in Israel's physical blessings? I am leaning towards no. Paul never promised to us in the Body of Christ that we can expect to live without sickness and without poverty, some scripture that hint towards that can be found in

1 Cor 9:11 If we have sown unto you spiritual things, is it a great thing if we shall reap your carnal things?

Romans 15:27 It hath pleased them verily; and their debtors they are. For if the Gentiles have been made partakers of their spiritual things, their duty is also to minister unto them in carnal things

Ephesians 1.3
3¶Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

To me, it seems Paul is trying to teach us in the Body of Christ that, thanks to the fall of Israel, we gentiles are made partakers of all spiritual blessings that Israel was suppose to get in the 2nd coming. And we are getting them NOW in our spirit.

But because we, by grace, got their spiritual blessings, we have the responsibility to bless others with material things.

Corban · Oct 19, 2020

Guojing said:

I have an idea.

God's intention is abundance for His creature. We see this in Eden. We also see it in the blessings of the Law in Leviticus 26 and Deuteronomy 28. So the question is, why does God ask His Church to forsake this world, it wealth, and quality of life? The answer is that it is for the sake of the gospel, but that when the gospel age is over, we will receive rich, manifold temporal blessings. Let's examine three scriptures:

Matthew 19:29; "And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life."

Galatians 3:29; "And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise."

Hebrews 6:5; "And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,"

In Matthew 19:29 is a clear statement that there are massive rewards waiting for the faithful gospel worker in the next age. In Galatians 3, the case is made how Gentiles can become co-heirs with Israel in Abraham's Covenant. This Covenant is extended from Canaan to the "whole earth" (Rom.4:13). In Hebrews 6:5 the Christians are castigated. But an interesting statement appears in verse 5. It states that the miracles we experience in this age or only a "taste" of what will be in the Millennial Kingdom. Mark 16 says that healings, miracles and surviving death will be the "signs" that we are believers. But it also states that they will only "follow". That is, there will be signs and wonders, but occasionally. Hebrews 6:5 intimates that they will be the order of the day once Christ returns.

Because Israel refused the Kingdom and murdered their King, Jesus retires to heaven and conducts affairs from His Father's Throne. The main affair is "BUILDING the Church". That means that the church will operate in enemy territory. Israel, and later, the whole world, hates Christ and His followers. They will be "hated by all nations for His Name". The function and the survival of the Church, because it is under constant threat and persecution by the whole world, will be EXPENSIVE! Men will even have to give their lives for it. Others will be robbed of their goods. And others even must give away their goods for the gospel's sake. So our Lord Jesus tells us not to set our hearts on wealth. They are too fleeting. They are not what God wants for His people YET. But when Christ returns in glory and pomp, the earth and its beauty and wealth will ALL be His. And He will apportion each man and woman who suffered loss for His Name's sake, a massive portion of what they lost or gave up.

In closing however, it must be clearly said that the spiritual blessings are more valuable than the temporal. Who would choose to own Texas, but never have the holy Spirit dwelling in them. Who would be Solomon if his sins were not forgiven? Who wants to inherit the wealth of Africa and not be known by God. Take your choice. The Temporal are great. The spiritual are by far, greater.

Guojing · Oct 19, 2020

Corban said:

Interestingly if you read Mark's account in Mark 10

28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.

29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,

30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.

So in this time, he shall receive physical blessings, but in the age to come, he shall get eternal life. All these by giving up all now and following him.

These are promises of physical blessings to Israel that are not directed to us gentile believers in the Body of Christ.

Corban · Oct 20, 2020

Guojing said:

You have touched on a point that I have long considered.

The context is giving all of our goods for the good of others. Mark 10:21 reads ; "Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: (i) go thy way, sell (2) whatsoever thou hast, and (3) give to the poor, and thou (4) shalt have treasure in heaven: and (5) come, (6) take up the cross, and (7) follow me."

To avoid writing a page, I will but summarize this verse.

Go THY way. The disposal of the man's goods is left in his power. If he only wants to sell half he it is still his to dispose of
"Sell" means he had fixed assets, probably Land and gold. This is not wrong for the Law promised prosperity
"Give to the poor" means benefit those who struggle for the basic things. It puts the burden on you to manage the wealth you are about to give away
"Treasure in heaven" I judge, is the key to the answer. More later, but such an action shows faith. The Treasure will come when Jesus comes, and it comes at God's hand - not that of men. It implies the resurrection and the Millennial Kingdom
"Come" is the opposite of "go thy way". The test is twofold. What will you do with your wealth when it is in your power, and will you return to the Lord when your wealth is gone, or will you return to making wealth
"Take up THE cross" - In other scriptures it is YOUR cross. "Your" cross is when you actively make decisions against your flesh. "THE" cross is the what Jesus stood for - humility and poverty (Phil.2:5-8). Wealth gives you position, whether you like it or not. Poverty, and the setting aside of yourself is regarded as foolishness in this world. By doing what Jesus said, you will be humbled and regarded as a fool
"Follow me" means travel the same road - a road of meekness, humbleness, and not claiming your rights. The Law guaranteed wealth and position. Solomon was greatest in this. To follow Christ is to shun the Law as a source of wealth like Christ did. The Law makes wealthy. The gospel makes poor that a man might take up his wealth LATER at the hand of God. This is what Abraham did when he could have taken the spoils of three kings.

I judge the things of Mark 10:29-30 to be regulated by "Treasure in heaven". That is, the "house", "brethren" etc., are the members of the Church. That is, you will give up your family and wealth for the gospel, but the Church will be your replacement NOW. It is decisive that "wife" is mentioned in verse 29, but not in verse 30. The members of the Church will be your new possession. You will be freely accepted by them and have access to their resources. Only, you cannot take another wife. Jesus did this at the end of Matthew Chapter 12. His new family were the "disciples". He renounced the family of the flesh. In the Church you will find all those things - and YOU will be dependent on them - not independent by being wealthy.

29 "And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life"

I have laid forth an idea that does not have much evidence. So if you have a better understanding with evidence, I am open. I would also like to say that I have lived my years. In those years the Lord taught me to be not so prosperous, and He made demands on my time and money. But he also blessed the latter years with Temporal thing. But then again, if we have something extra, we are to be "Stewards" of this extra wealth, and not consumers of it. The message is, deny yourself if you have wealth, and use it for God' glory.

I would have like to address the matter of INHERITING LIFE, but it would make an already long posting very long.

Guojing · Oct 20, 2020

Corban said:

To understand how the Jewish believers would have understood vs 30, note that vs 30 points to what we have been discussing regarding physical blessings and spiritual blessings.

The physical blessings houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, comes to them now in this time. The catch is of course, persecutions will also follow.

The spiritual blessing refer to eternal life, which for the nation of Israel, is something that they can expect only after the Tribulation, when Jesus returns for them in the 2nd coming. That will happen in the world to come Peter summed it up in Acts 3:19-21

19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:

21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

But us in the Body of Christ, because of the fall of the nation Israel, we get their spiritual blessing, eternal life NOW, we don't need to wait for Jesus 2nd coming.

But at the same time, we are not entitled to Israel's physical blessings, those houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands,

Grandpa · Oct 21, 2020

The Lord has said that His Words are Spirit and they are Life.

1 Corinthians 2:9-12
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.

10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

Corban · Oct 21, 2020

Guojing said:

I see it differently. I agree that our Lord was addressing a Jew, but there are TWO considerations to take into account.

The Jew who our lord was addressing had kept the Law in its entirety, BUT KNEW HE WAS NOT ENTITLED TO INHERIT ETERNAL LIFE. That is why he asked Jesus.
Verse 29 tells who is meant; "And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's". The phrase "NO MAN" applies to the whole of humanity - not exclusively to the Jew

Added to this, spiritual blessings are not part of this discussion. They are purely earthly blessings.

But if you would change your last sentence slightly, we could agree. I would write it thus;

"But at the same time, we are not entitled to Israel's physical blessings, those houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, IN THIS AGE."

Guojing · Oct 22, 2020

Corban said:

I see it differently. I agree that our Lord was addressing a Jew, but there are TWO considerations to take into account.

The Jew who our lord was addressing had kept the Law in its entirety, BUT KNEW HE WAS NOT ENTITLED TO INHERIT ETERNAL LIFE. That is why he asked Jesus.
Verse 29 tells who is meant; "And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's". The phrase "NO MAN" applies to the whole of humanity - not exclusively to the Jew

Added to this, spiritual blessings are not part of this discussion. They are purely earthly blessings.

But if you would change your last sentence slightly, we could agree. I would write it thus;

"But at the same time, we are not entitled to Israel's physical blessings, those houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, IN THIS AGE."

You don't regard eternal life as a spiritual blessing?

JaumeJ · Oct 22, 2020

Jew translates as one who praises God. Paul defines a true Jew in Romans.

At the time our Savior was completing His special mission here, there was no such thing as Judaism. Now people cannot seem to know the difference. Perhaps it stems from the barrier of xenophobia's, I cannot say.

I do know this, all who love God are the true Jews, and we are to beware of those who call themselves Jews but are not, rather they are an assembly of Satan.

Corban · Oct 22, 2020

Guojing said:

Oooppps! I don't remember saying, or even implying that. Mark 10 talks of earthly blessings NOW. Eternal Life is in the age to come. But I see where you might have got the idea. Let me answer this in back to front way.

The man approached Jesus ALREADY having earthly blessings. He wanted to know how to INHERIT Eternal Life. Our Lord Jesus answered and said that INHERITING Eternal Life was a REWARD that a man received in the NEXT AGE, for giving up earthly blessings IN THIS AGE. Now you might see the problems attached to this.

It is NOT "HAVING" eternal Life - but "INHERITING" eternal Life. They are two different words with different meanings
John 3:14-16 says we must BELIEVE to HAVE eternal life, but in Mark 10 the man must DO something - give up something
"Having" eternal life is a GIFT (Rom.6:23). But this INHERITING is to BE EARNED - a Reward
"Having" eternal life is gained NOW - in this lifetime, INHERITING eternal Life is for the NEXT AGE

If you can make the difference between "HAVING" (intrinsically) and "INHERITING" (or "entering") eternal Life, you can sort these problems out. Here is another prompt. 1st Corinthians 15:23 says that we Christians are resurrected "when He comes". This is confirmed in Revelation 20:4 when it says "they (who were dead) LIVED". But then 1,000 years goes by and a White Throne is set up to judge the DEAD. So, there are no Christians at this judgment. They were all raised 1,000 years earlier. But the "Book of LIFE" is present. And the grammar implies that some were found in the Book of Life. How so?

The answer to this is found in the difference between "HAVING" eternal Life" and "INHERITING eternal Life".

Guojing · Oct 22, 2020

Corban said:

Actually, my starting point, that I have spelt out in point 4 in the first post that you replied, for the nation Israel, they only get possess eternal life at the end when Jesus returns for them, so while the gospel of the kingdom was being preached to them, none of them can claim to have eternal life now.

Other than Mark 10:28-30, other scripture that points to that are found in Acts 3:19-21, 1 Peter 1:9, 1 Peter 4:17-18.

For everyone in the Body of Christ, where there is neither Jew nor gentile, we have righteousness, salvation and forgiveness of sins NOW. (Colossians 1:14, Ephesians 1:7)

Guojing · Oct 22, 2020

throughfaith said:

Colossians 3

1 If ye then be risen with Christ, seek those things which are above, where Christ sitteth on the right hand of God.

2 Set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth.

3 For ye are dead, and your life is hid with Christ in God.

4 When Christ, who is our life, shall appear, then shall ye also appear with him in glory.

This video may hep you understand better why the Body of Christ need to keep its focus on things above, rather than the physical blessings of Israel.

Corban · Oct 23, 2020

Guojing said:

Here is your point #4 of your posting #5. Quote;

I'm not sure what your point is, but I'll comment on this point #4. The BASIS for HAVING eternal life is FAITH (Jn.3:15-16). Now, FAITH is defined as the substance and hope of things NOT SEEN (Heb.11:1). Israel are "concluded by God" in Romans 11:32 as in UN-BELIEF. And according to the context this will remain until the "time of the Gentiles is full" (v.25). The point where the time of the Gentiles ends is Armageddon where Christ and His Overcomers crush the armies of the Gentiles. That means that Israel's UN-BELIEF STAYS UNTIL JESUS IS SEEN. Once Jesus is SEEN, there can be no FAITH, and with no FAITH there can be NO ETERNAL LIFE. Israel WILL NEVER HAVE ETERNAL LIFE.

There is no way they can have it, there is no exception to God's rule and there is no scripture that says Israel will HAVE eternal life. They will be resurrected, they will be forgiven, they will be gathered back to their Land, they will get a New Covenant of Law, they will have Jesus dwelling in their midst, the will be the leading Nation and they will be saved from the curses of the Law. But they CANNOT; and WILL NOT, EVER, have eternal life.

TheDivineWatermark · Oct 23, 2020

Corban said:

Re: your phrases in bold ^ ... these are two distinct phrases referring to two distinct points in the chronology:

--"the TIMES of the Gentiles" (Lk21:24 [see also Rev11:2]) indeed ENDS at His Second Coming to the earth; THIS refers to what started in 606/605bc, and refers to "Gentile domination over Israel" (think: Neb's dream/statue/image, with Neb as "head of gold"... and "Jerusalem TRODDEN DOWN/TREAD UNDER FOOT [of the Gentiles]" etc [NOT the equivalent of "the Church age," in other words]);

--"[UNTIL] the FULNESS [G4138 - plērōma] of the Gentiles BE COME IN [G1525 - eiselthē/eiserchomai" refers to a different thing, at a distinct point in the chronology (NOT at the END of the TRIB), even though there will be gentiles coming to faith IN/DURING/WITHIN the trib years [FOLLOWING "our Rapture"]; THIS speaks more to "purpose" regarding each time-slot (with "pleroma" carrying the meaning of "fulness of TIME" re: the Gentiles... IOW, He will turn His attention to focusing on His "My people Israel" AFTER "our Rapture [IN THE AIR]" point in time, as in, passages such as Ezek39:7 [Isa26:20 re: Israel; Hosea 5:14&15-6:3; Dan12:1-4,10; ] and many more... all referring to Israel IN/DURING/WITHIN the trib yrs... which is also who the early sections of Matt24 is speaking of, like in v.9, not to mention the phrase "the least of these My brethren" in 25:40,45, also)

Disagree.

I do not believe the phrase "have eternal life" equates to "be raptured" and/or the like. For example, the Gentiles/nations at the END of the trib (who will have come to faith AFTER "our Rapture" and IN/DURING/WITHIN the trib yrs, as consequence of Israel DOING the INVITING of them [TO "the wedding FEAST/SUPPER [earthly MK age]"]), of them (the Sheep [of the nations]) it is said, "but the righteous into life eternal" [i.e. they ENTER the earthly MK age; and "shall never die" Jn11:26]... I do not think it is any less true of those having DONE the INVITING [of them]. IOW, they also will have come to faith FOLLOWING "our Rapture" IN/DURING/WITHIN the trib years [not saying 100% of Israel will come to faith, mind you]

TheDivineWatermark · Oct 23, 2020

JaumeJ said:

Well, in Romans 2:29, where Paul had said, "But he is a Jew WHICH IS ONE inwardly"... those words "WHICH IS ONE" are important to tell us just what Paul is speaking of... he is only speaking of Jews here in this verse (not "believing GENTILES" that are supposedly [upon believing] now "true Jews," no.) One must grasp Paul's outline, in these first three chpts... He alternates between speaking of humanity in general, to Jews in particular... here's the general OUTLINE (if I don't mess this up

):

--Romans 1:1-7 Salutation

--Romans 1:17-32 Humanity in general [with v.18 covering two distinct aspects: 18a=general humanity; 18b=Jews ('[who] hold the truth [...]')]

--Romans 2:1-16 Transition

--Romans 2:17 - 3:20 Jew-specific [with 2:29's "But he is a Jew which IS ONE inwardly" (speaking of the believing Jews within the whole of Jews--but Jews only, here... NOT "Gentiles" BECOMING "Jews/true Jews"

)]

--Romans 3:21+ God's righteousness revealed in the gospel

So, no, I disagree that Paul is saying that Gentiles BECOME "true Jews" upon faithing... no. That is not the CONTEXT of Paul's words in chpt 2:17-3:20 (which section is centered around "Jews," per context).

JaumeJ · Oct 23, 2020

Sorry.. Perhaps I have been educated wrong but I have learned Hebrew well enough to read the Word. Been to Israel to investigate certain Hebrew and more.

All the above and a bag of peanuts will not get anyone a cappuccino at a Starbucks, but I do believe what I have learned because I was led to believe by the Holy Spirit.

who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

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