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Jan 8, 2009
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#62
Firstly 1 Jn explains the difference between God's children and the devil's children:

1Jn 3:10 In this the children of God are revealed, and the children of the Devil: everyone not practicing righteousness is not of God, also he who does not love his brother.

So children of the devil are not children of God (which is proof against any claim that every person on the earth is a child of God).



Secondly, to be a child of God is to be born of Him, so that narrows it down to Christians, or non-Christians who believe in Yeshua such as yourself Arel.

1Jn 5:1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.


Only those who have the Holy Spirit bearing witness with them are children of God:

Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:


Since only believers in Christ have the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Christ, that means only believers in Christ are children of God:

Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.



In summary, those who are not adopted sons and daughters of God by faith in Christ are not children of God.



The only place that I'm aware of where it refers to the general humankind as being called children of God is in Acts where it refers to them regarding themselves as offspring of God. But we have to remember this is nothing more than Aratus's hymn to Jupiter, which Paul adapts to refer to the one true God.


Act 17:28 For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.


 
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songster

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#63
I remember visiting the Philippines where groups of individuals would pray over office buildings, rearranging furniture and items according to their sense of spiritual correctness. During my last visit, I remember also asking about the many large dolls of Mary, the mother of the Christ, each adorned with a golden crown, and the dolls of Jesus which were surprisingly revered and thought to have actual power.

I also lived in Japan for about 5 years, being in the Navy. This was an interesting experience. I can recall times when my Japanese friends would make me aware of celebrations and explain the reasons for certain seasonal festivals. I can remember sitting on the floor being welcomed to fellowship in the home of a very hospitable Buddhist teacher.

The architecture of the temples in Japan, the food, and talk of the beautiful cherry blossoms near Mt. Fuji, have left an indelible imprint on my memory. Circumstances prevented me from marrying a lovely Japanese school teacher who taught English. Even today I rarely meet anyone with the sweet and welcoming demeanor of the Japanese people

After receiving Jesus Christ as Savior in 1986, I have grown in my understanding of the bible, Jewish history, and Christianity. Along life’s path there were many things that I did not consider harmful. In my teen years, reading horoscopes and even playing around with a Ouija board, from time to time, was thought about as casually as playing monopoly.

I now know that in my life there have been many distractions. I have learned that Satan comes as an angel of light, a deceiver, luring the flesh with beauty, pleasures, entertainment and fine sounding philosophies, which lack truth. I now understand what it means to be in the world, but not of the world. We as Christians must keep our eyes open, recognizing the dangers of idolatrous celebrations and practices.

From the Buddhist temples of Japan, to the veiled, crowned likenesses of Mary; from the many deities of the Hindi to the non-violent teachings of the Quran, I have found only one who was sent to die for the sins of all mankind, my savior, Jesus.
The precious people of God, made clean through the shedding of the blood of Jesus Christ, God’s only Son, have discovered the only truth, the only way into God’s kingdom, and the only way to have eternal life in Heaven with God. There are many alternatives this world has to offer, but I choose life, I believe the truth, I choose Jesus.
 
Jan 31, 2009
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#64
So much about loving others just as you love God, and a perfect love entails tolerance and acceptance.



Practice the things that you so vehemently preach.

Finally, be ye all of one mind, having compassion one of another, love as brethren, be pitiful, be courteous:
1 Peter 3:8
this is speaking to believers which most of your twisted out of content are,l we have to know who is being spoken to and spoken of, to know the full contents of each verse if everything that Jesus said applies to everyone what do you do with " depart from me ye workers of iniquity I never knew You" , so if we don't distinguish whom He is speaking of then all would burn!

Love as Brethren

There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear ... "
1 John 4:18
Job 28:28And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding.
That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another. And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it.
1 Corinthians 12:25-26
members of the Body of Christ those that have called upon the name of the Lord not mankind

But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
1 John 3:17
Brother again meaning brothers in Christ or either own mother's sons you make the call , but this does not imply mankind

But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he had compassion on him,
Luke 10:33


To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.
1 Corinthians 9:22
I don't think you were thinking on this one . this is a very bad example for your cause ., this states that not all are getting in, "by all means save some."
Joh 3:18He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no commandment greater than these."
Mark 12:31
do you love your neighbor by allowing them to continue in a false religion that will lead them straight to hell because you don't want to offend or do I love them by telling them that Jesus Christ is the only way and that ye must be born again through Christ, do you love your children if you let them play in a busy street or play with a loaded gun, or do you love them by giving them safe places to play and safe things to play with , It is you, you make the call

Do to others as you would have them do to you.
Luke 6:31
I thanked my God all the Time cause someone shared the gospel with me and told me That Jesus Christ was the only way . and that is what I am going to do to others regardless what you and others like you think of me

But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without
expecting to get anything back.Then your reward will be great, and you
will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked.
Luke 6:35
Letting people die without Jesus is not being good to them , praying that God will saved them that God will allow you to be a witness to thwm now to me that is doing good , what do ye think?
 
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Jan 31, 2009
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#65
"A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another.
John 8:34

Be completely humble and gentle; be patient, bearing with one another in love.
Ephesians 4:2

Above all, love each other deeply, because love covers over a multitude of sins.
1 Peter 4:8

Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God.
1 John 4:7
all these are again referring to christians

There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.
1 John 4:18
you already quoted this one see above in last post, but it takes both love and fear

Jude 1:22And of some have compassion, making a difference:Jude 1:23And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

And over all these virtues put on love, which binds them all together in perfect unity.
Colossians 3:14
Jesus was the only perfect one anything perfect even unity has to evolve around Jesus not unity in all religions but unity in Faith In Jesus Christ

So much about loving others just as you love God, and a perfect love entails tolerance and acceptance.
TOLERANCE!!! God does not tolerate sin: false religions are sin, false Idols are sin, worshipping these things are untolerable before a Holy God, a jealous God of the Bible, The God of the Christians
ACCEPTANCE!!! Repent for the Kingdom of God is at hand, Ye must be borned again, if My people who are called by my Name shall turn from their evil ways, God commended His love toward you as a sinner, but exspects you to become obedient to Him, and not tolerate evil, Job a perfect man one who eschewed ( hated) evil, idolatry is evil. "Why call me Lord' Lord and do not the things I say" " if you love me keep my commandments "

2co 5:17Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

It would be more than safe here to say that old things that should pass away would include old religions and take on the faith that Christ is the only way!!!

Practice the things that you so vehemently preach.
I WON'T EVEN GIVE ANY CREED TO THIS. I PREACH THE GOSPEL OF JESUS CHRIST
Joh 14:6Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
PLEASE STOP WHAT YOU ARE PREACHING AT LEAST IN THIS CHRISTIAN FORUM
 
Jan 31, 2009
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#66
I didn't mean to skip this one
But a certain Samaritan, as he journeyed, came where he was: and when he saw him, he had compassion on him,
Luke 10:33
having compassion is sharing the greatest Passion that man has ever known, the passion Of Christ as He died that all might have life through Him,

you walk by and see someone involved in a false relgion and you think well they will be ok so you pass by, a preacher walks by thinks well they don't won't to hear about Jesus they have their own thing and all ways lead in , or an intolerable saved Christain walks by and share Jesus with them, helps them escape a eternal dam-n- ation, which one of these would be a good neighbor!!!!!

2co 11:10As THE TRUTH of Christ is in me, no man shall stop me of this boasting in the regions of Achaia.
 
Sep 27, 2009
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#67
FIRST off, what's wrong with Bob Marley?

Perhaps the quote was even more appropriate than Veritas realized, since so quickly there was an objection to it.

Are we to understand that you'll even judge your fellow CHRISTIANS if they aren't your preferred type of Christian ? Just so we're clear, perhaps you could tell us which denominations we should consider our brethren, and which ones we should reject ?

Like Veritas said, there are some people who aren't going to convert. We need to ALL understand that. We don't have to ACCEPT it, but I DO think we should tolerate it. Why? Well, a good example is a joke I borrowed from author Claire Wolfe years ago, and have been using ever since-

If you pre-tribbers turn out to be wrong, you're gonna wish you were nicer to the Mormons.

When Yeshua quoted the Tanakh, in giving the second greatest command, which He likened to the first (Hear Oh Israel! The L-rd our G-d, the L-rd is one! And you are to love the L-rd our G-d with all your heart, all your soul, and all your might) which was

Love your NEIGHBOR as yourself.

We didn't say "brother" but NEIGHBOR.

I think a lot of people have trouble with that. And I think a lot of people think that cramming their beliefs down somebody's throat equates to love.

But do you know that for YEARS, the single biggest hindrance to me getting to know my Creator, was His people?

There is a sort of unwritten rule among evangelical denominations that if you aren't pissing people off, you're doing something wrong; that the gospel is offensive to the world, and so if you aren't offending folks, you aren't preaching the Word.

I disagree.

I believe it to be impossible to love someone, without also treating them with respect. The two just go together, naturally.

And while I sympthasize with what you guys are saying, about the Great Commission, and it being our responsibility to bring the Gospel to the world, there is a time and a place. There's a time and a place where that can be effective, and there's a time and a place where the ONLY thing you're going to accomplish it pissing people off.

While we don't need to be AFRAID to piss people off, neither should that be our goal.

In THIS context, of having accepted an invitation to a ceremony which is a deep seated part of someone else's culture, it would not ONLY be rude, tactless, and offensive, I really can't imagine any of them are going to respond to that. In that situation, you are a guest, and it is fully appropriate to keep that in mind.

Would you want to debate calvinism with your neighbor on Christmas morning? What about getting into a heated discussion on pre- or post- tribulation rapture at Easter servce? Probably not, right? You're not in the mood, you are there for a different reason entirely, and while you may be perfectly willing to discuss such matters as a general statement, it is simply in bad taste for someone to ambush you with them during your holidays. And you are going to be exceedingly unlikely to even consider the arguments that the person did make, aren't you?

It's just human nature.

But this is exactly what G-d was talking about, LOVE your neighbor as yourself. Your neighbor isn't going to believe as you. If he did, he'd be your brother, instead of your neighbor. Nonetheless, despite that status, we are STILL instructed to not only LOVE him (or her), but to love him AS OURSELVES... to give him the same consideration that WE would want.

"To everything there is a season, and a time for every purpose under heaven.."

I know some people take the Great Commission a little more seriously than others, and I know that evangelists pride themselves on doing their best to fulfill that role, as well (some of) they might.

But, brethren, let's keep in mind, that WE are mere mortals. We can't save ANYbody. We can't even save ourselves. So a modicum of restraint is not out of place here.

If you think for ONE SECOND that G-d needs YOU, in order to fulfill His Word, then, brethren, you've got a dangerously inflated sense of self-importance. His Word will be fulfilled, regardless. Even if Heaven and Earth should pass away, His Word will remain, just as true as the day He gave it to us.

You might think "Oh, I'm in contact with these heathens, so I need to preach to them RIGHT NOW, or they might lose their chance." Personally, I don't think that's going to be the case, and I don't think this depends on my beliefs anyway.

Calvinists already believe that G-d created some people, who were predestined to go to hell. So are you really failing, if you fail to prevent that? The rest of you, that believe in free will, STILL must admit that not everyone DOES get reconciled to our Creator. Is that our fault? Ultimately, no.

Perhaps there were things we could do better, but perhaps this is just one such thing. Perhaps we could have counted on the way we live our lives, and our testimony to bring people around, insist of relying on our insistence on preaching every time we open our mouths, even when it's inappropriate.
 
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Cup-of-Ruin

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#68
When Yeshua quoted the Tanakh, in giving the second greatest command, which He likened to the first (Hear Oh Israel! The L-rd our G-d, the L-rd is one! And you are to love the L-rd our G-d with all your heart, all your soul, and all your might) which was
This is incorrect, Jesus quoted and read from the Greek Septuagint, the Tanakh was not even in existence at the time and was later copied in parts over time from the complete Septuagint, which was the only complete OT scripture in existence at the time of Christ.
 
Sep 27, 2009
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#69
Oh, sure, that must be why He quoted the freaking Tanakh over 100 times.. because it didn't exist.

Do you even understand what the Tanakh IS?

T orah (Books of Moses)
|
N evi'im (Prophets)
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K evutim ("Writings")

It's what Christians call the "Old" testament, *I* just don't want to disrespect G-d's Word by calling it "old."
 
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Cup-of-Ruin

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#70
Oh, sure, that must be why He quoted the freaking Tanakh over 100 times.. because it didn't exist.

Do you even understand what the Tanakh IS?

T orah (Books of Moses)
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N evi'im (Prophets)
|
K evutim ("Writings")

It's what Christians call the "Old" testament, *I* just don't want to disrespect G-d's Word by calling it "old."
Beside hypotheticals lets look at the facts; the 'Leningrad Codex' is the oldest complete manuscript of the Tanakh, it was written in Cairo in the year 1009 AD. That's the fact, the oldest Tanakh dates to 1009 AD, there was no masoretic Hebrew manuscripts at the time of Christ as the language of Masoretic Hebrew was not even formed to approx. 600-700 AD. Greek however did exist at the the time of Christ and the Septaugint containing the Books of Moses - Pentateuch and the writings of the prophets, we know that Luke quoted the Septuagint, we can trace the Jesus quoted the Septuagint, all the Apostles wrote in Greek, none wrote in Hebrew and all the early Christians used the Greek OT and wrote in Greek! You can be hypothetical if you like, but I have the facts and the facts are there for anybody with the eyes to see.
 
Sep 27, 2009
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#72
Look, Cartman of Ruin, I'm gonna tell you like this-

*I* am in here taking unpopular positions, too. But unlike you, I'm willing to stand behind mine. I'm not making veiled predictions, like some Masonic wannabe that thinks they have the answers, and just refuses to share them. I STAND for what *I* believe. Because I KNOW if G-d be for me, who can stand against me?

So when you're willing to tell us what you think of the holocaust, what you think of the "Protocols," what role you think the Jews will play in the end times, and how you think the "true" believers will interact with them, in those times, you're welcome to rejoin a conversation I'm in.

Until then, I'm gonna ask that you quit derailing threads, and take your racist ideology to the nearest klan or panthers rally.

And, by the way, Sirach proves you wrong, as well as every NT reference to "the law and the prophets." The books were there AND the divisions were there. The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.


Beside hypotheticals lets look at the facts; the 'Leningrad Codex' is the oldest complete manuscript of the Tanakh, it was written in Cairo in the year 1009 AD. That's the fact, the oldest Tanakh dates to 1009 AD, there was no masoretic Hebrew manuscripts at the time of Christ as the language of Masoretic Hebrew was not even formed to approx. 600-700 AD. Greek however did exist at the the time of Christ and the Septaugint containing the Books of Moses - Pentateuch and the writings of the prophets, we know that Luke quoted the Septuagint, we can trace the Jesus quoted the Septuagint, all the Apostles wrote in Greek, none wrote in Hebrew and all the early Christians used the Greek OT and wrote in Greek! You can be hypothetical if you like, but I have the facts and the facts are there for anybody with the eyes to see.
 
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Cup-of-Ruin

Guest
#73
And, by the way, Sirach proves you wrong, as well as every NT reference to "the law and the prophets." The books were there AND the divisions were there. The absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.
So you admit that the Leningrad Codex dated 1009AD is the oldest Hebrew OT manuscript?
 
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Cup-of-Ruin

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#75
Sep 27, 2009
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#77
OK, but it derails the entire forum if you post false information, if you are posting false information then I have a duty as a Christian to correct you.
You know nothing of Yeshua HaMeshiach Sar Shalom, who is called in Greek the "Christ."

Race is your G-d, imposter! That's why you continually refuse to answer such simple questions about your beliefs... Because you and I both know that while the average poster here may not be as intimately familiar with your theology... where it begins, and where it leads... were you answer those questions honestly, they would ALL see you for what you really are, just like I do.
 
D

dovey

Guest
#78
I think most of us agree about who Christ is?...Dont you think our God, the living God, the creator of the Universe...the One who is Love...would want Christians to argue less about theology, focus more on genuine acts of kindness and try to love each other more? Pray for eachother more? get over ourselves more everyday so that we can share more love with others and thus prove to them that our God is who He says He is, and we are a witness of something tremendously powerful and loving?.....I pray that everyone on this site would agree in prayer to move mountains more, offer guinuine love to all who have need and argue less...in Jesus name
 
Jan 31, 2009
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#79
So you admit that the Leningrad Codex dated 1009AD is the oldest Hebrew OT manuscript?
I don't mean to barge here but cup if what you just said is true what was the eunuch reading and how can you or anyone prove if it was greek, hebrew or even english or better yet prove that it wasn't hebrew or greek or even english???


Ac 8:27And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship,Ac 8:28Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet.Ac 8:29Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot.Ac 8:30And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?Ac 8:31And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.Ac 8:32The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:Ac 8:33In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.Ac 8:34And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?Ac 8:35Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.
 
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Cup-of-Ruin

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#80
I don't mean to barge here but cup if what you just said is true what was the eunuch reading and how can you or anyone prove if it was greek, hebrew or even english or better yet prove that it wasn't hebrew or greek or even english???


Ac 8:27And he arose and went: and, behold, a man of Ethiopia, an eunuch of great authority under Candace queen of the Ethiopians, who had the charge of all her treasure, and had come to Jerusalem for to worship,Ac 8:28Was returning, and sitting in his chariot read Esaias the prophet.Ac 8:29Then the Spirit said unto Philip, Go near, and join thyself to this chariot.Ac 8:30And Philip ran thither to him, and heard him read the prophet Esaias, and said, Understandest thou what thou readest?Ac 8:31And he said, How can I, except some man should guide me? And he desired Philip that he would come up and sit with him.Ac 8:32The place of the scripture which he read was this, He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth:Ac 8:33In his humiliation his judgment was taken away: and who shall declare his generation? for his life is taken from the earth.Ac 8:34And the eunuch answered Philip, and said, I pray thee, of whom speaketh the prophet this? of himself, or of some other man?Ac 8:35Then Philip opened his mouth, and began at the same scripture, and preached unto him Jesus.
Well the only Isaiah dated to that time was in Greek and part of the Septuagint, the Ethiopian as Treaurer of the Queen of Ethiopia would have been an educated man and most definitely bi-lingual if not multi-lingual, and Greek was the major language of the civilized world at that time.
 
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