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I used to be a 1, now I'm a 5. There is wayyyy too much focus and talk about the Rapture. It will be an event none of us will see. Look instead for the Second Coming of the Lord. He comes after the Great Tribulation of Israel. The signs of His coming are many and obvious. Those of us who are sons of the light, will not know the day or hour but we sure will know the season.
They are going to say that this wasn't the Tribulation because they are still here so there is going to be another re-gathering of the Jews to their Land and then another Man of Sin. Just as they believe in multiple pin-ball returns of Christ, so will be the case for the Man of Sins. 
Oh wait, they see the Tribulation as God's Wrath upon the entire planet, not just Israel. They literalize all the seals, trumpets and bowls and squeeze them into 7 years. Since the planet doesn't get obliterated they will not recognize the Tribulation either.
Oh wait, they see the Tribulation as God's Wrath upon the entire planet, not just Israel. They literalize all the seals, trumpets and bowls and squeeze them into 7 years. Since the planet doesn't get obliterated they will not recognize the Tribulation either.
Popeye, buddy, why do you still get this wrong? I've showed you this passage several times now. Not taking the mark does not get you beheaded. The "mark" is one of three acceptable things that you need in order to buy or sell. The below PROVES beyond any doubt that the "mark" is NOT a computer chip.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
So you can have the: 1) Mark, or 2) Name of the Beast or, 3) the Number of his name. If you have at least one of these three, you can buy or sell. Nothing says you are killed if you don't. If you needed a computer chip than the other two options would not be an option. You have to stop watching those entertaining, yet crazy Tim LaHaye movies as the guy is out to lunch on this stuff.
It's not worshiping/serving the image/copy of the Northern Islamic Empire that will get you killed. The image or copy is of the former Ottoman Empire, the 7th head of the Beast which was mortally wounded, yet now lives.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed.
"Worship" and "serve" are often used interchangeably in most religions, including ours. If you worship Christ, don't you also serve Him or should want to serve Him? In fact the word, "worship" and "serve" appear together in the same verse 31 times in the Bible. They most often are found in relation to following false gods/faiths such as here:
Deuteronomy 11:16
“Take heed to yourselves, lest your heart be deceived, and you turn aside and serve other gods and worship them.
Strict Sharia Law is coming back and already here in many parts of the Muslim world. If you are Muslim and refuse to worship (bow towards Mecca and pray 5 times a day, a strict law) you will be killed. If you are Muslim you are just killed. Now if you are Jewish or Christian and refuse, you will be beheaded as that is the preferred way for Muslims to kill Jews and Christians.
Can we now agree on this? Or are you still waiting for Rome to make a comeback and Catholic priests taking to the street with machetes?
[SUP]17 [/SUP]and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
So you can have the: 1) Mark, or 2) Name of the Beast or, 3) the Number of his name. If you have at least one of these three, you can buy or sell. Nothing says you are killed if you don't. If you needed a computer chip than the other two options would not be an option. You have to stop watching those entertaining, yet crazy Tim LaHaye movies as the guy is out to lunch on this stuff.
It's not worshiping/serving the image/copy of the Northern Islamic Empire that will get you killed. The image or copy is of the former Ottoman Empire, the 7th head of the Beast which was mortally wounded, yet now lives.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed.
"Worship" and "serve" are often used interchangeably in most religions, including ours. If you worship Christ, don't you also serve Him or should want to serve Him? In fact the word, "worship" and "serve" appear together in the same verse 31 times in the Bible. They most often are found in relation to following false gods/faiths such as here:
Deuteronomy 11:16
“Take heed to yourselves, lest your heart be deceived, and you turn aside and serve other gods and worship them.
Strict Sharia Law is coming back and already here in many parts of the Muslim world. If you are Muslim and refuse to worship (bow towards Mecca and pray 5 times a day, a strict law) you will be killed. If you are Muslim you are just killed. Now if you are Jewish or Christian and refuse, you will be beheaded as that is the preferred way for Muslims to kill Jews and Christians.
Can we now agree on this? Or are you still waiting for Rome to make a comeback and Catholic priests taking to the street with machetes
?
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P
Popeye, buddy, why do you still get this wrong? I've showed you this passage several times now. Not taking the mark does not get you beheaded. The "mark" is one of three acceptable things that you need in order to buy or sell. The below PROVES beyond any doubt that the "mark" is NOT a computer chip.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
So you can have the: 1) Mark, or 2) Name of the Beast or, 3) the Number of his name. If you have at least one of these three, you can buy or sell. Nothing says you are killed if you don't. If you needed a computer chip than the other two options would not be an option. You have to stop watching those entertaining, yet crazy Tim LaHaye movies as the guy is out to lunch on this stuff.
It's not worshiping/serving the image/copy of the Northern Islamic Empire that will get you killed. The image or copy is of the former Ottoman Empire, the 7th head of the Beast which was mortally wounded, yet now lives.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed.
"Worship" and "serve" are often used interchangeably in most religions, including ours. If you worship Christ, don't you also serve Him or should want to serve Him? In fact the word, "worship" and "serve" appear together in the same verse 31 times in the Bible. They most often are found in relation to following false gods/faiths such as here:
Deuteronomy 11:16
“Take heed to yourselves, lest your heart be deceived, and you turn aside and serve other gods and worship them.
Strict Sharia Law is coming back and already here in many parts of the Muslim world. If you are Muslim and refuse to worship (bow towards Mecca and pray 5 times a day, a strict law) you will be killed. If you are Muslim you are just killed. Now if you are Jewish or Christian and refuse, you will be beheaded as that is the preferred way for Muslims to kill Jews and Christians.
Can we now agree on this? Or are you still waiting for Rome to make a comeback and Catholic priests taking to the street with machetes?
[SUP]17 [/SUP]and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
So you can have the: 1) Mark, or 2) Name of the Beast or, 3) the Number of his name. If you have at least one of these three, you can buy or sell. Nothing says you are killed if you don't. If you needed a computer chip than the other two options would not be an option. You have to stop watching those entertaining, yet crazy Tim LaHaye movies as the guy is out to lunch on this stuff.
It's not worshiping/serving the image/copy of the Northern Islamic Empire that will get you killed. The image or copy is of the former Ottoman Empire, the 7th head of the Beast which was mortally wounded, yet now lives.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed.
"Worship" and "serve" are often used interchangeably in most religions, including ours. If you worship Christ, don't you also serve Him or should want to serve Him? In fact the word, "worship" and "serve" appear together in the same verse 31 times in the Bible. They most often are found in relation to following false gods/faiths such as here:
Deuteronomy 11:16
“Take heed to yourselves, lest your heart be deceived, and you turn aside and serve other gods and worship them.
Strict Sharia Law is coming back and already here in many parts of the Muslim world. If you are Muslim and refuse to worship (bow towards Mecca and pray 5 times a day, a strict law) you will be killed. If you are Muslim you are just killed. Now if you are Jewish or Christian and refuse, you will be beheaded as that is the preferred way for Muslims to kill Jews and Christians.
Can we now agree on this? Or are you still waiting for Rome to make a comeback and Catholic priests taking to the street with machetes
?
P
I don't get it Noah and his family spared before judgment. Lot and his family spared before judgment. Abraham pled to God not to destroy the righteous with the wicked. We are found in Christ (ark) we are given Christ righteousness (lot) for this sake we are not appointed to wrath (Paul) Sounds to me that when the fireworks start we will be in the spectators seat watching the new year roll in.
The part about the saints is found in relation to the first beast, the Beast of the Sea. The part about the "mark" is found in relation to the second beast, the Beast of the Earth.
The Beast of the Sea, is the Islamic Beast of the North (of Israel). This beast attacks and overcomes the Saints. Are Saints living in this location under attack now??? Guess what, they are being overcome. I can send you links to some stories about this if you'd like.
The Beast from the Earth has not appeared yet. This Beast will order all those under his power to accept the mark, name or number. So, how is it that you are correct again?
The Beast of the Sea, is the Islamic Beast of the North (of Israel). This beast attacks and overcomes the Saints. Are Saints living in this location under attack now??? Guess what, they are being overcome. I can send you links to some stories about this if you'd like.
The Beast from the Earth has not appeared yet. This Beast will order all those under his power to accept the mark, name or number. So, how is it that you are correct again?
The first questions everyone needs to answer before they can understand future prophesy as it relates to Revelation and related OT passages are:
1) What is the Great Tribulation, who causes it and who are its victims?
2) What is the Wrath of God, what triggers it and what group(s) are the subject of said Wrath?
Once you sort this out, then we can have a meaningful discussion.
Most of Revelation was previously revealed by the OT prophets. Start with this passage as it contains both the GT and the wrath that follows. You will see Jesus mirrors this story in Mat 24, Mark 13, etc as does John in Rev.
Eze 38:[SUP] 18 [/SUP]“And it will come to pass at the same time, when Gog comes against the land of Israel,” <<< This is the Great Tribulation>>>>>
says the Lord God, “that My fury will show in My face. [SUP]19 [/SUP]For in My jealousy and in the fire of My wrath I have spoken: ‘Surely in that day there shall be a great earthquake in the land of Israel, [SUP]20 [/SUP]so that the fish of the sea, the birds of the heavens, the beasts of the field, all creeping things that creep on the earth, and all men who are on the face of the earth shall shake at My presence. The mountains shall be thrown down, the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.’ [SUP]21 [/SUP]I will call for a sword against Gog throughout all My mountains,” says the Lord God. “Every man’s sword will be against his brother. [SUP]22 [/SUP]And I will bring him to judgment with pestilence and bloodshed; I will rain down on him, on his troops, and on the many peoples who are with him, flooding rain, great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. <<<<THIS IS GOD'S WRATH>>>>
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Thus I will magnify Myself and sanctify Myself, and I will be known in the eyes of many nations. Then they shall know that I am the Lord.”’
To escape God's Wrath one must first be in the area where the wrath occurs. If you don't live where the wrath comes, then no need to worry. God always gives instructions to the innocent before He passes judgment. He tells you what to do and where to go.
He told Noah to build an ark
He told Lot to flee Sodom
He told Rahab to hang a banner out her window
He told Moses to paint the doorways with blood
God always instructs and if you listen and obey (that's the key), you have nothing to fear. In the case of His wrath He tells us to GET OUT OF DA WAY!!!
Rev 18: “Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues. [SUP]5 [/SUP]For her sins have reached to heaven, and God has remembered her iniquities.
Jer 51: [SUP]45 [/SUP]“My people, go out of the midst of her! And let everyone deliver himself from the fierce anger of the Lord.
Nowhere does He tell us of a flight to heaven to avoid His judgment because none is needed.
1) What is the Great Tribulation, who causes it and who are its victims?
2) What is the Wrath of God, what triggers it and what group(s) are the subject of said Wrath?
Once you sort this out, then we can have a meaningful discussion.
Most of Revelation was previously revealed by the OT prophets. Start with this passage as it contains both the GT and the wrath that follows. You will see Jesus mirrors this story in Mat 24, Mark 13, etc as does John in Rev.
Eze 38:[SUP] 18 [/SUP]“And it will come to pass at the same time, when Gog comes against the land of Israel,” <<< This is the Great Tribulation>>>>>
says the Lord God, “that My fury will show in My face. [SUP]19 [/SUP]For in My jealousy and in the fire of My wrath I have spoken: ‘Surely in that day there shall be a great earthquake in the land of Israel, [SUP]20 [/SUP]so that the fish of the sea, the birds of the heavens, the beasts of the field, all creeping things that creep on the earth, and all men who are on the face of the earth shall shake at My presence. The mountains shall be thrown down, the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.’ [SUP]21 [/SUP]I will call for a sword against Gog throughout all My mountains,” says the Lord God. “Every man’s sword will be against his brother. [SUP]22 [/SUP]And I will bring him to judgment with pestilence and bloodshed; I will rain down on him, on his troops, and on the many peoples who are with him, flooding rain, great hailstones, fire, and brimstone. <<<<THIS IS GOD'S WRATH>>>>
[SUP]23 [/SUP]Thus I will magnify Myself and sanctify Myself, and I will be known in the eyes of many nations. Then they shall know that I am the Lord.”’
To escape God's Wrath one must first be in the area where the wrath occurs. If you don't live where the wrath comes, then no need to worry. God always gives instructions to the innocent before He passes judgment. He tells you what to do and where to go.
He told Noah to build an ark
He told Lot to flee Sodom
He told Rahab to hang a banner out her window
He told Moses to paint the doorways with blood
God always instructs and if you listen and obey (that's the key), you have nothing to fear. In the case of His wrath He tells us to GET OUT OF DA WAY!!!
Rev 18: “Come out of her, my people, lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her plagues. [SUP]5 [/SUP]For her sins have reached to heaven, and God has remembered her iniquities.
Jer 51: [SUP]45 [/SUP]“My people, go out of the midst of her! And let everyone deliver himself from the fierce anger of the Lord.
Nowhere does He tell us of a flight to heaven to avoid His judgment because none is needed.
P
Popeye, buddy, why do you still get this wrong? I've showed you this passage several times now. Not taking the mark does not get you beheaded. The "mark" is one of three acceptable things that you need in order to buy or sell. The below PROVES beyond any doubt that the "mark" is NOT a computer chip.
[SUP]17 [/SUP]and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
So you can have the: 1) Mark, or 2) Name of the Beast or, 3) the Number of his name. If you have at least one of these three, you can buy or sell. Nothing says you are killed if you don't. If you needed a computer chip than the other two options would not be an option. You have to stop watching those entertaining, yet crazy Tim LaHaye movies as the guy is out to lunch on this stuff.
It's not worshiping/serving the image/copy of the Northern Islamic Empire that will get you killed. The image or copy is of the former Ottoman Empire, the 7th head of the Beast which was mortally wounded, yet now lives.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed.
"Worship" and "serve" are often used interchangeably in most religions, including ours. If you worship Christ, don't you also serve Him or should want to serve Him? In fact the word, "worship" and "serve" appear together in the same verse 31 times in the Bible. They most often are found in relation to following false gods/faiths such as here:
Deuteronomy 11:16
“Take heed to yourselves, lest your heart be deceived, and you turn aside and serve other gods and worship them.
Strict Sharia Law is coming back and already here in many parts of the Muslim world. If you are Muslim and refuse to worship (bow towards Mecca and pray 5 times a day, a strict law) you will be killed. If you are Muslim you are just killed. Now if you are Jewish or Christian and refuse, you will be beheaded as that is the preferred way for Muslims to kill Jews and Christians.
Can we now agree on this? Or are you still waiting for Rome to make a comeback and Catholic priests taking to the street with machetes?
[SUP]17 [/SUP]and that no one may buy or sell except one who has the mark or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
So you can have the: 1) Mark, or 2) Name of the Beast or, 3) the Number of his name. If you have at least one of these three, you can buy or sell. Nothing says you are killed if you don't. If you needed a computer chip than the other two options would not be an option. You have to stop watching those entertaining, yet crazy Tim LaHaye movies as the guy is out to lunch on this stuff.
It's not worshiping/serving the image/copy of the Northern Islamic Empire that will get you killed. The image or copy is of the former Ottoman Empire, the 7th head of the Beast which was mortally wounded, yet now lives.
[SUP]15 [/SUP]He was granted power to give breath to the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak and cause as many as would not worship the image of the beast to be killed.
"Worship" and "serve" are often used interchangeably in most religions, including ours. If you worship Christ, don't you also serve Him or should want to serve Him? In fact the word, "worship" and "serve" appear together in the same verse 31 times in the Bible. They most often are found in relation to following false gods/faiths such as here:
Deuteronomy 11:16
“Take heed to yourselves, lest your heart be deceived, and you turn aside and serve other gods and worship them.
Strict Sharia Law is coming back and already here in many parts of the Muslim world. If you are Muslim and refuse to worship (bow towards Mecca and pray 5 times a day, a strict law) you will be killed. If you are Muslim you are just killed. Now if you are Jewish or Christian and refuse, you will be beheaded as that is the preferred way for Muslims to kill Jews and Christians.
Can we now agree on this? Or are you still waiting for Rome to make a comeback and Catholic priests taking to the street with machetes
?
But I can not see him being a world leader that has a Jewish following,or that he could pass as the real messiah.
But I believe the GT is global. So we are light years apart on several things.
I figured the new wife would have straightened you out by now!
Just joking dude
Have a good un
I told you good buddy that the wife was post trib before I met her. She is so in tune with the spiritual and I'm in awe of her every day. She probably wouldn't have married me if I was pre.
The AC will most definitely be Muslim. They are the deceived. Jews didn't recognize the Messiah but they sure don't follow Allah. Remember, the Muslims believe there is a Jesus too. They call him Isa. He is supposed to help the Mahdi to rid the world of evil, which in their minds are Jews, Christians and westerners like us. Isa is supposed to then bring in peace one all of us evil non-Muslims are exterminated.
The Tares are Muslims. They have been growing up beside the Jews. This can be said about no other group. Mat 24 applies to Israel. The concept of the Church had only barely been discussed. The disciples were asking Jesus about things dealing with the Temple then the signs of His return. The topic was Israel, not the Church.
There are those whose names are written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the earth, right? Then there must be those whose names were not written in the Book. Ever wonder why??? Why are some of us saved and some not? Why do some of us recognize the true God while others follow a false God and Messiah as in Allah and Muhammad? Doesn't that question bother you?
. She probably wouldn't have married me if I was pre. The AC will most definitely be Muslim. They are the deceived. Jews didn't recognize the Messiah but they sure don't follow Allah. Remember, the Muslims believe there is a Jesus too. They call him Isa. He is supposed to help the Mahdi to rid the world of evil, which in their minds are Jews, Christians and westerners like us. Isa is supposed to then bring in peace one all of us evil non-Muslims are exterminated.
The Tares are Muslims. They have been growing up beside the Jews. This can be said about no other group. Mat 24 applies to Israel. The concept of the Church had only barely been discussed. The disciples were asking Jesus about things dealing with the Temple then the signs of His return. The topic was Israel, not the Church.
There are those whose names are written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the earth, right? Then there must be those whose names were not written in the Book. Ever wonder why??? Why are some of us saved and some not? Why do some of us recognize the true God while others follow a false God and Messiah as in Allah and Muhammad? Doesn't that question bother you?
They are going to say that this wasn't the Tribulation because they are still here so there is going to be another re-gathering of the Jews to their Land and then another Man of Sin. Just as they believe in multiple pin-ball returns of Christ, so will be the case for the Man of Sins.
Oh wait, they see the Tribulation as God's Wrath upon the entire planet, not just Israel. They literalize all the seals, trumpets and bowls and squeeze them into 7 years. Since the planet doesn't get obliterated they will not recognize the Tribulation either.
Oh wait, they see the Tribulation as God's Wrath upon the entire planet, not just Israel. They literalize all the seals, trumpets and bowls and squeeze them into 7 years. Since the planet doesn't get obliterated they will not recognize the Tribulation either.
no one really knows what the Mark will actually look like until its here.