Jesus Christ was God manifest in the Flesh

[PneumaPsucheSoma]

You have one heck of a nerve to keep demanding that people answer your questions. You do it because you are insecure and live in error. You are a heckler when you do that. You provoke people with your incessant desire and demand that others answer your questions because you do not like being opposed by those that do not back off. You are one of the biggest accusers on this site and you parade around in your sanctimonious sarcasm making demands from others and accusing them of your own guilt.

You know darn well that when it comes to providing support in the scriptures, my answers are usually loaded and if I give no scripture you know that I have the scripture and have mentioned many times that I am available to give them upon request. But you pretend and lie on this site that it is not so. You deliberately deceive people for your own purposes and that is not good. Your friend VW left for a time and you did not like that and you hold me responsible. But I am not to blame for his wounds or for yours that you both claim and hold the church responsible. You both have scores of inward issues with the church and body of Christ and you come on this site to exercise yourself your way as an independent believer.

Jesus Christ was God manifest in the flesh and if any deny this simply truth and mystery of godliness, that is the spirit of antichrist, and those that try to cover up their error with confusion are even worse in their pursuit to convince others. If you have one speck of decency or one once of grace in your heart, please do not ever ask me another question as long as you live, for I am not interested. I am officially cutting you off and treating you as one who asks and thinks like a heretic for many reasons. Whatever others think of this post will be between them and God but my conscience in clean on this matter. If you could see my face you would see an angry countenance but without sin and with great joy and peace in my heart.

As one who has observed these exchanges... you may somehow be at peace with yourself, but you make your exit from controversy as a dishonest, disingenuous, pouting child.

I adamantly affirm the Deity of Christ, and can thoroughly exegete that He indeed IS. But... Scripture doesn't demand that belief for eternal life. Nor does Scripture refer to the spirit of antichrist in this regard. In 1 John 4, the Apostle is referring to Gnostics who insisted Jesus didn't actually become flesh, which they believed was corrupt; rather that He was just an immaterial manifested projection of sorts.

LBG has consistently presented basic facts that you ignore, having deceived yourself into thinking you've somehow refuted his view. But this is normal for Trinitarians, who can't support their beliefs from Scripture and presume their perceptions are reality.

You likely won't respond to me, either, since I don't agree with your doctrines of men; but, for the record, you leave the topic with your opinions unrepresented and unsubstantiated. You haven't provided any scriptural foundation for your assertion that salvific faith must include the Deity of Christ; and your accusation against LBG is baseless personal.

You seem to be a person of general integrity and great zeal, even though I disagree with your views. You have not acquitted yourself well in this area, and LBG's simple assertions have gone unrepudiated, leaving you with limited credibility.

Why not just post Scripture or admit it's not specifically required in the Word? You've not ever done either that I'm aware of.

 

[Crazy4GODword]

Jesus does claim His deity, it is written

 

[wakeup]

1Tim 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

How can so many that say they believe on the Lord Jesus Christ for salvation and the forgiveness of sins, but do not believe that Jesus Christ was God in the flesh? There are those right here on this site that believe so. How can any person believe in the Son of God yet not believe that the Son was God in the flesh? It is contrary to the truth of scripture and to the Holy Spirit to believe that Jesus Christ was not God in the flesh (1Tim 3:16)?

When we worship and magnify Christ we are worshipping God in spirit and truth. When we love God, we love the Father and the Son because they are one and our love is according to the truth. The Son of God is equal to the Father but the Jews did not want to believe so. Many were offended, even some of the disciples, when Christ stated that they must eat His flesh and drink His blood or they would have no life in them (Jn 6:54-71).

Did not God come from heaven as the bread of life? When Christ claimed to be the Son of God they considered that to be blasphemy because He made Himself equal with God . Are we going to be led astray and believe that Jesus Christ through the incarnation, when God to on human form through the flesh, was not God in the flesh but only the Son of God who was inferior and not equal with God? Is this where we are being lead by the spirit of antichrist in these last days?

you are contradicting john1:14. the word was made flesh,not God.

 

[Crazy4GODword]

you are contradicting john1:14. the word was made flesh,not God.

wake up bro read John 1:1 the word was God,,,,,14 made flesh

 

[livingbygrace]

As one who has observed these exchanges... you may somehow be at peace with yourself, but you make your exit from controversy as a dishonest, disingenuous, pouting child.

I adamantly affirm the Deity of Christ, and can thoroughly exegete that He indeed IS. But... Scripture doesn't demand that belief for eternal life. Nor does Scripture refer to the spirit of antichrist in this regard. In 1 John 4, the Apostle is referring to Gnostics who insisted Jesus didn't actually become flesh, which they believed was corrupt; rather that He was just an immaterial manifested projection of sorts.

LBG has consistently presented basic facts that you ignore, having deceived yourself into thinking you've somehow refuted his view. But this is normal for Trinitarians, who can't support their beliefs from Scripture and presume their perceptions are reality.

You likely won't respond to me, either, since I don't agree with your doctrines of men; but, for the record, you leave the topic with your opinions unrepresented and unsubstantiated. You haven't provided any scriptural foundation for your assertion that salvific faith must include the Deity of Christ; and your accusation against LBG is baseless personal.

You seem to be a person of general integrity and great zeal, even though I disagree with your views. You have not acquitted yourself well in this area, and LBG's simple assertions have gone unrepudiated, leaving you with limited credibility.

Why not just post Scripture or admit it's not specifically required in the Word? You've not ever done either that I'm aware of.

PPS

A well known Evangelist once said

'If we believe Christ is the son of God, that he died for our sins on the cross and that if we repent of our sins and ask him into our lives as Lord and Saviour we are saved. And the Evangelist believed that was the core message of Chrisitanity and their heartfelt wish was that whatever other disagreements there were between denominations they would unite around that basic message of salvation

I admire very much you , Eternally Grateful and others who take your stance. For though there may be differences in perception on this subject between us, your bottom line is what is actually written in scripture

A belief that a person must believe Christ is God Himself to have eternal life is not scriptural, therefore it is opionion based on the theology of man, not the spirit breathed Bible
And as I have stated. I have been to Trinitarian churches for thirty years, not once did I ever hear from the pulpit that a person must believe Christ is God Himself to have eternal life

So either these churches did not believe it was an essential belief, or they were failing their flock abysmally

God Bless

 

[mpaper345]

There is only one God who is a Holy Spirit.Father is a title for God the Holy Spirit.The Son is the man Christ Jesus.

Jesus is God manifest in the flesh,but not a second person of a trinity,but the one true God with no distinction of persons.

When the Bible says that God was manifest in the flesh,it means that God manifest all His attributes to the man Christ Jesus,and the Spirit in Christ is still connected to the omnipresent Spirit of God,for God cannot be separated,and God is in all and through all.

It was the Spirit that moved on the face of the deep in Genesis.

Jesus was conceived of the Holy Spirit not a God the Son.

When the fulness of time was come God sent forth His Son,made of a woman,made under the law,and the Son was made according to the flesh,not eternally begotten.

The term Son means to come after the Father or else the term Son has no meaning.The Son cannot be called the Son if He has no beginning,and to be eternally begotten makes no sense,for how can you be eternally begotten,either you are begotten or you are eternal,you cannot be both.

The Bible says there is one God,the Father.It does not say there is 3 persons in one God,but says there is one God,the Father.

The Bible says that the Son shall be called The everlasting Father,and that is because there is only one deity,the Father,and Jesus is God manifest in the flesh,which God said He would reveal His new name to the Jews and speak to them,and Jesus said it is the Father that dwells in Him,He does the works.

There is only one God the Holy Spirit,and whatever name He calls Himself or whatever title He has,He is still one God with no distinction of persons that did it all,created all things,was manifest in the flesh,and dwells in the saints,which Jesus did all those things for He is the one true God,and Jesus is the name of the Father and the Son inherited that name.

Jesus is God manifest in flesh,so it is the name of the Father and the Son,which the prophet Agur asked the question,what is His name and what is His Son's name,if you can tell(Proverbs 30:4).

There is a lot of proof to shoot down a trinity.

14That thou keep this commandment without spot, unrebukable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
15Which in his times he shall shew, who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
16Who only hath immortality, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honour and power everlasting. Amen(1 Timothy 6:14-16).


Jesus is more than a visible God,for He dwells in the light which no man can approach unto,and no man has seen Jesus and no man shall ever see Jesus,for He is the invisible God.


Take a tub of water and submerge a glass in the water.The water in the tub is all the same substance.The water in the tub fills the glass,but the water in the glass is still connected to the water in the tub,and is all the same substance.


That is like Jesus,God manifest all His attributes to the Son,the man Christ Jesus,but the Spirit in Christ is still connected to the omnipresent Spirit of God with no distinction of persons.


It makes Jesus a visible manifestation of God,so we can see the exact image of the invisible God the Father,so God can provide salvation for mankind,and have a visible relationship with the saints,for the throne in heaven is the throne of both God and the Lamb(Revelation 22:3-4).


Even if people have the Holy Spirit and act like Jesus,they are not an exact image of God,for Jesus is the fulness of God's attributes,where the saints have partial attributes.


Jesus is the exact image of God,and the best God can do to show us Himself,for we can never see the invisible God and will never see the invisible God.


Not even angels can see God unless He shows them a visible manifestation of Himself,for the Bible says God was manifest in the flesh,seen of angels(1 Timothy 3:16).


Jesus is the Father,for the only deity is the Father,who is a Holy Spirit,and Jesus is God manifest in flesh,who shall be called The everlasting Father(Isaiah 9:6).

 

[Crazy4GODword]

Whoa it sounds like you contradicted yourself for a moment......

 

[livingbygrace]

I disagree. Yes Jesus called the Father the one true God, but he was giving the father credit where credit was do. Remember he did not think is was robbery to think he was equal with God.

I think for me, and maybe this will make sense to you. What Makes God God. What separates him from Angels. We look at the essence and deity. that is what makes them God. The father is the supreme authority. Even the son and spirit give him those dues. But they have the essence of God. and that is what makes them God. Angels have no deity they are created, nore do they have the essence of God (omniscience, omnipresence, Omnipotence etc etc) . The son was not created, nor was the spirit. but have always been with the Father. Does this make sense?

I doubt there is as much disagreement between us as you may think in essence of the nature of the son. I would disagree with your interpretation of Phil 2:6 though. I will give you the answer someone posted on another website. He believed in the Trinity, but not an equal Trinity

What was the bait used by satan to tempt Eve to eat the apple?
Equality with God, being as God. Gen 3:5
Eve fell for the bait and Adam followed

But although Christ being in the nature of God did not consider equality with God something to be grasped.
So the second Adam was not tempted to desire equality with God, though he had the very nature of God himself.

And what was the result?

Therefore God exalted him to the highest place
and gave him the name that is above every name
that at the name of Jesus every knee shall bow
in Heaven and on earth and under the earth
and every tongue con fess that Jesus Christ is Lord
to the glory of God, the Father

I agree with you, the Father is the supreme authority. I have said this before and will once again.

The Spirit exhibits in Christ. The fulness of the Godhead bodily rests on Christ. Therefore, the Father is fully in the son via the Spirit. The Fathers work is done THROUGH the son. The son speaks the words of the Father.
But, and this is the root of our disagreement I guess. Can Christ have the spirit of his Father so fully in him and still not be God Himself? For the spirit of the Father is fully in the son

I guess fir the answer to that you have to decide what you stand on in your Christianity.
The teaching of men?
The rational mind and intellect and what seems correct according to the working out of the rational mind?
Or do you stand on the plainest of Bible verses on this subject?(I am generalising here)

When I was eleven or twelve I sat in my sunday school class at the fundamentalist church I went to and the sunday schlool teacher looked at me and said
'You have to accept ALL of the Bible, you cannot pick and choose what you accept, it is the word of God'

I never forgot those words and have always wanted to stand on scripture, and that must come before any teaching that would contradict the plain words of the Bible

And it is a fact that if we give Christ the title of the one true God Himself you have to dismiss the plainest of scripture on this subject in the Bible. I cannot do that.

As a teenager I believed what I was taught in church. When I finally read the Bible for myself when I was 19 I realised I had not been taught much of the basics of the Gospel by a church that considered itself fundamental

Many judge that I am condemned, for my beliefs, but God knows my heart(and I cannot rightly trust completely the motives of my heart it can be deceitful) and to the best of the ability of what I am given by God I will remasin faithful to the plain, emphatic statements in the Bible on this subject, and I know I will never be condemned for that by Christ, by ,many men yes, but not by Christ on the day of judgement for to me the Bible is the final authority, not man, and not creeds or councils
And I am sure that by the grace of God both of our beliefs and the way we see this subject will not hinder our entry into Heaven for we both know the bottom line, bjut many have taken 'the bait' and do not accept the Biblical botytom line for salvation

 

[Crazy4GODword]

So you contradict what Jesus said..... because of what you think?
Jesus said He is the Almighty

Amen

 

[livingbygrace]

So you contradict what Jesus said..... because of what you think?
Jesus said He is the Almighty

Amen

You have the youthful exuberance of a 15 year old, and I found (and was told) that at that age we tend to think we have all the answers, but we don't

Please quote a plain and clear scripture where Christ claimed to be the one true God Himself
Not one where you infer that was meant


If you can do that you would then have to believe in a Bible that contradicted itself for you have already told me that you believe Christ spoke the truth in John 17:3

 

[Crazy4GODword]

Jesus said this......

Revelation 1:8
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

and I don't know everything....

read this verse in other translations

 

[livingbygrace]

Jesus said this......

Revelation 1:8
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

and I don't know everything....

read this verse in other translations

As I said. Can you give me a scripture where Christ claimed to be the one true God Himself

And I repeat, you have already accepted that Christ spoke the truth when he said the Father was the only true God

 

[Crazy4GODword]

As I said. Can you give me a scripture where Christ claimed to be the one true God Himself

And I repeat, you have already accepted that Christ spoke the truth when he said the Father was the only true God

bro, i just showed you the verse....did you miss it or something, He said He is the Almighty the Alpha and Omega

here is another Revelation 22:13

 

[livingbygrace]

bro, i just showed you the verse....did you miss it or something, He said He is the Almighty the Alpha and Omega

here is another Revelation 22:13

The above is not Christ saying he is the one true God. Have a read of Rev 3:12. Four times in that verse Christ refers to God as 'my God'

Now will you answer my question
Do you believe Christ spoke the truth in John 17:3 when he said there was only one true God, the Father?

 

[Crazy4GODword]

The above is not Christ saying he is the one true God. Have a read of Rev 3:12. Four times in that verse Christ refers to God as 'my God'

Now will you answer my question
Do you believe Christ spoke the truth in John 17:3 when he said there was only one true God, the Father?

I believe that yes, but He is the Father....read John 5:17,18 My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” Therefore the Jews sought to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.

 

[livingbygrace]

I believe that yes, but He is the Father....read John 5:17,18 My Father has been working until now, and I have been working.” Therefore the Jews sought to kill Him, because He not only broke the Sabbath, but also said that God was His Father, making Himself equal with God.

So you believe Jesus is the Father? I doubt you will find any Trinitarians agreeing with you

 

[Crazy4GODword]

Christ is the Father, by Spirit not flesh that is my answer......and i believe what i hear what is true.......guessing you didn't read the verse i posted....either

 

[Crazy4GODword]

Love ya bro, thats my answer

 

[livingbygrace]

Christ is the Father, by Spirit not flesh that is my answer......and i believe what i hear what is true.......guessing you didn't read the verse i posted....either

Yes I read your verse but it doesn't say what you think it does. My advice would be have a chat with some Trinitarians about your belief that Christ is the Father.

Sorry but I am not going to get into a pointless debate with you here. There is no point in you putting up scripture that does not plainly say what you want it to. My advice would be for you to contemplate on what you actually believe. I know of no Trinitarian who believes Christ is the Father, as far as I know that is only oneness belief.

Take care and God Bless

 

[Crazy4GODword]

ok....i am a trinity believer that God the Son, Father and Spirit are one God.....so how am i condridcting that belief?