and do i think i bring anything new to the table? yes i do. I've read about 30 books on the subject since the beginning of the year, most more recent than 2008. this is the latest stuff in the debate. what happened 8 years ago might be irrelevant by now, what with new discoveries, new studies and the results of all the recents debates. have you done your homework and consulted what the people who disagree with you have to say? oh no that's right, you don't believe you can be mistaken, why would you?
Let's talk about god
- Thread starter Karaka
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maybe, sure, but the biblical scholars are not fools, they are not speculating on christian forums, they do serious research. i think we should listen to what they say. especially since most of them are in fact christians... they have no axe to grind, but they are honest and they follow the evidence where it leads. they supports their claim, they don't pretend to have reached their conclusions on faith and they say all the same stuff i say without thinking it undermine their faith. i really don't get why you guys are so against what they say...
~~~~~REVELATION 1:7-8~~~~~
Behold, he cometh with clouds;
and every eye shall see him,
and they also which pierced him:
and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him.
Even so, Amen.
I am Alpha and Omega,
the beginning and the ending,
saith the Lord, which is, and which was,
and which is to come, the Almighty.
Behold, he cometh with clouds;
and every eye shall see him,
and they also which pierced him:
and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him.
Even so, Amen.
I am Alpha and Omega,
the beginning and the ending,
saith the Lord, which is, and which was,
and which is to come, the Almighty.
Trofimus, to get a balanced view of any subjects, youtube videos are not really adequate, not even debates about the questions. Only well reasoned, well argued books or university courses can really inform you about such a deep and complex subject. No Youtube video should convince you God exists. a thorough survey of the literature from both believers and nonbelievers reveals that the matter is not clear cut nor settled. the evidence for God is non existent or non conclusive, that's why apologists fall back to other methods to try to demonstrate that God exists. There is no valid reason to be certain God exists. One can believe, I've looked hard and long for knowledge of God and haven't found anything except personal experiences like people here advocate, and personal experience are by definition subjective and can not be shared and thus do not constitue valid evidence for God.
the last thing is scripture, but if you want to check a few posts back, you'll see that I'm arguying that scriptures are not reliable as a way to know God either.
the last thing is scripture, but if you want to check a few posts back, you'll see that I'm arguying that scriptures are not reliable as a way to know God either.
That's fine of course, each his own, but i would think believers should be interested in checking out whether they are correct or not about the beliefs that are so central to their lives. Something like checking out who wrote the bible and when and under which circumstances the books within it were compiled, seems to me to be one of the most important point in the spiritual life of somebody who believe the bible is the word of God. Being mistaken about this means you need to reconsider a lot of what you take for granted. denying the facts is never a good policy to function in this world. If God exists he gave us the ability to reason and the scientific method as the most effective way to make sense of the world, that would mean he intends us to make use of reason and of the scientific method to find out what is true and what is not.
you know, i was thinking about what a colossal waste of time this thread might be.
and then i recalled the testimony of a woman who was ministered to by a church for two years before God opened her eyes.
so, yeah, what do i know?
and then i recalled the testimony of a woman who was ministered to by a church for two years before God opened her eyes.
so, yeah, what do i know?
Well, I am sure I have suggested you read Scriptures, a number of times for sure, so you simply show how irrational and illogical your question really is. God is not hiding in the Bible, either, though, if that is what your silly little question was getting at. His plan for humanity is clearly laid out therein, for those with eyes to see. I suggest again, read the good book Eight years ago I had basically just started talking to atheists and various other non-believers, though some were believers of a different stripe, Satanists even, and polytheists, etc. Most were just atheists, maltheists, antitheists, agnostics, what have you. People with an ax to grind against religion in general, and Christianity in particular. You really don't bring anything new to the table.
Eight years ago I had basically just started talking to atheists and various other non-believers, though some were believers of a different stripe, Satanists even, and polytheists, etc. Most were just atheists, maltheists, antitheists, agnostics, what have you. People with an ax to grind against religion in general, and Christianity in particular. You really don't bring anything new to the table.