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Then let's discuss Romans 9 shall we?
11*(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth
12*It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
God had chosen to love Jacob and hate Esau BEFORE any one of them had done any good or evil.
Now I pose a few questions for you. I hope you answer in honesty for us all without prejudice.
Did Esau do any good in his life?
Likewise did Jacob do evil before the Lord?
If so, then why was it this way?
11*(For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth
12*It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.
God had chosen to love Jacob and hate Esau BEFORE any one of them had done any good or evil.
Now I pose a few questions for you. I hope you answer in honesty for us all without prejudice.
Did Esau do any good in his life?
Likewise did Jacob do evil before the Lord?
If so, then why was it this way?
Jacob did alot of evil in his early life. look what he did to his brother. as for esau i am not sure. and I wonder why it would even matter. does it? did Paul say one did evil and one did not? ithey were chosen before they did anything. so why are we looking at this?
how about looking at what Paul quoted.
1. Did God not tell rebecca two nations were in her womb, one would serve the other. and one would rule the other. or was he talking about the two kids?
2. Did Jacob not call Esau lord? did Jacob not call himself the servant of Esau? better yet. did jacob ever lord over Esau while they were alive?
and when did God tell anyone he love jacob and hated esau? was he talking about the literal kids, or the nations which proceded from him.
these are the important questions to get context are they not?
Yes God is the potter. He makes some people to be kings, great singers, great worriers, great politicians, great presidents and so on
It’s got nothing to do with Free Will. We are not talking about Omnipotence.
The expression “Free Will” only means that “you might be willing for something”
It’s got nothing to do with Free Will. We are not talking about Omnipotence.
The expression “Free Will” only means that “you might be willing for something”
Of course not! I understand them as you do. What I'm pointing to is the example of the operation of God to bring about salvation.
As with the example given us in Jacob and Esau's life, that salvation was given to us ALL in Christ Jesus BEFORE the world began (or any of us were born having done neither good or evil).
As with the example given us in Jacob and Esau's life, that salvation was given to us ALL in Christ Jesus BEFORE the world began (or any of us were born having done neither good or evil).
There was a serial killer Jack the Ripper who was active in impoverished areas in London in 1888 attacking female prostitutes from the slums whose throats were cut prior to abdominal mutilations.
Did God make Jack the Ripper?
Did Jack the Ripper abode in Christ?
Was God pleased in Jack the Ripper?
With help of Jack the Ripper God wanted to make known the riches of his glory?
Did God make Jack the Ripper?
Did Jack the Ripper abode in Christ?
Was God pleased in Jack the Ripper?
With help of Jack the Ripper God wanted to make known the riches of his glory?
A suicidal Islamic extremist, right before he explodes the bomb on the train or the plane or the bus, believes that it will be exploded only if God predestined it to be exploded.
So suicidal Islamic extremist is in fact doing the will of God
Is it Islam that originates from Calvinism or Calvinism originates from Islam?
So suicidal Islamic extremist is in fact doing the will of God
Is it Islam that originates from Calvinism or Calvinism originates from Islam?
Christ was not in jack the ripper, and he committed many atrocities in his life. But where is he at now? Has he not put off the flesh WHERE SIN DWELLS?
Now you may say that he raped and killed women and you're not like him. But the God who said do not do the things that he has done also FROM THE SAME MOUTH said not to do whatever it is you do from time to time.
You may not have done those horrible things that he did, but what sin you have committed, made you guilty of all.
Jack the ripper is no longer jack the ripper! Neither are those he killed. For they have put off the body of sins.
You just misunderstand some key concepts or ignore some verses
Romans 7:16-20 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good. Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. For I know that in me (that is , in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not. For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do . Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
Romans 7:16-20 If then I do that which I would not, I consent unto the law that it is good. Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. For I know that in me (that is , in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing: for to will is present with me; but how to perform that which is good I find not. For the good that I would I do not: but the evil which I would not, that I do . Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.