Who Is A Jew
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oh come on.
did you read what Jesus said or not?
Malachi 4 5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: 6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.
John 1 29 The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, "Look! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
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Matthew 2 10When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceedingly great joy. 11They came into the house and saw the young child with Mary, his mother, and they fell down and worshiped him. Opening their treasures, they offered to him gifts: gold, frankincense, and myrrh. 12Being warned in a dream that they shouldn't return to Herod, they went back to their own country another way.
13Now when they had departed, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream, saying, "Arise and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and stay there until I tell you, for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him."
14He arose and took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt, 15and was there until the death of Herod; that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying, "Out of Egypt I called my son."
16Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked by the wise men, was exceedingly angry, and sent out, and killed all the male children who were in Bethlehem and in all the surrounding countryside, from two years old and under, according to the exact time which he had learned from the wise men. 17Then that which was spoken by Jeremiah the prophet was fulfilled, saying,
18"A voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation, weeping and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children; she wouldn't be comforted, because they are no more."
19But when Herod was dead, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, saying, 20"Arise and take the young child and his mother, and go into the land of Israel, for those who sought the young child's life are dead." 21He arose and took the young child and his mother, and came into the land of Israel. 22But when he heard that Archelaus was reigning over Judea in the place of his father, Herod, he was afraid to go there. Being warned in a dream, he withdrew into the region of Galilee, 23and came and lived in a city called Nazareth; that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through the prophets: "He will be called a Nazarene."
and so on.
John 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
John 11:52 and not only for that nation but also for the scattered children of God, to bring them together and make them one.
Romans 8:14 because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.
Romans 8:16 The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God's children.
did you read what Jesus said or not?
Malachi 4 5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD: 6 And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to the children, and the heart of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the earth with a curse.
John 1 29 The next day John saw Jesus coming toward him and said, "Look! The Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world!
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Matthew 2 10When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceedingly great joy. 11They came into the house and saw the young child with Mary, his mother, and they fell down and worshiped him. Opening their treasures, they offered to him gifts: gold, frankincense, and myrrh. 12Being warned in a dream that they shouldn't return to Herod, they went back to their own country another way.
13Now when they had departed, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to Joseph in a dream, saying, "Arise and take the young child and his mother, and flee into Egypt, and stay there until I tell you, for Herod will seek the young child to destroy him."
14He arose and took the young child and his mother by night, and departed into Egypt, 15and was there until the death of Herod; that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the Lord through the prophet, saying, "Out of Egypt I called my son."
16Then Herod, when he saw that he was mocked by the wise men, was exceedingly angry, and sent out, and killed all the male children who were in Bethlehem and in all the surrounding countryside, from two years old and under, according to the exact time which he had learned from the wise men. 17Then that which was spoken by Jeremiah the prophet was fulfilled, saying,
18"A voice was heard in Ramah, lamentation, weeping and great mourning, Rachel weeping for her children; she wouldn't be comforted, because they are no more."
19But when Herod was dead, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, saying, 20"Arise and take the young child and his mother, and go into the land of Israel, for those who sought the young child's life are dead." 21He arose and took the young child and his mother, and came into the land of Israel. 22But when he heard that Archelaus was reigning over Judea in the place of his father, Herod, he was afraid to go there. Being warned in a dream, he withdrew into the region of Galilee, 23and came and lived in a city called Nazareth; that it might be fulfilled which was spoken through the prophets: "He will be called a Nazarene."
and so on.
John 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because he has not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
John 11:52 and not only for that nation but also for the scattered children of God, to bring them together and make them one.
Romans 8:14 because those who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.
Romans 8:16 The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are God's children.
G
Am I wrong in reading a negative connotation of normal in one who believes Jesus Christ as God?
So a nonbeliever said something that changed your faith. That is how I read what you've said.
This is most definitely not what He came to do. What gospel is this? To me, that seems to the gospel according to an unbelieving Jew. Again, Col 2:8. I read through Colossians this morning so it flashed me the moment I read your post.
Please acknowledge that you just said "She was right." The unbelieving Jew was right and your "normal" christian faith was wrong. And as you said, you changed. I'm just revealing to you what you typed here.
I never posted anything here to boast over Jewish believers. My issue is with the roots movement that is subtly corrupting the body of Jesus Christ. There a variety of signs here in this thread.
So a nonbeliever said something that changed your faith. That is how I read what you've said.
This is most definitely not what He came to do. What gospel is this? To me, that seems to the gospel according to an unbelieving Jew. Again, Col 2:8. I read through Colossians this morning so it flashed me the moment I read your post.
Please acknowledge that you just said "She was right." The unbelieving Jew was right and your "normal" christian faith was wrong. And as you said, you changed. I'm just revealing to you what you typed here.
I never posted anything here to boast over Jewish believers. My issue is with the roots movement that is subtly corrupting the body of Jesus Christ. There a variety of signs here in this thread.
G
Friend, are you an adherent to the Hebrew Roots movement?
Do you believe that if one does not observe the sabbath, then one is obviously not reborn?
Do you also believe that if one does not observe dietary restrictions, then one is not reborn?
Do you believe the OT takes precedence over the NT?
This is a 1st century church enemy arising in the last day. There are multiple passages of God's word in this thread alone...I'm confused how you see it that you are on the right side of God's word here.
Do you believe that if one does not observe the sabbath, then one is obviously not reborn?
Do you also believe that if one does not observe dietary restrictions, then one is not reborn?
Do you believe the OT takes precedence over the NT?
This is a 1st century church enemy arising in the last day. There are multiple passages of God's word in this thread alone...I'm confused how you see it that you are on the right side of God's word here.
expect more and more of it.
since christians have been brainwashed into gazing to Rome, and overlooking the obvious - worse, joining it.
"let's ask a Rabbi"
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The basis of Jewish law and tradition (halakha) is the Torah (also known as the Pentateuch or the Five Books of Moses). According to rabbinic tradition there are 613 commandments in the Torah. Some of these laws are directed only to men or to women, some only to the ancient priestly groups, the Kohanim and Leviyim (members of the tribe of Levi), some only to farmers within the Land of Israel. Many laws were only applicable when the Temple in Jerusalem existed, and fewer than 300 of these commandments are still applicable today.
While there have been Jewish groups whose beliefs were claimed to be based on the written text of the Torah alone (e.g., the Sadducees, and the Karaites), most Jews believed in what they call the oral law. These oral traditions were transmitted by the Pharisee sect of ancient Judaism, and were later recorded in written form and expanded upon by the rabbis.
Rabbinic Judaism (which derives from the Pharisees) has always held that the books of the Torah (called the written law) have always been transmitted in parallel with an oral tradition. To justify this viewpoint, Jews point to the text of the Torah, where many words are left undefined, and many procedures mentioned without explanation or instructions; this, they argue, means that the reader is assumed to be familiar with the details from other, i.e., oral, sources. This parallel set of material was originally transmitted orally, and came to be known as "the oral law".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judaism
since christians have been brainwashed into gazing to Rome, and overlooking the obvious - worse, joining it.
"let's ask a Rabbi"
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The basis of Jewish law and tradition (halakha) is the Torah (also known as the Pentateuch or the Five Books of Moses). According to rabbinic tradition there are 613 commandments in the Torah. Some of these laws are directed only to men or to women, some only to the ancient priestly groups, the Kohanim and Leviyim (members of the tribe of Levi), some only to farmers within the Land of Israel. Many laws were only applicable when the Temple in Jerusalem existed, and fewer than 300 of these commandments are still applicable today.
While there have been Jewish groups whose beliefs were claimed to be based on the written text of the Torah alone (e.g., the Sadducees, and the Karaites), most Jews believed in what they call the oral law. These oral traditions were transmitted by the Pharisee sect of ancient Judaism, and were later recorded in written form and expanded upon by the rabbis.
Rabbinic Judaism (which derives from the Pharisees) has always held that the books of the Torah (called the written law) have always been transmitted in parallel with an oral tradition. To justify this viewpoint, Jews point to the text of the Torah, where many words are left undefined, and many procedures mentioned without explanation or instructions; this, they argue, means that the reader is assumed to be familiar with the details from other, i.e., oral, sources. This parallel set of material was originally transmitted orally, and came to be known as "the oral law".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Judaism
Obviously you do not believe I am your friend in that you have taken a great liberty in naming me as an adherent to something I have never heard named before, although I am aware there are Messianic Jews and people who are returned to all of the law.
I will tell you again, I am saved by grace in Yeshua the Only Begotten Son of Yahweh. I have learned this from reading the Word, the names I mean. The salvation came by the Holy Spirit and my yielding to my Maker. Simply put, I repented of this world.
I have not labeled anyone in this forum as to what his affiliation may be, but there are many who as soon as they see anything relating to Jews become rabid. Jesus Christ is the foremost Jew. It is always sufficient for me when anyone loves Yeshua as his Savior. I will call Him by His name because it makes me feel even a more intimate relationship with the One Who saved me from the burning fire.
Unless you can afford me this same courtesy as one who claims the Blood of the Lamb of Yahweh, I will thank you to not continue assuming upon my person and soul. This is not the Way given to us by the Son of Yahweh.
I will tell you again, I am saved by grace in Yeshua the Only Begotten Son of Yahweh. I have learned this from reading the Word, the names I mean. The salvation came by the Holy Spirit and my yielding to my Maker. Simply put, I repented of this world.
I have not labeled anyone in this forum as to what his affiliation may be, but there are many who as soon as they see anything relating to Jews become rabid. Jesus Christ is the foremost Jew. It is always sufficient for me when anyone loves Yeshua as his Savior. I will call Him by His name because it makes me feel even a more intimate relationship with the One Who saved me from the burning fire.
Unless you can afford me this same courtesy as one who claims the Blood of the Lamb of Yahweh, I will thank you to not continue assuming upon my person and soul. This is not the Way given to us by the Son of Yahweh.
Who is confused, this is common knowledge among those who have read the Word, meditated and prayed with it?Here below is just one comparative on the subject of the disobedience of the Children of Israel being the venue for all mankind's salvation. If you understood, you would know it is the will of Yahweh that all men be saved, thus it was His will the Children NOT be perfect. Although they are the chosen, they are not chosen for any innate virtue rather for the will of our Father.
(ASV) For as ye in time past were disobedient to God, but now have obtained mercy by their disobedience,
(Darby) For as indeed *ye* also once have not believed in God, but now have been objects of mercy through the unbelief of *these*;
(DRB) For as you also in times past did not believe God, but now have obtained mercy, through their unbelief:
(FDB) Car comme vous aussi vous avez été autrefois désobéissants à Dieu et que maintenant vous êtes devenus des objets de miséricorde par la désobéissance de ceux-ci,
(FLS) De même que vous avez autrefois désobéi à Dieu et que par leur désobéissance vous avez maintenant obtenu miséricorde,
(INR) Come in passato voi siete stati disubbidienti a Dio, e ora avete ottenuto misericordia per la loro disubbidienza,
(IRL) Poiché, siccome voi siete stati in passato disubbidienti a Dio ma ora avete ottenuto misericordia per la loro disubbidienza,
(KJV) For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
(KJV+) ForG1063 asG5618 yeG5210 in times pastG4218 have(G2532) not believedG544 God,G2316 yetG1161 have nowG3568 obtained mercyG1653 through theirG5130 unbelief:G543
(ROB) După cum voi, cândva, n-aţi ascultat de Dumnezeu, dar acum aţi fost miluiţi prin neascultarea acestora,
(SSE) Porque como también vosotros en algún tiempo no creisteis a Dios, pero ahora habéis alcanzado misericordia con ocasión de la incredulidad de ellos;
(Vulgate) sicut enim aliquando et vos non credidistis Deo nunc autem misericordiam consecuti estis propter illorum incredulitatem
(Webster) For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief;
(WNT) but just as you were formerly disobedient to Him, but now have received mercy at a time when they are disobedient,
as you should be able to see, most versions say disobedience. If you study the Word you will find it is mentioned in several places. I am sorry about your confusion.
Now it seems to me after your unfortunate remarks to me about putting me in an oven, you were more or less agreed to stop STALKING ME. You are quite transparent.
　
(ASV) For as ye in time past were disobedient to God, but now have obtained mercy by their disobedience,
(Darby) For as indeed *ye* also once have not believed in God, but now have been objects of mercy through the unbelief of *these*;
(DRB) For as you also in times past did not believe God, but now have obtained mercy, through their unbelief:
(FDB) Car comme vous aussi vous avez été autrefois désobéissants à Dieu et que maintenant vous êtes devenus des objets de miséricorde par la désobéissance de ceux-ci,
(FLS) De même que vous avez autrefois désobéi à Dieu et que par leur désobéissance vous avez maintenant obtenu miséricorde,
(HNT) כי כאשר גם־אתם מלפנים ממרים הייתם את־פי אלהים ועתה הוחנתם במרים של־אלה׃
(INR) Come in passato voi siete stati disubbidienti a Dio, e ora avete ottenuto misericordia per la loro disubbidienza,
(IRL) Poiché, siccome voi siete stati in passato disubbidienti a Dio ma ora avete ottenuto misericordia per la loro disubbidienza,
(KJV) For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
(KJV+) ForG1063 asG5618 yeG5210 in times pastG4218 have(G2532) not believedG544 God,G2316 yetG1161 have nowG3568 obtained mercyG1653 through theirG5130 unbelief:G543
(ROB) După cum voi, cândva, n-aţi ascultat de Dumnezeu, dar acum aţi fost miluiţi prin neascultarea acestora,
(SSE) Porque como también vosotros en algún tiempo no creisteis a Dios, pero ahora habéis alcanzado misericordia con ocasión de la incredulidad de ellos;
(Vulgate) sicut enim aliquando et vos non credidistis Deo nunc autem misericordiam consecuti estis propter illorum incredulitatem
(Webster) For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief;
(WNT) but just as you were formerly disobedient to Him, but now have received mercy at a time when they are disobedient,
as you should be able to see, most versions say disobedience. If you study the Word you will find it is mentioned in several places. I am sorry about your confusion.
Now it seems to me after your unfortunate remarks to me about putting me in an oven, you were more or less agreed to stop STALKING ME. You are quite transparent.
　
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M
grearblue, I am not a part of the Hebrew Roots movement. She WAS right in that Jesus, Yeshua, did not come to start a new religion. She was also right that He came to show the truth to the jews first, then to the gentiles. Jesus Himself said
and in the Complete Jewish Bible
in the Literal Version
and in the Amplified
That is what Jesus, Yeshua, said about Himself, and I do not care to argue with Him. She was right about the mission of the Messiah, also, acording to the Messiah Himself.
God also did not always speak through Christians, or even humans If Balaam can learn from an ass, can I not learn from a Jewish girl? God came first to them, and up to the end of the gospels, God speaks through jews, including Jesus, because that was His Earthly linage. Hope I don't have to quote that!
By "normal" Christian, I meant like the 99% you find in most churches. hey sit back, don't think, and believe everything they hear from their chosen pulpit without question no matter how ridiculous it may be, and I'm not saying it is. Most of it is true, but my point is that no one pays attention. I have heard the term Hebrew Roots Movement and Holy Name movement but I have no idea what they believe, other than what is obvious from the name.
The girl showed me something that should have been obvious, but wasn't, at least to me. I said I prayed about it, sought it out in the Bible, and discovered what Jesus and the old prophets were trying to convey beyond the obvious meaning of the literal words. Jesus' parables can be taken literally as well as figuratively. If all you see is literally, you will never get it. You know that. There are other allegories and what you might call slang in every language, and even in the bible.
I drive a cab. If I were to tell you that I realized that driving a cab is somewhat like the Kingdom of God in that sometimes we run into stop signs and sometimes we run into yield signs and that we are to try to take someone along with us (like helping them find the Lord is like helping a customer find his destination) would you call that false doctrine or tell me I am spoiled or starting a new religion?
How can you assume I have fallen away, or become spoiled or am a part of some movement I know nothing about simply because I said I realized something I had not thought of before which enhanced my faith and made it more meaningful?
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Rom 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
What does your spirit bear witness about me? Why are you so quick to judge, and so slow to consider?
Jesus DID come to fulfill the law, known to Jews as Torah, which He did. We keep the law by availing ourselves of Him, not by any physical works. In the original it says He FILLED the law, meaning that He IS the sacrifice, the tithe, the incense, and so on. If we have Him, the law is not only kept, but also filled and fulfilled. There is no more physical thing that I can do to come to Him. it is by faith only, and if He chooses to reveal a little bit more of what that means through a Jewish girl, I thank Him for that. He could have chosen a jackass. He taught Elijah through a flood, an earthquake, a fire and a still, small voice.
I didn't think anyone would twist my words into a false religion, and judge me with no reason other than I said I talked to a girl who happened to be Jewish, so I didn't go into detail. Had I known you were going to be so quick to judge and condemn someone you don't know anything about, I would have told you this and quite a lot more, before I posted.
God also did not always speak through Christians, or even humans If Balaam can learn from an ass, can I not learn from a Jewish girl? God came first to them, and up to the end of the gospels, God speaks through jews, including Jesus, because that was His Earthly linage. Hope I don't have to quote that!
By "normal" Christian, I meant like the 99% you find in most churches. hey sit back, don't think, and believe everything they hear from their chosen pulpit without question no matter how ridiculous it may be, and I'm not saying it is. Most of it is true, but my point is that no one pays attention. I have heard the term Hebrew Roots Movement and Holy Name movement but I have no idea what they believe, other than what is obvious from the name.
The girl showed me something that should have been obvious, but wasn't, at least to me. I said I prayed about it, sought it out in the Bible, and discovered what Jesus and the old prophets were trying to convey beyond the obvious meaning of the literal words. Jesus' parables can be taken literally as well as figuratively. If all you see is literally, you will never get it. You know that. There are other allegories and what you might call slang in every language, and even in the bible.
I drive a cab. If I were to tell you that I realized that driving a cab is somewhat like the Kingdom of God in that sometimes we run into stop signs and sometimes we run into yield signs and that we are to try to take someone along with us (like helping them find the Lord is like helping a customer find his destination) would you call that false doctrine or tell me I am spoiled or starting a new religion?
How can you assume I have fallen away, or become spoiled or am a part of some movement I know nothing about simply because I said I realized something I had not thought of before which enhanced my faith and made it more meaningful?
Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.
Rom 8:15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.
Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
Rom 8:17 And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
What does your spirit bear witness about me? Why are you so quick to judge, and so slow to consider?
Jesus DID come to fulfill the law, known to Jews as Torah, which He did. We keep the law by availing ourselves of Him, not by any physical works. In the original it says He FILLED the law, meaning that He IS the sacrifice, the tithe, the incense, and so on. If we have Him, the law is not only kept, but also filled and fulfilled. There is no more physical thing that I can do to come to Him. it is by faith only, and if He chooses to reveal a little bit more of what that means through a Jewish girl, I thank Him for that. He could have chosen a jackass. He taught Elijah through a flood, an earthquake, a fire and a still, small voice.
I didn't think anyone would twist my words into a false religion, and judge me with no reason other than I said I talked to a girl who happened to be Jewish, so I didn't go into detail. Had I known you were going to be so quick to judge and condemn someone you don't know anything about, I would have told you this and quite a lot more, before I posted.
G
We have both posted in threads where the roots movement has been discussed. I'll be transparent here. If I could undo any assaults toward you, I would. I am a sinner and I can easily fall into my own stance. This morning in Colossians I was meditating over false humility...and here I feel as if I have fallen into the exact things. In this exact moment I am brought back to the question of whether CC is too much of a conflict-ridden endeavor for me. I am sorry. I do consider you a friend in Christ Jesus and I do believe you love the Lord with all that you are. I do praise God for you.
Many months ago I fell into this topic with avinu and loveme1 and, while I still don't have any issues with anyone calling the Lord by Yeshua, or God by Yahweh, I've found that there are certain Roots ideas that seem to also reside within believers who worship using Hebrew nomenclature. I have issues with a Roots movement the mirrors 1st century church Judaisers.
Anyway...if you are telling my I took too much liberty, then I believe you and I am sorry. More self control in avoiding topics that have the potential to bring me to debating...that is needed.
Many months ago I fell into this topic with avinu and loveme1 and, while I still don't have any issues with anyone calling the Lord by Yeshua, or God by Yahweh, I've found that there are certain Roots ideas that seem to also reside within believers who worship using Hebrew nomenclature. I have issues with a Roots movement the mirrors 1st century church Judaisers.
Anyway...if you are telling my I took too much liberty, then I believe you and I am sorry. More self control in avoiding topics that have the potential to bring me to debating...that is needed.
G
Please reflect for a moment. Your first post was very brief, and as I broke it down, you should be able to see exactly why I said what I did. Someone who doesn't believe in Jesus Christ set you on a path to reconsider aspects of your faith. That is it. That is all you posted, though you acknowledged that He is the Messiah. And you are right that I was way too quick to judge.
I am as error-ridden as anyone and I struggle with being overly critical at times. Please forgive me for taking liberties that I had no business taking.
I am as error-ridden as anyone and I struggle with being overly critical at times. Please forgive me for taking liberties that I had no business taking.
M
To further answer these questions, no, I do not. The only thing necessary is faith in Jesus, or Yeshua.
Neither testament takes precedence. They are both equally important. The old tells us who and what to look for as well as the reasons. Without it Jesus would not be understood or received, and without the new, we would not know who Jesus is or even how to come to Him or why. They complement each other.
I'm sure all of us believe at least one thing some false religion might also believe. Moslems believe in Abraham and Sarah and follow Solomon to some extent. Mormons believe that Mary and Joseph were Jesus' earthly mother and father. I share these beliefs, but I am neither Moslem nor Mormon. I could go on. And it wouldn't be fair of me to ask you if you were Buddhist because you believe what Jesus said about what a man sows that shall he also reap, which is basically what they call karma, would it?
Please accept me as a brother. I'm not out to shove my beliefs down anyone's throat any more than you are. Salvation is a free will choice. It has a world wide meaning and a heavenly meaning, and it also has a personal meaning to the person receiving it. You might rejoice that you are no longer bound by lust, for example, while I might rejoice that I don't need drugs or alchohol anymore. Both are correct, yet one is more meaningful to me, another to you.
I hope you can accept me as a brother, while remembering that there are very few brothers who have never disagreed on anything. thenks fo rcalling me friend.
Mike
Neither testament takes precedence. They are both equally important. The old tells us who and what to look for as well as the reasons. Without it Jesus would not be understood or received, and without the new, we would not know who Jesus is or even how to come to Him or why. They complement each other.
I'm sure all of us believe at least one thing some false religion might also believe. Moslems believe in Abraham and Sarah and follow Solomon to some extent. Mormons believe that Mary and Joseph were Jesus' earthly mother and father. I share these beliefs, but I am neither Moslem nor Mormon. I could go on. And it wouldn't be fair of me to ask you if you were Buddhist because you believe what Jesus said about what a man sows that shall he also reap, which is basically what they call karma, would it?
Please accept me as a brother. I'm not out to shove my beliefs down anyone's throat any more than you are. Salvation is a free will choice. It has a world wide meaning and a heavenly meaning, and it also has a personal meaning to the person receiving it. You might rejoice that you are no longer bound by lust, for example, while I might rejoice that I don't need drugs or alchohol anymore. Both are correct, yet one is more meaningful to me, another to you.
I hope you can accept me as a brother, while remembering that there are very few brothers who have never disagreed on anything. thenks fo rcalling me friend.
Mike
You're still confused but too proud to admit it and too self oriented in being effected by others. You and tribesman must have twin spirits, because you're both very introspective in what you know and how you relate to others with your understanding. If some insignificant person like me brings you to the point of introspection claiming that I am stalking you, then you have some very deep problems that come from having a troubled heart. First get over yourself, second get crucified with Christ in your experience and thirdly don't condemn yourself when you realize that what I have said is all true. Sooner or later you will come to that realization and it will be supported by the Holy Spirit and of other members of the body of Christ.
Would it make you feel better were I to refer to Yeshua by the name taken from the Greek, Jesus? He is the same Savior. I had been using both names, but when some people started calling me Judaizer and labeling me with one title or another it raised my ire a bit. I did not sin, however it peeved me that folks were so petty as to denounce a family member simply for using the original name of Jesus, Yeshua. I have followed the Master's teaching in judging for myself what is right, having nothing to do with these individuals, however they tend to come into where I post simply to harangue, and never to share. This is not of the Lord's teaching, and I want nothing to do with these individuals. I am certain they could refrain from this practice, but no, they do not, even going to the extreme of changing the Word.
Now you are being totally obstinate. You do not respect the family in Yeshua, Jesus, and `you do not respect your elders. You claim Paul is authorized as a teacher yet by your actions you label him a liar. Here are your own words about a brother in Yeshua, Jesus.
Originally Posted by Red33
These are just questions for your consideration concerning fruit. If they do not have any redemptive value for you, then ignore them, but if they do, then see if there is any merit in applying them. You mentioned roasting and now I have this urge for some roasted turkey, but I'll have to wait for T-day.
"JaumeJ put himself in the oven, I just cranked up the fire a few degrees to stir him up and see if he would turn over little.
It was the will of God that those He had chosen as elect and precious be the ones to bring the salvation of God to all nations. But, because of their unbelief and disobedience, God had to override them and put them aside and raise up a people and graft them into the vine (Christ) to bring salvation to all nations. Their unbelief led to the salvation of the Gentiles because it was the will of God that all men might be saved. You are a little confused but your close."
Not only am I NOT confused, I provided scripture with the exact subject I was sharing. I do not understand how you can consistently have something in front of you that is black and you call it white. It must be a gift to you from your master.
The above is not an exchange of sharing the Word, exhortation, or edification, it is libel. I recommend you come back to the forum when you have become family in Yeshua, Jesus.
Originally Posted by Red33
These are just questions for your consideration concerning fruit. If they do not have any redemptive value for you, then ignore them, but if they do, then see if there is any merit in applying them. You mentioned roasting and now I have this urge for some roasted turkey, but I'll have to wait for T-day.
"JaumeJ put himself in the oven, I just cranked up the fire a few degrees to stir him up and see if he would turn over little.
It was the will of God that those He had chosen as elect and precious be the ones to bring the salvation of God to all nations. But, because of their unbelief and disobedience, God had to override them and put them aside and raise up a people and graft them into the vine (Christ) to bring salvation to all nations. Their unbelief led to the salvation of the Gentiles because it was the will of God that all men might be saved. You are a little confused but your close."
Not only am I NOT confused, I provided scripture with the exact subject I was sharing. I do not understand how you can consistently have something in front of you that is black and you call it white. It must be a gift to you from your master.
The above is not an exchange of sharing the Word, exhortation, or edification, it is libel. I recommend you come back to the forum when you have become family in Yeshua, Jesus.
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(ASV) For as ye in time past were disobedient to God, but now have obtained mercy by their disobedience
so simple for the judaizers and zionists to merely leave off the next verse which states plainly when the disobedient jews were able to obtain mercy. even though its right there in black and white.
(ASV) Romans 11 30 For as ye in time past were disobedient to God, but now have obtained mercy by their disobedience,
31 even so have these also now been disobedient, that by the mercy shown to you they also may now obtain mercy.
so simple for the judaizers and zionists to merely leave off the next verse which states plainly when the disobedient jews were able to obtain mercy. even though its right there in black and white.
(ASV) Romans 11 30 For as ye in time past were disobedient to God, but now have obtained mercy by their disobedience,
31 even so have these also now been disobedient, that by the mercy shown to you they also may now obtain mercy.
It is written it is Yahweh's will that no soul be lost. The subject of the post was not who is not saved, the subject of my post was that salvation was gained by the nations because the Jews were disobedient, had they been perfect, only Jews would be saved. Now, how can this be Judaizing or whatever your anti-Jew term is? I am trying to share the Word of Yahweh, God, and it seems it is not being heard, not by you anyway. Why do you hate so much? Yahweh, God, teaches us to love all people, excluding none from the Gospel of Yeshua, Jesus. Why do you teach that all Jews are lost? I cannot comprehend such an hatred. PS, my comparative cut and paste will only take one line at a time, so I selected the one pertinent to the subject..........
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