Working out our Salvation

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Elin

Banned
Jan 19, 2013
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#41
Okay, so it is IMPOSSIBLE for one who has been truly born-again
to decide that he/she prefers his/her old lifestyle of sin,
and acts on this free-will choice!
You do not factor in that he is born of the imperishable seed of God, and does not prefer
his old lifestyle of sin.

If he fails to walk in the light, God will discipline his son until he comes back into the light.
God does not discipline those who are not his own children.

Okay, this "falling away" of yours ...
can one subsequently decide to return to an obedient lifestyle,
and act on this free-will choice!
A reformed life (by one's own decision) and a transformed life (through the rebirth)
are two different things.

An unbeliever can choose to reform his life, but that is not salvation.
Only the born again have transformed lives by the Holy Spirit, which is salvation.

Only the unregenerate "fall away" in the NT sense of the word (fall away from their profession of faith).
The unregenerate, having chosen The Way once and not liked it, will not choose it again.
 
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K

keepitsimple

Guest
#42
You do not factor in that he is born of the imperishable seed of God, and does not prefer
his old lifestyle of sin.

If he fails to walk in the light, God will discipline his son until he comes back into the light.
God does not discipline those who are not his own children.

A reformed life (by one's own decision) and a transformed life (through the rebirth)
are two different things.

An unbeliever can choose to reform his life, but that is not salvation.
Only the born again have transformed lives by the Holy Spirit, which is salvation.

Only the unregenerate "fall away" in the NT sense of the word (fall away from their profession of faith).
The unregenerate, having chosen The Way once and not liked it, will not choose it again.

What a blessing you are and continue to be to this place. Steady as a rock ... and unwavering in the gospel of Jesus Christ. Keep on keeping on dear sis' :)
 
Feb 7, 2013
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#43
Amen. See context is very important... simple words can form heresies.
The HOLY SPIRIT inspired the Holy Bible, and HE is indeed the given 'Comforter', 'Helper' and 'Teacher' in all Born Again believers, 'to lead us into the full Truth', of the Holy Bible in sound doctrine Spiritual Kingdom knowledge, understanding them in full context, knitting them altogether to tell a Truth story in ministering, like Sir Stephen in the book of Acts, could minister to the opposing Jews, in a moment in reminder and a stir up of memory, from Abraham to JESUS, for them to remember and patiently understand the written Torah in context.

The HOLY SPIRIT also, 'reminds us all that JESUS have spoken', in the four Gospel and in the Epistles of the Apostles, as they were HIS chosen instruments to continue to finish the New Covenant for the Church/Body of CHRIST, to grow up spiritually, in obedience to them all, conformed in faith and in practice and perform them according to HIS Will of New Covenant 'Agape' faith, all together 'united' and are 'one', as GOD's Kingdom Government and family in and by CHRIST and the HOLY SPIRIT, and as laboring temporary foreigner servants here on earth in order to complete the Gospel to all nation and all ears and return home, in laying down ones life during tribulations and persecutions, from generation after generation, for the continuing ignorant and lost of this world.

HE also, 'tells us what is going to happen', through the Holy Bible written Prophecies.

Through the Truth founded Church, HE the HOLY SPIRIT will convict the world of sin, that regarding 'sin they are all wrong about their sin against the true GOD, because they do not believe in the MESSIAH', whom GOD sent, to take away the sins of this world and liberate them and start living right and sin no more growing into the spirit-man like JESUS of Nazareth.

And regarding 'the righteousness of GOD, as their sin, that JESUS died and rose again', and is in Heaven beside GOD the FATHER, as the 'Great High Priest', 'Prince of Peace', 'Good Shepherd', 'Wonderful', 'Councilor', 'Mighty God'.

And also regarding the judgement of GOD, as their sin, 'that the ruler of this world has already been judged', and they are sin and death, for 'sin has lost it's power and death has lost it's sting' to rule mankind.

For GOD, JESUS and the HOLY SPIRIT have liberated them and if only they believe in the Gospel and be saved and furthermore meantime grow by forsaking carnal slumber rest and 'workout their own salvation in fear and trembling' spiritually, by using the New Covenant as their guide and 'lamp to their feet'. in order to find their way home 'which is narrow and very difficult to follow and only a few make it; and enter GOD's place of rest.

Be blessed in the name of LORD JESUS CHRIST, in this HOLY SPIRIT gift of Prophesying, who have come to serve all and in order to be safe, from the Wrath and Judgement of GOD to come, 'to those who have not welcome the Gospel' in context, including Christians.

Christians, 'Be Alert' and 'Stay Awake' rooted to the 'New Covenant' and also as reference the 'Old', and not so drawn to, 'signs and wonders', for JESUS said, only 'an adulteress and perverse generation seek them'. And they are in HIS 'Church/Body', so learn how 'to distinguish between the spirit of error and the spirit of truth' within the Body.

As it is written and proclaimed by our MESSIAH that;

"Your worst enemy will be in your own household."
 

Elin

Banned
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
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#44

What a blessing you are and continue to be to this place. Steady as a rock ... and unwavering in the gospel of Jesus Christ. Keep on keeping on dear sis' :)
What a kind and encouraging thing to say.

Thank you so much.

Love,
Elin
 
Mar 12, 2014
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#45
One can hear the word for years and not receive/believe it.
Yes, and one cannot believe it if he never hears it, Rom 10:14,15. Faith comes by hearing the word of God Rom 10:17, and not by a random choice of God.

Elin said:
Only when one is born again by the will of God, not by human decision (to believe--Jn 1:13), does one
then receive/believe it.

Regeneration (Jn 1:13) and faith (a gift--Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27; Ro 12:3) are a direct and
single operation of the Holy Spirit, neither are of man's decision (Jn 1:13; Php 1:29; Ac 18:37).
God does not determine for men which men will be born again and which ones will not.

Not biblically possible for one to be saved/born again then believe.
 

Elin

Banned
Jan 19, 2013
11,909
141
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#46
Elin said:
One can hear the word for years and not receive/believe it.
Only when one is born again by the will of God, not by human decision (to believe--Jn 1:13), does one then receive/believe the word of God.

Regeneration
(Jn 1:13) and faith (a gift--Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27; Ro 12:3) are
a direct and
single operation of the Holy Spirit, neither are of man's decision
(Jn 1:13; Php 1:29; Ac 18:37).
Faith comes by hearing the word of God Rom 10:17,
Which in no way precludes faith as a direct gift from God.

and not by a random choice of God.

God does not determine for men which men will be born again and which ones will not.


Not biblically possible for one to be saved/born again then believe.
In all of your above, you are not in agreement with the Scriptures given above which state otherwise.
 
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Mar 12, 2014
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#47
Which in no way precludes faith as a direct gift from God.


In all of your above, you are not in agreement with the Scriptures given above which state otherwise.
One believes in his heart Rpm 10:9, faith comes by hearing the word of God, Rom 10:17 and is not given or withheld from men by some random choice of God apart from the word.

It's you creating the impossibility that one can be saved/born again BEFORE he even believes, Jn 3:18
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#48
One believes in his heart Rpm 10:9, faith comes by hearing the word of God, Rom 10:17 and is not given or withheld from men by some random choice of God apart from the word.

It's you creating the impossibility
that one can be saved/born again BEFORE he even believes, Jn 3:18
Jn 3:18; Ro 10:9, 17 preclude neither.

Scripture neither states nor shows any such impossibilty, but states the opposite:

regeneration
(Jn 1:13) and

faith (a gift
--Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27; Ro 12:3)

are a direct and single operation of the Holy Spirit, neither are of man's decision
(Jn 1:13; Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:37).

You are not in agreement with the Scriptures above.
 
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Mar 12, 2014
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#49
Jn 3:18; Ro 10:9, 17 preclude neither.

Scripture neither states nor shows any such impossibilty, but states the opposite:

regeneration
(Jn 1:13) and

faith (a gift
--Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27; Ro 12:3)

are a direct and single operation of the Holy Spirit, neither are of man's decision
(Jn 1:13; Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:37).

You are not in agreement with the Scriptures above.
Jn 3:18 "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

He that believeth not is condemned already. You have one born again first THEN believes when the unbeliever is condemned already and not born again.

Rom 10:9,17 shows that belief comes by hearing the word of God, belief is then formed in the heart, it's not something God randomly gives to some ans withhold from others.
 

my_adonai_

Senior Member
Mar 19, 2012
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#50
Jud 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

Heb 2:3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

Scripture directly points out to us that we should be diligent Christians in all things partaining to His word. No slackness, no lazyness...
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#51
Elin said:
Jn 3:18; Ro 10:9, 17 preclude neither.

Scripture neither states nor shows any such impossibilty, but states the opposite:

regeneration
(Jn 1:13) and

faith (a gift
--Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27; Ro 12:3)

are a direct and single operation of the Holy Spirit, neither are of man's decision
(Jn 1:13; Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:37).

You are not in agreement with the Scriptures above.
Jn 3:18 "He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."

He that believeth not is condemned already. You have one born again first THEN believes when the unbeliever is condemned already and not born again.

Rom 10:9,17 shows that belief comes by hearing the word of God, belief is then formed in the heart, it's not something God randomly gives to some ans withhold from others.
Jn 3:18; Ro 10:9, 17 are not necessarily preclusive of the Scriptures above, as you view them to be.
 
A

AbbeyJoy

Guest
#52
Not by works by faith and Following Jesus :)
 
Feb 7, 2013
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#53
Jud 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.

Heb 2:3 How shall we escape, if we neglect so great salvation; which at the first began to be spoken by the Lord, and was confirmed unto us by them that heard him;

Scripture directly points out to us that we should be diligent Christians in all things partaining to His word. No slackness, no lazyness...
Thank you dearly beloved my_adonai_, for Grace and Truth of our LORD JESUS CHRIST, that you too stand for, and practice that you have freely received and freely shared with us. That we cannot lack and slumber and CHRIST does all the work for us to change.

This are the instructions of Apostle Paul to young Timothy, upon witnessing and knowing the false ignorance in GOD's Word believers, who boldly oppose true authority chosen by CHRIST and also their sound doctrine spiritual knowledge of the HOLY SPIRIT for CHRSIT. This is the same happening in today's churches, and sadly they are born again churches and majority of them carry the vast free available Holy Bible and time and peace to learn from the teacher, the HOLY SPIRIT and believer teachers.

Time has traveled since the beginning of CHRIST to now 2015 and the growth of HIS church in faith with practices to HIS 'Every Word that proceeded out of HIS mouth', suppose to be excellent in manifesting and witnessing to the ignorant and lost world and laying down ones lives freely in order to save another, even to the ones who are hated the most. who are your unbelieving ignorant wicked neighbors.

Apostle Paul said to Timothy to be prepared to meet the established churches and their behaviors and to be aware not to please them but only GOD and HIS Word. Even though such remain in their carnality and weakness, also with all due respect to them, witness among, 'to watch out for itching ears', 'do not let them bully you' (since Timothy may be young) and how to select church leaders and deacons and their status of reputation among the believing and un believing community.

So we are not surprised her children also in this forum and in the churches and every where, blend in and conformed with unbelievers/world and also in pity and in support to all their unrighteousness, and also with their brethren, as debaters and opposing to the sound doctrine and self proclaim braggers, and many more, with all merciful due respect to them also to 'repent!' according to the established New Covenant 'contract' that GOD made with all born again believers, in order to 'abide' and remain safe for eternity.

Thank you once again and all, and be blessed in the name of LORD JESUS CHRIST.

CHRIST is not entirely for all of us who are so called, 'born again' and 'have a calling'. This is because according to the New Covenant sound doctrine Spiritual knowledge, HE will always remain faithful to the HOLY FATHER who always art in Heaven (who as CHRIST, have made HIM as our Spiritual biological FATHER, even through that knowledge), in steadfastness obedience to HIS 'every Word that proceeded out of HIS mouth' (that which CHRIST imparted as 'Grace and Truth of GOD' in us and also gifts of the HOLY SPIRIT, to be servants in service to others in 'Agape' practice unconditionally), and only does according the HIS Will.
 
Mar 12, 2014
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#54
Jn 3:18; Ro 10:9, 17 are not necessarily preclusive of the Scriptures above, as you view them to be.

Jn 3:18 along with Mk 16:16 and all the verses that put belief BEFORE salvation precludes anyone being saved BEFORE they believe.

Acts 16:31 "And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt (future tense) be saved, and thy house."

It's not "believe on the Lord Jesus for you have been saved"

Verses do not contradict verses.
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#55
Jn 3:18 along with Mk 16:16 and all the verses that put belief BEFORE salvation precludes anyone being saved BEFORE they believe.

Acts 16:31 "And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt (future tense) be saved, and thy house."

It's not "believe on the Lord Jesus for you have been saved"

Verses do not contradict verses.
Jn 3:18; Ro 10:9, 17 do not necessarily preclude Jn 1:13, Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27; Ro 12:3
as you view them to do.
 
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Mar 12, 2014
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#56
Jn 3:18; Ro 10:9, 17 do not necessarily preclude Jn 1:13, Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27; Ro 12:3
as you view them to do.
Jn 3:18 along with Mk 16:16 and all the verses that put belief BEFORE salvation precludes anyone being saved BEFORE they believe.

Acts 16:31 "And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt (future tense) be saved, and thy house."

It's not "believe on the Lord Jesus for you have been saved"

Verses do not contradict verses.


None of the verses you post have one saved before he believes nor do any of them contradict all the verses that put belief BEFORE salvation.

Rom 10:10 "For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness..."
 
Aug 15, 2009
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#57
One must remember that EVERY EPISTLE was written to the church to teach, edify & warn the church. So what the apostles say about falling away from the faith is ONLY to & about the church. :)
 
Jan 19, 2013
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#58
Elin said:
Jn 3:18; Mk 16:16; Ac 16:31; Ro 10:9, 17 do not necessarily preclude
Jn 1:13, Php 1:29; 2Pe 1:1; Ac 18:27; Ro 12:3 as you think they do.
Jn 3:18 along with Mk 16:16 and all the verses that put belief BEFORE salvation precludes anyone being saved BEFORE they believe.

Acts 16:31 "And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt (future tense) be saved, and thy house."

It's not "believe on the Lord Jesus for you have been saved"

Verses do not contradict verses.


None of the verses you post have one saved before he believes nor do any of them contradict all the verses that put belief BEFORE salvation.

Rom 10:10 "For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness..."
Addressed above.