GOD'S DISCIPLINE ISN'T PUNISHEMENT FOR PAST SINS...
- Thread starter joaniemarie
- Start date
-
Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.
If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!
To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
I came to a sort of fork in the road and dilemma about posting on cc this morning. If we address the false posts and accusations against us as Christians and private individuals we give more fuel to the fire.... But if we don't try to set the record straight., false accusations go un challenged. (?????????????) What to do??
It's funny you should be some what of a conservative Nehemiah. But as brother Flsnook said the irony is lost on you here. I am not a liberal thinker in politics or in the Bible. Truth is truth. But that is not ever going to be proven to you or the other 3 Christians here who already have their minds made up about me and the other believers who don't agree with your views of certain Bible interpretations.
I can't keep wasting my time trying to talk to you about who I am when you already have your mind made up. And I have to add., many don't want to be confused with the facts., emotion is much more profitable.
We hold to the foundational solid truths of the Christian faith as outlined many times here on this thread under "WE BELIEVE". Yet many here STILL want to label and harass those who don't see all the other secondary issues the same as them. It's uncanny!!
I like the way JGIG put it in one of her posts. Calling someone a hyper grace or word of faith gives gossip wings. Labeling others is such a poor way to discuss anything. Diminishing others is all a label does. Stops all critical thinking.
First I want to set the record straight to the accusation I am in some way in kahoots with the owners and mods of CC and am allowed to post whatever I want. This is what gossip and misinformation does. Like politics it takes a veiled accusation and gives it wings. Something we believers should NEVER do.
I have not spoken to the owner of this site in a few years and I donate a very bare minimum to cc I'm 'guessing' just as much or less as most here who are members. But I have no idea what others give and it's none of my business. I do however believe if we are members here we should be able to post our Christian faith freely without harassment.
There is a line I think we have to draw each day about what we give attention to and this accusation I believe could not stand. As far as the other posts and false info I read this morning., I'm not going to dignify them with an answer.
It's funny you should be some what of a conservative Nehemiah. But as brother Flsnook said the irony is lost on you here. I am not a liberal thinker in politics or in the Bible. Truth is truth. But that is not ever going to be proven to you or the other 3 Christians here who already have their minds made up about me and the other believers who don't agree with your views of certain Bible interpretations.
I can't keep wasting my time trying to talk to you about who I am when you already have your mind made up. And I have to add., many don't want to be confused with the facts., emotion is much more profitable.
We hold to the foundational solid truths of the Christian faith as outlined many times here on this thread under "WE BELIEVE". Yet many here STILL want to label and harass those who don't see all the other secondary issues the same as them. It's uncanny!!
I like the way JGIG put it in one of her posts. Calling someone a hyper grace or word of faith gives gossip wings. Labeling others is such a poor way to discuss anything. Diminishing others is all a label does. Stops all critical thinking.
First I want to set the record straight to the accusation I am in some way in kahoots with the owners and mods of CC and am allowed to post whatever I want. This is what gossip and misinformation does. Like politics it takes a veiled accusation and gives it wings. Something we believers should NEVER do.
I have not spoken to the owner of this site in a few years and I donate a very bare minimum to cc I'm 'guessing' just as much or less as most here who are members. But I have no idea what others give and it's none of my business. I do however believe if we are members here we should be able to post our Christian faith freely without harassment.
There is a line I think we have to draw each day about what we give attention to and this accusation I believe could not stand. As far as the other posts and false info I read this morning., I'm not going to dignify them with an answer.
Last edited:
I absolutely agree.
There are many "little" things in Bible teaching that can be easily overlooked for the sake of peace, but when core meanings & values are being changed, such as faith, grace, repentance, etc., one cannot simply stand by & let it happen.
Threads are popping up all the time attempting to change these, & when the Ops are confronted, they cry "I'm being attacked".
Then they cry, "can't we all get along?"
I know we're close to the end, because these groups are multiplying.
There are many "little" things in Bible teaching that can be easily overlooked for the sake of peace, but when core meanings & values are being changed, such as faith, grace, repentance, etc., one cannot simply stand by & let it happen.
Threads are popping up all the time attempting to change these, & when the Ops are confronted, they cry "I'm being attacked".
Then they cry, "can't we all get along?"
I know we're close to the end, because these groups are multiplying.
If I were to read this post without knowing the author, I would mostly agree with it.
But knowing that the author has cried "wolf" so many times, and her reputation of copy/pasting every freegrace teacher out there, what can we say then?
Knowing the author consistently teaches false doctrine fully unproven, it becomes blah, blah, blah.
Know the consistency of a member before taking them seriously, and it will save you a lot of headache down the road.
But knowing that the author has cried "wolf" so many times, and her reputation of copy/pasting every freegrace teacher out there, what can we say then?
Knowing the author consistently teaches false doctrine fully unproven, it becomes blah, blah, blah.
Know the consistency of a member before taking them seriously, and it will save you a lot of headache down the road.
U
And what exactly is the heretical version of grace?
It is free, otherwise it would not be grace?
It is unmerited, otherwise it would not be grace?
Freegracers also know this....
Titus 2:11-14
[SUP]11 [/SUP]For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people. [SUP]12 [/SUP]It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, [SUP]13 [/SUP]while we wait for the blessed hope—the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ,
Along with we are now "under grace"
So where is the slander?
It is free, otherwise it would not be grace?
It is unmerited, otherwise it would not be grace?
Freegracers also know this....
Titus 2:11-14
[SUP]11 [/SUP]For the grace of God has appeared that offers salvation to all people. [SUP]12 [/SUP]It teaches us to say “No” to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age, [SUP]13 [/SUP]while we wait for the blessed hope—the appearing of the glory of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ,
Along with we are now "under grace"
So where is the slander?
U
The word slander means to "taint" in a negative light.
It is not always at the higher legal definition but it can be a more subtle nuanced defamation of a group or a single person.
To call freegrace teachers as a group, heretics, which has sometimes been done on here on occasion, I think is tainting certain teachers in negative light.
The word "heretic" in and of itself is a silly word to use anyway considering its historical root.
This is casting "the author" and those "freegrace teachers" in a negative light without even making a solid case for the accusations.
The group that adhere to a free grace theology are not the same as though that adhere to a hypergrace theology, although there may be some blurring of the camps in some places.
Casting a big net without adequate information and with the tone of the post I definitively see that aspect of slander present.
And the word slander is used by people who were not even here at that time.
It is not always at the higher legal definition but it can be a more subtle nuanced defamation of a group or a single person.
To call freegrace teachers as a group, heretics, which has sometimes been done on here on occasion, I think is tainting certain teachers in negative light.
The word "heretic" in and of itself is a silly word to use anyway considering its historical root.
This is casting "the author" and those "freegrace teachers" in a negative light without even making a solid case for the accusations.
The group that adhere to a free grace theology are not the same as though that adhere to a hypergrace theology, although there may be some blurring of the camps in some places.
Casting a big net without adequate information and with the tone of the post I definitively see that aspect of slander present.
And the word slander is used by people who were not even here at that time.
'The slander" is when you they say those living in unrepentant sin are still covered by grace when they're not. Freegracers say once we accept Jesus, it's over. One & done.
They refuse the scriptures(rebellion) which plainly points to christians falling from grace, & living in delusion because God made them believe the delusion to prepare them for Tribulation judgment.
Rom 6
1What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase?2May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?
They refuse the scriptures(rebellion) which plainly points to christians falling from grace, & living in delusion because God made them believe the delusion to prepare them for Tribulation judgment.
Rom 6
1What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase?2May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?
Last edited:
U
If you dislike a certain sect, tainting that group in a negative light is par for the course, it happens on here all the time, that really does not bother me to much, what I want to know is why, what is it that they perceive to be so harmful or wrong.
People also cast aspirations on others all time as well, I am not even sure people realize it.
Interestingly, I tend to see this coming from those who tend to follow the teachings of a particular reformer, as the one's who cast the most aspersions on another, this behaviour is so well known that there are counseling books on how to speak to these people so as not to raise their ire so to speak.
Having said that, those who hold to free grace theology really do not get along with those who claim "works" are part of salvation, and that is most evident on this discussion board.
This is a discussion board, that does have some parameters, but it is not church.
People also cast aspirations on others all time as well, I am not even sure people realize it.
Interestingly, I tend to see this coming from those who tend to follow the teachings of a particular reformer, as the one's who cast the most aspersions on another, this behaviour is so well known that there are counseling books on how to speak to these people so as not to raise their ire so to speak.
Having said that, those who hold to free grace theology really do not get along with those who claim "works" are part of salvation, and that is most evident on this discussion board.
This is a discussion board, that does have some parameters, but it is not church.
Last edited by a moderator:
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Hebrews 12:3-17, “For consider Him who endured such opposition from sinners against Himself, lest you become weary and faint in your lives."4, You have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin."5, And you have forgotten the appeal which speaks to you as to sons, “My son, do not despise the discipline of [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif], nor faint when you are reproved by Him,"6, for whom [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]יהוה [/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, serif]loves, He disciplines, and flogs every son whom He receives.” (Pro 3:11-12) "7, If you endure discipline, Yah is treating you as sons. For what son is there whom a father does not discipline?"8, But if you are without discipline, of which all have become sharers, then you are illegitimate and not sons."9, Moreover, we indeed had fathers of our flesh disciplining us, and we paid them respect. Shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live?"10, For they indeed disciplined us for a few days as seemed best to them, but He does it for our profit, so that we might share His apartness."11, And indeed, no discipline seems pleasant at the time, but grievous, but afterward it yields the peaceable fruit of righteousness to those who have been trained by it."12, So, strengthen the hands which hang down and the weak knees, Isa 35:3."13, and make straight paths for your feet, lest the lame be turned aside, but instead, to be healed."14, Pursue peace with all, and pursue apartness without which no one shall see the Master."15, See to it that no one falls short of the favor of Yah, that no root of bitterness springing up causes trouble, by which many become defiled,"16, lest there be anyone who whores, or profane one, like Ěsaw, who for a single meal sold his birthright. 17, For you know that afterward, when he wished to inherit the blessing, he was rejected, for he found no place for repentance, though he sought it with tears.”[/FONT]
Amen, UG.
And they demonstrate just how much they don't know what they're talking about by trying to conflate theologies.
Not, "Come, let us reason", but "Let's see how fast we can shoot this thread down."
And a thread that was meant to be a great encouragement to the Body was shot down in a flurry of ugly accusations and personal attacks. The beauty of the discipline of God and its purpose has been buried in a pile of rubbish.
Hopefully some readers will still find blessing in the posts that were on topic and from material that was presented.
-JGIG
After saying, "But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound", at the end of Romans 5, Paul anticipated that very question and that's why he stated in Romans 6 that,
[FONT="]What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life. (from Rom. 6)[/FONT]
What Paul wrote in Romans 6 in no way negates what Paul wrote in Romans 5.
Lewiz, please bring to the table the verse(s) on 'falling from grace' and let's discuss. Could be interesting!
-JGIG