1 Corinthians Chapter 1...Grammar Study

[cfultz3]

actually this confuses me more.

without the second form of sanctification (faith alone) what does this mean? We received the first part by faith alone. And yes, faith will bring us to the second part. But our faith will always be in flux. some days we will trust more. some days less. etc etc.

yes we are to become Christ's workers. Are you saying this spomething we must do to be presented to God as holy and without spot? If this is so, we would have to be perfect in doing this. this is why I questioned what you said.

Sorry, I am not being clear. One more time please, allow me to extend:

Originally Posted by cfultz3

in addition:

Seeing that one must be in the process of being transformed from within after having been justified outwardly (knowing that God will complete what He has started), I do not think it would be possible to be presented to God without the second form of sanctification (that is, having faith alone (the first sanctification alone)). Seeing that it also says that we are to become Christ's workers. And I think that is accomplished through being led by His Spirit to do God's will and purpose in our lives.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Sorry, I am not being clear. One more time please, allow me to extend:

Originally Posted by cfultz3

in addition:

Seeing that one must be in the process of being transformed from within after having been justified outwardly (knowing that God will complete what He has started), I do not think it would be possible to be presented to God without the second form of sanctification (that is, having faith alone (the first sanctification alone)). Seeing that it also says that we are to become Christ's workers. And I think that is accomplished through being led by His Spirit to do God's will and purpose in our lives.

so your saying. once we are saved (sanctified the first part) God will complete what he started in spite of us, and we can be secure in Christ because we know he will never take away his gift based on the first part.

because of this, we can become christian workers by being led by the spirit. and work towards matching our second part with the first part.

if this is what your saying, I agree. If not, I am still confused..lol

 

[cfultz3]

so your saying. once we are saved (sanctified the first part) God will complete what he started in spite of us, and we can be secure in Christ because we know he will never take away his gift based on the first part.

because of this, we can become christian workers by being led by the spirit. and work towards matching our second part with the first part.

if this is what your saying, I agree. If not, I am still confused..lol

If what you are saying is said of one who, out of freewill, remains sanctified (under the covering of Christ's blood), then yes that is what I am saying.

But, if what you are saying, and I know you are NOT, one cannot loose his salvation (his covering) by deliberately walking away from God, then no. And this, I believe, remains in harmony to Scripture. In that, God did not take away one's salvation, but by not keeping one's light single, they have forefeited the Light as their eye's light and returned to the darkness they once were deliveerd from.


Be back in about 2-3 hours.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

If what you are saying is said of one who, out of freewill, remains sanctified (under the covering of Christ's blood), then yes that is what I am saying.

now I am really confused. What of sanctification based on justification which is of faith in Christ? how can this be taken away if we did not do anything to earn it. but place our faith in Christ. If the first can very like the second. then the first is really non-existent.

But, if what you are saying, and I know you are NOT, one cannot loose his salvation (his covering) by deliberately walking away from God, then no.

Well this depends. How can one walk away from God? Did Not jesus say he will leave the flock to go get the one who walked away, and he would lose nothing which God gave him?

And this, I believe, remains in harmony to Scripture. In that, God did not take away one's salvation, but by not keeping one's light single, they have forefeited the Light as their eye's light and returned to the darkness they once were deliveerd from.

Again, this makes no sense. God gave it based on his promise, and nothing we did. But God will take it back (when you forfeit something, the one who gave it to you take it back) based on something we do? if this is the case. it was never given, or a gift in the first place was it? would it not instead be a down payment for something, that if you do not meet the requirement, you forfeit what was given you? This would bring about serious questions about if the gift of God was a gift at all would it not?

Be back in about 2-3 hours.

sounds good

 

[cfultz3]

Bookends and Eg,

I am sorry, but I do not wish to make this into a tread about sanctification. I would like to continue keeping it a study, even a commentary. Thank you for your understanding. May we all continue knowing that salvation is through faith which is a gracious act from God. This all we can agree on.

In God we trust our souls,

C. Fultz 3

 

[Bookends]

Bookends and Eg,

I am sorry, but I do not wish to make this into a tread about sanctification. I would like to continue keeping it a study, even a commentary. Thank you for your understanding. May we all continue knowing that salvation is through faith which is a gracious act from God. This all we can agree on.

In God we trust our souls,

C. Fultz 3

ops sorry, didn't read that until I hit the post button... respond at your will ...NP, I just deleted it... carry on!

 

[Bookends]

I guess the point I'm trying to make is this, when we all ready scripture, the light we receive from the Word can be slightly different from each other. Sometimes, we can see something totally different, but still not outside the bounds of orthodoxy. I think this is healthy, except when you get a total "nut-job" spuing out falsehoods like the Nephilim are the offspring of fallen angles who had sex with beautiful woman, Just Kidding everyone lol...Iron sharpens iron, you get my point.

 

[cfultz3]

I guess the point I'm trying to make is this, when we all ready scripture, the light we receive from the Word can be slightly different from each other. Sometimes, we can see something totally different, but still not outside the bounds of orthodoxy. I think this is healthy, except when you get a total "nut-job" spuing out falsehoods like the Nephilim are the offspring of fallen angles who had sex with beautiful woman, Just Kidding everyone lol...Iron sharpens iron, you get my point.

Brother,

Absolutely. As long as Christ and His doctrine is our foundation, we are assured of that salvation. And when we see 'nut-jobs', so to say, then we, those of Christ, need to stand in harmony so that deception will not find its mark. You are right on the mark (spiritual pun intended).

 

[cfultz3]

ops sorry, didn't read that until I hit the post button... respond at your will ...NP, I just deleted it... carry on!

I will Brother and thank you for that consideration.

 

[cfultz3]

I am trying a different color code as per request. Any suggestions are welcomed.

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Direct KJV from E-Sword:[/FONT]​

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:1 It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:2 And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:3 For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed, [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. [/FONT]




[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Textus Receptus expressed out [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:1 ολωςG3654 ADV - (commonly) ακουεταιG191 V-PPI-3S - (it is reported that there is) ενG1722 PREP - (among) υμινG4771 P-2DP - (you*) πορνειαG4202 N-NSF - (fornication (illicit sexual intercourse)) καιG2532 CONJ - (even) τοιαυτηG5108 D-NSF - (such) πορνειαG4202 N-NSF - (fornication) ητιςG3748 R-NSF - (which) ουδεG3761 CONJ-N - (not even (abst. abs. neg.)) ενG1722 PREP - (among) τοιςG3588 T-DPN εθνεσινG1484 N-DPN - (the Gentiles (non-Jewish. Christians are grafted Jews)) ονομαζεταιG3687 V-PPI-3S - (fornication is named) ωστεG5620 CONJ - (insomuch that) γυναικαG1135 N-ASF - (wife) τιναG5100 X-ASF - (some) τουG3588 T-GSM πατροςG3962 N-GSM - (of that one's father) εχεινG2192 V-PAN - (is to be had) [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:2 καιG2532 CONJ - (and) υμειςG4771 P-2NP - (you*) πεφυσιωμενοιG5448 V-RPP-NPM - (having had been made haughty = made haughty (puffed up, made proud)) εστεG1510 V-PAI-2P - (you* are) καιG2532 CONJ - (and) ουχιG3780 PRT-I - (by no means (intens. abs. neg.)) μαλλονG3123 ADV - (rather) επενθησατεG3996 V-AAI-2P - (you* have mourned) ιναG2443 CONJ - (so that) εξαρθηG1808 V-APS-3S - (he would have been removed) εκG1537 PREP - (from (origin)) μεσουG3319 A-GSN - (amongst (middle)) υμωνG4771 P-2GP - (you*) οG3588 T-NSM - (he) τοG3588 T-ASN εργονG2041 N-ASN - (the deed) τουτοG3778 D-ASN - (this) ποιησαςG4160 V-AAP-NSM - (having done) [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:3 εγωG1473 P-1NS - (I) μενG3303 PRT - (indeed) γαρG1063 CONJ - (seeing that (reason why they should have mourned instead)) ωςG5613 ADV - (as) απωνG548 V-PAP-NSM - (being absent) τωG3588 T-DSN σωματιG4983 N-DSN - (in the body) παρωνG3918 V-PAP-NSM - (being present) δεG1161 CONJ - (but) τωG3588 T-DSN πνευματιG4151 N-DSN - (in the spirit) ηδηG2235 ADV - (already) κεκρικαG2919 V-RAI-1S - (I had determined (judged)) ωςG5613 ADV - (as though) παρωνG3918 V-PAP-NSM - (being present) τονG3588 T-ASM - (the one + having accomplished) ουτωςG3779 ADV - (in this manner) τουτοG3778 D-ASN - (this) κατεργασαμενονG2716 V-ADP-ASM - (having performed (fully worked-out, brought about) (that is, fulfilled temptation in an act)) [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:4 ενG1722 PREP - (by (instrumentality)) τωG3588 T-DSN ονοματιG3686 N-DSN - (the authority (which that name possess)) τουG3588 T-GSM κυριουG2962 N-GSM - (from the Lord) ημωνG1473 P-1GP - (our) ιησουG2424 N-GSM - (Jesus) χριστουG5547 N-GSM - (Christ) συναχθεντωνG4863 V-APP-GPM - (belonging to having been gathered together = gathering) υμωνG4771 P-2GP - (your*) καιG2532 CONJ - (and) τουG3588 T-GSN - (the + spirit) εμουG1699 S-1SGSN - (my own) πνευματοςG4151 N-GSN - (spirit) συνG4862 PREP - (with (union)) τηG3588 T-DSF δυναμειG1411 N-DSF - (the power (innately so)) τουG3588 T-GSM κυριουG2962 N-GSM - (of the Lord) ημωνG1473 P-1GP - (our) ιησουG2424 N-GSM - (Jesus) χριστουG5547 N-GSM - (Christ) [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:5 παραδουναιG3860 V-2AAN - (to have surrendered) τονG3588 T-ASM - (an one) τοιουτονG5108 D-ASM - (such) τωG3588 T-DSM σαταναG4567 N-DSM - (the Satan (the accuser)) ειςG1519 PREP - (for (purpose)) ολεθρονG3639 N-ASM - (a destruction) τηςG3588 T-GSF σαρκοςG4561 N-GSF - (of the flesh) ιναG2443 CONJ - (so that) τοG3588 T-NSN πνευμαG4151 N-NSN - (the spirit) σωθηG4982 V-APS-3S - (spirit could have been saved) ενG1722 PREP - (during) τηG3588 T-DSF ημεραG2250 N-DSF - (the day) τουG3588 T-GSM κυριουG2962 N-GSM - (of the Lord) ιησουG2424 N-GSM - (Jesus) [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Personal rendition with grammatical notes:[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]1Co 5:1-5 It is commonly reported that there is fornication (illicit sexual intercourse) among you*, even such fornication which is not even (abst. abs. neg.) named among Gentiles (non-Jewish. Christians are grafted Jews): inasmuch that some wife of one's father is to be had. And you* are made haughty (puffed up, made proud) and by no means (intens. abs. neg.) rather mourned so that he, having done this deed, would have been removed from amongst (middle) you*. Seeing that (reason why they should have mourned instead) I, as being absent in the body but present in the spirit, indeed had already determined (judged) the one having performed (fully worked-out, brought about) (that is, fulfilled temptation in an act) in this manner as though being present by (instrumentality) the authority (which that name possess) belonging to your gathering and my own spirit from our Lord Jesus Christ, with (union) the power (innately so) of our Lord Jesus Christ, to have surrendered such an one into Satan (the accuser) for (purpose) a destruction of the flesh so that the spirit could have been saved during the day of the Lord Jesus.[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Talking points:[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Note that verse 4 is translated differently than KJV and that it is rendered as a continuation of verse 3.[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]some wife of one's father is to be had = without delving into the implications of this statement, what this tells me is that there is still a moral conduct which is to be a part of the new Covenant. And if there is, where does that moralness come from and how is it enacted in our daily life? As for me, seeing that Jesus fulfilled the sacrificial and priestly ordinances of the Law, the moral part of the Law remains. Seeing that Jesus said that the Law hangs upon love and that love fulfills the Law, then I understand it as saying that is the reason we are to love. For by us acting out love, we show God that His moral concepts are righteous and concur to Him that His way is the best way.[/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]you* are made haughty = should we accept through the deceitfulness of man's wisdom and knowledge, the justification one has made of his willingness to live in sin? Revelation 2:20-23 gives us an understanding as to what God will do to not only those who will justify their rebellion, but also those who are seduced by such and will not repent: [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Rev 2:22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. [/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]Rev 2:23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works. [/FONT]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]A very interesting note here is that one word 'repent' and that Rev 2:20-23 is spoken to those of a church. It is saying that we Christians can be led astray, inasmuch as allowing a Jezebel to teach false doctrine and lead some away and which end result will cause God to throw them in great tribulation, giving to each according to their works. The point I am trying to convey is: we are to remain a faithful bride to the One we have faith in, the Jews giving us an example of what happens when we are not faithful. Although, He is faithful and will not abandon us, we, as freewill beings, have that choose to remain or not remain faithful. [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]so that he would have been removed from amongst you* = by the means of having mourned over such a deed, they would have thrown him out. It could also be said that God Himself would had removed him. But by whatever means, as we will see later on in verse 5, it is not for the intent that one might be a part of the second death, but that, before he becomes a reprobate, his flesh would be detroyed and his spirit will still be saved. For those interested, as to the intent of excommunication being benefitual to a person living in sin, we see in 2Co 2:5-10, that this person repented, and was welcomed back into the church. But, also take into consideration if this person did not repent. I will leave that conclusion up to you and would like to see your opinion on such.[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]having done this deed = this saying that he was judged on what he did, reminds me of the Lord judging us according to our deeds. If we are to excommunicate members from the church, it would only seem proper that Christ will excommunicate members, as He would in Rev 2:20-23, from being a member of His Bride. I see this as two degrees of excommunication, the lesser is so that the offender would repent, the greater is those thrown out of the Kingdom of Christ because of unrepentance through the lesser excommunication.[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]judged = what are examples of when it is proper to judge another? What do we base that judgment on? Say one is a thief, even one who is often found with quite questionable company (not as one who proclaim his testimony of deliverance, but as one who is intermingled in their social life, as though being a part of that 'clique'), where do we go to know what is righteous judgment? I personally look at the beginning Outclass of God (the old Testament) to see what His will is concerning a certain matter.[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]by the name of our Lord, Jesus Christ = the same as saying, 'by the authority from our Lord, Jesus Christ'. It is the authority given to excommunication those living in deliberate sin from Christ's body. [/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]authority belonging to your gathering and my own spirit = Christ has given the Church and one's own spirit the authority to righteously judge. (Jon 7:24). When we are led by His Spirit of Truth, we know what is good and what is evil and we are to righteously discern actions but NEVER condemn, seeing that judgment belongs to the Lord.[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ = that is, in harmony with the power given to Christ to judge who is or is not to be a member of His body, Bride. Please read Matthew 18:15-20.[/FONT]


[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]delivered...so spirit could have been saved = what are your thoughts on this? Me, I see it as excommunicate him in hopes he will repent and if he does not, then, he is considered wicked and is judged by God as one who is on the outside (verse 13).[/FONT]

 

[pickles]

This is a very interesting and agreeable explanation of sanctification. I also see sanctification as our clothing to the wedding. And I thik I remember somewhere it speaks of the brightness of that clothing is different for each 'quest'. Do you know where it is spoken about? I know we all will be santified so that we can stand before God blameless and without spot, doesn't that brigtness have something to do with rewards? Please correct me if I am wrong.

God bless you also Pickles

Chris

I learned the part about provding the wedding clothing from another at this site, so hopefully that person will read this and bring more info to this.
I would like to learn about the brightness of the clothing as well.

Also, I find it interesting that when God clothed Adam and Eve when they were put out of the garden of eden, into the world, He dressed them in animal skins, flesh.
Then, when scripture speaks to our joining with Jesus in eternal life, we recieve robes that are white as snow.
I do love how scripture always keeps a continuity in message.

God bless
pickles

 

[cfultz3]

I learned the part about provding the wedding clothing from another at this site, so hopefully that person will read this and bring more info to this.
I would like to learn about the brightness of the clothing as well.

Also, I find it interesting that when God clothed Adam and Eve when they were put out of the garden of eden, into the world, He dressed them in animal skins, flesh.
Then, when scripture speaks to our joining with Jesus in eternal life, we recieve robes that are white as snow.
I do love how scripture always keeps a continuity in message.

God bless
pickles

Pickles,
I knew I was not imagining things and that we would shine differently than one another when we become glorified. Here are some Scriptures which gave me that understanding. As each star in the heavenly skies show forth their glory, we too, shall show forth our glory.

Dan 12:1 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.
Dan 12:2 And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
Dan 12:3 And they that be wise shall shine as the brightness of the firmament; and they that turn many to righteousness as the stars for ever and ever.

Pro 4:18 But the path of the just is as the shining light, that shineth more and more unto the perfect day.

Mat 13:43Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

1Co 15:40There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
1Co 15:41There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.
1Co 15:42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:

1Th 2:19 For what is our hope, or joy, or crown of rejoicing? Are not even ye in the presence of our Lord Jesus Christ at his coming?
1Th 2:20 For ye are our glory and joy.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

I learned the part about provding the wedding clothing from another at this site, so hopefully that person will read this and bring more info to this.
I would like to learn about the brightness of the clothing as well.

Also, I find it interesting that when God clothed Adam and Eve when they were put out of the garden of eden, into the world, He dressed them in animal skins, flesh.
Then, when scripture speaks to our joining with Jesus in eternal life, we recieve robes that are white as snow.
I do love how scripture always keeps a continuity in message.

God bless
pickles

I agree with this. I think people miss out on the message God sent when he clothed Adam and Eve. They were naked. (all their sin was exposed) they were lost (they were hiding from God because they knew he would judge them and they deserved it) And they forgot who God was (they thought they could hide from God, and lie to him and he would not know where they were and that what they said was a lie, the things of God were foolish to them)

yet what Did God do?

He killed an innocent, who knew no sin (the first death the world had ever seen) And HE CLOTHED THEM. even while they were still in rebellion and trying to blame each other.

When he clothed them, He hid their nakedness (their sin was no longer exposed) He became a father to them (he adopted them as his children) and he helped them the rest of their lives. and showed them how to grow again in him, and learn to trust him. which is what sanctification is.

The main point is this.

He clothed them before they got right with him. He did not demand they get right first. nor did he ever stop being their father.

Whats amazing, is the flesh he covered with them was temporary, a symbol, like the animal sacrifices he had man do from that day forward. Until his death took away sin forever, and with his death, he covers our nakedness with his body, his righteousness. Which holds us until we are clothed in the white robes, where we will be free of sin forever.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]delivered...so spirit could have been saved = what are your thoughts on this? Me, I see it as excommunicate him in hopes he will repent and if he does not, then, he is considered wicked and is judged by God as one who is on the outside (verse 13).[/FONT]

I see a different view.

I see one he was called a brother, and part of the church, even when he was sinning.
I see Paul not only judged him, but those who were allowing him to sin (they were just as guilty as he was)
I see a man who while in the body, Tasted the love and blessings of God. tasted the fellowship which comes from being with Gods people (something which one can not find in the world) tasted the good food which one can only find in the body (spiritual food) yet was deep in sin (a sin even the world considered evil) and had no reason to stop because even the church was proud of what he did (a little licentious, and misunderstanding of grace) who was past the point of normal chastisement by Gods people because for so long they let him get away with it. and even were proud of it. Thus they would be deemed hypocrites if they all of a sudden told him to stop. So instead of doing like God wants, and chasten him the way God told us to (witness, two witnesses, the whole church, excommunication) they had to use the last and final form of punishment God used.

God said to send him to the world so his body may be destroyed. Why? I look at it like this. Imagine you are living with a family who loves you unconditionally. You eat the finest food, and enjoy the finest life has to offer. Who all of a sudden is cast out into the world. where no one loves you at all, noe one even cares about you, and the ones who say they do only will love you as long as it is beneficial to them. and once your usefulness where's out, they will turn on you in a heartbeat (lack of love) where the food you eat is like dog food compared to the food you ate while you were in the body. You try and you try and you try to find food which even resembles the food you ate in your families house, but you can't find it. And nothing in life, no matter what it does. fills the emptiness in your life which was caused by being an outcast into the world. That just like the prodigal son who because he lost everything he had, Realizes what it is he is missing, and understands what he thinks made him happy (fornication and adultry) has left him lost, and without hope. That it is not as fun as he thought it was, and the one he expected to take care of his needs could not do the very thing he wanted. This brings him back to his family (see 1 cor 2) because he realizes what he is missing, and realizes his sin.

We also notice in 2 Corinthians, That after he did realize this, and tried to return. the church went the opposite end and would not let him back. Yet we realize a great thing. Paul still considered him a brother. Although the brother was no longer lost, he had found his way back, and was trying to get back home.

 

[cfultz3]

I see a different view.

I see one he was called a brother, and part of the church, even when he was sinning.
I see Paul not only judged him, but those who were allowing him to sin (they were just as guilty as he was)
I see a man who while in the body, Tasted the love and blessings of God. tasted the fellowship which comes from being with Gods people (something which one can not find in the world) tasted the good food which one can only find in the body (spiritual food) yet was deep in sin (a sin even the world considered evil) and had no reason to stop because even the church was proud of what he did (a little licentious, and misunderstanding of grace) who was past the point of normal chastisement by Gods people because for so long they let him get away with it. and even were proud of it. Thus they would be deemed hypocrites if they all of a sudden told him to stop. So instead of doing like God wants, and chasten him the way God told us to (witness, two witnesses, the whole church, excommunication) they had to use the last and final form of punishment God used.

God said to send him to the world so his body may be destroyed. Why? I look at it like this. Imagine you are living with a family who loves you unconditionally. You eat the finest food, and enjoy the finest life has to offer. Who all of a sudden is cast out into the world. where no one loves you at all, noe one even cares about you, and the ones who say they do only will love you as long as it is beneficial to them. and once your usefulness where's out, they will turn on you in a heartbeat (lack of love) where the food you eat is like dog food compared to the food you ate while you were in the body. You try and you try and you try to find food which even resembles the food you ate in your families house, but you can't find it. And nothing in life, no matter what it does. fills the emptiness in your life which was caused by being an outcast into the world. That just like the prodigal son who because he lost everything he had, Realizes what it is he is missing, and understands what he thinks made him happy (fornication and adultry) has left him lost, and without hope. That it is not as fun as he thought it was, and the one he expected to take care of his needs could not do the very thing he wanted. This brings him back to his family (see 1 cor 2) because he realizes what he is missing, and realizes his sin.

We also notice in 2 Corinthians, That after he did realize this, and tried to return. the church went the opposite end and would not let him back. Yet we realize a great thing. Paul still considered him a brother. Although the brother was no longer lost, he had found his way back, and was trying to get back home.

Hey Eg,

Correct me if I am wrong, but was he not forgiven by the church and Paul accepted that and by which, he was welcomed back? Did I miss a something?

I only post my notes here so people can see from where I am coming from.

so that he would have been removed from amongst you* = by the means of having mourned over such a deed, they would have thrown him out. It could also be said that God Himself would had removed him. But by whatever means, as we will see later on in verse 5, it is not for the intent that one might be a part of the second death, but that, before he becomes a reprobate, his flesh would be detroyed and his spirit will still be saved. For those interested, as to the intent of excommunication being benefitual to a person living in sin, we see in 2Co 2:5-10, that this person repented, and was welcomed back into the church. But, also take into consideration if this person did not repent. I will leave that conclusion up to you and would like to see your opinion on such.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Hey Eg,

Correct me if I am wrong, but was he not forgiven by the church and Paul accepted that and by which, he was welcomed back? Did I miss a something?

Many people believe the one to whom paul spoke of in 2 cor 2 is this one and very man. He said his punishment was made by the majority, and was "sufficient enough" to bring about sorrow or remorse (which it always does I might add) and that these people should let him back in, and not keep him out. for doing so, and keeping him separated from the body would cause even greater sorrow, probably more than one can bear (which has caused suicide in many people I might add)

the point is, the persons punishment was being outcast from the body. Not losing his salvation. If it was losing salvation, I think Paul would have said this. All sin has consequences, not just this one. Some, however, as in the law' are more damaging to society and the body, and as such, cause more harsher temporal punishment than others, such as the case here. The point is. All sin would separate us from god, there are no bad sins or good sins. So if doing this deed would cause us to lose salvation. then doing ANY SIN would cause the same thing.

I only post my notes here so people can see from where I am coming from.

so that he would have been removed from amongst you* = by the means of having mourned over such a deed, they would have thrown him out. It could also be said that God Himself would had removed him. But by whatever means, as we will see later on in verse 5, it is not for the intent that one might be a part of the second death, but that, before he becomes a reprobate, his flesh would be detroyed and his spirit will still be saved. For those interested, as to the intent of excommunication being benefitual to a person living in sin, we see in 2Co 2:5-10, that this person repented, and was welcomed back into the church. But, also take into consideration if this person did not repent. I will leave that conclusion up to you and would like to see your opinion on such.

As I showed before. being removed from everything the person had in the body, And sent out to be on his own would expose fully what the person has done. A person who truly was saved, would repent, because the sorrow would be too great. Only a person who never was saved, and never tasted ALL the the body of Christ and the adoption as sons of God would not repent, because they would not realize what it is they were missing.

I hope this makes sense.

 

[cfultz3]

Many people believe the one to whom paul spoke of in 2 cor 2 is this one and very man. He said his punishment was made by the majority, and was "sufficient enough" to bring about sorrow or remorse (which it always does I might add) and that these people should let him back in, and not keep him out. for doing so, and keeping him separated from the body would cause even greater sorrow, probably more than one can bear (which has caused suicide in many people I might add)

the point is, the persons punishment was being outcast from the body. Not losing his salvation. If it was losing salvation, I think Paul would have said this. All sin has consequences, not just this one. Some, however, as in the law' are more damaging to society and the body, and as such, cause more harsher temporal punishment than others, such as the case here. The point is. All sin would separate us from god, there are no bad sins or good sins. So if doing this deed would cause us to lose salvation. then doing ANY SIN would cause the same thing.

As I showed before. being removed from everything the person had in the body, And sent out to be on his own would expose fully what the person has done. A person who truly was saved, would repent, because the sorrow would be too great. Only a person who never was saved, and never tasted ALL the the body of Christ and the adoption as sons of God would not repent, because they would not realize what it is they were missing.

I hope this makes sense.

Thank you for your reply.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Thank you for your reply.

No problem. And thank you for being civil, and not like some people who would take what I said as an insult, and give me a 1000 word response as to how I am so wrong and how I have no clue what your saying. this is how we should all be, even if we disagree. This is how we can learn from each other. at least why they believe the way they do

 

[cfultz3]

No problem. And thank you for being civil, and not like some people who would take what I said as an insult, and give me a 1000 word response as to how I am so wrong and how I have no clue what your saying. this is how we should all be, even if we disagree. This is how we can learn from each other. at least why they believe the way they do

If we all could learn from each other that without ciivility (peace) no one will see the Lord. (word count 1001)

 

[cfultz3]

If we all could learn from each other that without ciivility (peace) no one will see the Lord. (word count 1001)

well missed out on that joke. It would had been funny if I were to had said (word cound 999 and 9/10)