50 Reasons For a Pretribulational Rapture By Dr. John F. Walvoord

[presidente]

That idea is not what is being conveyed in 2Th1. I showed this in the Post I'd linked, which addresses this.

Instead, the text states "ye who are troubled rest/repose with us IN THE REVELATION OF the Lord Jesus from heaven with His mighty angels INFLICTING VENGEANCE ON...

... and *that* ^ is DURING A SPANS-OF-TIME, rather than at a singular point-in-time.

That "spans-of-time" (INFLICTING VENGEANCE ON...) *includes* 2Th2:10-12's "GOD SHALL SEND TO THEM great delusion, THAT they should believe the LIE / the FALSE / the PSEUDEI"... DURING that "spans-of-time," not merely AT "a singular point-in-time".


[and 2Th2:10-12's "GOD SHALL SEND TO THEM great delusion, THAT they should believe the LIE / the FALSE/ the PSEUDEI" takes place FOLLOWING "our Rapture" / "THE Departure [*FIRST*]"]

Consider the parousia verses. is there any reason to think the Greek word would refer to a long journey as opposed to just the arrival? If you have Greek sources to show it, go ahead.

And is there any biblical evidence for a pre-trib rapture in the first place to justify interpreting the allegorical parts through pre-trib lenses. If there is no evidence for it, why not go with a more straight-forward interpretation.

 

[presidente]

Again, biblically speaking, the word "RETURN" is ONLY used of His Second Coming to the earth at the Rev19 point in time:

--Luke 12:36 (and context through verse 48; parallel to Matt24:36-51): "when he will RETURN FROM the wedding"... THEN the meal [G347--see its various occurrences, the ones relating to this point in time: His Second Coming to the earth, FOR the promised and prophesied earthly Millennial Kingdom age)

--Luke 19:12,15,17,19 (parallel to Matt25:14-30; same time-slot as the above) - "RETURN"... when He will deal out responsibilities having to do with "have thou authority over 10 cities"... and "likewise be thou over 5 cities" (those "cities" are on the earth)

Both pre-tribbers and post-tribbers AGREE He only "RETURNS" to the earth ONCE. That is not under question.

This seems to be hair-splitting. Pretrib has the 'coming' of Christ either taking a long time or 'coming' referring to multiple events. That's too convoluted to be tenable.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

This seems to be hair-splitting. Pretrib has the 'coming' of Christ either taking a long time or 'coming' referring to multiple events. That's too convoluted to be tenable.

It appears you've not grasped what I've said (in reference to the ANGELS and the TRUMPETS and VIALS associated with that SPANS-OF-TIME when the "INFLICTING VENGEANCE ON..." takes place, parallel with the spans-of-time that 2Th2:10-12 also takes to unfold)...


...and that a "coming" IN THE AIR, pertaining solely to "the Church which is His body," is not the same thing as His "coming" to the earth, when "EVERY eye" shall see Him. I find that most small children grasp such a distinction.





[this ^ fits also the PATTERN established between Jesus' own TWO ascensions, having taken place some "40 days" apart... and that is just "supporting" points, not the main argument]



____________

Plz check out the definition of the word "stasis / stasin" in Scripture... and its 9 occurrences:
https://biblehub.com/greek/4714.htm

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

Consider the parousia verses. is there any reason to think the Greek word would refer to a long journey as opposed to just the arrival? If you have Greek sources to show it, go ahead.

I've stated that "parousia" (re: His "presence") depends on CONTEXT... that is, who will be in His presence, and where/in what location.

[I explained "who" and "where" in my previous post, just now]


When "our Rapture [IN THE AIR]" takes place, the only ones in His "presence" (THERE) is "the Church which is His body," and no one else.

 

[FreeGrace2]

FreeGrace2 said:
First, explain the red words, if they DON'T refer to the Second Coming.

I said they do.
Are you suggesting or thinking I said they do not?? I didn't.

you weren't that clear. However, since you agree that the verses DO refer to the Second Coming, explain the "gathering" if it is not referring to the being "caught up", otherwise known as the rapture.

[Matt24's context IS Jesus covering the Subject of (the things surrounding) His Second Coming to the earth Rev19]

Right. And there is a gathering from one end of heaven to the other. If that's not a reference to a rapture, please explain what it is.

If you're going to "debate" [good kind of "debate"] with someone, at least get "what they've said" correct. I've only said it about a billion times. Now, a billion and one-th!

I don't generally read the post of others that are not directly to me. Doesn't matter how many times you may say something, if it wasn't to me, I probably didn't read it.

Anyway, I look forward to your explanation of what the "gathering" is if not a rapture.

 

[presidente]

It appears you've not grasped what I've said (in reference to the ANGELS and the TRUMPETS and VIALS associated with that SPANS-OF-TIME when the "INFLICTING VENGEANCE ON..." takes place, parallel with the spans-of-time that 2Th2:10-12 also takes to unfold)...

...and that a "coming" IN THE AIR, pertaining solely to "the Church which is His body," is not the same thing as His "coming" to the earth, when "EVERY eye" shall see Him. I find that most small children grasp such a distinction.

I see no reason to think Jesus comes in the air, then goes back. The men who spoke to the apostles at the ascension said that He would descend in like manner.

Also, what scripture do you have to support the idea of stretching II Thessalonians 1 out over such a long period of time? I can understand if there were actually some evidence for a pre-trib rapture, like some passage showing or stating that believers would be raptured before the tribulation. Matthew 24 does not have such a statement. Where is such an idea in any of the parallel passages? Nor does the book of Revelation.

If you think 'day' is a long period of time in II Thessalonians 1 and 2, let us consider the ramifications of that. So 'that day', which is used to describe the events in chapter 1, according to your interpretation if I understand it right refers to a period of time of several years during which Jesus comes back, pours out vengence on the wicked and gives the saints rest. So I assume your theory has Christ coming part-way down to collect the saints in the rapture, the difficulties of the tribulation, then Jesus returning again to the earth. So all that would happen in the 'day'-- as in some drawnout period of time.

But there is a problem in chapter 2, because it refers to the 'day' of Christ. If the 'day' is a long drawn out period in which all those things happen, then pre-trib, the version that equates the apostacy with the rapture at least, would say that the day of Christ cannot happen until the rapture and the man of sin being revealed. So then the rapture cannot happen until the rapture happens. That does not make much sense.

The big problem is there is just no evidence for pre-trib. Of course, you can assume and it and say, "Oh, this word doesn't really mean that. It means a long period of time. This passage here is talking about what happens before the rapture... and that one after the rapture." But just assuming pre-trib in these passages is circular reasoning, and there is no Biblical onramp to your highway of circulare reasoning. There is no scripture that puts a rapture before the tribulation. So why should I accept the convoluted interpretations instead of a straightforward reading of these passages?

[this ^ fits also the PATTERN established between Jesus' own TWO ascensions, having taken place some "40 days" apart... and that is just "supporting" points, not the main argument]

I have heard that theory, based on the fact that Jesus did not want Mary to touch him (or cling to Him?) because He had not yet ascended to the Father, and Jesus let Thomas touch his hands. Is there any other evidence for this idea?

 

[YWPMI]

1 Reason There Won't Be A Pre-Trib Rapture

The church will be present on earth to witness the great tribulation, and be eyewitnesses to the second coming

(They Shall See The Son Of Man Coming)

(Lift Up Your Heads For Your Redemption Draweth Nigh)

Luke 21:25-28KJV
25 And there shall be signs in the sun, and in the moon, and in the stars; and upon the earth distress of nations, with perplexity; the sea and the waves roaring;
26 Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken.
27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.

.
THANK YOU!!!
SOOO many "preachers" are teaching that pre trib rapture and that there is a hell... and that people better tithe or they will "go to hell"... not explaining tithing was done away with AND it was NOT about giving the priests money at all.
They are NOT teaching the TRUTH! Get people to STUDY the Word of God for themselves? No way... they would rather grab the power and the money claiming that they know it all.

.Thank you!

The last refuge of a scoundrel is politics and televangelism. and sometimes they are inter-changeable.

 

[Truth7t7]

God is fully capable of juggling four covenants and satisfying all of them completely and perfectly. Only the Mosaic covenant is obsolete. Scripture does in fact teach this.

However nowhere in Scripture does it ever say that the other three covenants are null and void. On the contrary Scripture is emphatic that all of these covenants will be completely fulfilled....in the age to come aka the millennial reign, which is the extended portion of the DOTL.

Jesus Is Gonna Redeem The Earth, By (Fire)!

There Will Be No 1,000 Year Millennial Kingdom Upon This Earth, Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation.

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ!

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[Truth7t7]

God is fully capable of juggling four covenants and satisfying all of them completely and perfectly. Only the Mosaic covenant is obsolete. Scripture does in fact teach this.

However nowhere in Scripture does it ever say that the other three covenants are null and void. On the contrary Scripture is emphatic that all of these covenants will be completely fulfilled....in the age to come aka the millennial reign, which is the extended portion of the DOTL.

The Second Coming Is (The End) Not The Start Of A Millennial Kingdom on Earth As Many "Falsely" Teach.

Afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. Then cometh the end,

(Then Cometh The End)

(Death Is Swallowed Up In Victory)

1 Corinthians 15:21-24 & 51-54KJV
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.
25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death.

51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

If you think 'day' is a long period of time in II Thessalonians 1 and 2, let us consider the ramifications of that. So 'that day', which is used to describe the events in chapter 1, according to your interpretation if I understand it right refers to a period of time of several years during which Jesus comes back, pours out vengence on the wicked and gives the saints rest. So I assume your theory has Christ coming part-way down to collect the saints in the rapture, the difficulties of the tribulation, then Jesus returning again to the earth. So all that would happen in the 'day'-- as in some drawnout period of time.

Correct (pretty much)!

"The Day of the Lord" time-period [aka "IN THAT DAY" same-context] is INITIATED by a spans-of-time of JUDGMENTs unfolding upon the earth... but it GOES ON to *include* a spans-of-time [a period-of-time] of BLESSINGs, also.

But here, we're talking about the first aspect of it (the JUDGMENTs *arriving* and then unfolding).

But there is a problem in chapter 2, because it refers to the 'day' of Christ. If the 'day' is a long drawn out period in which all those things happen, then pre-trib, the version that equates the apostacy with the rapture at least, would say that the day of Christ cannot happen until the rapture

[see bottom of this post for what it "would say" instead of what you've suggested it "would"]

First of all, v.2 (with the phrase under discussion) is saying of false conveyors... "[purporting] that the day of the Lord IS HERE / IS PRESENT [PERFECT INDICATIVE]"... meaning, already arrived and playing out in their present-day experiences (1:4 made that a VERY BELIEVABLE and REASONABLE claim, for them to be convinced was TRUE, despite its being NOT TRUE).

Paul is saying 'NOT SO! And here's WHY".

Now, it really makes little difference, overall, whether the phrase says "the day of Christ" (which is when WE go UP THERE) *or* "the day of the Lord" (which is ALWAYS "on the earth"), because BOTH PHRASES refer to a SPANS-OF-TIME (tho they run CONCURRENTLY, in distinct LOCATIONS). I listed something like 24 versions that have it as "the day of the Lord" [which the false purporters were saying "IS HERE / IS PRESENT"], and I do believe that makes the best sense of the text/context... but again, either way, it still refers to a "PERIOD-OF-TIME," and not merely a "singular point-in-time" or a "singular 24-hr day" kind of day.

and the man of sin being revealed. So then the rapture cannot happen until the rapture happens. That does not make much sense.

Nope.

"3 that day [the JUDGMENTS unfolding upon the earth time-period, per v.2!] will not be present, if not shall have come THE DEPARTURE [v.1's Subject (our NOUN-EVENT)] *FIRST* and [distinctly] the man of sin BE REVEALED..."

(and he is "revealed" at the START of those [7] Trib/Judgment spans-of-years [IN HIS TIME, the "IN THE NIGHT" time-period], NOT at its MIDDLE, nor at its END--just as all other sections of Scripture agree on this point)

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

I have heard that theory, based on the fact that Jesus did not want Mary to touch him (or cling to Him?) because He had not yet ascended to the Father, and Jesus let Thomas touch his hands. Is there any other evidence for this idea?

Well, actually, I'm not talking about the "eight days later" thing, when Thomas was then present.

I'm talking about "later that SAME DAY; very late in the evening the SAME DAY" per Luke 24:33-43, esp v.39 (what Jesus tells them, here); and understood in conjunction with what Jesus had said in John 16:16-22 (grasping the entire context here)... where what He'd said to MM "I [ACTIVE] ASCEND" (John 20:17) corresponds with His words here "I [ACTIVE] GO to the Father..." (and He came back to His carefully-chosen witnesses to appear before them only)





[the point in time re: His (LATER) Acts 1 VISIBLE ascension, wherever it is spoken of, is always expressed in the "passive"]

 

[VCO]

What translation is that from? The Greek doesn't say "always be ready," but "stay awake" or "watch."

We should stay awake and watch. We don't know the exact day or hour but we can know the season, Jesus told us that Himself:

"So also, when you see these things taking place, you know that the kingdom of God is near."—Luke 21:31

See also Matthew 24:45-51:

"Who then is the faithful and wise servant, whom his master has set over his household, to give them their food at the proper time? Blessed is that servant whom his master will find so doing when he comes. Truly, I say to you, he will set him over all his possessions. But if that wicked servant says to himself, 'My master is delayed,' and begins to beat his fellow servants and eats and drinks with drunkards, the master of that servant will come on a day when he does not expect him and at an hour he does not know and will cut him in pieces and put him with the hypocrites."

New Century Version.

QUOTE:

Greek NASB Number: 1127

Greek Word:
γρηγορέω

Transliterated Word: grêgoreô
Root: formed from perf. of 1453;

Definition: to be awake, to watch:--

List of English Words and Number of Times Used
alert (10),
awake (1),
keep (1),
keep watch (4),
keep watching (1),
keeping alert (1),
stay on the alert (1),
stays awake (1),
wake (2).

New American Standard Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible.
:END QUOTE.

 

[TheDivineWatermark]

The big problem is there is just no evidence for pre-trib. Of course, you can assume and it and say, "Oh, this word doesn't really mean that. It means a long period of time. This passage here is talking about what happens before the rapture... and that one after the rapture." But just assuming pre-trib in these passages is circular reasoning, and there is no Biblical onramp to your highway of circulare reasoning. There is no scripture that puts a rapture before the tribulation. So why should I accept the convoluted interpretations instead of a straightforward reading of these passages?

Well, the thing is, the same thing could be said of the "post-trib viewpoint," for these two chapters; but what I am endeavoring to point out (and is what I was planning to do when I take time to make "one post" responding to your request), is that the wording in 2Th1 corresponds "IN CERTAIN WAYS" to other passages/sections of Scripture, which "proves itself" to indeed be a "spans-of-time" rather than the "point-in-time" thing *you* are ASSUMING of this particular text.

 

[VCO]

.
THANK YOU!!!
SOOO many "preachers" are teaching that pre trib rapture and that there is a hell... and that people better tithe or they will "go to hell"... not explaining tithing was done away with AND it was NOT about giving the priests money at all.
They are NOT teaching the TRUTH! Get people to STUDY the Word of God for themselves? No way... they would rather grab the power and the money claiming that they know it all.

.Thank you!

The last refuge of a scoundrel is politics and televangelism. and sometimes they are inter-changeable.

Would you BELIEVE JESUS ? ? ?

Matthew 13:42 (HCSB)
42 They will throw them into the blazing furnace where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.


Matthew 13:49-51 (HCSB)
49 So it will be at the end of the age. The angels will go out, separate the evil people from the righteous,
50 and throw them into the blazing furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
51 “Have you understood all these things?” “Yes,” they told Him.

 

[Runningman]

Would you BELIEVE JESUS ? ? ?

Matthew 13:42 (HCSB)
42 They will throw them into the blazing furnace where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.


Matthew 13:49-51 (HCSB)
49 So it will be at the end of the age. The angels will go out, separate the evil people from the righteous,
50 and throw them into the blazing furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
51 “Have you understood all these things?” “Yes,” they told Him.

Would you believe Jesus that He's returning after the great tribulation to gather His elect?

Matthew 24:29-31
29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Would you believe that He gathers His elect in the post-tribulation rapture?

2 Thessalonians 2:1-3
1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

 

[VCO]

Last Night LATE, I was messing with some of my settings, and changed it to to Dark mode, but in Dark mode, I only have one Font Option, and that is WHITE.
Now I cannot remember were I clicked on Dark Mode. Can anybody help me, as I cannot even change the Words of Christ to RED.

Only on Google Chrome.

 

[lamad]

Would you believe Jesus that He's returning after the great tribulation to gather His elect?

Matthew 24:29-31
29Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. 31And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Would you believe that He gathers His elect in the post-tribulation rapture?

2 Thessalonians 2:1-3
1Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. 3Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

Would you believe when Jesus gathers His elect after the trib of those days, the church will already be WITH HIM? The church is in heaven for the marriage and supper, then return WITH HIM.

A good guess on "the elect" is God bringing all the Jews and Hebrews from everywhere they are at (Except hell) back to Israel as He promised them.

 

[lamad]

Would you BELIEVE JESUS ? ? ?

Matthew 13:42 (HCSB)
42 They will throw them into the blazing furnace where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.


Matthew 13:49-51 (HCSB)
49 So it will be at the end of the age. The angels will go out, separate the evil people from the righteous,
50 and throw them into the blazing furnace. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
51 “Have you understood all these things?” “Yes,” they told Him.

Perhaps the 6th trumpet is this parable taking place.

 

[lamad]

New Century Version.

QUOTE:

Greek NASB Number: 1127

Greek Word:
γρηγορέω

Transliterated Word: grêgoreô
Root: formed from perf. of 1453;

Definition: to be awake, to watch:--

List of English Words and Number of Times Used
alert (10),
awake (1),
keep (1),
keep watch (4),
keep watching (1),
keeping alert (1),
stay on the alert (1),
stays awake (1),
wake (2).

New American Standard Exhaustive Concordance of the Bible.
:END QUOTE.

I counted 15 times "watch" was written in relation to His coming.

 

[Runningman]

Would you believe when Jesus gathers His elect after the trib of those days, the church will already be WITH HIM? The church is in heaven for the marriage and supper, then return WITH HIM.

A good guess on "the elect" is God bringing all the Jews and Hebrews from everywhere they are at (Except hell) back to Israel as He promised them.

Would you believe that when Jesus descends from heaven with His angels, with the same trump of God mentioned in Matthew 24:29-31, and that He will gather His elect? Those who are alive on the Earth will be taken. Jesus already has established that this gathering to Him occurs after the great tribulation.

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17
16For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: 17Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.