Every place ive read where a man or nation was hardened they were already hardened and
desired or willed something first. Pharaoh hardened his own heart the bible provides that info.
I really appreciate your participation, Mike.
It wouldn't be the same without you.
However, note that Paul presents it a little differently when he states that God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden, and then Paul uses God's name in Ex 33:19, as well as the account of Pharoah, to prove with facts that is God's principle (Ro 9:15-18).
Paul presents it that way because before God even sent Moses to Egypt, he told Moses that
he would harden Pharoah's heart so that he would not let the people go.
"So that" states God's
purpose in his delierate action.
The same through history they hardened their hearts first. God then hardened it more so they
would have resolve and He would work His purpose. Ive found no place where God hardened
anyones heart that wasnt hardened already just to destroy them or send them to hell.
Yes, we are all
born with hardened hearts (Mt 7:11), which are softened only by God's grace.
So when God "hardens" a heart, all he does is not provide his softening grace, and leaves it to its rebellious inclinations.
However regarding God hardening hearts only to destroy them or send them to hell,
2Th 2:10-12 comes to mind:
"They perish because they refused to love the truth and be saved.
For this reason,
God sends them a powerful delusion
so that they will believe the lie,
and
so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness."
With Pharaoh for instance The world got a loud sermon about the God of Israel. Even over in Canaan
people got the news.
The reason Paul even goes into that is to show Israels hard hearts God made harder(blindness)
So they would have resolve. They did and Killed their Messiah.
Well, I think the text of
Ro 9:14-21 shows that the reason Paul went into that was to vindicate God as just, rather than unjust, in sovereignly hardening some and not all.
So that the world would see it again. Gentiles were allowed in....Israel was to get jealous(which they did)
Then they were shown mercy if they believed. And regrafted which they were.
Not all Israel was cut off. Only unbelieving Israel was cut off. The believing remnant was never cut off, and did not have to be regrafted.
It says He found them "all" in unbelief, so He could show mercy on all. So hardening again is not necessarily damnation. God has His purposes in it
Did you mean "bound" instead of "found"?
It states that he concluded, consigned (penned up), shut up, bound all in disobedience/unbelief.
It was God who bound them, shut them up in.
And then the Greek word used in Ro 11:32 is
apeitheia, which means "unbelief, disobedience," because willing disobedience
is unbelief.
God bound all men over to disobedience/unbelief for a period, Gentiles before the gospel, and Jews after the gospel.
Keeping in mind that all men are born in rebellion and unbelief (Eph 2:3; Ro 7:7-8), then to "bind them over" to disobedience/unbelief is simply a withholding of God's grace which changes rebellious unbelieving hearts.
Paul is pointing out that both groups under discussion, Jews and Gentiles, have had a period of disobedience.
He is not stating that every Gentile was in unbelief before the gospel, and that every Jew was in unbelief after the gospel.
The Biblical record testifies to faith and obedience among both.
So Romans 9 is not about whether God can do as He pleases (although He can) but the topic
is about Israel, not individual election, nor salvation(although its present somewhat in the text)
It primarily about God choice to use Israel how He sees fit. Which by the way is a story of pure mercy.
Actually, Ro 9 is about vindicating God's justice in cutting off Israel, to whom were the promises.
Paul shows that the promises were not to all Abraham's descendants, as they were not to Ishmael and Esau.
Paul shows that God's sovereign action is choosing some of Abraham's descendants, and not all, is nothing new.
So his cutting off of all but a believing remanant of Israel is consistent with what he has always done in Israel, and therefore is not a breaking of his promises to Israel.
But its a issue of national election not individual in Romans 9.
I think the issue is God breaking his promises to Israel in cutting off the unbelievers.
National election comes in only as election to be the people of God.
That election has been withdrawn from unbelieving Israel and bestowed on those who believe in Christ.
All unbeliving Israelites are welcome to admittance back into the people of God again, through faith in Jesus Christ.
Later ill make a post to show if hardening means damned then no Israelite was saved since they were hardened(romans 9 says blinded, same thing)
I think there are two things that are being confused in Ro 9 and 11:
1) every
individual is born in rebellion and unbelief, unregenerate (Eph 2:3; Ro 8:7-8),
2) Ro 9 is about two
groups each having a period of disobedience/unbelief
(Gentiles before the gospel, Israel after the gospel, which then removed them from the people of God)
so that all mankind is now on the same footing; i.e., admittance into the people of God is only by faith in Jesus Christ.
I think God binding all men over to disobedience/unbelief (Ro 11:32) refers to the two
groups under discussion, and not to every individual in the group.
I think that
no Israelite was saved since they were hardened is a misunderstanding of what Paul is saying in Ro 9 and 11.