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Didn't Jesus say this
John 16
16 These things have I spoken unto you, that ye should not be offended.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And these things will they do unto you, because they have not known the Father, nor me.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]But these things have I told you, that when the time shall come, ye may remember that I told you of them. And these things I said not unto you at the beginning, because I was with you.
This is what the Talmud says
[h=4]V. A Jew who Kills a Christian Commits No Sin, but Offers an Acceptable Sacrifice to God[/h]In Speher Or Israel (177b) it says:
"Take the life of the Kliphoth and kill them, and you will please God the same as one who offers incense to Him."
And in Ialkut Simoni (245c. n. 772) it says:
"Everyone who sheds the blood of the impious is as acceptable to God as he who offers a sacrifice to God."
John 16
16 These things have I spoken unto you, that ye should not be offended.
[SUP]2 [/SUP]They shall put you out of the synagogues: yea, the time cometh, that whosoever killeth you will think that he doeth God service.
[SUP]3 [/SUP]And these things will they do unto you, because they have not known the Father, nor me.
[SUP]4 [/SUP]But these things have I told you, that when the time shall come, ye may remember that I told you of them. And these things I said not unto you at the beginning, because I was with you.
This is what the Talmud says
[h=4]V. A Jew who Kills a Christian Commits No Sin, but Offers an Acceptable Sacrifice to God[/h]In Speher Or Israel (177b) it says:
"Take the life of the Kliphoth and kill them, and you will please God the same as one who offers incense to Him."
And in Ialkut Simoni (245c. n. 772) it says:
"Everyone who sheds the blood of the impious is as acceptable to God as he who offers a sacrifice to God."
Yes i understand the media thing, i know who owns them and their bent.
In my other house i had a sauna and about 30 years ago i bought a koran
and two best seller books written by Muslims to get a look for my own, about an hour
a nite while taking my saunna. Yes the glue and pages sorta fell apart but i did
what i consider a pretty good looky and stayed as objective as i could to see what they see.
Since i knew whatever i bought in the Christian bookstores would be propaganda.(about Islam)
Id agree the religion is pretty facinating especially the mystical side.
But it didnt do anything for me. Just informed me. But it wasnt the first religion i studied either.
I kept up till i saw how they all had similiarities and common roots.
But im afraid they all stood out and cant come close to who i put my Faith in, even tho i know
there is a power behind them all. ty for answering
In my other house i had a sauna and about 30 years ago i bought a koran
and two best seller books written by Muslims to get a look for my own, about an hour
a nite while taking my saunna. Yes the glue and pages sorta fell apart but i did
what i consider a pretty good looky and stayed as objective as i could to see what they see.
Since i knew whatever i bought in the Christian bookstores would be propaganda.(about Islam)
Id agree the religion is pretty facinating especially the mystical side.
But it didnt do anything for me. Just informed me. But it wasnt the first religion i studied either.
I kept up till i saw how they all had similiarities and common roots.
But im afraid they all stood out and cant come close to who i put my Faith in, even tho i know
there is a power behind them all. ty for answering
P
The reason I do not engage with you is because when false accusation flows from someone as casually, naturally and automatically as it seems to from your keyboard - while showing absolutely no respect for others including an 85 year old church elder, with mischaracterization, false characterization, and false accusation, even as he continued to patiently try to explain his view to your locked eyes and ears - I do nonetheless understand it, because I believe it to be a fulfillment of 2Timothy 3:3. As evidenced throughout your posts and threads I see lots of effort at division, and false accusation and characterization, but little effort at being constructive. Accusing brethren.
You would rail against unregenerate Jews, who might see all Gentiles as a monolithic group - claiming there is no difference between an atheist and Christan Gentile - even as you are unable to discern a difference between an unregenerate agnostic Hollywood movie producing Jew, and one whose life revolves around our God YHWH as He revealed Himself through our Old Testament scriptures. Roman Catholic styled punitive supersessionism. Makes me wonder if you have ever met a Jew that has faith in YHWH. They are among the sweetest and most gentle people I have met.
1Cr 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and [that] no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
You even presume to act as an authority to tell us all about Judaism. And there is no shortage of David Dukes and Ted Pikes that march around with a Talmud in their hand assigning beliefs to Jews through those texts (that Jews don't even consider uninspired) - just as you generalized and assigned in your post, and do to Christians throughout this forum, while also even proclaiming God's judgments against others. Yet through all of Ted Pike's railing against Jews, while believing it to be standing up for Jesus, would it seem he and his wife remained under God's protection?
It doesn't even seem to have registered with you, that the person you have been joined with in your one-sided predatory attacks against Jews and against Christians in this forum, is not a Christian, and what that might indicate. Yet scripture instructs us regarding fruit. Nor do you seem to be able to grasp, that the end you are fighting for, is to convert all of Israel into what Gaza was converted into, by international secular powers that fulfilled your goal.
"Christians can only continue living safely in the Gaza Strip if they accept Islamic law, including a ban on alcohol and on women roaming publicly without proper head coverings, an Islamist militant leader in Gaza told WND in an exclusive interview."
"This missionary activity is endangering the entire Christian community in Gaza,"
"His comments come after gunmen on Sunday attacked Gaza's Latin Church and adjacent Rosary Sisters School, reportedly destroying crosses, bibles, pictures of Jesus and furniture and equipment. The attackers also stole a number of computers."
Christians warned: Accept Islamic law
"'Arab Spring' becoming Nightmare For Christians":
"Christians can In the case of Ayyad, who managed the only Christian bookstore in Gaza, his body was discovered riddled with gunshot and stab wounds."
"The witnesses said they saw three armed men, two of whom were wearing masks, beat Ayyad repeatedly with clubs and the butts of their guns while they accused him of attempting to spread Christianity in Gaza. The witnesses said that after sustaining the beating, Ayyad was shot by all three men."
‘Arab Spring’ becoming nightmare for Christians
The ultimate goal you are in fact fighting for, is the same as that which all of Israel's neighbors desire, and that is the conquest of Israel and subjugation of all Israeli Jews, Israeli Christians, and and Israeli non-Muslim Arabs - the vast majority of whom are in favor of keeping the Israeli Jewish State - to Islam.
Wikipedia article on secular Arabs: "In contrast, a poll of 507 Arab-Israelis conducted by the Israeli Democracy Institute in 2007 found that 75 percent profess support for Israel's status as a Jewish and democratic state which guarantees equal rights for minorities. Israeli Arab support for a constitution in general was 88 percent.[31]"
Wake up. Look around. Freedom, liberty and the right to self-determination is the very antitheses of the side you have chosen - the Islamic aggressors. Islam can only be maintained under a despotic, murderous, totalitarian state where truth is increasingly excluded. You are joined with those in Egypt, where Christians are being killed, and churches burned, as the Muslim Brotherhood settles into power throughout the region.
You are fighting to turn Israel into just another sharia law ruled, little girl circumcising (female genital mutilation or FGM), multiple wife and concubine beating, Christian and Jew beheading, imperialistic conquering, Islamic slave state. You have chosen the side of the purple team, along with the vast majority of the world, that has also blinded itself to the 1400 year history of Islamic conquest and subjugation - because of disdain for Jews. A continuation of 2500 years of persecution.
View attachment 43522
These are the very people, who were elected in a majority to replace the former protection of the democracy of the Jewish State, who now rule Gaza:
[video=youtube;l4d9HPw4a_k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4d9HPw4a_k[/video]
This is what they do with money that westerners are stupid enough to send them while being duped into believing it to be charitable:
"Finally, a Palestinian 'Charity' Tells The Truth" By Debbie Schlussel
"A Gaza charity headed by the interior minister of Hamas yesterday offered $1.4 million to any Arab citizen of Israel who abducts an Israeli soldier."
I wonder how many thousands of rockets lobbed into your town you would have put up with, before wishing your government did a little something about it? Why do you suppose your partner in one-sided predatory attacks against Jews (though perhaps not as much as you, against Christians in this forum), is a "non-Christian"? While he hasn't yet said he is a Muslim, his home country is Malaysia, and since there is no shortage of Muslims there I presume he is, since he claimed to be saved. I pray the good Lord guides him back into the forum for more chat on this thread - rather than to witness a cacophony of division and accusation and assigning beliefs to others. Why don't you focus on considering the fruit of the tree that you have chosen.
There are indeed only two sides to the conflict.
That of Israeli Muslims VS Israeli Jews, Christians and non-Muslim Arabs.
There is only one side that desires to fight. The same one that has lusted after conquest of all kindgoms of the world, and subjugation of all people to themselves, for 1400 years. Does it make sense to you that Iraeli Jews, Christians and non-Muslim Arabs that enjoy the freedom, liberty and self-rule of the democracy of the Jewish state, desire to live - at best in dhimmitude as has already begun in Gaza - in a totalitarian Islamic slave state? There is likely no shortage of Israeli Muslims that also do not want to be ruled under the despotism, repression and terror of an Islamic state, who enjoy more freedom in Israel, than Muslims do in any Islam controlled country on earth.
You would rail against unregenerate Jews, who might see all Gentiles as a monolithic group - claiming there is no difference between an atheist and Christan Gentile - even as you are unable to discern a difference between an unregenerate agnostic Hollywood movie producing Jew, and one whose life revolves around our God YHWH as He revealed Himself through our Old Testament scriptures. Roman Catholic styled punitive supersessionism. Makes me wonder if you have ever met a Jew that has faith in YHWH. They are among the sweetest and most gentle people I have met.
1Cr 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and [that] no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.
You even presume to act as an authority to tell us all about Judaism. And there is no shortage of David Dukes and Ted Pikes that march around with a Talmud in their hand assigning beliefs to Jews through those texts (that Jews don't even consider uninspired) - just as you generalized and assigned in your post, and do to Christians throughout this forum, while also even proclaiming God's judgments against others. Yet through all of Ted Pike's railing against Jews, while believing it to be standing up for Jesus, would it seem he and his wife remained under God's protection?
It doesn't even seem to have registered with you, that the person you have been joined with in your one-sided predatory attacks against Jews and against Christians in this forum, is not a Christian, and what that might indicate. Yet scripture instructs us regarding fruit. Nor do you seem to be able to grasp, that the end you are fighting for, is to convert all of Israel into what Gaza was converted into, by international secular powers that fulfilled your goal.
"Christians can only continue living safely in the Gaza Strip if they accept Islamic law, including a ban on alcohol and on women roaming publicly without proper head coverings, an Islamist militant leader in Gaza told WND in an exclusive interview."
"This missionary activity is endangering the entire Christian community in Gaza,"
"His comments come after gunmen on Sunday attacked Gaza's Latin Church and adjacent Rosary Sisters School, reportedly destroying crosses, bibles, pictures of Jesus and furniture and equipment. The attackers also stole a number of computers."
Christians warned: Accept Islamic law
"'Arab Spring' becoming Nightmare For Christians":
"Christians can In the case of Ayyad, who managed the only Christian bookstore in Gaza, his body was discovered riddled with gunshot and stab wounds."
"The witnesses said they saw three armed men, two of whom were wearing masks, beat Ayyad repeatedly with clubs and the butts of their guns while they accused him of attempting to spread Christianity in Gaza. The witnesses said that after sustaining the beating, Ayyad was shot by all three men."
‘Arab Spring’ becoming nightmare for Christians
The ultimate goal you are in fact fighting for, is the same as that which all of Israel's neighbors desire, and that is the conquest of Israel and subjugation of all Israeli Jews, Israeli Christians, and and Israeli non-Muslim Arabs - the vast majority of whom are in favor of keeping the Israeli Jewish State - to Islam.
Wikipedia article on secular Arabs: "In contrast, a poll of 507 Arab-Israelis conducted by the Israeli Democracy Institute in 2007 found that 75 percent profess support for Israel's status as a Jewish and democratic state which guarantees equal rights for minorities. Israeli Arab support for a constitution in general was 88 percent.[31]"
Wake up. Look around. Freedom, liberty and the right to self-determination is the very antitheses of the side you have chosen - the Islamic aggressors. Islam can only be maintained under a despotic, murderous, totalitarian state where truth is increasingly excluded. You are joined with those in Egypt, where Christians are being killed, and churches burned, as the Muslim Brotherhood settles into power throughout the region.
You are fighting to turn Israel into just another sharia law ruled, little girl circumcising (female genital mutilation or FGM), multiple wife and concubine beating, Christian and Jew beheading, imperialistic conquering, Islamic slave state. You have chosen the side of the purple team, along with the vast majority of the world, that has also blinded itself to the 1400 year history of Islamic conquest and subjugation - because of disdain for Jews. A continuation of 2500 years of persecution.
View attachment 43522
These are the very people, who were elected in a majority to replace the former protection of the democracy of the Jewish State, who now rule Gaza:
[video=youtube;l4d9HPw4a_k]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l4d9HPw4a_k[/video]
This is what they do with money that westerners are stupid enough to send them while being duped into believing it to be charitable:
"Finally, a Palestinian 'Charity' Tells The Truth" By Debbie Schlussel
"A Gaza charity headed by the interior minister of Hamas yesterday offered $1.4 million to any Arab citizen of Israel who abducts an Israeli soldier."
I wonder how many thousands of rockets lobbed into your town you would have put up with, before wishing your government did a little something about it? Why do you suppose your partner in one-sided predatory attacks against Jews (though perhaps not as much as you, against Christians in this forum), is a "non-Christian"? While he hasn't yet said he is a Muslim, his home country is Malaysia, and since there is no shortage of Muslims there I presume he is, since he claimed to be saved. I pray the good Lord guides him back into the forum for more chat on this thread - rather than to witness a cacophony of division and accusation and assigning beliefs to others. Why don't you focus on considering the fruit of the tree that you have chosen.
There are indeed only two sides to the conflict.
That of Israeli Muslims VS Israeli Jews, Christians and non-Muslim Arabs.
There is only one side that desires to fight. The same one that has lusted after conquest of all kindgoms of the world, and subjugation of all people to themselves, for 1400 years. Does it make sense to you that Iraeli Jews, Christians and non-Muslim Arabs that enjoy the freedom, liberty and self-rule of the democracy of the Jewish state, desire to live - at best in dhimmitude as has already begun in Gaza - in a totalitarian Islamic slave state? There is likely no shortage of Israeli Muslims that also do not want to be ruled under the despotism, repression and terror of an Islamic state, who enjoy more freedom in Israel, than Muslims do in any Islam controlled country on earth.
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E
yet I think we all could agree some take it to far. It is one thing to fight a false gospel. and love people to want them to come to Christ, it is a far other thing to judge and condemn people based on false accusations and misleading arguments who want the same thing, but might believe something different.
Anyone who has been in this chat room lately and can not understand why crazy4godword feels the way he does must not be reading much. I think what crazy4godword says should be taken at heart..
Anyone who has been in this chat room lately and can not understand why crazy4godword feels the way he does must not be reading much. I think what crazy4godword says should be taken at heart..
P
If you have explained to me that you were a Muslim, my approach regarding Islam would have been a little different. What you perceive as a lack of calm, was simple honesty and truth. My replies were the result of my suspecting you were a non-Christian (based on a review of your posting history) and doing nothing more than one-sided rabble rousing against Israeli Jews.
Drett, do you understand that the crucifixion of Jesus Christ, and the blood He shed to save us all from sin, is the whole subject of the Gospel? Indeed it is the whole subject of the whole bible.
Leviticus 17:11 For the life of the flesh [is] in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it [is] the blood [that] maketh an atonement for the soul.
Drett, do you understand that the crucifixion of Jesus Christ, and the blood He shed to save us all from sin, is the whole subject of the Gospel? Indeed it is the whole subject of the whole bible.
Leviticus 17:11 For the life of the flesh [is] in the blood: and I have given it to you upon the altar to make an atonement for your souls: for it [is] the blood [that] maketh an atonement for the soul.
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P
I realize that you only have the chance to pop in now and then, so let me get to the reason I asked this question. Muslims generally have the same answer:
Narrated ‘Abis bin Rabia: ‘Umar came near the Black Stone and kissed it and said, "No doubt, I know that you are a stone and can neither benefit anyone nor harm anyone. Had I not seen Allah’s Apostle kissing you I would not have kissed you." (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 2, Book 26, Number 667)
So the reason Muhammad's followers kiss the black stone is because Muhammad kissed the black stone. The reason I raised this point is because that is the same list of reasons that Muhammad's followers must deny the crucifixion and death of the Lamb of God, and reject the blood that He shed, to save all from sin. Because Muhammad denied it in the 7th century.
The reason I believe in the shed blood of the Messiah - Yeshua (which means YHWH "saves" "delivers" or "rescues") is because that is the whole subject of the Gospel, as revealed through all of the prophets and witnesses in the New Testament.
Here's one of the reasons I believe them:
"My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"
Does that sound familiar? Well I copied and pasted that from Psalms 22, that was penned hundreds of years before the cross. Here's what else it says:
16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet. 17 I may tell all my bones: they look [and] stare upon me. 18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.
PSALMS 22
If you want to believe that the King James Version is corrupted, which is the only fall-back that Muhammad's followers have suggested to me (indeed so corrupted that the whole subject of the Gospel became its complete opposite!), then here's that passage from a version of the Tanac by a rabidly anti-Christian group of Jews whose stated purpose is "counter-missionary education":
Psalms 22:2. My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?
17. For dogs have surrounded me; a band of evildoers has encompassed me, like a lion, my hands and feet. 18. I tell about all my bones. They look and gloat over me. 19. They share my garments among themselves and cast lots for my raiment.
What do lions do with their teeth and nails? That was penned before crucifixion was even invented. Muslims claim they respect Jesus as a prophet, so what did Jesus prophesy?
Matthew 20:17 And Jesus going up to Jerusalem took the twelve disciples apart in the way, and said unto them, 18 Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death, 19 And shall deliver him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify [him]: and the third day he shall rise again.
And after it was fulfilled?
Luke 24:44 And he said unto them, These [are] the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and [in] the prophets, and [in] the psalms, concerning me. 45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, 46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. 48 And ye are witnesses of these things.
He even referenced the Psalms passage. Now how many reasons can you come up with for rejecting these fulfilled prophecies other than the same solitary reason that Muslims kiss the black stone? That is because Muhammad proclaimed the exact opposite of this prophecy and its fulfillment - which are the whole subject of the Gospel.
Surah 4:157 That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-
Narrated ‘Abis bin Rabia: ‘Umar came near the Black Stone and kissed it and said, "No doubt, I know that you are a stone and can neither benefit anyone nor harm anyone. Had I not seen Allah’s Apostle kissing you I would not have kissed you." (Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 2, Book 26, Number 667)
So the reason Muhammad's followers kiss the black stone is because Muhammad kissed the black stone. The reason I raised this point is because that is the same list of reasons that Muhammad's followers must deny the crucifixion and death of the Lamb of God, and reject the blood that He shed, to save all from sin. Because Muhammad denied it in the 7th century.
The reason I believe in the shed blood of the Messiah - Yeshua (which means YHWH "saves" "delivers" or "rescues") is because that is the whole subject of the Gospel, as revealed through all of the prophets and witnesses in the New Testament.
Here's one of the reasons I believe them:
"My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?"
Does that sound familiar? Well I copied and pasted that from Psalms 22, that was penned hundreds of years before the cross. Here's what else it says:
16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet. 17 I may tell all my bones: they look [and] stare upon me. 18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.
PSALMS 22
If you want to believe that the King James Version is corrupted, which is the only fall-back that Muhammad's followers have suggested to me (indeed so corrupted that the whole subject of the Gospel became its complete opposite!), then here's that passage from a version of the Tanac by a rabidly anti-Christian group of Jews whose stated purpose is "counter-missionary education":
Psalms 22:2. My God, my God, why have You forsaken me?
17. For dogs have surrounded me; a band of evildoers has encompassed me, like a lion, my hands and feet. 18. I tell about all my bones. They look and gloat over me. 19. They share my garments among themselves and cast lots for my raiment.
What do lions do with their teeth and nails? That was penned before crucifixion was even invented. Muslims claim they respect Jesus as a prophet, so what did Jesus prophesy?
Matthew 20:17 And Jesus going up to Jerusalem took the twelve disciples apart in the way, and said unto them, 18 Behold, we go up to Jerusalem; and the Son of man shall be betrayed unto the chief priests and unto the scribes, and they shall condemn him to death, 19 And shall deliver him to the Gentiles to mock, and to scourge, and to crucify [him]: and the third day he shall rise again.
And after it was fulfilled?
Luke 24:44 And he said unto them, These [are] the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and [in] the prophets, and [in] the psalms, concerning me. 45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures, 46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day: 47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem. 48 And ye are witnesses of these things.
He even referenced the Psalms passage. Now how many reasons can you come up with for rejecting these fulfilled prophecies other than the same solitary reason that Muslims kiss the black stone? That is because Muhammad proclaimed the exact opposite of this prophecy and its fulfillment - which are the whole subject of the Gospel.
Surah 4:157 That they said (in boast), "We killed Christ Jesus the son of Mary, the Messenger of Allah";- but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but so it was made to appear to them, and those who differ therein are full of doubts, with no (certain) knowledge, but only conjecture to follow, for of a surety they killed him not:-
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P
In the other thread you asked for a single point. Here is the point. I follow the God of the scriptures YHWH, as He revealed Himself through ALL of His prophets and witnesses, in the 1600 year record of revelation to mankind, that His people have followed through two covenants, for 3500 years.
I follow it because of fulfilled prophecy,
Muhammad's followers follow Muhammad alone, through his heavily abrogated, 23 year, 7th century record, that proclaims the exact opposite of the whole subject of the Gospel. A record that includes a 4,500 year pre-Muhammad history of Islam - that was entirely penned in the 7th to 10th centuries AD, without reference to any historical record that preceded the 5th century - of a town in the SW Arabian desert, located 1200 kilometers from the Holy Land of the prophets and patriarchs, for which there is no historical or archaeological record that suggests that Mecca ever existed before about the 4th century AD.
The one true and great God of the scriptures gave us each the free will to choose.
I follow it because of fulfilled prophecy,
Muhammad's followers follow Muhammad alone, through his heavily abrogated, 23 year, 7th century record, that proclaims the exact opposite of the whole subject of the Gospel. A record that includes a 4,500 year pre-Muhammad history of Islam - that was entirely penned in the 7th to 10th centuries AD, without reference to any historical record that preceded the 5th century - of a town in the SW Arabian desert, located 1200 kilometers from the Holy Land of the prophets and patriarchs, for which there is no historical or archaeological record that suggests that Mecca ever existed before about the 4th century AD.
The one true and great God of the scriptures gave us each the free will to choose.
which subject?
Islam or Israel?
well, they're trying to.
who is a Jew?
people who practice Judaism?
this is most certainly true.
The Bible reveals God laid Jerusalem to waste in 70AD.
Jews are in the area now. this is most certainly true.
most of them never came from there, ever.
their ancestors didn't and they are not of Jacob.
but Judaism does consider them jews, and so they are.
that's fine.
it's a religious and tribal affiliation.
we all belong to something.
what's your point?
IT WAS:
planned well before they went there.
it took 2 world wars to arrange it.
at the hands of terrorists (Urgun and others)
through deceit (The Balfour Declaration)
while polluting the Land with blood (the thing God hates)
with trillions in foreign aid from The US and Britain and France...without which it's a failed State.
stealing the water and resources from surrounding areas and peoples.
not belonging to UN Global treaties.
abominable human rights abuses
that tiny strip of Land has become a formidable global geopolitical focus, with this i agree.
but not on it's own.
world jewry supports it.
so do many other nations.
Israeli political power is enormous.
it's not a conspiracy - it's out in the open.
uh...i don't think so.
i'll call it what i choose.
right. when Jesus walked the earth, He sought and found His lost sheep in Israel.
the others refused to repent, and Jerusalem was destroyed in 70AD.
Walid Shoebat...you are kidding...okay PeteWaldo. i know where you are coming from.
[video=youtube;xC9jUjU8aEI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xC9jUjU8aEI[/video]
Published on Jan 27, 2012
Christian dishonesty and deception:
Mixed Message: The testimony of a self-described former terrorist.
By Doug Howard, for ChristianityToday.com:
" On Christmas Day 2009, our youngest son, Jay, found himself on Delta Northwest Airlines Flight 253 from Amsterdam to Detroit. Toward the end of the flight, Jay's seatmate, a Nigerian Muslim about his age named Umar abd al-Muttalib, tried to blow up the plane using a bomb hidden in his underwear. Reflecting on Jay's experience, and on Umar and the failed efforts by his father to warn authorities, has helped me clarify my attitude toward American Christian anti-Islamic literary polemics, including Kamal Saleem's "memoir," The Blood of Lambs. The book fits the familiar pattern of reassuring Christians of the superiority of their own faith tradition by negative comparisons with a dehumanized Islam. But Kamal Saleem's titillating dance with violence and fame makes the book more complicated and more uncomfortable than most like it. By embracing the glamorous violence it claims to abhor, it raises readers' hopes of touching secret human meanings through it.
I first encountered Kamal Saleem when he appeared at Calvin College in November 2007. A look at his website told me immediately that he was not who he said he was. The signature of his deception was his statement that "in my family was the Grand Wazir of Islam." The term is ridiculous, a spurious title meant to mislead the innocent with an aura of authority. The audience, including many from the Grand Rapids Muslim community, watched Kamal Saleem's performance with quiet restraint. He told stories, now repeated in The Blood of Lambs, of being recruited as a child for missions against Israel via tunnels under the Golan Heights, disguised as sheep; of visions of a rider on a white horse who, drawn swords in hand, commanded him to sever the heads of the infidels. In one painfully disturbing account, the mother of his friend screamed with joy that her little boy had met a violent death and joined the martyrs in heaven. He continued with the story of his immigration to America to recruit for jihad. Instead he was converted to Christianity as the result of a car accident, when he was taken into the home of a Christian physician and cared for out of selfless love. These tales were interspersed with exhortations for America to "wake up" to the threat of radical Islam and testimonials to the power of Christ in helping him forsake his old life.
Kamal Saleem sometimes appears with two other "former terrorists," who also appear in the book. One is Zachariah Anani, a Canadian. Tom Quiggin, a former intelligence and security expert with the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, stated in the Windsor (Ontario) Star that Anani is "not an individual who rates the slightest degree of credibility." The other, Walid Shoebat, was exposed in the Jerusalem Post. According to his brother, who still lives in Beit Sahour, Shoebat left Palestine in 1978 to further his education in the United States. He met and married the daughter of a Baptist minister and converted to Christianity. The most extreme thing he ever did was attaching Palestinian flag stickers to utility poles around town. A 2006 letter from Rev. Alex Awad, president of the Council of Evangelical Churches in Palestine, warned American churches about him. Yet these three men march brazenly on, not only in churches but at Christian colleges and major universities."
...........
Mixed Message
The testimony of a self-described former terrorist.
Mixed Message | Books and Culture ' click
cont.....
Islam or Israel?
well, they're trying to.
who is a Jew?
people who practice Judaism?
this is most certainly true.
The Bible reveals God laid Jerusalem to waste in 70AD.
Jews are in the area now. this is most certainly true.
most of them never came from there, ever.
their ancestors didn't and they are not of Jacob.
but Judaism does consider them jews, and so they are.
that's fine.
it's a religious and tribal affiliation.
we all belong to something.
what's your point?
IT WAS:
planned well before they went there.
it took 2 world wars to arrange it.
at the hands of terrorists (Urgun and others)
through deceit (The Balfour Declaration)
while polluting the Land with blood (the thing God hates)
with trillions in foreign aid from The US and Britain and France...without which it's a failed State.
stealing the water and resources from surrounding areas and peoples.
not belonging to UN Global treaties.
abominable human rights abuses
that tiny strip of Land has become a formidable global geopolitical focus, with this i agree.
but not on it's own.
world jewry supports it.
so do many other nations.
Israeli political power is enormous.
it's not a conspiracy - it's out in the open.
uh...i don't think so.
i'll call it what i choose.
right. when Jesus walked the earth, He sought and found His lost sheep in Israel.
the others refused to repent, and Jerusalem was destroyed in 70AD.
Walid Shoebat...you are kidding...okay PeteWaldo. i know where you are coming from.
[video=youtube;xC9jUjU8aEI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xC9jUjU8aEI[/video]
Published on Jan 27, 2012
Christian dishonesty and deception:
Mixed Message: The testimony of a self-described former terrorist.
By Doug Howard, for ChristianityToday.com:
" On Christmas Day 2009, our youngest son, Jay, found himself on Delta Northwest Airlines Flight 253 from Amsterdam to Detroit. Toward the end of the flight, Jay's seatmate, a Nigerian Muslim about his age named Umar abd al-Muttalib, tried to blow up the plane using a bomb hidden in his underwear. Reflecting on Jay's experience, and on Umar and the failed efforts by his father to warn authorities, has helped me clarify my attitude toward American Christian anti-Islamic literary polemics, including Kamal Saleem's "memoir," The Blood of Lambs. The book fits the familiar pattern of reassuring Christians of the superiority of their own faith tradition by negative comparisons with a dehumanized Islam. But Kamal Saleem's titillating dance with violence and fame makes the book more complicated and more uncomfortable than most like it. By embracing the glamorous violence it claims to abhor, it raises readers' hopes of touching secret human meanings through it.
I first encountered Kamal Saleem when he appeared at Calvin College in November 2007. A look at his website told me immediately that he was not who he said he was. The signature of his deception was his statement that "in my family was the Grand Wazir of Islam." The term is ridiculous, a spurious title meant to mislead the innocent with an aura of authority. The audience, including many from the Grand Rapids Muslim community, watched Kamal Saleem's performance with quiet restraint. He told stories, now repeated in The Blood of Lambs, of being recruited as a child for missions against Israel via tunnels under the Golan Heights, disguised as sheep; of visions of a rider on a white horse who, drawn swords in hand, commanded him to sever the heads of the infidels. In one painfully disturbing account, the mother of his friend screamed with joy that her little boy had met a violent death and joined the martyrs in heaven. He continued with the story of his immigration to America to recruit for jihad. Instead he was converted to Christianity as the result of a car accident, when he was taken into the home of a Christian physician and cared for out of selfless love. These tales were interspersed with exhortations for America to "wake up" to the threat of radical Islam and testimonials to the power of Christ in helping him forsake his old life.
Kamal Saleem sometimes appears with two other "former terrorists," who also appear in the book. One is Zachariah Anani, a Canadian. Tom Quiggin, a former intelligence and security expert with the Royal Canadian Mounted Police, stated in the Windsor (Ontario) Star that Anani is "not an individual who rates the slightest degree of credibility." The other, Walid Shoebat, was exposed in the Jerusalem Post. According to his brother, who still lives in Beit Sahour, Shoebat left Palestine in 1978 to further his education in the United States. He met and married the daughter of a Baptist minister and converted to Christianity. The most extreme thing he ever did was attaching Palestinian flag stickers to utility poles around town. A 2006 letter from Rev. Alex Awad, president of the Council of Evangelical Churches in Palestine, warned American churches about him. Yet these three men march brazenly on, not only in churches but at Christian colleges and major universities."
...........
Mixed Message
The testimony of a self-described former terrorist.
Mixed Message | Books and Culture ' click
cont.....
CONT.....
Re: The Return of Jews to Israel
[paragraph breaks mine]
JERUSALEM POST
The Palestinian 'terrorist' turned Zionist
By JORG LUYKEN03/30/2008 01:07
Walid Shoebat set to speak with Joe Lieberman, Sallai Meridor at a conference this summer.
Photo: Courtesy When he was 16, says Walid Shoebat, he was recruited by a PLO operative by the name of Mahmoud al-Mughrabi to carry out an attack on a branch of Bank Leumi in Bethlehem. At six in the evening he was supposed to detonate a bomb in the doorway of the bank. But when he saw a group of Arab children playing nearby, he says, his conscience was pricked and he threw the bomb onto the roof of the bank instead, where it exploded causing no fatalities.
This is the story that Shoebat, who converted from Islam to Christianity in 1993 and has lived in the United States since the late 1970s, has told on tours around the US and Europe since 9/11 opened the West's public consciousness to the dangers of Islamic extremism. Shoebat's Web site says his is an assumed name, used to protect him from reprisal attacks by his former terror chiefs, whom he says have put a $10 million price on his head. Shoebat is sometimes paid for his appearances, and he also solicits donations to a Walid Shoebat Foundation to help fund this work and to "fight for the Jewish people."
The BBC, Fox News and CNN have all presented Shoebat as a terrorist turned peacemaker, interviewing him as someone uniquely capable of providing insight into the terrorist mindset. Now he and two other former extremists are set to appear along with US Senator Joe Lieberman, Ambassador to the US Sallai Meridor and other notables at an annual "Christians United For Israel" conference in Washington in July. The three "ex-terrorists" have appeared previously at Harvard and Columbia universities and, most recently, at the US Air Force Academy in Colorado, in February, at a conference whose findings, the organizers said, would be circulated at the Pentagon and among members of Congress and other influential figures.
Last year, Shoebat spoke to the BattleCry Christian gathering in San Francisco, which drew a reported 22,000 evangelical teenagers to what the San Francisco Chronicle described as "a mix of pep rally, rock concert and church service." The paper described Shoebat as a self-proclaimed "former Islamic terrorist" who said that Islam was a "satanic cult" and who told the crowd how he eventually accepted Jesus into his heart. However, Shoebat's claim to have bombed Bank Leumi in Bethlehem is rejected by members of his family who still live in the area, and Bank Leumi says it has no record of such an attack ever taking place.
His relatives, members of the Shoebat family, are mystified by the notion of "Walid Shoebat" being an assumed name. And the Walid Shoebat Foundation's working process is less than transparent, with Shoebat's claim that it is registered as a charity in the state of Pennsylvania being denied by the Pennsylvania State Attorney's Office. Shoebat's claim to have been a terrorist rests on his account of the purported bombing of Bank Leumi.
But after checking its files, the bank said it had no record of an attack on its Bethlehem branch anywhere in the relevant 1977-79 period. Shoebat told The Jerusalem Post that this could be because the bank building was robustly protected with steel and that the attack may have caused little damage. Asked whether word of the bombing made the news at the time, he said, "I don't know. I didn't read the papers because I was in hiding for the next three days." (In 2004, he had told Britain's Sunday Telegraph: "I was terribly relieved when I heard on the news later that evening that no one had been hurt or killed by my bomb.") Shoebat could not immediately recall the year, or even the time of year, of the purported bombing when talking to the Post by phone from the US.
After wavering, he finally settled for the summer of 1977. The Sunday Telegraph described Shoebat as a man who "for much of his life... was eager to commit acts of terrorism for the sake of his soul and the Palestinian cause." In that interview he described how he and his peers were indoctrinated as children "to believe that the fires of hell were an ever-present reality. We were all terrified of burning in hell when we died... The teachers told us that the only way we could certainly avoid that fate was to die in a martyrdom operation - to die for Islam."
But an uncle and a cousin of Shoebat, who still live in Beit Sahur in the Bethlehem area, where Shoebat grew up, said that Shoebat's education was rather mild ideologically, and that religion did not play a dominant role. The uncle, interviewed at his home, said he remembered little about his nephew, because Walid left for America at the age of 16, and because his American mother always kept a distance from the rest of the family. The uncle and his wife both said firmly that there was no attack on Bank Leumi.
When questioned on this discrepancy, Shoebat was adamant that he did carry out such a bombing, and that his relatives deny it to cover up for another cousin who was with him during the attack and still lives in Bethlehem. Shoebat evinced no particular surprise that his family could be tracked down simply by asking Beit Sahur locals where they lived, even though his Internet site claims that his is an assumed name. Shoebat describes his conversion to Christianity as a transformation "from hate to love." He told the Post that he believes "in a Greater Israel that includes Judea and Samaria, and by this I mean a Jewish state."
He argued that Israel should retake the Gaza Strip and rehouse Jews there, regarding Gaza as Jewish by right. "If a Jew has no right to Gaza, then he has no right to Jaffa or Haifa either," he said. He advocates that the government of Greater Israel introduce a law providing for the exiling of anybody who denies its right to exist, "even if they were born there." He has little sympathy for the PLO or Hamas. "The Palestinians have not met a single demand from Israel," he said, and added, "Both the PLO and Hamas have not given up the goal of destroying Israel." "The Jews are not aware of the true threat," Shoebat said. "They are still fighting dead Nazis. It is easy to fight dead people. But they don't have the will to fight the living Nazis, the Islamic radicals."
He told the Post he had set up his Walid Shoebat Foundation to educate Americans as to why the US should support Israel. Shoebat said the foundation had reached out to over 450 million people. He said it held events where he and others like him - whom he called "ex-terrorists" who have become Zionists - spoke about their views to Jewish, Christian and secular audiences. A New York Times report last month on the Air Force Academy event, headlined "Speakers at Academy Said to Make False Claims," noted that "Academic professors and others who have heard the three men speak in the United States and Canada said some of their stories border on the fantastic, like Mr. Saleem's account of how, as a child, he infiltrated Israel to plant bombs via a network of tunnels underneath the Golan Heights.
No such incidents have been reported, the academic experts said. They also question how three middle-aged men who claim they were recruited as teenagers or younger could have been steeped in the violent religious ideology that only became prevalent in the late 1980s." The Times quoted Prof. Douglas Howard, who teaches the history of the modern Middle East at Calvin College in Grand Rapids, Michigan, as saying after he heard Saleem speak last November at the college that he thought the three were connected to several major Christian evangelical organizations. "It was just an old time gospel hour: 'Jesus can change your life, he changed mine,'" Howard said.
The professor told the Times that his doubts about the authenticity of the three grew after he heard stories like that of the Golan Heights tunnels, "as well as something on Mr. Saleem's Web site along the lines that he was descended from the grand wazir of Islam. The grand wazir of Islam is a nonsensical term." The newspaper said Arab-American civil rights organizations have questioned "why, at a time when the United States government has vigorously moved to jail or at least deport anyone with a known terrorist connection, the three men, if they are telling the truth, are allowed to circulate freely." A spokesman for the FBI, the paper reported, said there were no warrants for their arrest. The Times said the three men were to be paid $13,000 for the Air Force Academy event.
Visitors to Shoebat's Internet site are encouraged to make a donation to his foundation to enable him to disseminate his message. However, a notice on the page states that for "security reasons," the money will not be debited to his foundation, but rather to a company called Top Executive Media. The name Top Executive Media is used by a greetings card firm from Pennsylvania called Top Executive Greetings, a company with an annual turnover of $500,000. When one makes a donation through the Shoebat Internet site, the Web address changes to topexecutivegreetings.com/shoebat. This seems to be the only active page for the company; its homepage is blank. Asked by the Post whether the Walid Shoebat Foundation is a registered charity, Shoebat replied that it is registered in Pennsylvania.
The Pennsylvania State Attorney's office said it had no record of a charity registered under this name. Questioned further, Shoebat said it was registered under a different name, but that he was not aware of the details, which are handled by his manager. "I remain separate to the running of the charity so that I am not constrained by church rules," he explained, adding that the organization's connection to certain churches meant it would be difficult for him to speak to secular audiences if he became too involved in running it. Dr. Joel Fishman, of the Allegany County Law Library in Pennsylvania, expressed doubts about this donation process.
If the money were being given to a registered charity, the charity would have to make annual reports to the state and federal government on how it was being spent, he noted. Shoebat insisted donations were not being misused, however. "I survive by being an author," he said. "I only get paid for being an author. All the money that is donated gets put back into events."
If the Bank Leumi bombing claim is unfounded, it is unclear why Shoebat would have wanted to manufacture a terrorist past. True or not, however, it has plainly brought him some prominence and provided him with a means to speak in favor of Israel and be paid for doing so.
http://www.jpost.com/Features/The-Palestinian-terrorist-turned-Zionist < click
CONT.....
Re: The Return of Jews to Israel
[paragraph breaks mine]
JERUSALEM POST
The Palestinian 'terrorist' turned Zionist
By JORG LUYKEN03/30/2008 01:07
Walid Shoebat set to speak with Joe Lieberman, Sallai Meridor at a conference this summer.
Photo: Courtesy When he was 16, says Walid Shoebat, he was recruited by a PLO operative by the name of Mahmoud al-Mughrabi to carry out an attack on a branch of Bank Leumi in Bethlehem. At six in the evening he was supposed to detonate a bomb in the doorway of the bank. But when he saw a group of Arab children playing nearby, he says, his conscience was pricked and he threw the bomb onto the roof of the bank instead, where it exploded causing no fatalities.
This is the story that Shoebat, who converted from Islam to Christianity in 1993 and has lived in the United States since the late 1970s, has told on tours around the US and Europe since 9/11 opened the West's public consciousness to the dangers of Islamic extremism. Shoebat's Web site says his is an assumed name, used to protect him from reprisal attacks by his former terror chiefs, whom he says have put a $10 million price on his head. Shoebat is sometimes paid for his appearances, and he also solicits donations to a Walid Shoebat Foundation to help fund this work and to "fight for the Jewish people."
The BBC, Fox News and CNN have all presented Shoebat as a terrorist turned peacemaker, interviewing him as someone uniquely capable of providing insight into the terrorist mindset. Now he and two other former extremists are set to appear along with US Senator Joe Lieberman, Ambassador to the US Sallai Meridor and other notables at an annual "Christians United For Israel" conference in Washington in July. The three "ex-terrorists" have appeared previously at Harvard and Columbia universities and, most recently, at the US Air Force Academy in Colorado, in February, at a conference whose findings, the organizers said, would be circulated at the Pentagon and among members of Congress and other influential figures.
Last year, Shoebat spoke to the BattleCry Christian gathering in San Francisco, which drew a reported 22,000 evangelical teenagers to what the San Francisco Chronicle described as "a mix of pep rally, rock concert and church service." The paper described Shoebat as a self-proclaimed "former Islamic terrorist" who said that Islam was a "satanic cult" and who told the crowd how he eventually accepted Jesus into his heart. However, Shoebat's claim to have bombed Bank Leumi in Bethlehem is rejected by members of his family who still live in the area, and Bank Leumi says it has no record of such an attack ever taking place.
His relatives, members of the Shoebat family, are mystified by the notion of "Walid Shoebat" being an assumed name. And the Walid Shoebat Foundation's working process is less than transparent, with Shoebat's claim that it is registered as a charity in the state of Pennsylvania being denied by the Pennsylvania State Attorney's Office. Shoebat's claim to have been a terrorist rests on his account of the purported bombing of Bank Leumi.
But after checking its files, the bank said it had no record of an attack on its Bethlehem branch anywhere in the relevant 1977-79 period. Shoebat told The Jerusalem Post that this could be because the bank building was robustly protected with steel and that the attack may have caused little damage. Asked whether word of the bombing made the news at the time, he said, "I don't know. I didn't read the papers because I was in hiding for the next three days." (In 2004, he had told Britain's Sunday Telegraph: "I was terribly relieved when I heard on the news later that evening that no one had been hurt or killed by my bomb.") Shoebat could not immediately recall the year, or even the time of year, of the purported bombing when talking to the Post by phone from the US.
After wavering, he finally settled for the summer of 1977. The Sunday Telegraph described Shoebat as a man who "for much of his life... was eager to commit acts of terrorism for the sake of his soul and the Palestinian cause." In that interview he described how he and his peers were indoctrinated as children "to believe that the fires of hell were an ever-present reality. We were all terrified of burning in hell when we died... The teachers told us that the only way we could certainly avoid that fate was to die in a martyrdom operation - to die for Islam."
But an uncle and a cousin of Shoebat, who still live in Beit Sahur in the Bethlehem area, where Shoebat grew up, said that Shoebat's education was rather mild ideologically, and that religion did not play a dominant role. The uncle, interviewed at his home, said he remembered little about his nephew, because Walid left for America at the age of 16, and because his American mother always kept a distance from the rest of the family. The uncle and his wife both said firmly that there was no attack on Bank Leumi.
When questioned on this discrepancy, Shoebat was adamant that he did carry out such a bombing, and that his relatives deny it to cover up for another cousin who was with him during the attack and still lives in Bethlehem. Shoebat evinced no particular surprise that his family could be tracked down simply by asking Beit Sahur locals where they lived, even though his Internet site claims that his is an assumed name. Shoebat describes his conversion to Christianity as a transformation "from hate to love." He told the Post that he believes "in a Greater Israel that includes Judea and Samaria, and by this I mean a Jewish state."
He argued that Israel should retake the Gaza Strip and rehouse Jews there, regarding Gaza as Jewish by right. "If a Jew has no right to Gaza, then he has no right to Jaffa or Haifa either," he said. He advocates that the government of Greater Israel introduce a law providing for the exiling of anybody who denies its right to exist, "even if they were born there." He has little sympathy for the PLO or Hamas. "The Palestinians have not met a single demand from Israel," he said, and added, "Both the PLO and Hamas have not given up the goal of destroying Israel." "The Jews are not aware of the true threat," Shoebat said. "They are still fighting dead Nazis. It is easy to fight dead people. But they don't have the will to fight the living Nazis, the Islamic radicals."
He told the Post he had set up his Walid Shoebat Foundation to educate Americans as to why the US should support Israel. Shoebat said the foundation had reached out to over 450 million people. He said it held events where he and others like him - whom he called "ex-terrorists" who have become Zionists - spoke about their views to Jewish, Christian and secular audiences. A New York Times report last month on the Air Force Academy event, headlined "Speakers at Academy Said to Make False Claims," noted that "Academic professors and others who have heard the three men speak in the United States and Canada said some of their stories border on the fantastic, like Mr. Saleem's account of how, as a child, he infiltrated Israel to plant bombs via a network of tunnels underneath the Golan Heights.
No such incidents have been reported, the academic experts said. They also question how three middle-aged men who claim they were recruited as teenagers or younger could have been steeped in the violent religious ideology that only became prevalent in the late 1980s." The Times quoted Prof. Douglas Howard, who teaches the history of the modern Middle East at Calvin College in Grand Rapids, Michigan, as saying after he heard Saleem speak last November at the college that he thought the three were connected to several major Christian evangelical organizations. "It was just an old time gospel hour: 'Jesus can change your life, he changed mine,'" Howard said.
The professor told the Times that his doubts about the authenticity of the three grew after he heard stories like that of the Golan Heights tunnels, "as well as something on Mr. Saleem's Web site along the lines that he was descended from the grand wazir of Islam. The grand wazir of Islam is a nonsensical term." The newspaper said Arab-American civil rights organizations have questioned "why, at a time when the United States government has vigorously moved to jail or at least deport anyone with a known terrorist connection, the three men, if they are telling the truth, are allowed to circulate freely." A spokesman for the FBI, the paper reported, said there were no warrants for their arrest. The Times said the three men were to be paid $13,000 for the Air Force Academy event.
Visitors to Shoebat's Internet site are encouraged to make a donation to his foundation to enable him to disseminate his message. However, a notice on the page states that for "security reasons," the money will not be debited to his foundation, but rather to a company called Top Executive Media. The name Top Executive Media is used by a greetings card firm from Pennsylvania called Top Executive Greetings, a company with an annual turnover of $500,000. When one makes a donation through the Shoebat Internet site, the Web address changes to topexecutivegreetings.com/shoebat. This seems to be the only active page for the company; its homepage is blank. Asked by the Post whether the Walid Shoebat Foundation is a registered charity, Shoebat replied that it is registered in Pennsylvania.
The Pennsylvania State Attorney's office said it had no record of a charity registered under this name. Questioned further, Shoebat said it was registered under a different name, but that he was not aware of the details, which are handled by his manager. "I remain separate to the running of the charity so that I am not constrained by church rules," he explained, adding that the organization's connection to certain churches meant it would be difficult for him to speak to secular audiences if he became too involved in running it. Dr. Joel Fishman, of the Allegany County Law Library in Pennsylvania, expressed doubts about this donation process.
If the money were being given to a registered charity, the charity would have to make annual reports to the state and federal government on how it was being spent, he noted. Shoebat insisted donations were not being misused, however. "I survive by being an author," he said. "I only get paid for being an author. All the money that is donated gets put back into events."
If the Bank Leumi bombing claim is unfounded, it is unclear why Shoebat would have wanted to manufacture a terrorist past. True or not, however, it has plainly brought him some prominence and provided him with a means to speak in favor of Israel and be paid for doing so.
http://www.jpost.com/Features/The-Palestinian-terrorist-turned-Zionist < click
CONT.....
according to the Bible, God Himself destroyed Jerusalem in 70AD.
through his chosen instrument, Titus and the Roman Army.
desolate.
just like Daniel 9 says.
no 2nd century ruler vanquished ancient israelite apostates - The Lord God Almighty brought down the old Covenant Curses.
don't you understand your Bible?
or is this a Hasbara Mission?
jews need the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
do you get around to that at all?
huh?
at least we're using the right language.
actors and theater.
oh....this is about 'governments' not understanding they're supposed to be at war with Islam?
which governments?
ya....this is about psychological warfare intended to keep stoking the fires of the Clash of Civilizations.
why are you on this forum PeteWaldo?
so far i see nothing but carnal propaganda and politics.
Pro-Zionist propaganda.
manipulation of christians on a Christian Bible forum.
and so far none of your stuff is real history.
so i have a pretty good idea of why you are here. but i might be wrong.
let's see if you get around to it......
here's what i would really like you to address:
oh....this is about 'governments' not understanding they're supposed to be at war with Islam?
which governments?
CONT.....
through his chosen instrument, Titus and the Roman Army.
desolate.
just like Daniel 9 says.
no 2nd century ruler vanquished ancient israelite apostates - The Lord God Almighty brought down the old Covenant Curses.
don't you understand your Bible?
or is this a Hasbara Mission?
jews need the Gospel of Jesus Christ.
do you get around to that at all?
huh?
at least we're using the right language.
actors and theater.
oh....this is about 'governments' not understanding they're supposed to be at war with Islam?
which governments?
ya....this is about psychological warfare intended to keep stoking the fires of the Clash of Civilizations.
why are you on this forum PeteWaldo?
so far i see nothing but carnal propaganda and politics.
Pro-Zionist propaganda.
manipulation of christians on a Christian Bible forum.
and so far none of your stuff is real history.
so i have a pretty good idea of why you are here. but i might be wrong.
let's see if you get around to it......
here's what i would really like you to address:
oh....this is about 'governments' not understanding they're supposed to be at war with Islam?
which governments?
CONT.....
Re: The Return of Jews to Israel
CONT.....
fear....fear..................scary Islam stuff.............fear.....fear......
uh....who else is there but jews and non-jews?
who is a non-jew?
507 people?
in the poll?
oh come on
....oh let's all remind our governments not to 'put forward the hopelessly naive and wishful idea that they are not at war against Islam' based on an Israeli poll of 507 people.
huh? can't you guys do any better than this?
Hasbara Handbook: Promoting Israel on Campus
http://www.middle-east-info.org/take/wujshasbara.pdf
what's with the "Jewish State" thing?
with rights for "minorities"?
why not ONE STATE with everybody equal.
easy...no walls, no checkpoints, no barbed wire, no guard towers, no apartheid.
Talmud doesn't allow for that though ...does it Pete?
no, it doesn't. it calls for total domination and subjugation of the goyim.
everybody knows it.
a-a-a-a-a-anyways.
let's see where we're going with this......
wow!
okay! i'm CONVINCED!
most definitely porn; drugs; strip clubs; usury; gambling; graft; homosexuality; drunkeness; organ trafficing; child kidnapping and prostitution rings; arms smuggling; and the false religion of Rabbinic Judaism sounds better.
like....are you saying unbelieving unregenerate jews are any more or less unregenerate than any other unsaved person?
what's the deal here?
hey....maybe we should look at the Talmud.
wanna?
why are you speaking from a Christian perspective?
i for one don't believe you're a christian.
virtually no jews today are ancient israelites Pete.
don't you know that?
many of them do now.
so not sure where you're going with this.
even if they are, most are secular, just like ALL other secular ppl.
and the religious folks adhere to Talmudic Judaism, not Moses.
which is an antichrist religion just like Islam.
but you already know that....dont you.
CONT.....
CONT.....
fear....fear..................scary Islam stuff.............fear.....fear......
uh....who else is there but jews and non-jews?
who is a non-jew?
507 people?
in the poll?
oh come on
....oh let's all remind our governments not to 'put forward the hopelessly naive and wishful idea that they are not at war against Islam' based on an Israeli poll of 507 people.
huh? can't you guys do any better than this?
Hasbara Handbook: Promoting Israel on Campus
http://www.middle-east-info.org/take/wujshasbara.pdf
what's with the "Jewish State" thing?
with rights for "minorities"?
why not ONE STATE with everybody equal.
easy...no walls, no checkpoints, no barbed wire, no guard towers, no apartheid.
Talmud doesn't allow for that though ...does it Pete?
no, it doesn't. it calls for total domination and subjugation of the goyim.
everybody knows it.
a-a-a-a-a-anyways.
let's see where we're going with this......
wow!
okay! i'm CONVINCED!
most definitely porn; drugs; strip clubs; usury; gambling; graft; homosexuality; drunkeness; organ trafficing; child kidnapping and prostitution rings; arms smuggling; and the false religion of Rabbinic Judaism sounds better.
like....are you saying unbelieving unregenerate jews are any more or less unregenerate than any other unsaved person?
what's the deal here?
hey....maybe we should look at the Talmud.
wanna?
why are you speaking from a Christian perspective?
i for one don't believe you're a christian.
virtually no jews today are ancient israelites Pete.
don't you know that?
many of them do now.
so not sure where you're going with this.
even if they are, most are secular, just like ALL other secular ppl.
and the religious folks adhere to Talmudic Judaism, not Moses.
which is an antichrist religion just like Islam.
but you already know that....dont you.
CONT.....
Re: The Return of Jews to Israel
CONT....
summary: so far we have a bunch of infantile Zionist propaganda making Israel/judaism out to be good clean heros and arabs/islam out to be bad awful subhumans. standard stuff.
nothing really about Jesus so far.
but let's see....
really!
i'll be sure to tell my Canadian government not to forget that.
and my Muslim neighbours ought to be....what....spied on? arrested? boycotted?
what exactly?
Pete....so far i don't see much about The Great Commission. i see calls to WAR.
and Zionist propaganda.
you got anything else?
see, anyone who denies Jesus Christ is the Son of God, the Messiah and Savior come in the flesh is ANTICHRIST.
so i reckon we got more than 1.5 billion.
include all unbelieving jews in ISRAEL on your antichrist list.
they all need THE GOSPEL.
not money or guns for WAR Pete.
don't forget now.....
1 John 2:22
Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is the antichrist--denying the Father and the Son.
okay.
we're done.
'Islamists' didn't do 9-11.
Israel and the neocons did it.
and blamed it on Arabs....= perpetual WAR ON TERROR, which the American people are tired of.
so they need this constant #$%^&* agitation to keep them in fear.
ready for the next false flag event.
sickening. and really really OLD.
i reckon it'll work though.
it always does.
..............
see you later then.
i might come back sometime and dig through your TRASH if i feel like it.
CONT....
summary: so far we have a bunch of infantile Zionist propaganda making Israel/judaism out to be good clean heros and arabs/islam out to be bad awful subhumans. standard stuff.
nothing really about Jesus so far.
but let's see....
really!
i'll be sure to tell my Canadian government not to forget that.
and my Muslim neighbours ought to be....what....spied on? arrested? boycotted?
what exactly?
Pete....so far i don't see much about The Great Commission. i see calls to WAR.
and Zionist propaganda.
you got anything else?
see, anyone who denies Jesus Christ is the Son of God, the Messiah and Savior come in the flesh is ANTICHRIST.
so i reckon we got more than 1.5 billion.
include all unbelieving jews in ISRAEL on your antichrist list.
they all need THE GOSPEL.
not money or guns for WAR Pete.
don't forget now.....
1 John 2:22
Who is the liar? It is whoever denies that Jesus is the Christ. Such a person is the antichrist--denying the Father and the Son.
okay.
we're done.
'Islamists' didn't do 9-11.
Israel and the neocons did it.
and blamed it on Arabs....= perpetual WAR ON TERROR, which the American people are tired of.
so they need this constant #$%^&* agitation to keep them in fear.
ready for the next false flag event.
sickening. and really really OLD.
i reckon it'll work though.
it always does.
..............
see you later then.
i might come back sometime and dig through your TRASH if i feel like it.
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