A Simple Question, No Contention, No Controversy

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Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
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PHYSICAL circ. is no longer required in the NT....NOW we (men and women) are circumcised by GOD in the heart.
You can say this for circumcision, but you refuse to say this for the Lord's Day. However if Sabbath-keeping is required, so is circumcision. There are no half-measure in the Law of Moses. Either keep it all, or you have broken it all.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
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Jaume,
What I am going to say is not meant as a criticism.

You aren't yet understanding being one with Jesus if you are following any law. That was His prayer for us His body. That we would come to understand this.

In being one, we are walking in Him daily...aware of His Presence always, and then moving in and with Him. There is nothing in between to keep Him seperate from us. Personally or as a whole together.

I am not there yet. However, I see it. The truth of this. And my motto is, if you see it, you can be it.

Truth comes as revelation first....experience brings faith. Faith is you know that you know that you know. Unshakable. Not just belief.

Our biggest enemy? I believe is our own "self".
Perhaps were I to share something important to me with you, in the spirit of confession to all.

Mondays I take a long walk to the closest shipping center. Yesterday I found myself singing to our Fadther that I may walk clad in praises of Him, and clad in the righteousness of Jesus.

Thinking in these terms is due to the fact I know without the praises of God on my lips and the righteousness of our Lord and Savior, Jesus, I am naked, I have nothing on my own.

The righteousness of Jesus includes His obedience unto a horrible, agonizing deth on a tree just for me.....for all.

We are taught to imitate Jesus Christ. We are taught to hear Him.

How can anyone say He believes Him and hears Him ifhey believe obedience is being under the law? This thinking is perverse in the sight of the mercy and grace of our Father, Jesus.
 
Mar 28, 2016
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Lately I see the Sabbath issue and the differences men have because some make the word Sabbath into a time sensitive word. Adding to the true meaning of the word Sabbath which simply means "rest" with no other meaning added. Even most paraphrasers change the word into a time sensitive word.
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,782
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You can say this for circumcision, but you refuse to say this for the Lord's Day. However if Sabbath-keeping is required, so is circumcision. There are no half-measure in the Law of Moses. Either keep it all, or you have broken it all.
I try to keep the Commandments of GOD given personally by HIM...NOT those commandments given through Moses. There is NO MENTION in the Commandments of circumcision but certainly of keeping the Sabbath day holy.
Neither does the 'lords day specify a particular day of the week. Maybe you should put DIFFERENCE between holy and UNholy for better understanding and not lump it all together in confusion....we are not commanded to keep the law of Moses.
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,782
332
83
Lately I see the Sabbath issue and the differences men have because some make the word Sabbath into a time sensitive word. Adding to the true meaning of the word Sabbath which simply means "rest" with no other meaning added. Even most paraphrasers change the word into a time sensitive word.
GOD has made Sabbath TIME-sensitive when HE added ' 7th DAY '. How much more could you define TIME but by a 'literal period ???
Without the exact DAY it could indeed just mean rest...but you can't say a specific day has no meaning !
 
Feb 28, 2016
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EX. 20:1.
And God spoke all these words, saying,

the (10) Commandments are very clear, since they were personally/directly spoken
by God to the people.

MATT. 5:17.
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

keeping the Commandments is 'freedom', and dis-obeying them is 'bondage', or 'jail-time'...
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,782
332
83
EX. 20:1.
And God spoke all these words, saying,

the (10) Commandments are very clear, since they were personally/directly spoken
by God to the people.

MATT. 5:17.
Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

keeping the Commandments is 'freedom', and dis-obeying them is 'bondage', or 'jail-time'...
Yes, and more detail can be found in Deut 5.
 

gb9

Senior Member
Jan 18, 2011
11,709
6,307
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Yes, and more detail can be found in Deut 5.
the inventing done here is by the sda/Hebrew root cults to try to use the lie that Jesus rose on the Sabbath to point toward Sabbath keeping for salvation. there is the great deception.

the Jews kept days from twilight from twilight. ya'll ignore that by the way they counted days, Christ died on thur. afternoon ( 1 ), in the tomb from twilight to twilight ( the Sabbath ) ( 2 ), then rose during the night, ( 3 ), which leads us to " early in the morning on the first day of the week".

the pope and the catholic church did not invent time and day keeping. God ordained the Jewish Sabbath on the last day of the week for Israel, ( only ), thus the next day is the first day of the week.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
24,347
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I try to keep the Commandments of GOD given personally by HIM...NOT those commandments given through Moses. There is NO MENTION in the Commandments of circumcision but certainly of keeping the Sabbath day holy.
There is definitely a command given by God PERSONALLY to Israel through Moses. All commandments given through Moses are God's commandments, so don't try to dodge the issue:

LEVITICUS 12
1
And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean.

3 And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised.


And the commandment for Sabbath-keeping was also given to Israel, NOT the Church:

EXODUS 35
1 And Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said unto them, These are the words which the LORD hath commanded, that ye should do them.

2 Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death.

3Ye shall kindle no fire throughout your habitations upon the sabbath day.


Now go to Acts 15 and see if either of these commandments were given to the Church.
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,782
332
83
There is definitely a command given by God PERSONALLY to Israel through Moses. All commandments given through Moses are God's commandments, so don't try to dodge the issue:

LEVITICUS 12
1
And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,

2 Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, If a woman have conceived seed, and born a man child: then she shall be unclean seven days; according to the days of the separation for her infirmity shall she be unclean.

3 And in the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised.


And the commandment for Sabbath-keeping was also given to Israel, NOT the Church:

EXODUS 35
1 And Moses gathered all the congregation of the children of Israel together, and said unto them, These are the words which the LORD hath commanded, that ye should do them.

2 Six days shall work be done, but on the seventh day there shall be to you an holy day, a sabbath of rest to the LORD: whosoever doeth work therein shall be put to death.

3Ye shall kindle no fire throughout your habitations upon the sabbath day.


Now go to Acts 15 and see if either of these commandments were given to the Church.
I don't need to go to Acts, I know that JESUS/YASHUA did not teach any of this in the NT. Why are You still rumaging around in the commandments of Moses contained in the ordinances long since fulfilled by Christ ?
 
T

theanointedsinner

Guest
God rested on the 7th day
the sabbath was made for man
but the sabbath is optional right now
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
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jHow can the Sabbath be optional? I see this nowhere in the Word.

Were this the case, Love is optional and I know God is not optional, He IS:

Praise God, He is worthy not we.
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
2,782
332
83
God rested on the 7th day
the sabbath was made for man
but the sabbath is optional right now
It seems there is some MISunderstanding in this.. The Sabbath Day is not optional....God has not 'rescinded it. However, it is no longer a command to keep it as in the OT. NOW we keep it and God's Commandments from 'choice and LOVE to HIM - not because we are forced.
This is a clear indication to God who LOVES HIM and who does not !!!
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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Australia
righteousness is by faith, keeping the law does not make us saved.
Rom 3:31 Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
Rom 6:1 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?

Rom 7:6 But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

We are delivered by the death of Jesus, His blood makes us clean from the transgression of the law. But does that mean we can continue in sin?

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet.

No law = no sin.

Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.
Rom 7:9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died.
Rom 7:10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death.
Rom 7:11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.
Rom 7:12 Wherefore the law is holy, and the commandment holy, and just, and good.
Rom 7:13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.
Rom 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.

This tells me the law is still valid for us to understand sin today.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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Australia
Faith without works is dead.
Jas 2:9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
Jas 2:10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.
Jas 2:11 For he that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law.
Jas 2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Sure Jesus covers our sins and we all fall short of the glory of God, but these verses tell me that the Ten commandments are still valid.
If the Law is written on our hearts and we break one we need to repent. but if the law is not valid we don't need to repent.
The one law that is argued is the Sabbath. "For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all. "

The Sabbath is part of the law talked about above.
 

JaumeJ

Senior Member
Jul 2, 2011
21,229
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Many, most, in the forums cannot distinguish between obedience and being under the law.

Righteousness is Jesus Christ, not any of us are without His righteous nous as our garments.

Obedience is obeying what Jesus has taught us in word and deed just how to obsessive what remains of the law, as He teaches, He has not destroyed the law, it is fulfilled by Him, and we have it in our inward parts forever......yes, we obey the law under grace and mercy. Do not be deceived by the deceived or wicked ones.

Do not teach against the law none of the laws that remain after knowing which as taught by Jesus Christ. Those who believe to the contrary still have the veil of Moses.

Is Love destroyed? No! Neither are the laws contained and making up the sum total of love.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
3,555
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Australia
The first question asked
God created the Sabbath on the seventh day.
Gen 2:1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them.
Gen 2:2 And on the seventh day God ended his work which he had made; and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made.
Gen 2:3 And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.
 

beta

Senior Member
Aug 8, 2016
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AGREE with all posts by TMS and JJ. The Commandments are spiritual and eternal. Man is not left without direction and instruction until the end of his days. Those who 'do away with them ' will hear the words 'Depart from me you who work iniquity....Jesus never knew them ! HE kept His Fathers Commandments and was obedient unto death. Are we being conformed to His image ? or not ?