A Study of Torah from Gen. - Rev.

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Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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#81
He was your first murderer, your first fugitive. what is a fugitive,what is a vagabond. it is all there in genesis where God sent him out of his presence. . anyone that finds him means they were looking for him, not come across him.
 
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Rainrider

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
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#82
He was your first murderer, your first fugitive. what is a fugitive,what is a vagabond. it is all there in genesis where God sent him out of his presence. .
Just edited my last post. Hope it helps. I my self see none of you say in Gen.4 Yes Cain was sent out, yet he was not a fugitive, that would imply he was running from justice. His judgment had already been set.
 

Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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#83
man, are you reading the scripture? it says he is a fugitive in plain daylight GENESIS ;4 14
 

Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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#84
Don't forget verse 12 where God pronounced his sentence.
 

Rainrider

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
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#85
man, are you reading the scripture? it says he is a fugitive in plain daylight GENESIS ;4 14
I know it does, yet that doesn't change the fact that
1 Cain was scared, and pleading for his life
2 That was before sentence was handed down
3 a person can not flee from justice, once a sentence is handed down.
If one only looks at a part of a passage out of context, they can well say HaShem isn't real. then show said statement from the word if the other person doesn't place said passage back into context, they may believe it as well.
 

Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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#86
I can't talk to you. you are spiritually blind. sorry , don't mean to offend, but you are.
 
Jun 5, 2017
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#87
Hi All just some thoughts about the “Torah” (Hebrew) or “Pentateuch” (Greek); the Book of Moses (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy).

The purpose of the Torah or Book of Moses was to;

1. Provide the history of the 7 Day week of the creation of all things and the Creator (Genesis)
2. Provide the history of the fall of mankind into sin and our destruction because of sin with a great flood (Genesis)
3. Provide the history of God’s faithful people that followed God through this period (the minority Genesis and Exodos).
4. Provide the history of God’s covenant to Abraham and his seed because they obeyed God through faith and how God worked through his chosen people (Genesis and Exodos)
5. Provide history of the oppression of Gods people from those that do not follow God (Exodus)
6. Provide history of the deliverance of God’s people from oppression (Exodus)
7. Provide history of how God gave His Law (10 commandments) to his people which was spoken by God, written by God on two tables of stone from Sinai. (Exodus)
8. Provide a description of the plan of salvation from sin revealed through the Priestly Sanctuary service, ceremonial laws and animal sacrificial system that include lessons from feast and holy days, new moons and ceremonial Sabbaths connected to these feasts (e.g. The Passover, Day of Atonement, Feast of Trumpets etc.) that all point to the coming of Jesus as the Saviour of the world. (Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy)
9. The rest of the Book of Moses (Leviticus, Numbers and Deuteronomy) outlines laws of Moses that are related to (the sanctuary service, ceremonial laws, civil and health laws.

Some people try to say that the Torah is the 10 commandments but it is only a description of them and the background as to why they were given. The Book of Moses “Torah” is based around God’s 10 commandments but is not God’s 10 commandments. It describes what the 10 commandment are, how they were given and provides the background as to why God’s Law was given. It is main focus of the old covenant given to God's people before Jesus and the new covenant arrived.

The main purpose of the Torah besides the 9 points above was to provide a prescription if God’s people should sin and break any of his 10 commandments through the Sanctuary service, ceremonial laws and sacrificial animal systems. The Feast days, Holy Days, New Moons and annual ceremonial Sabbaths, were a shadow of things to come and pointed to the coming of the Messiah (Col 2:16-17, Heb 10:1, Eph 2:14). These all pointed to Jesus as our sacrifice for sin and our advocate in heaven as our great high priest. The Torah (Book of Moses) is not the Law of God but a background to WHY it was given and the remedy for sin in the Old covenant. It was always separated from the 10 commandments (tables of Stone) placed in the side of the “Ark of the Covenant” but not inside the Ark of the Covenant with the 10 commandments. The Torah or Book of Moses is complimentary to God’s Law but is not God’s Law. God's Law is forever. The laws of Moses (Sanctuary laws, ceremonial laws, annual feasts etc) on the other hand were all Shadows that pointed to Jesus and were nailed to the cross.

Hope this may be helpful to some

God bless you.
 
Jun 5, 2017
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#88
continuing and further...


Many in Christianity are teaching a counterfeit Gospel that is not really the Gospel of Jesus at all. This counterfeit Gospel always tries to do away with God's Law and always says all you have to do is believe in Jesus, believe in Jesus. While this is partially true it does not tell the full story so is a counterfeit Gospel because the devils believe and they are not saved right (James 2:9)? We need to live by every Word that proceeds out of the mouth of God (Matt 4:4)

The counterfeit Gospel is a Gospel that does not include God's forever Laws (10 Commandments). Why is this so? Because it is only through the Law of God (10 commandments) that any of us have a knowledge of what sin is (1John 3:4; Rom 3:20;24). If we do away with God's Law we have no knowledge of sin. If we have no knowledge of sin we have no need of a savior. If we have no need of a savior we have no salvation. If we have no salvation we are lost. "For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law." (Rom 2:12).

God's Law shows us that we are sinners in need of a savior. God's Law was given to us that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God (Rom 3:19). It shows us that we are sinners and cannot save ourselves from this disease that we have within us so that we can by Faith lay hold of the promises of God's Words so that Jesus can save us from our sins. Jesus did not come to save the righteous (those that think they do not need saving) but sinners (those that know their need of saving) (Matt 9:12-13; Mark 2:17; Luke 5:32) God's Law has always been part of the true Gospel of Christ. The counterfeit Gospel does not have it. God's forever Law (the 10 commandments) is the foundation of both the Old and the New Covenant and the very foundation and basis of the true Gospel of Christ.

God bless you all. To him who loved us and washed us in His own Blood be the power and glory forever and ever
 

Gabriel2020

Senior Member
May 6, 2017
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#90
Amen, he came to fulfill the law. which means completion., and that was the rest of the gospel to go along with the law.
 
Jun 5, 2017
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#91
Amen, he came to fulfill the law. which means completion., and that was the rest of the gospel to go along with the law.
Absolutely! He came to fulfull the Law in us who walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit." (Rom 8:4). This is the new Covenant (Heb 8:10-12), God writing His Laws in the hearts of His people so that they can follow Him because they love him. Love is the fulfilling of God's Law

God bless you
 
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May 11, 2014
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#92
When you say salvation comes by faith, followed by obedience, do you mean obedience to the tassels and other instructions in the law of Moses?
 

Dan_473

Senior Member
Mar 11, 2014
9,054
1,051
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#93
I believe we may have missed a commandment along the way.

Gen 3:19
For you are dust,
and you shall return to dust.
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
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#94
This is turning out not to be a complete study at all

ifvwe we're going through Genesis to revelation, there should be more of scripture and less of men's input
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
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#95
Shouldn't we start all over again with each FULL chapter and not bits and pieces with a man's overview telling the participants what "GOD really said" all the while, leaving out FULLY what GOD really did say
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
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#96
In Gen. 4 we are told of Cain and Able. Most churches have long explanations of this chapter, but God always has a simple teaching in His word that must be looked at first. The simple teaching is one of obedience. A principle of the Lord that we find all through scripture is that blood is required for forgiveness. In Ex 12:13 scripture tells us that when God sees the blood on the doorpost He will pass that house and not take the first born. Often we are told in scripture that blood is precious to the Lord.

The principles of the Lord was not written down until Moses, it was given orally. From the beginning God let His principles be known. We are told that it is through grace we are forgiven our sins, not through our own labors. Cain and Able had to know this, yet Cain used the results of his own labor to sacrifice for atonement. Able obeyed and used the blood of a perfect lamb sacrified for his sin.
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
591
113
#97
In Gen. 4 we are told of Cain and Able. Most churches have long explanations of this chapter, but God always has a simple teaching in His word that must be looked at first. The simple teaching is one of obedience. A principle of the Lord that we find all through scripture is that blood is required for forgiveness. In Ex 12:13 scripture tells us that when God sees the blood on the doorpost He will pass that house and not take the first born. Often we are told in scripture that blood is precious to the Lord.

The principles of the Lord was not written down until Moses, it was given orally. From the beginning God let His principles be known. We are told that it is through grace we are forgiven our sins, not through our own labors. Cain and Able had to know this, yet Cain used the results of his own labor to sacrifice for atonement. Able obeyed and used the blood of a perfect lamb sacrified for his sin.
The simple hidden thing from the beginning is the attitude of the heart

Abel brought to the lord an acceptable sacrifice from a pure and clean heart
Cain didnt

Cain was too busy watching his brother
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
591
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#98
At that time there was no mention that a sacrifice was required. Nor was it mentioned that Abel or Cain had incurred personal sin

in fact GOD forewarns Cain to do what is right because sin is crouching at his door
 

Rainrider

Senior Member
Jun 17, 2017
1,534
87
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#99
When you say salvation comes by faith, followed by obedience, do you mean obedience to the tassels and other instructions in the law of Moses?
No. The Law is divided so that one can clearly see what parts belong to what peoples. When this study gets to that point, we will see just what laws are for who. It is the lack of thus simple understanding that prompted this study. Yet at the same time, to understand anything, one must have the full story, and not just the parts they like. Trust me, there are parts to this story I don't like. Yet they can't be removed just because I don't what they tell us, or what is going on in the minds of people. Of the 613 laws we will find in Torah, a vary small portion will apply to Gentiles. We will also find that some don't make it past the OT at all.
 

miknik5

Senior Member
Jun 2, 2016
7,833
591
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Please don't remove Matthew 17. It will prove to be very important in understanding JESUS' authority and preeminence over and above the law and the prophets

we certainly don't believe there are three tabernacles

Do we?