A true Christian is a "follower" of Jesus Christ

[followjesus]

Lying like the above statement is just ludicrous and show the shallowness of the slander
and distortions these people hold inside themselves.

People do not love sin, they are slaves to it. The HG claim is you cannot be free from it,
it is merely their as a reminder of your need for Christ.

But to face this reality is too hard, because it admits failure, which emotionally is hard and
a place you do not want to go. So the focus is always on Jesus's victory and imputed
righteousness. But that does not deal with the belief they are continually sinning and missing
what they should be.

And so not surprisingly the doctrine comes, do not be sin aware but God aware.
Paul would rather say this

Do not think of yourself more highly than you ought, but rather think of yourself with sober judgment, in accordance with the faith God has distributed to each of you.
Rom 12:3

Now if Paul thought people were continually being caught in sin and condemnation
he would not have written the above comments. When the corithians where in sin
he wrote

Therefore let us keep the Festival, not with the old bread leavened with malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
1 Cor 5:8

Now in all sincerity lying has just got to stop if you claim to follow Jesus.
What is being said is simple and open and honest. So I would hope if you know Jesus
at all you will be able to do this. Or has even this passed you by?

its the doctrines some keep bro. a doctrine is not just the words we look at, but it is when we begin to pattern our thinking after a way of thought. doctrine is how we think. a false doctrine is blinding and powerful when we trulky believe it. false doctrine doesnt originate from anywhere but Gods wnwmy and ours. the gosl of a false doctrine has been and will forever be, to turn our minds, and therefore our lives away from the truth, who is Jesus alone. the gospel is meant to bring mans corrupt thinking ( a result from the original deception and passed through flesh and vlood to all) into line with ids thinking ( the gospel) Jesus is exactly right as you know and i know and many others know, some just arent there yet. when a false doctrine takes hold in a mind, its a struggle to change the thinking, but always possible with Gods Living and enduring, all powerful and all sufficient word. a false line of thought creates a greater struggle to find truth, because its not only now a result of the original deception, but on top of that, there is a false answer to that deception. 2 problems rather than coming from a place of inherited thinking of adam and eve, then we have another layer of deception on top of that original one. the answer for even a thousand deceptions is Gods truth, Jesus Christ and His thinking simply accepted as the truth. that is the victory over the world, and our effort to bring our minds into conformity of Gods Chosen One

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG - Do not know what you mean, but if you are happy, that is all I can hope
for you.

I love Jesus because it is simple. Learn how to meet needs, to share love and
grow in the Kingdom. I thought everyone knew this.

But then people not of the Kingdom are here as well. Hallelujah, for in all things
it is to Gods glory.

When you walk with Jesus the only enemies are His enemies so have no fear, for
He is with you.

At that time many will turn away from the faith and will betray and hate each other, and many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. Because of the increase of wickedness, the love of most will grow cold, but the one who stands firm to the end will be saved.
Matt 24:10-13

So be prepared for irrational, unyielding and deluded opposition, because to them
you will be evil but to the Lord blessed.

You still failed to respond to the post where I caught you red handed twisting my words, and slandering what I said by misquoting me.

So my words stand

You do it to yourself.

I can not help you Peter. No one can, Until you repent of what you are doing, you have no witness..

You cannot go around judging people for doing the very thing you yourself are doing.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

it all hinges on whether a person takes Jesus word for things. He is the way, the truth and the Life. the very One who is returning, gives the clearest picture of what His return will be like, yet some cant acceopt it, so they have to change the color and shape of the lens to make it apply and support thier own way of thinking, thoier own way of Life, to excuse them to follow thier own will rather than Gods. when a person has to change what Jesus says to make it fit a doctrine, that is when they need to abandon that very doctrine and follow Jesus

Would this be like watering down Gods law. So you can appear to be righteous, Thus no longer needing the grace of God. So the demand of God (perfection) is no longer reuired? and you can judge other people as sinners, And free grace preachers (although grace is not free, Jesus paid the price)

Sadly, that has been going on since Jesus day, It is not anything new, and will continue until he comes. The modern day Pharisee lives strong and has great power.. But he will suffer the same fate as the jewish Pharisee, Unless he becomes like paul and repents.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

amen thats the wisest and simplest doctrine you state there. " listen and learn from the Lord"

In order to do that, You have to hear all of Gods words. Not just bits and peaces of it.

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

right belief is necessary, thats why we need to believe in Jesus and learn to believe as He taught and clearly He taught " dont just hear and think this, apply it to life" thats right thinking.

You cannot renew your own mind by just "taking thought", no more than you can just take thought and add a foot to your stature.

Luke 12:25-26
[SUP]25 [/SUP]And which of you with taking thought can add to his stature one cubit?

[SUP]26 [/SUP]If ye then be not able to do that thing which is least, why take ye thought for the rest?



It is God who renews the mind, and gives you the ability think "right thoughts" by the working of His Spirit. Men do not command the hand of God just by "right thinking".

 

[InSpiritInTruth]

Psalm 51:10
Create in me a clean heart, O God; and renew a right spirit within me.


Ephesians 4:23
And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;

Unless you are the Creator God, you cannot renew your own mind. ​

 

[Grace777x70]

Thank God that the gospel of the grace of Christ has given us believers a new heart!

I believe that scripture teaches that we have new hearts now in Christ as a new creation in Him. In the Old Testament David cried out prophetically "Create in me a clean heart O God". Jesus Himself says to "clean up the inside of the cup and the vessel will be clean".

We don't need to search our hearts for wrong things - we need to have our minds renewed to the truth of Christ living in us now.

It's the flesh that "speaks" to us as all the "works of the flesh" in Gal 5 are from the flesh. We are not "in the flesh" as Paul says in Romans 8:9 - but we are "in the Spirit" - our inner man in Christ.

We need as Christians to learn to live from this new heart that was "created" in us because of Christ's finished work for us.

I firmly believe we are confusing the "desires of the flesh which still has the law of sin in it" ( Romans 7:23 ) and wrongly calling it our heart. We have been circumcised with the circumcision of the Heart - called the circumcision of Christ and the body of flesh. Col 2:11. This is also called "being sealed by the Holy Spirit" Eph 1:13

The Holy Spirit "cut away" ( as in physical circumcision ) the body of the flesh from the inner man who is in Christ - the new creation - created in righteousness and holiness. Eph 4:23

Here are the reasons why I believe we Christians have a new heart now in Christ and not a corrupted heart. We need to learn how to live from this new heart which is where Christ is in us as one spirit by the Holy Spirit.

The believers new heart in Christ is created in righteousness and holiness: First it was prophesied in the Old Testament.

Ezekiel 36:26 (NASB)
[SUP]26 [/SUP] "Moreover, I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone ( old man ) from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. ( new man in Christ )


Romans 2:29 (NASB)
[SUP]29 [/SUP] But he is a Jew who is one inwardly; and circumcision is that which is of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the letter; and his praise is not from men, but from God.


By grace we have been given a new heart that is obedient.

Romans 6:17 (NASB)
[SUP]17 [/SUP] But thanks be to God that though you were slaves of sin, you became obedient from the heart to that form of teaching to which you were committed,

God cleaned house and moved in. God will not dwell in unrighteousness. God through the Holy Spirit is in our inner man now.

Ephesians 3:16-17 (NASB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] that He would grant you, according to the riches of His glory, to be strengthened with power through His Spirit in the inner man,

[SUP]17 [/SUP] so that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; and that you, being rooted and grounded in love,

God sealed us and gave us the Holy Spirit in our new hearts.

2 Corinthians 1:22 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] who also sealed us and gave us the Spirit in our hearts as a pledge.

We have the Spirit of God's Son in our hearts now.

Galatians 4:6 (NASB)
[SUP]6 [/SUP] Because you are sons, God has sent forth the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying, "Abba! Father!"

God has cleansed our hearts by faith.

Acts 15:8-9 (NASB)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] "And God, who knows the heart, testified to them giving them the Holy Spirit, just as He also did to us;

[SUP]9 [/SUP] and He made no distinction between us and them, cleansing their hearts by faith.

We love from our hearts now as it is pure.

1 Timothy 1:5 (NASB)
[SUP]5 [/SUP] But the goal of our instruction is love from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith.

2 Timothy 2:22 (NASB)
[SUP]22 [/SUP] Now flee from youthful lusts and pursue righteousness, faith, love and peace, with those who call on the Lord from a pure heart. (this is a believer in Christ..hang around them )

1 Peter 3:4 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] but let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the imperishable quality of a gentle and quiet spirit, which is precious in the sight of God.

There are more but this should work to show that the believer has a new heart in Christ.

We still have the flesh to deal with in our bodies and we are admonished to not to yield to that...but all that is a different subject.

 

[PeterJens]

You still failed to respond to the post where I caught you red handed twisting my words, and slandering what I said by misquoting me.
So my words stand
You do it to yourself.
I can not help you Peter. No one can, Until you repent of what you are doing, you have no witness..
You cannot go around judging people for doing the very thing you yourself are doing.

EG - who are you really? A shadow on a hill, something that is of value.
The problem is my friend if truth cannot dwell in you then all else is lost.
I am not going to try to understand your logic because it is too full of lies.

The emotional impact of your words evaporate once you loose the integrity
in someone elses eyes. I am sure you do not understand this, but God bless.

I am not going to resist you only point out lies when spoken, it is up to you
what you do with it. I cannot be guilty or troubled by what I have not done.

This is the wonder of a good conscience and a clean heart. Sorry you do not
know what this means.

 

[PeterJens]

What is a sign of someone caught out?
Reams of junk triggered by a few words. It is called a wild fire as it rampages
through someones conscience and ideas. They try so hard to answer the question
before them but it just seems to slip out of their grasp.

 

[PeterJens]

What does it mean to me to follow Christ?

To dwell on His word.
What jumped out for me was the persistent prayer for justice.
Jesus is saying He will bring it. Judgement does happen here and now.

I had not seen it so plainly before.
Jesus calls us to be yoked with Him.

It has been interesting to hear so many people hate this concept.
But think about this. The Lord of creation is willing to teach you.

 

[JGIG]

Always so entertaining to read the imaginary conversations PJ has with imaginary posters here at the BDF . . .

 

[PeterJens]

Always so entertaining to read the imaginary conversations PJ has with imaginary posters here at the BDF . . .

I ask myself a question to put a point into context. It is a way of exploring an idea.
Much of bdf gets itself into polarised positions which are boring most of the time once
declared.

If you ever read a novel, it is all written by one individual who is actually discussing
something in their own head. Maybe you have never noticed this lol.

 

[PeterJens]

What I find amazing about Jesus is you are never the same person at the
end of the journey that you were at the beginning.

Some of my friends I could not say that is true of, in fact they are rather like
a collapsed old house slowly falling into the sea.

 

[Stephen63]

if you truly mean what you just said, about admiring someone else's opinions, and you want to be encouraging . THEN STOP CALLING ANYONE WHO DOES NOT AGREE WITH YOU A LAIR. stop saying you are being slandered. stop bad-mouthing grace 777 by 7. that guy knows more about the Word than you and me combined.

The only reason you're taking up for G777 is because if he gives up & leaves, it will leave the others to do the REAL legwork & the group would fall apart. Actually G777 knows more than the whole HG group combined.

You shouldn't worry though..... G777 isn't going anywhere. He won't go & nobody's gonna ban him. Haven't you figured that out already?

 

[Cee]

It's interesting when we say one thing is a command and another isn't. They are both commands. Heal the sick, that's a command not a suggestion. Love one another that's a command.

Pursue love, that's a command.
Earnestly desire spiritual gifts, that's a command.

It's not one or the other. It's both.

When Jesus returns will He find faith on the Earth? Or will people say we'll I did the things I could control, but not things that only you can do.

It's the parable of the talents. Well I didn't want to lose what you have me so I buried it.

We pursue love and earnestly desire gifts. It's both not either or.

But I'm not going to repeat myself and argue Scriptures that are so clear.

Bless you thanks for the discourse.

i think you are confusing evidence of the holy spirit, with what Jesus teaches His followers to actually do remember miracles are a gift of the spirit, some are given that power some are not, others are given other gifts to use to show the world Jesus is true. miracles are for unbelievers to see and then believe, to be convinced, same with many gifts of the spirit. when He says " we are to do the things He did" it relates to " deny yourself pick up your cross and follow me" that is what the greater works are, the greatest Love, selfless, sacrificial Love, denying my wants, to meet anothers need.

Thats the commands of Jesus, to Love those who are unloved by the world. when He says " Love others as yourself" when were hungry, we feed ourselves, thirsty we get a drink, naked we clothe ourselves ect. Love is in the action according to the word. the gisfts of the spirit, are for spreading the gospels truth, evidence to helop others believe. Ithink if you Look at matthew 25 you can see that those who are sent to eternal fire had the spirit, yet failed to Love others. its really clear in the scriptures i left. they prophecied ( a spiritual gift) 1 corinthians 14:1 "Follow the way of love and eagerly desire gifts of the Spirit, especially prophecy." and in matthew 7 " Lord did we not prophecy in your name?" these are rejected with the phrase " away from me you evildoers matthew 7:22-23 "Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!"

they prophecied in His name, a gift of the spirit for edification and building up the church, this is not a command that we are to do, but a manifestation of a spiritaul gift. the things He teaches us to actually go and do, are evident through His gospel " Love one another with action and in truth, not with words but by laying down your life for others. meeting thier need as we do our own when we are able. His gospel teaches godly Love, and for His followers to act in that. a manifestation of a spiritual gift, also is to be used, but not all receive the same gifts, so theres a difference in a command, and a spiritual gift. all are commanded to Love others, those with a spiritual gift, excercise it for the purpose of edification. that has zero to do with salvation. as you see in matthew 7:22-23, and matthew 25. we may have great spiritual gifts, but if we do not " follow the way of Gods Love" we will hear what we do not want to hear from The Lord. if we Just take Jesus words, as if he knows perfectly what he is saying then its evident that what we do, having received forgiveness beforehand, matters greatly. to receive His blood and not receive His word...thats a scary thought.


I believe we all shopuld be among those who hear " well done my good and faithful servant, come and take your inheritance prepared for you from the creation of the world" those who give thier selves to His Love, applying it to our lives for the sake of others.

rather than be among thos who call Him lord, and hear "away from me you who are cursed into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels."

the clearest picture of Judgement the most unmistakable is that which Jesus himself Gives. those who did not actually do God s will, they believed, even had spiritual gifts and used them, what they lacked and what made the difference in eternal Life in his presence and glory, or eternal Life in eternal fire was whether they actually did the things He taught. which is to Love in action and in truth.

james 2:14-16 "What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them? 15Suppose a brother or a sister is without clothes and daily food. 16If one of you says to them, “Go in peace; keep warm and well fed,” but does nothing about their physical needs, what good is it? "

or again

1 john 3:16-18 "This is how we know what love is: Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. And we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers and sisters. 17If anyone has material possessions and sees a brother or sister in need but has no pity on them, how can the love of God be in that person? 18Dear children, let us not love with words or speech but with actions and in truth."

its really about belief in action

 

[eternally-gratefull]

EG - who are you really? A shadow on a hill, something that is of value.
The problem is my friend if truth cannot dwell in you then all else is lost.
I am not going to try to understand your logic because it is too full of lies.

The emotional impact of your words evaporate once you loose the integrity
in someone elses eyes. I am sure you do not understand this, but God bless.

I am not going to resist you only point out lies when spoken, it is up to you
what you do with it. I cannot be guilty or troubled by what I have not done.

This is the wonder of a good conscience and a clean heart. Sorry you do not
know what this means.

I pointed out your lie All you had to do was quote it and respond to it, You have not even acknowledged it is even there..

All you can do is blame everyone else. and not even admit what you did

Thats sad peter. Tha is real sad that your pride is so deep you can not even admit a mistake. If you can;t admit a miastake, How can you admit to God your sin? It must be rough.

 

[Grandpa]

What does it mean to me to follow Christ?

To dwell on His word.
What jumped out for me was the persistent prayer for justice.
Jesus is saying He will bring it. Judgement does happen here and now.

I had not seen it so plainly before.
Jesus calls us to be yoked with Him.

It has been interesting to hear so many people hate this concept.
But think about this. The Lord of creation is willing to teach you.

You know what people really don't like?

Its the idea of not having power over every situation. They love their free will. They abstained from the unclean. They keep themselves from sin.

But that's not what the Lord tells us.

2 Corinthians 12:9 [FONT=&quot]And he said unto me, [/FONT][FONT=&quot]My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness.[/FONT][FONT=&quot] Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

[/FONT]If you are relying on your own strength and your own understanding then you are not relying on the strength and power of the Lord Jesus Christ.

Its that simple.


Why is it, do you think, that "your" group has such disdain for His Grace? Because it takes away from the illusion of your own power. Why else would you refer to it as "Hyper"?

No one who relies on the Lord Jesus Christ would ever call His Grace hyper grace. That is a term for scoffers, dishonoring the Work and Grace of God.


It is completely logical for legalists and workers to have a disdain for Grace. How is it fair that the legalists work so hard to be "sinless". Everyone should have to work as hard as they do. How can people expect to make it to the Kingdom of God if they are not at least as "righteous" as the legalist and worker, "maintaining" their salvation and keeping themselves "clean" and "holy".

 

[miknik5]

What does it mean to me to follow Christ?

To dwell on His word.
What jumped out for me was the persistent prayer for justice.
Jesus is saying He will bring it. Judgement does happen here and now.

I had not seen it so plainly before.
Jesus calls us to be yoked with Him.

It has been interesting to hear so many people hate this concept.
But think about this. The Lord of creation is willing to teach you.

You are "jumping" ahead of the LORD's MINISTRY then...and need first to be yoked and NOT jump ahead...

 

[miknik5]

What I find amazing about Jesus is you are never the same person at the
end of the journey that you were at the beginning.

Some of my friends I could not say that is true of, in fact they are rather like
a collapsed old house slowly falling into the sea.

You better be. Because most often we are the "better" in the beginning of the walk than at the end...

Which is why the last will be first and the first will be last.

 

[miknik5]

I ask myself a question to put a point into context. It is a way of exploring an idea.
Much of bdf gets itself into polarised positions which are boring most of the time once
declared.

If you ever read a novel, it is all written by one individual who is actually discussing
something in their own head. Maybe you have never noticed this lol.

Change your tagline, sir...it is all about "self"...