Born Again Vs. Saved

[resurrection33]

This ain't heaven friend.

Have you then repented and discovered that it isn't?

 

[resurrection33]

My main concern is that if you persist in this philosophy this will be as close as you ever get to heaven.

Mr 8:37 Or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?

For the cause of Christ
Roger

Like I've said over and over and over again on this website, the Lord led me to repent of sins I was committing, and suddenly my life was transformed into something indescribably beautiful. I can keep witnessing but I can't force anyone to repent.

 

[notuptome]

Mat 12:43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.
45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.

Self reformation is not what the Lord desires.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

 

[limey410]

Have you then repented and discovered that it isn't?

Repent: for the Kingdom of heaven is at hand. Does not mean repent and earth turns in to heaven.

 

[resurrection33]

Mat 12:43 When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none.
44 Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished.
45 Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.

Self reformation is not what the Lord desires.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I believe obeying Jesus is a good idea, not a bad one.

 

[resurrection33]

Repent: for the Kingdom of heaven is at hand. Does not mean repent and earth turns in to heaven.

It means: Repent and find out what happens.

 

[KJV1611]

Absolutely they were born again. Without the Spirit, we're none of His. And there wasn't a KJV in sight.

I take it that you don't believe the indwelling of the Holy Spirit is the second birth?

 

[KJV1611]

Do you believe the OT saints were born again?

Of course they were. The church was in the wilderness and the Spirit of Christ was in them.

 

[KJV1611]

Here's why I say the OT saints were born again...

James 2:23 said Abraham was God's friend. Now, the unregenerate, those devoid of God's Spirit, are His enemies. Romans 8 7-8 attests to that. Those in the flesh, those w/o the Spirit, are His enemies, at enmity with Him. Those in the Spirit, are those who have His Spirit, are born again. They are the only ones who can please God. So, to be God's friend, Abraham had to have God's Spirit within him.

Which Spirit? The Holy Ghost wasn't given until pentecost.

John 16:7 KJV
Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

 

[KJV1611]

I do not have to guess and or put doubt into people's minds by far flung rabbit trails that lead people to doubt the word......seems more than a few threads have that goal!!!!!

David speaks of his salvation in the present tense in the Psalms............

Forgive me for asking your opinion.

 

[KJV1611]

Does anyone argue that the great people of God including th eProhets were nor led by the Holy Spirit?

It is obvious to all of God's children.

Well, if the Comforter and the Holy Spirit are the same thing then the Holy Spirit wasn't around in the old testament because he didn't come until Jesus left.

 

[KJV1611]

It says we are born again of the incorruptible seed.

Doesn't 1 Peter 1:23 say that the incorruptible seed IS the word of God? incorruptible seed is the descriptor of the word of God.

1 Peter 1:23 KJV
Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

 

[KJV1611]

born again and saved its all the same thing............ no one can be saved unless they are born again.............

Do you have any bible verses that prove that?

 

[KJV1611]

Add a third dimension to the discussion: Is being saved the same as going to heaven?

If you're saved you're going to heaven.

 

[KJV1611]

I can relate to KJV in this...though I was never an atheist.

I had an experience that I believe is the new birth. Jesus became my Lord.

Then a few months later, was baptized in Holy Spirit. Perhaps that is what he is calling coming into the kingdom?

I see in scripture that there is the Spirit of Christ. Then there is the kingdom of God within. Walking in kingdom ways is our salvation here on earth.

Resurrection hit on the completion, IMHO.

You know that you're born again if you can see and enter the kingdom of God.... see the spiritual things of the bible and not just the LETTER.

John 3:3-5 KJV
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
[4] Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
[5] Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

 

[stonesoffire]

According to Titus you are incorrect in your experience.

Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

One event not separate events according to scripture.

For the cause of Christ
Roger

I know we don't see eye to eye on this and probably won't since you think the gifts are no longer.

But, the Spirit of Christ was what the disciples received after they realized that Jesus had risen was from the dead. I believe they repented for their unbelief in what He had told them.

They were born again then...Jesus said "receive ye my Spirit as He breathed on them". Then Pentecost...

How many times have we heard "do you have Jesus in your heart"?

Well, have you been "whelmed" by Holy Spirit?

 

[stonesoffire]

You know that you're born again if you can see and enter the kingdom of God.... see the spiritual things of the bible and not just the LETTER.

John 3:3-5 KJV
Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
[4] Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
[5] Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

Can you give an example of some of the spiritual things you see KJV?

 

[KJV1611]

With some emphasis on a few words:

John 3
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Jesus answered and said to him, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

[SUP]4 [/SUP]Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?”

[SUP]5 [/SUP]Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.


So now, the point comes to what is the water referred to?

a) For those born of the Spirit can see.
b) But to Enter requires both water and the Spirit

And there is a distinction between (a) and (b) but virtue of the fact that one "sees" whereas the other "enters".

All those in (a) had a natural birth anyway. So the explanation for water being natural birth cannot be the real explanation.

So ---- what is the "water" referred to? Herein lies the clue. For we know that "salvation" will mean to "enter"

Water is the word of God. John's baptism if you see what I mean.

Ephesians 5:26 KJV
That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

 

[limey410]

Well, if the Comforter and the Holy Spirit are the same thing then the Holy Spirit wasn't around in the old testament because he didn't come until Jesus left.

You believe the word is the Spirit of Christ. And the OT saints had the word.

 

[KJV1611]

Repent: for the Kingdom of heaven is at hand. Does not mean repent and earth turns in to heaven.

This sounds like the earth that always has been to me.

Matthew 13:24-25 KJV
Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:
[25] But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.