Calvinist Kitchen...stirring the pot
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Hebrews 3
15 While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
16 For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
17 But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?
18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.
15 While it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts, as in the provocation.
16 For some, when they had heard, did provoke: howbeit not all that came out of Egypt by Moses.
17 But with whom was he grieved forty years? was it not with them that had sinned, whose carcases fell in the wilderness?
18 And to whom sware he that they should not enter into his rest, but to them that believed not?
19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.
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L
Actually, John 3:16 pretty much includes everyone which is why I really see no point in a debate such as this.
However, you really need to look a little deeper. IF God chooses not to give faith, then we cannot blame anyone for not responding.
The hardening of Pharaoh's heart is attributed to Pharaoh's choice when he refused and continued to refuse. God knew Pharaoh's heart all along. He didn't suddenly hit him with a contrary nature.
God knows who will respond and who will not respond in a positive manner. To simply create nasty people, in His own image mind you (geez, is God nasty?) would make God capricious to say the least. By the Holy Spirit within me, I can pretty much tell when a person is responding and when they are hardening their heart. I don't press issues and time may or not give a change.
To state in a simplified manner that everything that happens is God is to forfeit a proper understanding of both the nature of God and our own response to Him.
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So is this not suggesting that people harden their own hearts because of unbelief? If he is drawing someone and they choose to harden their heart and not accept Him...then that is unbelief.
Today if you will hear his voice harden not your hearts.... seems to be showing that we have a choice. If God is drawing you can choose to accept his call and believe or choose to harden your hearts.
Today if you will hear his voice harden not your hearts.... seems to be showing that we have a choice. If God is drawing you can choose to accept his call and believe or choose to harden your hearts.
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No, actually it isn't.
You are failing yet again to implement 2 Timothy 2:15.
I think that any further engagement would only be profitable if you would submit to using Scripture in context, not out of context as you have been doing.
Apparently you aren't willing to do so at this time. Nor will you answer questions of what you believe a doctrine teaches, a doctrine you've maligned due to unfamiliarity.
No hard feelings, but I think it best to move on to more profitable engagements with those who desire to do so by usage of facts, truth, integrity and in context Scripture.
You are failing yet again to implement 2 Timothy 2:15.
I think that any further engagement would only be profitable if you would submit to using Scripture in context, not out of context as you have been doing.
Apparently you aren't willing to do so at this time. Nor will you answer questions of what you believe a doctrine teaches, a doctrine you've maligned due to unfamiliarity.
No hard feelings, but I think it best to move on to more profitable engagements with those who desire to do so by usage of facts, truth, integrity and in context Scripture.
L
It's worse than that Soggy. Calvin did not even invent the 5 points or 'tulip' as it is often referred to. So actually, people are following the Synod of Dort. That particular event occurred in response to one Jacobus Arminius. Some in this following were against certain points of Calvin's, but they did not know nuthin bout no tulips and may never have been to Holland.
disclaimer: not arguing against Calvinism, the good people here can make up their own minds
not arguing for Mr Arminius cause I can't squeeze the whole truth and nothing but the truth out of him either
disclaimer: not arguing against Calvinism, the good people here can make up their own minds
not arguing for Mr Arminius cause I can't squeeze the whole truth and nothing but the truth out of him either
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