Can the Trinity be Biblically proven?
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<quote>Quasar says :The following is God's description of Himself, directly from the Scriptures.
the Scriptural contradiction of the doctrine of the Trinity is documented in the following, to seek and correct, the false teachings found in it, that were accepted into the Roman Catholic Church in the 4th century A.D.
1. it is necessary to properly identify God, whom both Jesus, Paul and John have done, in Jn.1:18, 4:24; Rom.1:20; 2 Cor.3:17-18, Col.1:15 and 1 Jn.4:12, when they identify Him as Spirit.,</quote>
the Scriptural contradiction of the doctrine of the Trinity is documented in the following, to seek and correct, the false teachings found in it, that were accepted into the Roman Catholic Church in the 4th century A.D.
1. it is necessary to properly identify God, whom both Jesus, Paul and John have done, in Jn.1:18, 4:24; Rom.1:20; 2 Cor.3:17-18, Col.1:15 and 1 Jn.4:12, when they identify Him as Spirit.,</quote>
- We must distinguish between descriptions of God (the triune God) and descriptions of the Father.
- John 1.18 says that the Son Who is in the bosom of the Father has made God (the triune God) known. In context this demonstrates that the Son is GOD, for only God could make God known in this unique sense.
- John 4.24 merely says that God is Spirit. It defines the nature of God.
- Rom 1.20 is a description of the triune God.
- 2 Cor 3.17-18 shows that 'the LORD' (Jesus) and 'the Spirit' combine as one in our sanctification.
- Colossians 1.15 describes Jesus as the exact visible representation (image) of the invisible God. In other words He, having become man, revealed God in visible form. He is then described as 'the firstBORN of all creation'. In other words He was to be seen as BORN before the whole of creation ie in eternity.
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- <quote>Quasar says ; God, who is the Spirit, makes it clear that He is also Holy, in Lev.11:44-45; Lev.19:2; Ps.99:3; Ps.99:5; 1 Pet.1:15-16 and in Rev.4:8. Therefore there is no option to the fact that God is the HOLY SPIRIT. </quote>
The fact that God is holy makes no difference at all to the fact that the Holy Spirit is a separate persona in the Triune God as the NT makes clear,
So quasar, how can you say the following, "John 1.18 says that the Son Who is in the bosom of the Fatherhas made God (the triune God) known. In context this demonstrates that the Son is GOD, for only God could make God known in this unique sense." where you just admitted that the Son is GOD, and then say this?
"According to the Scriptures, there is only ONE true God, as Jesus pointed out in Jn.14:28 and in 17:3, as well as what the Holy Spirit said of Himself in: Deut.4:35; Isa.43:10; 44:6 and in 45:5, plus many more places." This is a "blantant" contradiction which show you don't know what your talking about.
Look, John 17:3, "And this is eternal life, that they may Know Thee, (who is the Thee in the verse quasar) the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom Thous hast sent." Did you notice that little word "and" which is a conjunction so does that mean that Jesus Christ is not the true God? Or according to you is Jesus just a little mighty false god and "chopped" liver? You can't have it both ways.
This is why I ask you before if Jesus Christ is a true God or a false god? You can't have it both ways? The arguments your using are from the JW playbook. They to argue that Jesus is "a god" and they to give Proverbs 8 as proof (like you do) to support their heretical theology. The one thing you have in your favor is that you do believe Jesus is God and they do not.
But your belief is a contradiction of the Scriptures. And btw, the JW's love to quote Revelation 3:14 to prove that Jesus is a created being which is in line with Proverbs 8. Can you please tell me what your take is on that verse? I would love to hear how you understand it?
IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
"According to the Scriptures, there is only ONE true God, as Jesus pointed out in Jn.14:28 and in 17:3, as well as what the Holy Spirit said of Himself in: Deut.4:35; Isa.43:10; 44:6 and in 45:5, plus many more places." This is a "blantant" contradiction which show you don't know what your talking about.
Look, John 17:3, "And this is eternal life, that they may Know Thee, (who is the Thee in the verse quasar) the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom Thous hast sent." Did you notice that little word "and" which is a conjunction so does that mean that Jesus Christ is not the true God? Or according to you is Jesus just a little mighty false god and "chopped" liver? You can't have it both ways.
This is why I ask you before if Jesus Christ is a true God or a false god? You can't have it both ways? The arguments your using are from the JW playbook. They to argue that Jesus is "a god" and they to give Proverbs 8 as proof (like you do) to support their heretical theology. The one thing you have in your favor is that you do believe Jesus is God and they do not.
But your belief is a contradiction of the Scriptures. And btw, the JW's love to quote Revelation 3:14 to prove that Jesus is a created being which is in line with Proverbs 8. Can you please tell me what your take is on that verse? I would love to hear how you understand it?
IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
{YOU CAN NOT DENY THE DEITY OF JESUS,ETERNALLY PAST,ETERNALLY FUTURE,AND BE COUNTED AS A BELIEVER,SAINT,OR CHRISTIAN.
YOU ARE IN FACT,IF YOU DO SO,A HERETICQUOTE by popeye]
With your understanding of the Scriptures, you contradict many OT passages such as Isa.45:5. The Scriptures are crystal clear as to when Jesus became the Son of God/God the Son, whether you are able to accept it or not!
Quasar92
YOU ARE IN FACT,IF YOU DO SO,A HERETICQUOTE by popeye]
With your understanding of the Scriptures, you contradict many OT passages such as Isa.45:5. The Scriptures are crystal clear as to when Jesus became the Son of God/God the Son, whether you are able to accept it or not!
Quasar92
And yet again quasar, more contradictions from you. You said this: "Show me where I have denied the deity of Jesus Christ in anything I have posted!" Then in this post you say this: "With your understanding of the Scriptures, you contradict many OT passages such as Isa.45:5. The Scriptures are crystal clear as to when Jesus became the Son of God/God the Son, whether you are able to accept it or not!"
Isaiah 45:5, "I am the Lord and there is no other; Besides Me there is no God." So who does this refer quasar? Is it God the Father or is it God the Son? And when exactly did the Son of God/God the Son become God the Son? And speaking of "sons" let me "school" you on the term "Firsborn" which you think it "ONLY" means first one born. There's a secondary meaning that obviously your not aware of even though it has been brought to your attention.
The word "firsborn" as it is used of Jesus Christ can be found in five places in the New Testament. Romans 8:29, Colossians 1:15, 18, Revelation 1:5 and Hebrews 1:6. In this specific places the word does not mean first one born or first one created. It refers "RANK." In other words, Jesus is first in rank in the whole creations. He is first in rank in the inhabited world, first rank among the resurrected, and first in rank among the glorified. None is comparable to Him.
Remember what I told you what John the Baptist stated at John 1:15? Which btw you did not answer or address the question of how is it that John the Baptist new that Jesus Christ existed before him? Here's the verse, "John bore witness of Him/Jesus, and cried out, saying, "This was He of whom I said, He who comes after me, HAS A HIGHER RANK THAN I, for (or why quasar?) HE EXISTED BEFORE ME."
The meaning of firstborn can also be illustrated from the Old Testament. In ancient Israel the eldest son was given preferential treatment. He assumed more responsibility than the others, and was rewarded with honor and given two shares in the family inheritance instead of a single share that each of his younger brothers received. BUT, sometimes the eldest son fell out of favor with his father and was "REPLACED" in the favored position by a younger brother.
Here are some examples. Joseph, replaced Reuben at Genesis 4:3 and 1 Chronicles 5:1,2. Ephraim, who replaced Manasseh at Genesis 48:13-20. Jacob replaced Esau at Genesis 27 and Solomon replace Adonijah at 1 Kings 1:5-53. In all os these cases the younger became the firstborn, i.e., he attained to FIRST IN RANK.
This means that the word "firstborn" does not always refer to the first one born by birth. So when the word is applied to Jesus Christ it does not mean first one born at birth but that He rightly deserves preferential share, honor, inheritance and glory etc. So for example when the Bible says Jesus Christ is the "firstborn" from the dead it does not mean He was the first one brought to life because Lazarus was dead before Jesus but Jesus was the firstborn from the dead in a permannet way.
So quasar, can you please for a change address these issues with some "cogent" answers instead of referring me to post #473 or whatever instead?
IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
Isaiah 45:5, "I am the Lord and there is no other; Besides Me there is no God." So who does this refer quasar? Is it God the Father or is it God the Son? And when exactly did the Son of God/God the Son become God the Son? And speaking of "sons" let me "school" you on the term "Firsborn" which you think it "ONLY" means first one born. There's a secondary meaning that obviously your not aware of even though it has been brought to your attention.
The word "firsborn" as it is used of Jesus Christ can be found in five places in the New Testament. Romans 8:29, Colossians 1:15, 18, Revelation 1:5 and Hebrews 1:6. In this specific places the word does not mean first one born or first one created. It refers "RANK." In other words, Jesus is first in rank in the whole creations. He is first in rank in the inhabited world, first rank among the resurrected, and first in rank among the glorified. None is comparable to Him.
Remember what I told you what John the Baptist stated at John 1:15? Which btw you did not answer or address the question of how is it that John the Baptist new that Jesus Christ existed before him? Here's the verse, "John bore witness of Him/Jesus, and cried out, saying, "This was He of whom I said, He who comes after me, HAS A HIGHER RANK THAN I, for (or why quasar?) HE EXISTED BEFORE ME."
The meaning of firstborn can also be illustrated from the Old Testament. In ancient Israel the eldest son was given preferential treatment. He assumed more responsibility than the others, and was rewarded with honor and given two shares in the family inheritance instead of a single share that each of his younger brothers received. BUT, sometimes the eldest son fell out of favor with his father and was "REPLACED" in the favored position by a younger brother.
Here are some examples. Joseph, replaced Reuben at Genesis 4:3 and 1 Chronicles 5:1,2. Ephraim, who replaced Manasseh at Genesis 48:13-20. Jacob replaced Esau at Genesis 27 and Solomon replace Adonijah at 1 Kings 1:5-53. In all os these cases the younger became the firstborn, i.e., he attained to FIRST IN RANK.
This means that the word "firstborn" does not always refer to the first one born by birth. So when the word is applied to Jesus Christ it does not mean first one born at birth but that He rightly deserves preferential share, honor, inheritance and glory etc. So for example when the Bible says Jesus Christ is the "firstborn" from the dead it does not mean He was the first one brought to life because Lazarus was dead before Jesus but Jesus was the firstborn from the dead in a permannet way.
So quasar, can you please for a change address these issues with some "cogent" answers instead of referring me to post #473 or whatever instead?
IN GOD THE SON,
bluto
P
From;
Spirit & Truth Fellowship International.
Conclusion
It should now be clear that the doctrine of the Incarnation is not biblical and was developed by man, particularly in the third through fifth centuries in conjunction with the doctrines of the Trinity and the dual nature of Christ. Based upon this evidence, we propose that the idea of incarnation give way to a simpler and more biblical explanation of Jesus’ origin—that God was his source by the same process of special creation that brought the heavens and the earth into being. We agree that it is important for Christians to believe in the virgin birth of Jesus, because without that teaching, Jesus is merely the offspring of Joseph and Mary, and tainted by the sin of mankind. If so, he would be incapable of being our Redeemer, because he could never present himself as the perfect sacrifice for sins. In that case, Christianity would indeed fall apart. But nothing is lost if a shift is made in Christian thinking from Jesus being the “incarnation” of God to Jesus being the creation of God, his Father. How sad that the vast majority of Christians believe the fable that God became a baby. The truth is nearly just the opposite—a baby became the Lord!
Quasar.....is that you?????
Spirit & Truth Fellowship International.
Conclusion
It should now be clear that the doctrine of the Incarnation is not biblical and was developed by man, particularly in the third through fifth centuries in conjunction with the doctrines of the Trinity and the dual nature of Christ. Based upon this evidence, we propose that the idea of incarnation give way to a simpler and more biblical explanation of Jesus’ origin—that God was his source by the same process of special creation that brought the heavens and the earth into being. We agree that it is important for Christians to believe in the virgin birth of Jesus, because without that teaching, Jesus is merely the offspring of Joseph and Mary, and tainted by the sin of mankind. If so, he would be incapable of being our Redeemer, because he could never present himself as the perfect sacrifice for sins. In that case, Christianity would indeed fall apart. But nothing is lost if a shift is made in Christian thinking from Jesus being the “incarnation” of God to Jesus being the creation of God, his Father. How sad that the vast majority of Christians believe the fable that God became a baby. The truth is nearly just the opposite—a baby became the Lord!
Quasar.....is that you?????
Here is one that was in our Sermon at Church this morning:
Revelation 1:8-20 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.
[SUP]12 [/SUP] And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;
[SUP]13 [/SUP] And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire;
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:
[SUP]18 [/SUP] I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter;
[SUP]20 [/SUP] The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.
Revelation 22:12-13 (ASV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to render to each man according as his work is.
[SUP]13 [/SUP] I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end.
WHO does those verses say the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last actually IS?
CORRECT, the resurrected and ascended Jesus Christ.
Isaiah 41:4 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] "Who has performed and accomplished it, Calling forth the generations from the beginning? 'I, the LORD, am the first, and with the last. I am He.'"Ecclesiastes 3:11 (HCSB)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] He has made everything appropriate in its time. He has also put eternity in their hearts, but man cannot discover the work God has done from beginning to end.
Isaiah 46:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Declaring the end from the beginning, And from ancient times things which have not been done, Saying, 'My purpose will be established, And I will accomplish all My good pleasure';
Revelation 1:8 (ASV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] I am the Alpha and the Omega, saith the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.
NOW, Who do those verses say the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last actually IS?
CORRECT, the Lord GOD Almighty.
Deal with it ye deniers of Christ's Deity and unbelievers! Jesus meant every word LITERALLY when He said:
John 10:30 (HCSB)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] The Father and I are one.”
Revelation 1:8-20 (KJV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.
[SUP]9 [/SUP] I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.
[SUP]10 [/SUP] I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
[SUP]11 [/SUP] Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.
[SUP]12 [/SUP] And I turned to see the voice that spake with me. And being turned, I saw seven golden candlesticks;
[SUP]13 [/SUP] And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.
[SUP]14 [/SUP] His head and his hairs were white like wool, as white as snow; and his eyes were as a flame of fire;
[SUP]15 [/SUP] And his feet like unto fine brass, as if they burned in a furnace; and his voice as the sound of many waters.
[SUP]16 [/SUP] And he had in his right hand seven stars: and out of his mouth went a sharp twoedged sword: and his countenance was as the sun shineth in his strength.
[SUP]17 [/SUP] And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, Fear not; I am the first and the last:
[SUP]18 [/SUP] I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.
[SUP]19 [/SUP] Write the things which thou hast seen, and the things which are, and the things which shall be hereafter;
[SUP]20 [/SUP] The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.
Revelation 22:12-13 (ASV)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] Behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to render to each man according as his work is.
[SUP]13 [/SUP] I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end.
WHO does those verses say the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last actually IS?
CORRECT, the resurrected and ascended Jesus Christ.
Isaiah 41:4 (NASB)
[SUP]4 [/SUP] "Who has performed and accomplished it, Calling forth the generations from the beginning? 'I, the LORD, am the first, and with the last. I am He.'"Ecclesiastes 3:11 (HCSB)
[SUP]11 [/SUP] He has made everything appropriate in its time. He has also put eternity in their hearts, but man cannot discover the work God has done from beginning to end.
Isaiah 46:10 (NASB)
[SUP]10 [/SUP] Declaring the end from the beginning, And from ancient times things which have not been done, Saying, 'My purpose will be established, And I will accomplish all My good pleasure';
Revelation 1:8 (ASV)
[SUP]8 [/SUP] I am the Alpha and the Omega, saith the Lord God, who is and who was and who is to come, the Almighty.
NOW, Who do those verses say the Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last actually IS?
CORRECT, the Lord GOD Almighty.
Deal with it ye deniers of Christ's Deity and unbelievers! Jesus meant every word LITERALLY when He said:
John 10:30 (HCSB)
[SUP]30 [/SUP] The Father and I are one.”
Some serious mistakes coming from you Quassar relative to Jesus is Jehovah yet what you have quoted in the book of Jeremiah and in Zechariah cemented that Jesus is Jehovah! Another, it seems you did response to a wrong topic for the true God mention in John 17:3. I asked is this the way you document, something irrelevant to the topic?
You said: “It is a mistranslation in the use of Jehovah in ascribing it to Jesus.”
Is this what I only hear from you, a notable 35 years of doubt and alterations of God’s Words? I guess you need to explain more before you complain.
You said: “It is a mistranslation in the use of Jehovah in ascribing it to Jesus.”
Is this what I only hear from you, a notable 35 years of doubt and alterations of God’s Words? I guess you need to explain more before you complain.
Hi Fellows,
I guess I should add a little of what I have learned from the Scriptures so you can cut me up in little pieces too,
First, --- I believe 'My Testimony' is Scriptural:
My simple faith is easy to explain --- I believe in the three in heaven, God the Father --- the Word --- and the Holy Spirit, John 1:1, and 1 John 5:7. --- The Word/Christ and the Holy Spirit came to earth and were housed in the physical body of Jesus (the only One who could be seen by men). --- Jesus was the Christ, the Son of God on earth, --- and after His death on the cross as our Savior, and His resurrection, --- God exalted Him to the position in heaven of High Priest (after the order of Melchizedek). --- The Word/Christ returned to their positions at the right hand of God. --- The Holy Spirit remains on earth to give believers New Life, while we are still in our old bodies.
--- The Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit are Three, --- but they are NOT a trinity, they are ONE in harmony and purpose. --- The Father is the designer and Architect and He created all things, pertaining to our world, through the Word (Logos, the creative power of God) John, 1:3. --- The Word, who was God (Theos) John 1:1, and the Holy Spirit, always did the Father's will.
The Word and Christ were together in the OT, which I can show you later, and then both came from heaven, with the Holy Spirit to indwell the Body of Jesus, the 'body' that God had prepared for that purpose. --- Hebrews 10:
5 Therefore, when He came into the world, He said:
"Sacrifice and offering You did not desire, But a body You have prepared for Me.
6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin You had no pleasure.
7 Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come— In the volume of the book it is written of Me—
To do Your will, O God.’"
This is written in Isaiah 48:
16 "Come near to Me, hear this: I have not spoken in secret from the beginning;
From the time that it was, I was there. And now the Lord God and His Spirit Have sent Me."
--- This was the Word speaking, because it says in John 1:14, that "The Word became flesh and dwelt among us."
The Word came and took up residence in the body that was created for Him.
Placid
I guess I should add a little of what I have learned from the Scriptures so you can cut me up in little pieces too,
First, --- I believe 'My Testimony' is Scriptural:
My simple faith is easy to explain --- I believe in the three in heaven, God the Father --- the Word --- and the Holy Spirit, John 1:1, and 1 John 5:7. --- The Word/Christ and the Holy Spirit came to earth and were housed in the physical body of Jesus (the only One who could be seen by men). --- Jesus was the Christ, the Son of God on earth, --- and after His death on the cross as our Savior, and His resurrection, --- God exalted Him to the position in heaven of High Priest (after the order of Melchizedek). --- The Word/Christ returned to their positions at the right hand of God. --- The Holy Spirit remains on earth to give believers New Life, while we are still in our old bodies.
--- The Father, the Word, and the Holy Spirit are Three, --- but they are NOT a trinity, they are ONE in harmony and purpose. --- The Father is the designer and Architect and He created all things, pertaining to our world, through the Word (Logos, the creative power of God) John, 1:3. --- The Word, who was God (Theos) John 1:1, and the Holy Spirit, always did the Father's will.
The Word and Christ were together in the OT, which I can show you later, and then both came from heaven, with the Holy Spirit to indwell the Body of Jesus, the 'body' that God had prepared for that purpose. --- Hebrews 10:
5 Therefore, when He came into the world, He said:
"Sacrifice and offering You did not desire, But a body You have prepared for Me.
6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin You had no pleasure.
7 Then I said, ‘Behold, I have come— In the volume of the book it is written of Me—
To do Your will, O God.’"
This is written in Isaiah 48:
16 "Come near to Me, hear this: I have not spoken in secret from the beginning;
From the time that it was, I was there. And now the Lord God and His Spirit Have sent Me."
--- This was the Word speaking, because it says in John 1:14, that "The Word became flesh and dwelt among us."
The Word came and took up residence in the body that was created for Him.
Placid
Supposing yo provide Scriotural proof of the "serious mistakes" I have made.By the same token, you are making a serious mistake by inferring that Jesus is Jehovah. First of all, the letter "J" did not exist at the earliest, until the 12th century. Jehovah is the exclusive English phonetic name for the Hebrew tetragrammaton, YHWY/Yahwey. It was never intended to be used as a name for Jesus.
Yes, I replied to a wrong post, for which I apologized. Do you have some kind of problem with that. Furthermore, If you have problems with something I have posted, then put it in proper quotes, so I know where you are cming from.
Quasar92
And I would like to add this by way of further explanation.
I learned the Scriptures from the Bible, and from older Christians who knew their Bible, --- and who carried much of it in their minds and hearts.
My greatest Mentor was the Chaplain of the Faith Rescue Mission I worked at for 25 years.
We came from two totally different backgrounds. He came from the Middle East, and had spent 39 years with the Bible Society, in Alexandria, Egypt, --- and yet God had led us to understand the Scriptures the same way.
--- I also belonged to Gideons International, the organization which places Bibles and New Testaments in the lifestreams of humanity, where they may read it without commentary. --- Both our Mission and the Gideons were interdenominational ministries that dealt with bringing people to Christ.
At our Mission, we had a morning Bible Study with the resident men, that we took on our Rehabilitation Program, and as they would accept the Lord, we would teach them further, --- but then they began going to Church on Sundays. --- One time they might go to this one, and next Sunday to that one. --- We had many Evangelical Denominational Church groups coming to the Mission for evening Services, and they would invite our guys to their Churches, and sometimes, to their homes. --- This was great because it was integrating these converts back into society, with Christian contacts.
--- And they sometimes began to ask about the different teachings in the Denominational Churches. And I was interested in using the Scripture to answer all of their questions.
--- But one day, the Chaplain said something to me in his office, as we shared about them, --- and this was the 'Word of Wisdom' for me.
--- "Don't be too quick to teach doctrines to these men --- Let us make them Christians, and let the Churches make them Baptists or Pentecostals."
--- At the Mission we met, and worked with, a lot of Good Ministers. Their Denomination didn't matter. --- God looks on the heart. If it is open, so that He can use the vessel in His service, He does.
--- The success of ministers and servants will be in accordance with how much they reflect Christ, --- and how obedient they are to the constant guidance of the Holy Spirit.
"It is not how much we have of Him, but how much He has of us."
--- A Christian's desire, is to see others become like Christ. --- A religious man's desire is to see others become like him.
--- So over the years as I have met Bible School Graduates, it doesn't take long to know what they had learned, --- and want to teach.
If they were on fire from the Lord, they will have an Evangelistic Spirit. --- It their thoughts are on trinity, --- don't try to change them, just let them be.
--- If we are all saved by Faith in God and by accepting Jesus Christ, then the Lord can teach us His way, --- if, and when, we allow Him.
So I remain one who looks to the Lord for guidance. I am not teaching anyone, nor asking anyone to follow me, --- but I want everyone to follow God's leading in their lives. --- Only then will we have true harmony, if we are all obedient to Him.
Anyone who doesn't have the Holy Spirit in their life has their own problem.
--- I don't criticize the Faith of others, but when others criticize me, I just say, "Okay, you go your way, I'll go His."
I learned the Scriptures from the Bible, and from older Christians who knew their Bible, --- and who carried much of it in their minds and hearts.
My greatest Mentor was the Chaplain of the Faith Rescue Mission I worked at for 25 years.
We came from two totally different backgrounds. He came from the Middle East, and had spent 39 years with the Bible Society, in Alexandria, Egypt, --- and yet God had led us to understand the Scriptures the same way.
--- I also belonged to Gideons International, the organization which places Bibles and New Testaments in the lifestreams of humanity, where they may read it without commentary. --- Both our Mission and the Gideons were interdenominational ministries that dealt with bringing people to Christ.
At our Mission, we had a morning Bible Study with the resident men, that we took on our Rehabilitation Program, and as they would accept the Lord, we would teach them further, --- but then they began going to Church on Sundays. --- One time they might go to this one, and next Sunday to that one. --- We had many Evangelical Denominational Church groups coming to the Mission for evening Services, and they would invite our guys to their Churches, and sometimes, to their homes. --- This was great because it was integrating these converts back into society, with Christian contacts.
--- And they sometimes began to ask about the different teachings in the Denominational Churches. And I was interested in using the Scripture to answer all of their questions.
--- But one day, the Chaplain said something to me in his office, as we shared about them, --- and this was the 'Word of Wisdom' for me.
--- "Don't be too quick to teach doctrines to these men --- Let us make them Christians, and let the Churches make them Baptists or Pentecostals."
--- At the Mission we met, and worked with, a lot of Good Ministers. Their Denomination didn't matter. --- God looks on the heart. If it is open, so that He can use the vessel in His service, He does.
--- The success of ministers and servants will be in accordance with how much they reflect Christ, --- and how obedient they are to the constant guidance of the Holy Spirit.
"It is not how much we have of Him, but how much He has of us."
--- A Christian's desire, is to see others become like Christ. --- A religious man's desire is to see others become like him.
--- So over the years as I have met Bible School Graduates, it doesn't take long to know what they had learned, --- and want to teach.
If they were on fire from the Lord, they will have an Evangelistic Spirit. --- It their thoughts are on trinity, --- don't try to change them, just let them be.
--- If we are all saved by Faith in God and by accepting Jesus Christ, then the Lord can teach us His way, --- if, and when, we allow Him.
So I remain one who looks to the Lord for guidance. I am not teaching anyone, nor asking anyone to follow me, --- but I want everyone to follow God's leading in their lives. --- Only then will we have true harmony, if we are all obedient to Him.
Anyone who doesn't have the Holy Spirit in their life has their own problem.
--- I don't criticize the Faith of others, but when others criticize me, I just say, "Okay, you go your way, I'll go His."