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A

AnandaHya

Guest
For many the scripture is God-breathed and useful for training in unrighteousness, and for false teaching, and for destruction.

Men, who interpret scriptures as God, who don't know God for themselves. I seek to know God, and his Christ, personally intimately.

If we don't know him for ourselves, we will not be able to determine what is deception and what is not. I don't heap men to me, but to Christ. But people don't want Jesus Christ, they want their interpretations of their bibles.

May Jesus bless you.
I know Jesus personally and intimately and He directs me to the Bible, to His Church, to doing good works in His name, to feeding the hungry, visiting the sick, spending time with the Elderly, praying for the lost.

Before I knew Jesus I could care less for any of those things, yet it saddens me that people claim to want to know Jesus yet do not hear those things spoken in their hearts as things GOD tells THEM to do.

James 1:27
Pure and undefiled religion before God and the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their trouble, and to keep oneself unspotted from the world.


I would have pure and undefiled religion before God any day

Especially over false humility and fake worship. but hey men would rather afflict their souls and mortify their flesh then actually OBEY GOD.

Isaiah 58:5
Is it a fast that I have chosen, A day for a man to afflict his soul? Is it to bow down his head like a bulrush, And to spread out sackcloth and ashes? Would you call this a fast, And an acceptable day to the LORD?

men might call that an acceptable day to the LORD but God says differently.

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ma_AJlgCwPc&feature=player_embedded#![/video]

Most just say empty prayers and move on.

Will you stop and spend the time and offer others God's love and plan of salvation?
 
A

AnandaHya

Guest
God made you imperfect? Or have you made you imperfect?

Did God make you sin, or did you choose to sin?

Does your heart echo the words of Jesus Christ? That is what will matter.

But if you have envying and bitterness in your heart, that heart needs to be changed. Out of the abundance of it, the mouth speaks.

May Jesus bless you.
do you judge me imperfect Ramon?

Do you place upon me envy and bitterness?

I find neither in my heart.

God has given me all I need to do the good works He has assigned me in this life. He has given me His love. What more do I need?

why would I envy? What is there to be bitter about Ramon?

what sin do you hold to my account?

what sin can you accuse me of, when JESUS has washed me clean?

I am free in Christ. can you say the same?
 
R

Ramon

Guest
Ananda, it is that very love that keeps me here. I would have gone a long time ago. But I would have been in disobedience then. It was because of that same love that was in Christ that he was killed and hung on that tree. He could have easily not done it, but then he would have been in disobedience also.

His plan of salvation is to save people from their sins, which if they continue in, will land them in hell. If I hated you, I would tell you this lie, ''it is fine, Jesus died for your sins, you don't have to worry, homosexuals and liars and thieves and drunks and murderers are all God's children.''

Oh yes, and then we might be preaching abominations. But I am not for abominations. The seducers are the ones who seduce people to NOT repent of sin and follow Jesus Christ. They are those who afflict the poor, but fatten themselves. Many Churches are fat the same way. And God has called them FAT!!

No! There are children of God and children of the Devil. Satan entices people to not repent of sin, but God convicts of sin, and prompts repentance.

Many people will wake up in hell, because of these seducing lies. And the wrath of God is heavy on those that seduce unstable souls there.
 
M

MissCris

Guest
IN JESUS.....THEY CAN'T DESCRIBE WHAT THAT REALLY MEANS....THEY MEAN THEY ARE DEITY.




ONCE FOR ALL, for those who care what God really said, not the NEW BREED who will wax worse and worse: and as Washer, Piper, Sproul and most MATURE christians on this site have tried to warn are DESTROYING lives and shipwrecking faith by TEACHING MAN BECOMING GOD.

they abuse Romans 8. they abuse every reference to COMMANDMENTS given by God Incarnate who KNOWS men will not be PERFECT until they are GLORIFIED and EVEN THEN WILL NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER BE DEITY



Be ye therefore perfect ... - The Saviour concludes this part of the discourse by commanding his disciples to be "perfect." This word commonly means "finished, complete, pure, holy." Originally, it is applied to a piece of mechanism, as a machine that is complete in its parts. Applied to people, it refers to completeness of parts, or perfection, where no part is defective or wanting.

Thus, Job JObadiah 1:1 is said to be "perfect;" that is, not holy as God, or "sinless" - for fault is afterward found with him Job 9:20; Job 42:6; but his piety was "proportionate" - had a completeness of parts was consistent and regular. He exhibited his religion as a prince, a father, an individual, a benefactor of the poor. He was not merely a pious man in one place, but uniformly. He was consistent everywhere. See the notes at that passage. This is the meaning in Matthew. Be not religious merely in loving your friends and neighbors, but let your piety be shown in loving your enemies; imitate God; let your piety be "complete, proportionate, regular." This every Christian may be; this every Christian must be...
Barnes'

............................


Be ye therefore perfect, as your Father,.... This perfection is to be restrained to the subject Christ is upon, love to men, and not to be referred to any, or every other thing; wherefore, in Luke 6:36 it is, "be ye merciful, as your Father also is merciful"; and regards not a perfection of degree in that, but objects and quality: that is to say, not that men may, or can, or ought to be as perfect in love, as to the degree of it, as God is; that is impossible: the "as" here, is not a note of equality, but of likeness: such, who profess God to be their Father, ought to imitate him, particularly in their love to men, which ought to be extended to the same objects, as the divine goodness is; that, as he shows regard in a providential way to all men, good and bad, just and unjust, and his tender mercies are over all his works; so ought they to love all men with a natural affection, and hate no man, no, not their enemies: for he that loves only his friends, and not his enemies, loves imperfectly; he does not take in the whole compass of objects his love is to extend unto; and as God loves sincerely, and without dissimulation, so should they. To be "perfect", is to be sincere and upright: in this sense is the word often used, and answers to the Hebrew word which signifies the same: see Deuteronomy 18:13 which is the passage Christ seems to refer to here; and the sense is, be ye sincere and upright in your love to all men, as your heavenly Father is hearty and sincere in his affections to them.
Gill

.............................



48. Be ye therefore-rather, "Ye shall therefore be," or "Ye are therefore to be," as My disciples and in My kingdom.
perfect-or complete. Manifestly, our Lord here speaks, not of degrees of excellence, but of the kind of excellence which was to distinguish His disciples and characterize His kingdom. When therefore He adds, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect-He refers to that full-orbed glorious completeness which is in the great Divine Model, "their Father which is in heaven."
JFB

....................................


Lastly, Our Saviour concludes this subject with this exhortation (v. 48), Be ye therefore perfect, as your Father which is in heaven is perfect. Which may be understood, 1. In general, including all those things wherein we must be followers of God as dear children. Note, It is the duty of Christians to desire, and aim at, and press toward a perfection in grace and holiness, Phil. 3:12-14. And therein we must study to conform ourselves to the example of our heavenly Father, 1 Pt. 1:15, 16. Or, 2. In this particular before mentioned, of doing good to our enemies; see Lu. 6:36. It is God's perfection to forgive injuries and to entertain strangers, and to do good to the evil and unthankful, and it will be ours to be like him. We that owe so much, that owe our all, to the divine bounty, ought to copy it out as well as we can.
MHC

I DO NOT KNOW HOW MANY TIMES WE MUST MAKE THIS DISTICTION BETWEEN THE PERFECTION OF THE CREATOR OF THE UNIVERSE GOD ALIGHTY THE I AM and what Jesus expects of His peopele:

5046. teleios

teleios: having reached its end, i.e. complete, by ext. perfect​
Original Word: τέλειος, α, ον
Part of Speech: Adjective
Transliteration: teleios
Phonetic Spelling: (tel'-i-os)
Short Definition: perfect, full-grown
Definition: perfect, (a) complete in all its parts, (b) full grown, of full age, (c) specially of the completeness of Christian character.

Cognate: 5046 téleios (an adjective, derived from 5056 /télos, "consummated goal") – mature (consummated) from going through the necessary stages to reach the end-goal, i.e. developed into a consummating completion by fulfilling the necessary process (spiritual journey). See 5056 (telos).
[This root (tel-) means "reaching the end (aim)." It is well-illustrated with the old pirate's telescope, unfolding (extending out) one stage at a time to function at full-strength (capacity effectiveness).]
Word Origin
from telos
Definition
having reached its end, i.e. complete, by ext. perfect
NASB Word Usage
complete (2), mature (4), more perfect (1), perfect (12).


complete, perfect, mature

From telos; complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.); neuter (as noun, with ho) completeness -- of full age, man, perfect.

Now THAT explains things.
 
A

AnandaHya

Guest
Ramon it is love that has me speak for if it was anything else I would have left long ago.

there are more then homosexuals, liars, thieves, drunks and murderers in hell and that is the point I have been trying to get across to you.

those who claim to BE God INCARNATE will be there TOO. Those who Claim to be BEGOTTEN OF GOD will be in the lake of Fire, because there is a BIG difference between being BEGOTTEN of GOD and being Adopted of God, though you don't seem to grasp the importance.

it IS a salvation issue.

it refers to these passages Ramon. Read them and really pray about it and perhaps you will see the danger I and others are trying to warn new believers of.

2 Thessalonians 2
7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He[d] who now restrains will do so until He[e] is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


do you understand this mystery?

I pray that you love the truth enough to pray and seek God's wisdom.
 
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zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
God made you imperfect? Or have you made you imperfect?

Did God make you sin, or did you choose to sin?

Does your heart echo the words of Jesus Christ? That is what will matter.

But if you have envying and bitterness in your heart, that heart needs to be changed. Out of the abundance of it, the mouth speaks.

May Jesus bless you.
YOU.
the accuser of christ's church.
WHAT ARROGANCE.

there are a million guys likes you out there.
not one will go to church, not one will agree they are sinners.

see this?

1 John 1:8
New International Version (©1984)
If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

New Living Translation (©2007)
If we claim we have no sin, we are only fooling ourselves and not living in the truth.

English Standard Version (©2001)
If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.



we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
Ananda, it is that very love that keeps me here. I would have gone a long time ago. But I would have been in disobedience then. It was because of that same love that was in Christ that he was killed and hung on that tree. He could have easily not done it, but then he would have been in disobedience also.

His plan of salvation is to save people from their sins, which if they continue in, will land them in hell. If I hated you, I would tell you this lie, ''it is fine, Jesus died for your sins, you don't have to worry, homosexuals and liars and thieves and drunks and murderers are all God's children.''

Oh yes, and then we might be preaching abominations. But I am not for abominations. The seducers are the ones who seduce people to NOT repent of sin and follow Jesus Christ. They are those who afflict the poor, but fatten themselves. Many Churches are fat the same way. And God has called them FAT!!

No! There are children of God and children of the Devil. Satan entices people to not repent of sin, but God convicts of sin, and prompts repentance.

Many people will wake up in hell, because of these seducing lies. And the wrath of God is heavy on those that seduce unstable souls there.
do you still Ramon?
YES....OR....NO.
 
R

Ramon

Guest
Ramon it is love that has me speak for if it was anything else I would have left long ago.

there are more then homosexuals, liars, thieves, drunks and murderers in hell and that is the point I have been trying to get across to you.

those who claim to BE God INCARNATE will be there TOO. Those who Claim to be BEGOTTEN OF GOD will be in the lake of Fire, because there is a BIG difference between being BEGOTTEN of GOD and being Adopted of God, though you don't seem to grasp the importance.

it IS a salvation issue.

it refers to these passages Ramon. Read them and really pray about it and perhaps you will see the danger I and others are trying to warn new believers of.

2 Thessalonians 2
7 For the mystery of lawlessness is already at work; only He[d] who now restrains will do so until He[e] is taken out of the way. 8 And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will consume with the breath of His mouth and destroy with the brightness of His coming. 9 The coming of the lawless one is according to the working of Satan, with all power, signs, and lying wonders, 10 and with all unrighteous deception among those who perish, because they did not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 And for this reason God will send them strong delusion, that they should believe the lie, 12 that they all may be condemned who did not believe the truth but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


do you understand this mystery?

I pray that you love the truth enough to pray and seek God's wisdom.
My friend, you have passed Judgement on every saint, who are not saints unless they are born of God. Jesus said that you cannot enter the kingdom unless you are Born of God. You have to be reborn from heaven. You say these will end up in the lake of fire?
 
A

AnandaHya

Guest
My friend, you have passed Judgement on every saint, who are not saints unless they are begotten of God. Jesus said that you cannot enter the kingdom unless you are Born of God. You have to be reborn from heaven. You say these will end up in the lake of fire?
to be BORN AGAIN is NOT the same as to be BEGOTTEN.

you should learn the difference.
 
R

Ramon

Guest
do you still Ramon?
YES....OR....NO.
If you are asking do I still fall short, yes.

If you are asking if I do repent, yes.

If you are implying I will always fall short. NO

If you are implying I need not repent, NO!!

But I cannot say of another man who is more mature in Christ that he is fallen short simply because I have not achieved it yet. I do say YET!
 
R

Ramon

Guest
1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
1Jn 5:19 And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.
1Jn 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
1Jn 5:21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
If you are asking do I still fall short, yes.

If you are asking if I do repent, yes.

If you are implying I will always fall short. NO

If you are implying I need not repent, NO!!

But I cannot say of another man who is more mature in Christ that he is fallen short simply because I have not achieved it yet. I do say YET!
i NEVER said we do not need to repent. i do it every day.

i asked you DO YOU STILL SIN

not your soft "fall short" when it applies to YOU.

i asked do you SIN?


yes or no.?


ACCORDING TO JOHN, IF YOU SAY no, YOU ARE A LIAR (SIN) DECEIVED AND THERE IS NO TRUTH IN YOU.

1 John 1:8
New International Version (©1984)
If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

New Living Translation (©2007)
If we claim we have no sin, we are only fooling ourselves and not living in the truth.

English Standard Version (©2001)
If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.



not ONE genuine Christian will listen to those who claim sinlessness for they KNOW they are LIARS (sinners and hypocrites)

if you wish to teach HOLINESS. do so.
that's NOT what you do.

now answer the question according to God's standards - DO YOU SIN?

"
If you are implying I will always fall short. NO"

when? in this life? YES OR NO?
 
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R

Ramon

Guest
i NEVER said we do not need to repent. i do it every day.

i asked you DO YOU STILL SIN

not your soft "fall short" when it applies to YOU.

i asked do you SIN?


yes or no.?


ACCORDING TO JOHN, IF YOU SAY no, YOU ARE A LIAR (SIN) DECEIVED AND THERE IS NO TRUTH IN YOU.

1 John 1:8
New International Version (©1984)
If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

New Living Translation (©2007)
If we claim we have no sin, we are only fooling ourselves and not living in the truth.

English Standard Version (©2001)
If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.



not ONE genuine Christian will listen to those who claim sinlessness for they KNOW they are LIARS (sinners and hypocrites)

if you wish to teach HOLINESS. do so.
that's NOT what you do.

now answer the question according to God's standards - DO YOU SIN?

"
If you are implying I will always fall short. NO"

when? in this life? YES OR NO?
These are the games you all play all day. If I played along:

1Jn 2:4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.
 
R

Ramon

Guest
i NEVER said we do not need to repent. i do it every day.

i asked you DO YOU STILL SIN

not your soft "fall short" when it applies to YOU.

i asked do you SIN?


yes or no.?


ACCORDING TO JOHN, IF YOU SAY no, YOU ARE A LIAR (SIN) DECEIVED AND THERE IS NO TRUTH IN YOU.

1 John 1:8
New International Version (©1984)
If we claim to be without sin, we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.

New Living Translation (©2007)
If we claim we have no sin, we are only fooling ourselves and not living in the truth.

English Standard Version (©2001)
If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

New American Standard Bible (©1995)
If we say that we have no sin, we are deceiving ourselves and the truth is not in us.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.



not ONE genuine Christian will listen to those who claim sinlessness for they KNOW they are LIARS (sinners and hypocrites)

if you wish to teach HOLINESS. do so.
that's NOT what you do.

now answer the question according to God's standards - DO YOU SIN?

"
If you are implying I will always fall short. NO"

when? in this life? YES OR NO?
Yes, by God's grace, I will be sin free IN THIS LIFE! BECAUSE THE ETERNAL LIFE OF CHRIST WILL BE FULLY IN ME! AND NOT THE OLD LIFE!!
 
J

jimmydiggs

Guest
Yes, by God's grace, I will be sin free IN THIS LIFE! BECAUSE THE ETERNAL LIFE OF CHRIST WILL BE FULLY IN ME! AND NOT THE OLD LIFE!!
Call me when you're sin free.
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
1Jn 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.
1Jn 5:19 And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness.
1Jn 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
1Jn 5:21 Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen.
every true christian in the world knows this means does not continue in a life of willful sin.unable to....
the Spirit does allow it to the true christian who is trying to obey and is being transformed.

they know this means the battle goes on until they die.
they know that OSSESSIONS with sinlessness LEAD TO SIN.
so if they RECKON themselves dead to sin, they can overcome it.

but with LAWYERS AND PHARISEES PREACHING HELL AND SIN CONTINUALLY YOU ARE HURTING THEM!!!!! and you are lying.

go out and SERVE THE NEEDY. you'll see sin on unimaginable scale and you will learn COMPASSION.

AND YOU WILL STOP YOUR ARROGANT PERFECTIONISM AND BECOME PERFECT (MATURE AND COMPLET) IN LOVE....