Did Jesus ever tell us that we no longer need to keep the law of Moses?

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FollowtheShepherd

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Sep 15, 2019
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Here is what I have been given on this,

These new converted Christians, familiar with idols, have not come to the realization yet that there is but one God and an idol is "man made" nothing, air and it is not the food sacrificed to air that hurts you, but what you "think and feel", that is what defiles what hurts the conscience.


Matthew 15:11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

Matthew 15:12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?

Matthew 15:13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.

Matthew 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

Matthew 15:15 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Declare unto us this parable.

Matthew 15:16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?

Matthew 15:17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?

Matthew 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

Matthew 15:19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

Matthew 15:20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.
But Matt 15 is about Jesus speaking against a man made law of "hand washing" not about idols.

Matthew 15:1-10, " 1 Then Pharisees and scribes came to Jesus from Jerusalem and said, 2 “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat.” 3 He answered them, “And why do you break the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Whoever reviles father or mother must surely die.’ 5 But you say, ‘If anyone tells his father or his mother, “What you would have gained from me is given to God,” 6 he need not honor his father.’ So for the sake of your tradition you have made void the word of God. 7 You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said: 8 “‘This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me; 9 in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’” 10 And he called the people to him and said to them, “Hear and understand:

Also Jesus and the 12 comdemm eating meat offered to idols, they do not say "it ok if...."




Jesus and the 12 say not to eat meat sacrificed to idols, the self sppointed apostle Paul, whom none testify as an apostle other than himself says Jesus chose him, but if Jesus chose him why does Paul say it is ok to eat meat sacrificed to idols, when Jesus says not to, in the last book written humans, post Paul's writings?

the 12:

Acts 15:28-29, “For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay on you no greater burden than these requirements: that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols, and from blood, and from what has been strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”

Paul:

1 Corinthians 8:7-8, "However, not all possess this knowledge. But some, through former association with idols, eat food as really offered to an idol, and their conscience, being weak, is defiled. Food will not commend us to God. We are no worse off if we do not eat, and no better off if we do."

Jesus:

Revelation 2:20, "But I have this against you, that you tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess and is teaching and seducing my servants to practice sexual immorality and to eat food sacrificed to idols."
 

NayborBear

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
So if they followed the law perfectly

why did christ need to come? They fullfilled the law and thus never needed saved to begin with
PRECISELY because of ones like you and your ilk!
That's WHY the Father SENT Christ!
Go ahead! Blow me off!
But, I speak the TRUTH!
And somewheres deep down in those charred remains you call a heart?
You KNOW IT!
Isaiah 28

15 Because ye have said, We have made a covenant with death, and with hell are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made lies our refuge, and under falsehood have we hid ourselves:

Just "look" what you have to look forwards to:
Isaiah 28
18 And your covenant with death shall be disannulled, and your agreement with hell shall not stand; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then ye shall be trodden down by it.
(one would have to have gone through this to know)
You want man's precepts to teach you?
Or God?
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
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The books may have been written in that order but the "EVENTS" did not. Could not. Think Jesus raised from the dead. Pentacost
Well if says Galatians was written before the Jersalem council, and for sure Paul circumcised Timothy AFTER the Jerusalem council.

◄ Galatians ►
Bible Book Summary
Galatians Summary
by Jay Smith
https://biblehub.com/summary/galatians/1.htm

The book of Galatians is a Pauline Epistle (letter from Paul). It was written by the Apostle Paul about 49 A.D. prior to the Jerusalem Council which had taken place in 50 A.D
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
113
But Matt 15 is about Jesus speaking against a man made law of "hand washing" not about idols.

Matthew 15:1-10, " 1 Then Pharisees and scribes came to Jesus from Jerusalem and said, 2 “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat.” 3 He answered them, “And why do you break the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Whoever reviles father or mother must surely die.’ 5 But you say, ‘If anyone tells his father or his mother, “What you would have gained from me is given to God,” 6 he need not honor his father.’ So for the sake of your tradition you have made void the word of God. 7 You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said: 8 “‘This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me; 9 in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’” 10 And he called the people to him and said to them, “Hear and understand:

Also Jesus and the 12 comdemm eating meat offered to idols, they do not say "it ok if...."




Jesus and the 12 say not to eat meat sacrificed to idols, the self sppointed apostle Paul, whom none testify as an apostle other than himself says Jesus chose him, but if Jesus chose him why does Paul say it is ok to eat meat sacrificed to idols, when Jesus says not to, in the last book written humans, post Paul's writings?

the 12:

Acts 15:28-29, “For it has seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay on you no greater burden than these requirements: that you abstain from what has been sacrificed to idols, and from blood, and from what has been strangled, and from sexual immorality. If you keep yourselves from these, you will do well. Farewell.”

Paul:

1 Corinthians 8:7-8, "However, not all possess this knowledge. But some, through former association with idols, eat food as really offered to an idol, and their conscience, being weak, is defiled. Food will not commend us to God. We are no worse off if we do not eat, and no better off if we do."

Jesus:

Revelation 2:20, "But I have this against you, that you tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess and is teaching and seducing my servants to practice sexual immorality and to eat food sacrificed to idols."
True but that does not change what Jesus said about Matthew 15:11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
113
Well if says Galatians was written before the Jersalem council, and for sure Paul circumcised Timothy AFTER the Jerusalem council.

◄ Galatians ►
Bible Book Summary
Galatians Summary
by Jay Smith
https://biblehub.com/summary/galatians/1.htm

The book of Galatians is a Pauline Epistle (letter from Paul). It was written by the Apostle Paul about 49 A.D. prior to the Jerusalem Council which had taken place in 50 A.D
When did the events in ACTS take place?
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
312
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When did the events in ACTS take place?
Paul wrote the letter before Acts 15 happened in 49AD. Acts 16 where Tim is circumcised by Paul happened after that

Bible Book Summary
Galatians Summary
by Jay Smith
https://biblehub.com/summary/galatians/1.htm

The book of Galatians is a Pauline Epistle (letter from Paul). It was written by the Apostle Paul about 49 A.D. prior to the Jerusalem Council which had taken place in 50 A.D
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
312
63
True but that does not change what Jesus said about Matthew 15:11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.
You are ignoring the entire context of Mat 15 and applying it to "justify" something Jesus and the 12 say DO NOT DO.

If Jesus says don;t do it, how can you take Mat 15 and say, it's ok to do it?
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
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You are ignoring the entire context of Mat 15 and applying it to "justify" something Jesus and the 12 say DO NOT DO.

If Jesus says don;t do it, how can you take Mat 15 and say, it's ok to do it?
I am not following you. I will go back and read Matt 15 again to see if I can find what you are saying.
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
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I am not following you. I will go back and read Matt 15 again to see if I can find what you are saying.
I will try to re-word it.

Matt 15 is about a hand washing ritual that is a man amde law of the Pharisees, Jesus breaks it and says they reject God's commands for their tradition, then says "what gos in the mouth does not defile" In context it is not about idols meat, it is about a hand washing ritual.

Aside from that Jesus and the 12 all forbid the eating of meat sacrificed to idols, so I am asking;

How could you take what Jesus said in Matt 15 not even related to idol meat to justify something Jesus forbids in Revelation 2; idol meat?
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
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Matthew 15:1 Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying,
Matthew 15:2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.

Matthew 15:3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?

Matthew 15:4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.

Matthew 15:5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;

Matthew 15:6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

Matthew 15:7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,

Matthew 15:8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

Matthew 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Matthew 15:10 And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:

Matthew 15:11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.


Matthew 15:12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?

Matthew 15:13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.

Matthew 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

Matthew 15:15 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Declare unto us this parable.

Matthew 15:16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?

Matthew 15:17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?

Matthew 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.


Matthew 15:19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

Matthew 15:20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

Matthew 15:21 Then Jesus went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon.

No, I am still not following.
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
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Matthew 15:1-20, " 1 Then Pharisees and scribes came to Jesus from Jerusalem and said, 2 “Why do your disciples break the tradition of the elders? For they do not wash their hands when they eat.” 3 He answered them, “And why do you break the commandment of God for the sake of your tradition? 4 For God commanded, ‘Honor your father and your mother,’ and, ‘Whoever reviles father or mother must surely die.’ 5 But you say, ‘If anyone tells his father or his mother, “What you would have gained from me is given to God,” 6 he need not honor his father.’ So for the sake of your tradition you have made void the word of God. 7 You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said: 8 “‘This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me; 9 in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.’” 10 And he called the people to him and said to them, “Hear and understand: 11 it is not what goes into the mouth that defiles a person, but what comes out of the mouth; this defiles a person.” 12 Then the disciples came and said to him, “Do you know that the Pharisees were offended when they heard this saying?” 13 He answered, “Every plant that my heavenly Father has not planted will be rooted up. 14 Let them alone; they are blind guides. And if the blind lead the blind, both will fall into a pit.” 15 But Peter said to him, “Explain the parable to us.” 16 And he said, “Are you also still without understanding? 17 Do you not see that whatever goes into the mouth passes into the stomach and is expelled? 18 But what comes out of the mouth proceeds from the heart, and this defiles a person. 19 For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false witness, slander. 20 These are what defile a person. But to eat with unwashed hands does not defile anyone.”

How can Matt 15 justify what Jesus condems?

Revelation 2:20 But I have this against you, that you tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess and is teaching and seducing my servants to practice sexual immorality and to eat food sacrificed to idols.
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
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Matthew 15:1 Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying,
Matthew 15:2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.

Matthew 15:3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?

Matthew 15:4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.

Matthew 15:5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;

Matthew 15:6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

Matthew 15:7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,

Matthew 15:8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

Matthew 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.

Matthew 15:10 And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:

Matthew 15:11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.

Matthew 15:12 Then came his disciples, and said unto him, Knowest thou that the Pharisees were offended, after they heard this saying?

Matthew 15:13 But he answered and said, Every plant, which my heavenly Father hath not planted, shall be rooted up.

Matthew 15:14 Let them alone: they be blind leaders of the blind. And if the blind lead the blind, both shall fall into the ditch.

Matthew 15:15 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Declare unto us this parable.

Matthew 15:16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?

Matthew 15:17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?

Matthew 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

Matthew 15:19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

Matthew 15:20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

Matthew 15:21 Then Jesus went thence, and departed into the coasts of Tyre and Sidon.

No, I am still not following.
verse 2 the part you did not bold;

Matthew 15:2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
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verse 2 the part you did not bold;

Matthew 15:2 Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
Because not washing their hands was a TRADITION of the Elders, a tradition of man, it was not of GOD.
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
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Because not washing their hands was a TRADITION of the Elders, a tradition of man, it was not of GOD.
but the Pharisses said not washing hands defiled a man. and it wanst just like we think hand washing, it was a whole ritual then a "prayed" saying "thank the Lord for commanding the hand washing. BUt as you said God NEVER commanded it before eating a meal.
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
113
Because not washing their hands was a TRADITION of the Elders, a tradition of man, it was not of GOD.
THEN JESUS ASKED THEM
Matthew 15:3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
and EXPLAINS HOW THEY TRANSGRESS
Matthew 15:4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.

Matthew 15:5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;

Matthew 15:6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

Matthew 15:7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,

Matthew 15:8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
THIS IS WHAT THE PHARISEES DO
Matthew 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
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THEN JESUS CALLED THE MULTITUDE

Matthew 15:10 And he called the multitude, and said unto them, Hear, and understand:


AND JESUS TOLD THEM

Matthew 15:11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
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AND AGAIN REPEATING IT


Matthew 15:16 And Jesus said, Are ye also yet without understanding?

Matthew 15:17 Do not ye yet understand, that whatsoever entereth in at the mouth goeth into the belly, and is cast out into the draught?
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
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aND SUMMED IT UP WITH


Matthew 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.

Matthew 15:19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:

Matthew 15:20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
312
63
THEN JESUS ASKED THEM
Matthew 15:3 But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?
and EXPLAINS HOW THEY TRANSGRESS
Matthew 15:4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.

Matthew 15:5 But ye say, Whosoever shall say to his father or his mother, It is a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me;

Matthew 15:6 And honour not his father or his mother, he shall be free. Thus have ye made the commandment of God of none effect by your tradition.

Matthew 15:7 Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying,

Matthew 15:8 This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.
THIS IS WHAT THE PHARISEES DO
Matthew 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
Also by the hand washing for saying it is "law". Mark 7 also witnesses to this topic, but words were added much later "therefore Jesus declared all foods clean" but the rst is good to read, not all translations contain the added words. They were added into the margin and the nyears later copied into the text, they do not appear until hundreds of years later.

Also Matt 23 expands on more of their nonsense. Matt 23 is really good on this topic.
 

DeighAnn

Banned Serpent Seed Heresy
Jun 11, 2019
2,436
760
113
Well if says Galatians was written before the Jersalem council, and for sure Paul circumcised Timothy AFTER the Jerusalem council.

◄ Galatians ►
Bible Book Summary
Galatians Summary
by Jay Smith
https://biblehub.com/summary/galatians/1.htm

The book of Galatians is a Pauline Epistle (letter from Paul). It was written by the Apostle Paul about 49 A.D. prior to the Jerusalem Council which had taken place in 50 A.D
I am still lost here. Could you explain it again. I am sorry. If you have time.