Do Catholics and Muslims worship the same God?

[watcher2013]

Watcher! Again, you have taken everything out of context in order to suit your argument. You COMPLETELY ignored what I explained to you that the pope meant when he stated that Muslims worship the same God and how I said that they understand him differently to us. We know this because they too worship the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob. They differ to us because they don't believe that Christ was the Messiah or God made flesh.

Their God and our God the Father are still the same God.[/QUOTE]

If you are going to based your argument in the catechism mentioned above, The Catholics and Muslims worship the same God your statement fits the catechism.

They differ to us because they don't believe that Christ was the Messiah or God made flesh

Do they differ or the same?

Catholic catechism say "together with us, they adore"...who the god who will judge mankind at the last day.

THIS IS WHAT THE CATECHISM MEANS WHEN WHEN IT STATES THAT THEY HAVE A HEAD START AHEAD OF OTHERS WHEN IT COMES TO LEADING THEM TO THE TRUTH! They believe in God! The same God. They just don't understand Him completely when it comes to Trinity!

You cannot equate the True God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob to those god without Christ.

example:
Joh 8:39 Theyanswered and said unto him, Abraham is our father. Jesus saith unto them, If yewere Abraham's children, ye would do the works of Abraham. Joh 8:40 But now yeseek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God:this did not Abraham.
Joh 8:41 Ye do thedeeds of your father. Then said they to him, We be not born of fornication; wehave one Father, even God.

(Who they say their father was vs 39... they are the children of Abraham. then in vs. 41, They have ONE FATHER, even GOD)
Have you notice???? your argument is not far away from theirs.

And This is what Jesus said to them
Joh 8:42 Jesus saidunto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth andcame from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me.
You cannot separate Christ from Godhead... For God sent his Son...

And Jesus further said...
Joh 8:43 Why do yenot understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Joh 8:44 Ye are ofyour father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was amurderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is notruth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar,and the father of it.
Joh 8:45 And becauseI tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

Your last statement about praying to Mary instead of God proves to me that this has become a personal attack on Catholics for you because you have COMPLETELY ignored us when we told you we do not do this.

Catechism 2676 This twofold movement of prayer to Mary has found aprivileged expression in the Ave Maria:

When you have the brain capacity to open up your mind beyond your bias and to look deeper into the teachings of the Catholic Church to know them before you criticise them, then I will continue to discuss with you. Your comments are too shallow. Peace, and God bless.

Have I not invited in this thread even those who defend the catholic faith to list down what Catholics do to Worship God and what Catholics do to Honor Mary...
I assumed your brain is not to small to list them down? Besides you are just listing down the teaching of catholic church.

 

[Bowman]

A most interesting thread. Well, really two threads. I can't figure out if it is about the Catholic Church or the religion of Islam!!

Since I can't fuse the two together, I will just comment on a personal experience with Islam.

Two years ago, when I was taking World Religions for my Seminary degree, we chose to go to a Mosque. The Imam was from Egypt, had memorized the Qur'an and had a degree in comparative religions, and he knew the Bible better than most lay Christians. He tried to convert our class, of course, but didn't have a lot of luck.

I found the people to be kind and friendly, and spent a lot of time talking with them. However, the thing I really walked away with, is the the Muslims believe in the Torah - The first 5 books of our Bible. I found that interesting, because if you read it, it really is the story of the Jews, with a few verses about Ishmael. So why they feel it is true, when it is not really about them, I do not know.

The other thing the Imam said was although they believe in the gospels, BUT the 4 "gospels" and the rest of the New Testament have been "corrupted". That gives them a lot of wiggle room to deny everything the Bible says about Jesus, except that he is a prophet, and Messiah, who is coming at the end of the age. I found that interesting, but even when our prof challenged the Imam about was it "possible" that God could come down as a man to earth from heaven, the Imam said he could, but he wouldn't. End of conversation.

So that tells me that the Muslim religion does not believe in the revelation of Jesus Christ as God and man.

So whatever else the Catholics believe, they do believe in the divinity and humanity of Christ. The Muslims do not. So regardless of what the Pope says, it cannot be the same religion.

Of course, I am neither Catholic nor Muslim, just relating my own experiences I garnered at the Mosque.

Excellent comments and observations, Angela!

You have discovered first-hand, like myself, that all followers of islam follow the same cookie-cutter doctrines and are robotically programmed to put forth the same unwarranted attacks upon the Holy Bible....if they only knew that almost all of the Koran was paraphrased from the Bible...

At least the imam did not ask you 'who ran the Universe while God was dead for three days'....!

This is the kind of ignorance that Christians must deal with when conversing with followers of islam.

I have studied Koranic Arabic for 15+ years and have yet to come across anyone who knows more about the true meaning of the Koran than I do....I perform the same careful exegesis on theh Arabic as I do on the Biblical original languages...and the outcomes even surprised me, at first.

The Koran actually is an early Arab Christian writing which confirms the deity of Jesus Christ! All lost to islamic ignorance...

Islam is the largest Christian cult on the planet.

 

[Bowman]

The scriptures states to worship the God of the house. You can believe as you wish.

I beleive what the Arabic tells me....and it is NOTHING like islam tells you.

 

[watcher2013]

We worship God by praising him as creator, sustainer, and savior of the world. We genuflect to God alone. We proclaim our belief in and allegiance to the Trinity in our Creeds. We ask God to forgive our sins.

We venerate Mary and other saints using different words. We ask the saints to pray for us.

Who can forgive sins????

Praying to Mary for Deliverance
Catechism para 966 "In giving birth you kept your virginity; in your Dormition you did not leavethe world, O Mother of God, but were joined to the source of Life. Youconceived the living God and, by yourprayers, will deliver our souls from death.)
Embedded in the Novena Prayer
Mary, Mother of Forgiveness, may I forgive others as youforgave me in imitation of your Son

can you see the difference?

 

[Bowman]

You are the copy and paste king

This is my own material.

Anything that I post, I can 100% backup.....unlike yourself...

This sort of nonsense is the reason why I am studying Arabic. So I don't need to rely on translations. I don't know why you want to keep trying to change the translation.

If you don't take the time to verify the translation, then you are owned by the translator.

The English language is required to clarify the Arabic...

Hebrew also has many words that have many meanings.

That is why you must study each meaning in context.

Islam ignores this in favor of pouring their own jaded world-view into the text....almost always unsupported...

You take the context of the verse to find the correct translation.

Let them adore the Lord of this House

There are only four ayat to the sura, and I have provided all four....what part(s) would you like to review?

 

[7seven7]

Really?

View attachment 56829

Then why are they bowing to the kaaba stone?

Brother, you don't know enough about their faith to make this kind of statement. Why don't you tell me why they bow to it? But give me an answer according to their theology. Don't assume! The question posed in this thread was "Do Catholics and Muslims worship the same God?" Indeed, according to the Bible and the quoran, we do. And indeed, going by the same two books, ALL CHRISTIANS worship the same God as the Muslims! Interpretations differ MASSIVELY! But they worship the God of Abraham, and so do I. Which God do you worship?

 

[Hizikyah]

Home :: Son of Hamas :: by Mosab Hassan Yousef

 

[7seven7]

It's probably better understood that they worship the same God as the God of the OT? They got a lot of things wrong, I know, but their God IS the same as our OT God. They, like the Jews, don't believe that Jesus was the Messiah. That's the diff. But that doesn't change the FACT THAT THEY WORSHIP THE GOD OF ABRAHAM!

 

[Hizikyah]

LiveLeak.com - HAMAS PLAYS HOST TO PEDOPHILIA - 450 Grooms Wed GIRLS Under Ten In Gaza

 

[jimmydiggs]

To the OP's question: In short, yes, it is the devil.

 

[jimmydiggs]

They got a lot of things wrong, I know, but their God IS the same as our OT God.

What they worship isn't even close. Besides, since when were there two Gods? One for the OT one for the NT? This notion of two Gods is unbiblical.

 

[chestertonrules]

If we enter the kingdom of Yahweh we will never go through the real death, yes.

11 of the 12 disciples were murdered by Rome so they tasted FLESHLY death, but wont taste the 2nd death

HOWEVER NONE HAS BEEN RAISED YET, except the firstfruits, YAHSHUA

Jesus said that those who live and believe in him will never die. Their souls are alive and they want us to join them with Jesus in heaven. That is why we should seek their prayers.

 

[chestertonrules]

Who can forgive sins????

Praying to Mary for Deliverance
Catechism para 966 "In giving birth you kept your virginity; in your Dormition you did not leavethe world, O Mother of God, but were joined to the source of Life. Youconceived the living God and, by yourprayers, will deliver our souls from death.)
Embedded in the Novena Prayer
Mary, Mother of Forgiveness, may I forgive others as youforgave me in imitation of your Son

can you see the difference?

Only God can forgive sins, but his grace can be poured out by the prayers of others. Do you pray for your non Christian friends?


I don't know why you insist on this attempt to distort Catholic teaching. It is easy enough to find out the truth. Anyone reading this can look up Catholic teaching in the Catechism and see that you are lying.

 

[chestertonrules]

Have I not invited in this thread even those who defend the catholic faith to list down what Catholics do to Worship God and what Catholics do to Honor Mary...
I assumed your brain is not to small to list them down? Besides you are just listing down the teaching of catholic church.

I already answered this in detail and you ignored it because it exposed you as a dishonest poster.

 

[Bowman]

The question posed in this thread was "Do Catholics and Muslims worship the same God?" Indeed, according to the Bible and the quoran, we do. And indeed, going by the same two books, ALL CHRISTIANS worship the same God as the Muslims! Interpretations differ MASSIVELY! But they worship the God of Abraham, and so do I. Which God do you worship?

No, brother.

True Christians do NOT worship the same God as that of Muslims.

The 'allah', as revealed in the Koran, is Satan....dressed-up to look like the true Biblical God....this is the god that followers of islam worship.

Muslim's do not have the Son - thus, they do not have eternal life.

 

[1Christianwarrior316]

Why don't you tell me why they bow to it? But give me an answer according to their theology. Don't assume!

Muslims consider the kaaba to be the most holiest site which is in Mecca. They believe this to be the ancient house of God. Five times a day, Muslims around the world face this holy site while praying as instructed by the quran.
2.144 We see the turning of thy face (for guidance to the heavens: now Shall We turn thee to a Qibla that shall please thee. Turn then Thy face in the direction of the sacred Mosque: Wherever ye are, turn your faces in that direction.

qiblah
the direction of the sacred shrine of the Ka'bah in Mecca, Saudi Arabia, toward which Muslims turn five times each day when performing the salat (daily ritual prayer).

The question posed in this thread was "Do Catholics and Muslims worship the same God?"

I was not responding to the op but to your statement, “We know this because they too worship the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob.”

Indeed, according to the Bible and the quoran, we do. And indeed, going by the same two books, ALL CHRISTIANS worship the same God as the Muslims!

This statement is blasphemy!!!

Brother, you don't know enough about their faith to make this kind of statement.

You know nothing about me and you make such a statement? I know enough about their so called religion to know that it was inspired by Satan and is leading many of it’s followers to destruction.
So let me ask you 7seven7. If God changes not (Mal 3:6) why does the quran teach God has no son and the Word of God teach he does?

The quran says….
Surah 19.35 It is not befitting to (the majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! when He determines a matter, He only says to it, "Be", and it is.
87 None shall have the power of intercession, but such a one as has received permission (or promise) from ((Allah)) Most Gracious.
88. They say: "((Allah)) Most Gracious has begotten a son!"
89. Indeed ye have put forth a thing most monstrous!
90. At it the skies are ready to burst, the earth to split asunder, and the mountains to fall down in utter ruin,
91. That they should invoke a son for ((Allah)) Most Gracious.
92. For it is not consonant with the majesty of ((Allah)) Most Gracious that He should beget a son.

The Word of God says….
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.

But they worship the God of Abraham, and so do I.

They actually worship a pagan moon god.
2Co 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?

Which God do you worship?

If you want to continue to believe that we worship the same God then by all means do as you believe. But as for me, and my house, we will serve the Lord!

 

[7seven7]

No, brother.

True Christians do NOT worship the same God as that of Muslims.

The 'allah', as revealed in the Koran, is Satan....dressed-up to look like the true Biblical God....this is the god that followers of islam worship.

Muslim's do not have the Son - thus, they do not have eternal life.

Can they be saved?

 

[7seven7]

Muslims consider the kaaba to be the most holiest site which is in Mecca. They believe this to be the ancient house of God. Five times a day, Muslims around the world face this holy site while praying as instructed by the quran.
2.144 We see the turning of thy face (for guidance to the heavens: now Shall We turn thee to a Qibla that shall please thee. Turn then Thy face in the direction of the sacred Mosque: Wherever ye are, turn your faces in that direction.

qiblah
the direction of the sacred shrine of the Ka'bah in Mecca, Saudi Arabia, toward which Muslims turn five times each day when performing the salat (daily ritual prayer).



I was not responding to the op but to your statement, “We know this because they too worship the God of Abraham Isaac and Jacob.”



This statement is blasphemy!!!



You know nothing about me and you make such a statement? I know enough about their so called religion to know that it was inspired by Satan and is leading many of it’s followers to destruction.
So let me ask you 7seven7. If God changes not (Mal 3:6) why does the quran teach God has no son and the Word of God teach he does?

The quran says….
Surah 19.35 It is not befitting to (the majesty of) Allah that He should beget a son. Glory be to Him! when He determines a matter, He only says to it, "Be", and it is.
87 None shall have the power of intercession, but such a one as has received permission (or promise) from ((Allah)) Most Gracious.
88. They say: "((Allah)) Most Gracious has begotten a son!"
89. Indeed ye have put forth a thing most monstrous!
90. At it the skies are ready to burst, the earth to split asunder, and the mountains to fall down in utter ruin,
91. That they should invoke a son for ((Allah)) Most Gracious.
92. For it is not consonant with the majesty of ((Allah)) Most Gracious that He should beget a son.

The Word of God says….
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.



They actually worship a pagan moon god.
2Co 6:14 Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?



If you want to continue to believe that we worship the same God then by all means do as you believe. But as for me, and my house, we will serve the Lord!

OK I just want to clear up that I don't agree with ANYTHING that the cult of Islam teaches. I cringe every time I see them walk around with their moustacheless beards. I hate what they teach about the worth of women. EVERYTHING I know about them I disagree with, and my Muslim friends know it. I agree with with you that it could very well be a cult started by Satan himself. It breeds so much hatred and evil for "infadels" that it would be INSANE to think that they TRULY worship our Lord! BUT! The fact remains that their founder, the "prophet" Mohommed, was raised by Christians and lived among them all his life believing in the same God. When he started this new movement, he did so in the name of the same God, but claimed that he understood Him better. I'm just answering the question of this thread. They believe that they are worshipping the True God, the God of Abraham. They know that we worship the True God of Abraham aswell, but they insist that we have offended God by teaching He had a Son. They teach rubbish, I know. I'm just stating the facts. They are following a teaching that contradicts itself many many times. They brainwash eachother into thinking its good to kill non-muslims. They think they know God but they obviously don't. But this God that they have wrong, from their beginning, was the God of Abraham.

P.S- Sorry for saying that you don't know enough about them. Didn't mean to upset you. God bless, brother.

 

[7seven7]

What they worship isn't even close. Besides, since when were there two Gods? One for the OT one for the NT? This notion of two Gods is unbiblical.

Jimmy, no body said that there were 2 gods. My point was that they believe in God before all the prophecies were fulfilled through Christ. There was an understanding about God before the revelation of Christ. The Muslims and the Jews are still stuck in the OT. But even then, only the first few books of the OT. That's probably why they don't get the prophecies and revelation of Christ. Get my drift, controversy boy? lol Peace

 

[7seven7]

The wailing wall, the temple, the church, the Kaaba. It is a place where people can get together and pray. We worship the God of that house not the house. This is instructed in Surah 106:3. The Kaaba brings people from all over the world to mix with each other.

Its really not that hard to understand, is it? Seems to me that people just really get off on condemning people which is why they search for anything they can to do so.