Do you observe the Sabbath?

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Mar 4, 2020
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Acts 15
1Certain people came down from Judea to Antioch and were teaching the believers: “Unless you are circumcised, according to the custom taught by Moses, you cannot be saved.” 2This brought Paul and Barnabas into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Paul and Barnabas were appointed, along with some other believers, to go up to Jerusalem to see the apostles and elders about this question. 3The church sent them on their way, and as they traveled through Phoenicia and Samaria, they told how the Gentiles had been converted. This news made all the believers very glad. 4When they came to Jerusalem, they were welcomed by the church and the apostles and elders, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.
5Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, “The Gentiles must be circumcised and required to keep the law of Moses.”
6The apostles and elders met to consider this question. 7After much discussion, Peter got up and addressed them: “Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Gentiles might hear from my lips the message of the gospel and believe. 8God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. 9He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. 10Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Gentiles a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? 11No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are.”
12The whole assembly became silent as they listened to Barnabas and Paul telling about the signs and wonders God had done among the Gentiles through them. 13When they finished, James spoke up. “Brothers,” he said, “listen to me. 14Simon has described to us how God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles. 15The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:
16“ ‘After this I will return
and rebuild David’s fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild,
and I will restore it,
17that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
even all the Gentiles who bear my name,
says the Lord, who does these things’ —
18things known from long ago.
19“It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Gentiles who are turning to God. 20Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from food polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from the meat of strangled animals and from blood. 21For the law of Moses has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the synagogues on every Sabbath.”
The Council’s Letter to Gentile Believers
22Then the apostles and elders, with the whole church, decided to choose some of their own men and send them to Antioch with Paul and Barnabas. They chose Judas (called Barsabbas) and Silas, men who were leaders among the believers. 23With them they sent the following letter:
The apostles and elders, your brothers,
To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia:
Greetings.
24We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said. 25So we all agreed to choose some men and send them to you with our dear friends Barnabas and Paul— 26men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. 27Therefore we are sending Judas and Silas to confirm by word of mouth what we are writing. 28It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: 29You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.
Farewell.
 
H

HopeinHim4ever

Guest
We are not under the law of Moses, so it's not about transgressing the law or sinning all we want. That is the straw man argument. Since the old covenant has been made obsolete, does this leave us with no moral direction? Absolutely not. God made the old covenant obsolete to legally put into place the new covenant. (2 Corinthians 3:6-9; Hebrews 8:6-13) The life of discipleship flows out of the new command, to love one another as He loved us (John 13:34), and the apostle Paul says that by bearing one another's burdens, we fulfill "law of Christ." (Galatians 6:2) Love fulfills the law (Romans 13:8-10) and out of this single command comes other commands, including references for the moral aspect of 9 of the 10 commandments which are reiterated under the new covenant, yet the command to keep the sabbath day is not binding on Christians under the new covenant.

1. You shall have no other gods before Me. - Acts 14:15
2. You shall make no idols. - 1 John 5:21
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. - 1 Timothy 6:1; James 2:7; James 5:12
4. Keep the sabbath day holy. - Not binding on the Church - Colossians 2:16-17
5. Honor your father and your mother. - Ephesians 6:1-2
6. You shall not murder. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 John 3:15
7. You shall not commit adultery. - Romans 13:9-10; 1 Corinthians 6:9-10
8. You shall not steal. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 4:28
9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. - Romans 13:9-10; Colossians 3:9-10
10. You shall not covet. - Romans 13:9-10; Ephesians 5:3

In regards to Romans 6:16, there are only two kinds of servants in this world, in the spiritual sense; servants of sin unto death, or servants of obedience unto righteousness. When we place our faith exclusively in Jesus Christ for salvation/believe the gospel by trusting in His finished work of redemption as the all sufficient means of our salvation, (Ephesians 2:8,9; Romans 1:16) we then become "servants of obedience unto righteousness." Being slaves of sin is put in the past tense. Paul goes on in Romans 6:18 - "You have been set free from sin and have become servants/slaves to righteousness."
Don't you think Colossians 2 is mostly in the context of manmade rules/traditions?
 

TMS

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Mar 21, 2015
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Why does this straw man argument always come up?
We both believe in righteousness by faith. Faith in Jesus to save us.

But we disagree on what righteousness is.

I believe righteousness involves all of the 10 commandments and reflects Gods perfect character.
God commanded us to keep them because they are righteous.

Rom 2:26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

But we all fail and we can not obtain righteousness ourselves.

Rom 3:23-24
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Rom 8: 3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit....
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

So keeping any laws will not make us righteous because we will fail

Righteousness comes by faith in Jesus...

The righteousness that Jesus is giving us is the perfect life He lived. Jesus was righteous because He perfectly obeyed the law.

Did Jesus keep the Sabbath day holy. Yes because it was a sin not to.
Righteousness involves keeping the 4th commandment.

Are you saying that Jesus changed the standard of righteousness?

Shouldn't we aim to follow the righteousness of Jesus,
Which was all 10 commandments?

Rom 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
 

TMS

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Mar 21, 2015
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Jesus keep the sabbath day holy to be perfectly righteous, and gives us that righteousness as a gift so we can stand righteous in the judgement. God must see the sabbath as an important part of righteousness or Jesus would not have needed to obeyed it.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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That is not true..
The Sabbath was made for man before sin.
The offerings were to atone for sin.
Now although God's rest on the seventh day in Genesis 2:3 did foreshadow a future Sabbath law, there is no Biblical record of the Sabbath before the children of Israel left the land of Egypt. Nowhere in Scripture is there any hint that Sabbath keeping was practiced from Adam to Moses.

The word "Sabbath" first appears in Exodus 16:23 - Then he said to them, “This is what the Lord has said: ‘Tomorrow is a Sabbath rest, a holy Sabbath to the Lord. Bake what you will bake today, and boil what you will boil; and lay up for yourselves all that remains, to be kept until morning.

God's word makes it quite clear that Sabbath observance was a sign between God and Israel: “The Israelites are to observe the Sabbath, celebrating it for the generations to come as a lasting covenant. It will be a sign between me and the Israelites forever, for in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, and on the seventh day he abstained from work and rested.” (Exodus 31:16-17)

In Deuteronomy 5, Moses restates the Ten Commandments to the next generation of Israelites. Here, after commanding Sabbath observance in verses 12–14, Moses gives the reason the Sabbath was given to the nation Israel: “Remember that you were slaves in Egypt and that the Lord your God brought you out of there with a mighty hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore the Lord your God has commanded you to observe the Sabbath day.” (Deuteronomy 5:15)

Types and shadows all pointed to the plan of salvation achived by Jesus.. they were introduced to help people and Israel to look forward in hope and understand salvation.

After Jesus fulfilled these plans we look back to Jesus as our hope and trust in what He did.
Faith.....
Yes and of course we do.

But the sabbath was given to man at creation before sin. It was not a type or shadow.
Yes it was.

Colossians 2:16 - Therefore, no one is to act as your judge in regard to food and drink, or in respect to a festival or a new moon, or a Sabbath day— 17 things which are only a shadow of what is to come; but the substance belongs to Christ. The substance has come, yet you are still clinging to the shadow. This remains your stumbling block.
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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We both believe in righteousness by faith. Faith in Jesus to save us.

But we disagree on what righteousness is.

I believe righteousness involves all of the 10 commandments and reflects Gods perfect character.
God commanded us to keep them because they are righteous.

Rom 2:26 Therefore if the uncircumcision keep the righteousness of the law, shall not his uncircumcision be counted for circumcision?

But we all fail and we can not obtain righteousness ourselves.

Rom 3:23-24
For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; 24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Rom 8: 3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: 4 That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit....
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

Rom 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.

So keeping any laws will not make us righteous because we will fail

Righteousness comes by faith in Jesus...

The righteousness that Jesus is giving us is the perfect life He lived. Jesus was righteous because He perfectly obeyed the law.

Did Jesus keep the Sabbath day holy. Yes because it was a sin not to.
Righteousness involves keeping the 4th commandment.

Are you saying that Jesus changed the standard of righteousness?

Shouldn't we aim to follow the righteousness of Jesus,
Which was all 10 commandments?

Rom 6:13 Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God.
Out of one side of your mouth you say that we are saved by faith and not by law keeping, yet out of the other side of your mouth it sounds like you are saying that keeping the 10 commandments (with a heavy emphasis on the 4th commandment - keeping the sabbath day) "in addition" to faith in Christ is how we are made righteous. I continue to hear double speak from you, which sounds similar to the SDA gospel of "salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works." You can't have it both ways.
 

gb9

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Jan 18, 2011
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Out of one side of your mouth you say that we are saved by faith and not by law keeping, yet out of the other side of your mouth it sounds like you are saying that keeping the 10 commandments (with a heavy emphasis on the 4th commandment - keeping the sabbath day) "in addition" to faith in Christ is how we are made righteous. I continue to hear double speak from you, which sounds similar to the SDA gospel of "salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works." You can't have it both ways.
they try to present Sabbath keeping as " optional requirement", as in " you do not have to, but you are in trouble if you don't"

no such things as a optional requirement ".
 

mailmandan

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2014
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they try to present Sabbath keeping as " optional requirement", as in " you do not have to, but you are in trouble if you don't"

no such things as a optional requirement ".
Sure sounds like sugar coated double talk to me.
 
Jun 5, 2020
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The sabbath is simply a day off. It was unknown in the OT era. The Hebrews were slaves and so had no conception of a day of rest. Also, in primitive agricultural, all people had to do at least some work every day.

So a command to rest was necessary but, as Jesus showed, the sabbath "law" could be violated when a person deemed it necessary to do so.
 

Cameron143

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Mar 1, 2022
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The sabbath is simply a day off. It was unknown in the OT era. The Hebrews were slaves and so had no conception of a day of rest. Also, in primitive agricultural, all people had to do at least some work every day.

So a command to rest was necessary but, as Jesus showed, the sabbath "law" could be violated when a person deemed it necessary to do so.
Jesus never violated the sabbath. He observed it fully and correctly.
 

Blade

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Nov 19, 2019
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"I believe righteousness involves all of the 10 commandments and reflects Gods perfect character.
God commanded us to keep them because they are righteous."

What is righteousness? Its right standing with God. How do we get it? By believing in Jesus. So what you said is not what His word says. He wrote His ways on mans heart. For me doing them obeying them does not in anyway make me more righteous then I already am. Its Christ not me. I have no none. No amount of good words deeds you name it can not add to His righteousness. What happens after is fruit. Like He said no branch can have fruit with out the vine. Everything on that branch comes from the vine. Sorry if you meant something else :)
 

TMS

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Mar 21, 2015
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Out of one side of your mouth you say that we are saved by faith and not by law keeping, yet out of the other side of your mouth it sounds like you are saying that keeping the 10 commandments (with a heavy emphasis on the 4th commandment - keeping the sabbath day) "in addition" to faith in Christ is how we are made righteous. I continue to hear double speak from you, which sounds similar to the SDA gospel of "salvation by grace plus law, faith plus works." You can't have it both ways.
I've explained it in detail so many times.

Paul in Romans explains it well so i keep using what Paul states..

I don't keep the law in order to be saved.. i keep the because i love my saviour.

The bible plainly states that those that love Jesus will obey and keep the law.

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Rom 13:10 KJV Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Rom 6:15-16
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. 16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Psa 1:2-3
2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night. 3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.

When i say, it is God's will that we obey His moral law and not sin. I'm not speaking from both sides of my mouth. I'm speaking the words of the bible.

Rom 6:20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

Do you believe we should establish the law even when we are saved by faith?
 
Mar 4, 2020
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I've explained it in detail so many times.

Paul in Romans explains it well so i keep using what Paul states..

I don't keep the law in order to be saved.. i keep the because i love my saviour.

The bible plainly states that those that love Jesus will obey and keep the law.

Joh 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments.

1Jn 5:3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

Rom 13:10 KJV Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Rom 6:15-16
15 What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid. 16 Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, his servants ye are to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

Psa 1:2-3
2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night. 3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.

When i say, it is God's will that we obey His moral law and not sin. I'm not speaking from both sides of my mouth. I'm speaking the words of the bible.

Rom 6:20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

Do you believe we should establish the law even when we are saved by faith?
I agree with keeping the 10 commandments, but I’m curious if there is a difference between God’s Law and Christ’s Law?

1 Corinthians 9
21To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law),
 

Nils

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Dec 16, 2022
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We are all one in Christ..
God isn't biased to any blood line, all can be part of His family.
We are grafted into the root of Abraham so we are Jews by adoption.
Rom 11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

As adopted Jews we should live like Gods children.

I've shown that the 10 commandments are not the old covenant.. and that the cerimonial laws are different to the 10 commandments, but people don't want to hear.
"Then the Lord said to Moses, “Write down these words, for in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel.”Moses was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights without eating bread or drinking water. And he wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant—the Ten Commandments.When Moses came down from Mount Sinai with the two tablets of the covenant law in his hands, he was not aware that his face was radiant because he had spoken with the Lord. - Exodus 34:27-29 NIV
 

GRACE_ambassador

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Feb 22, 2021
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op: observe sabbath?
Yes, Absolutely = resting In The True Sabbath, The Lord Jesus Christ - 24/7 = Amen.

The former "shadow sabbath" was for ISRAEL (Jews), But Now:

Gal 3:27 "For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ."

Gal 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free,
there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."

Praise His Holy Name!
-------------------------------
Precious friends:

Grace, Peace, And JOY In Christ, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly
Divided
(+ I and II)!
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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I agree with keeping the 10 commandments, but I’m curious if there is a difference between God’s Law and Christ’s Law?

1 Corinthians 9
21To those not having the law I became like one not having the law (though I am not free from God’s law but am under Christ’s law),
Because Christ and the Father are one, it means that Christs laws are the Fathers laws and the Fathers Laws are Christs laws. One and the same.

There are different laws.
Paul understood the cerimonial laws were not for the gentiles and jewish civil laws did not apply to other nations.
 

TMS

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"Then the Lord said to Moses, “Write down these words, for in accordance with these words I have made a covenant with you and with Israel.”Moses was there with the Lord forty days and forty nights without eating bread or drinking water. And he wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant—the Ten Commandments.When Moses came down from Mount Sinai with the two tablets of the covenant law in his hands, he was not aware that his face was radiant because he had spoken with the Lord. - Exodus 34:27-29 NIV
Yes, the bible states that.

It is interesting when you compare Moses with Jesus..

Moses was a type of christ of that time.. He needs Jesus like all of us, but he showed many parallels of how Jesus's ministry and life would be.
Strange how Israel mised it.
 

TMS

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Gal 3:28 "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free,
there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus."
All , one in Christ.

So the Sabbath is for all or non.
We should all keep it or no one should...

One verse in Col 2 does not controdict the rest of the Bible. Read it in context.

Col 2:8-23
8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Watch out for..
Tradotion of man,
Philosophy,
vain deceit,
Rudiments of the world.

In Christ we are complete, and He is the head of all.

Read the context...

14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.

He Nailed the handwriting of ordanaces to the cross.
The handwriting of ordanaces was against us.
Therefore blotting out the handwritting of ordances.... let no one judge you in the following.

16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ. 18 Let no man beguile you of your reward ......20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, 21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not; 22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men?

Are ye subject ordinances after the commandments of men?.

Eph 2:15 Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

Heb 9:1 Then verily the first covenant had also ordinances of divine service, and a worldly sanctuary.
Heb 9:9-11
Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience; 10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. 11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building;


It is important to understand that some laws were ordinances that were nailed to the cross.. not all laws finished at the cross.

The sabbaths that were yearly and finished at the cross are different to the weekly sabbaths.
Research it, there is a difference.
 
H

HopeinHim4ever

Guest
I've heard the point made, the Sabbath was made for man... not just the Jews.
 

TMS

Senior Member
Mar 21, 2015
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I've heard the point made, the Sabbath was made for man... not just the Jews.
Also..
Act 13:14 But when they departed from Perga, they came to Antioch in Pisidia, and went into the synagogue on the sabbath day, and sat down.
Act 13:42 And when the Jews were gone out of the synagogue, the Gentiles besought that these words might be preached to them the next sabbath.
Act 13:43 Now when the congregation was broken up, many of the Jews and religious proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas: who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
Act 13:44 And the next sabbath day came almost the whole city together to hear the word of God.
Act 17:2 And Paul, as his manner was, went in unto them, and three sabbath days reasoned with them out of the scriptures,
Act 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every sabbath, and persuaded the Jews and the Greeks.

Heb 4:9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
Heb 4:10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.