Doctrine of Unconditional Election

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Pilgrimshope

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Sep 2, 2020
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God predestined Adam, Eve and their offspring to live in paradise with condition if they obey, God predestined people go to hell if they not obey
Adam was the elect , he disbelieved what God had said because the devil told him it wasn’t true , the first false doctrine

then later God chose israel by grace and his promise to Abram for his descendants and later he gave them a law they refused to hear it and believe so again the elect were destroyed

“I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.”
‭‭Jude‬ ‭1:5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

and now he has said this

“And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;

but he that believeth not shall be damned.”
‭‭Mark‬ ‭16:15-16‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it is never going to be of God when we teach people to ignore his word and ways and commandments it’s always going to be satan saying “don’t worry about what he said , listen to me “

but we have been edifies to
Know this is prevalent and to avoid those teachers teaching as the false prophets of Jerusalem “ were chosen , God is Never going to bring his punishments to us and cut us off as he said , we’re the elect, eat drink and
Be merry”

it’s repetitive the word of God spoken To keep Man in life with him in his presence chosen and blessed having dominion , and soon after he establishes his covenant man begins to rebel and ignore and break the things he made plain and warned would bring death

it will always be that way and it’s proof to read some of the new order books out in the world “explaining “ things like “ election “ “ glorious grace” “ unconditional salvation “

sad when we have to reject Gods word and explain some different path

“Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him.

Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.”
‭‭John‬ ‭14:6, 21, 23-24‬ ‭KJV‬‬

it didn’t matter what the word was what has always mattered is that we believe it

if Adam and Eve had believed the fruit was deadly , tethered than what Satan said they wouldn’t have eaten the fruit

if Cain had believed what God said to him , he would t have killed his brother and been cast away with the mark

if Noah had believed what God said to him , he would have built an ark and saved his family and himself by faith 😁


“By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭11:7‬ ‭KJV‬‬

if Noah had heard what God said , and not believed it he wouldn’t have bothered obeying it.

it’s now down to what Jesus said forever in the gospel of the kingdom and if we begin to hear and believe it we’re going to be saved into his kingdom , if we follow the example of mankknd throughout history disbelieving and rejecting and making up new “ ways” to be saved and new reasons not to obey the lord it’s going to follow the same example as was always we will perish from his sight and those who hear and believed will live forever with the lord

to first hear Gods word and believe will make us move in Christ by the faith he imparts he teaches us to repent and walk upright he also enables us by faith to do it all that can get us is rejecting the truth of the gospel just like Adam rejected his word and followed another

but there are Many alternate roots nowadays only one still leads home to this place

“In my Father's house are many mansions: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.

And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know. Thomas saith unto him, Lord, we know not whither thou goest; and how can we know the way?

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.”
‭‭John‬ ‭14:2-6‬ ‭KJV‬‬

we can’t get home to the lord unless we follow his words in the gospel
 
Aug 20, 2021
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God predestined Adam, Eve and their offspring to live in paradise with condition if they obey, God predestined people go to hell if they not obey
no hell was the devil and his angels Matthew 25:41.For them it was only death.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
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no hell was the devil and his angels Matthew 25:41.For them it was only death.
“And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭9:27‬ ‭

our bodies die , our spirit faces judgement and ends up in heaven or hell
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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Yes, God made a lot of choices before He created the world. But it seems you don't understand what "conditions" means.

Regarding Eph 1:4, the "us" in that verse is defined clearly in v.19. "us who believe". So 1:4 says that God chose believers (who are in Him) before the foundation of the world to be holy and blameless.

Red words state the purpose of election in Eph 1:4. iow, from before the foundation of the world, God chose believers (He is omniscient) to be holy and blameless.

Could you address the list of examples I gave along with verses that prove my claim and see where I'm wrong.

Thanks.
Election before the foundation in Eph 1 is unconditional election to Salvation !
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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Yes but you are very selective as to what scripture you use to do so. You should look at the whole of scripture then perhaps you would get your theology right.
Nevertheless its the word of God !
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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Actually we should look at the unbiblical doctrine of divine determinism that you hold to. If that doctrine were true then God not only chose those to be saved but also those to be condemned to hell. And this was not because of anything they did but just because He wanted to. Now that is why the calvinist view impunes the character of God.
You keep trying to justify calvinism by proof texting but it does not work for anyone that takes the time to look at the verses in context.
So did you understand that post ? Its very important, Im giving a comprehensive view of unconditional election by presenting its counterpart !
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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BF you just will not learn will you. God has made that condition of salvation faith in Christ Jesus. But you think that your salvation is just because you won the lottery or at least you hope you did because you can never be sure can you.
Election to Salvation is unconditional, for its by grace and it occurred before the chosen were ever born ! Eph 1;Rom 9
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Well since you can not find this verse in your special Calvinist bible I put them here for you. You need to get yourself a real bible then perhaps you will trust in the real God of the bible not the one you have made up in your mind.
I have no problem with Jn 3:18. This thread is about Gods unconditional election before the foundation of the world, and reprbation before the foundation of the world.
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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8But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
Okay I have no problem with those scriptures, do you ?
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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This is a late replay: all thing are created 2 times once in the mind of god then in reality every nuance of what we r and how we would react to any environment for god does not make mistake,and knows all things.There is fact no mistakes in all of god creation.
You still lost me, for this is about God choosing individuals for Salvation in Christ before the foundation. Your comment here doesnt appear to sync with anything I said !
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Im defending unconditional election, its taught in Eph and Rom. I started this thread !
Thats fine

Romans 9 - 11 is not talking about the election of induvidual. its talking about the election of Israel.

You cant use Ephesians to support your view of Romans 9 - 11. Because they are talking about two different things.

It does not matter if yur started the thread. You need to stick to the conversation which is ongoing. We were discussing romans 9. Not Ephesians.

Learn some humility my friend.
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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If Election/Salvation was in ay degree conditioned or contingent on what a person does, even thinks, then they could not be by Grace. Election is of Grace minus works Rom 9:11;11:5-6 and Salvation is the same Eph 2:8-9; 2 Tim 1:9
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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Thats fine

Romans 9 - 11 is not talking about the election of induvidual. its talking about the election of Israel.

You cant use Ephesians to support your view of Romans 9 - 11. Because they are talking about two different things.

It does not matter if yur started the thread. You need to stick to the conversation which is ongoing. We were discussing romans 9. Not Ephesians.

Learn some humility my friend.
Its the only thing Election to Salvation can be about but of individuals. Christ died for Individuals, Salvation is for indviduals. You think God chose pigs and donkeys, and birds before the foundation ? You think He chose fish to be holy and blameless before Him in Love ? You dont seem to have the right bib;ical perspective my friend !
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Its the only thing Election to Salvation can be about but of individuals. Christ died for Individuals, Salvation is for indviduals. You think God chose pigs and donkeys, and birds before the foundation ? You think He chose fish to be holy and blameless before Him in Love ? You dont seem to have the right bib;ical perspective my friend !
Thats wrong

God chose Israel as a holy nation out of all the other nations (gentiles)

And Romans 9 - 11 is about that very thing.

Open your mind my friend
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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Thats wrong

God chose Israel as a holy nation out of all the other nations (gentiles)

And Romans 9 - 11 is about that very thing.

Open your mind my friend
Thats the Truth, Election unto Salvation is about individuals, and its taught to be unconditional in both Rom 9 and Eph 1 !
 
Oct 31, 2015
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Thats maybe what it seems to you, but thats not the truth of the matter, I showed why in the op.

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. John 3:16



What people are excluded from the world?






JPT
 
Oct 31, 2015
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Thats the Truth, Election unto Salvation is about individuals, and its taught to be unconditional in both Rom 9 and Eph 1 !

The elect is a reference to the Jews.


Therefore I endure all things for the sake of the elect, that they also may obtain the salvation which is in Christ Jesus with eternal glory. 2 Timothy 2:10



Do you believe only Jews will be saved?




JPT
 
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eternally-gratefull

Guest
Thats the Truth, Election unto Salvation is about individuals, and its taught to be unconditional in both Rom 9 and Eph 1 !
Your right election to salvation is about induviduals

Where your wrong is romana 9-11 is not about election to salvation
it’s about Gods chowing of Israel
 

phil36

Senior Member
Feb 12, 2009
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What people are excluded from the world?JPT


Hi Justpassingthrough. The text itself tells us who is exlcuded.

It's those who don't believe, those who are already condemened.

"that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life." (v16b).

"but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son" (v18b).