Doctrine of Unconditional Election

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Everlasting-Grace

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You can deny and red x if you want to, but the Word is clear. God made an unconditional promise to the Jews and he will keep it.
If God changed his mind and rejects his promise to them, What is keeping God from doing the same to us? That eternal life that he promised us based not on what we did. But on what he do.

lets face it, If God fails to keep his promise to israel. We have no hope. Because God can just as easily fail to keep his promise to us..
 

Everlasting-Grace

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No, God made an unconditional covenant with Abraham.

In Genesis 13:14-15, God told Abraham, “Lift your eyes now and look from the place where you are … for all the land which you see I will give to you and your descendants forever.”

And Genesis 15:18 states, “On the same day the LORD made a covenant with Abram, saying: ‘To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates.’”

God said to Isaac, “Sojourn in this land, and I will be with you and bless you; for to you and your descendants I will give all these lands, and I will perform the oath which I swore to Abraham your father” (Genesis 26:3).

he title deed to the Promised Land was then passed to Jacob from Isaac. In Genesis 28:13, God said, “I am the LORD God of Abraham your father and the God of Isaac; the land on which you lie I will give to you and your descendants.”


God made a blood covenant with Abraham and it passed on to his descendants. A blood covenant is unconditional and irrevocable. There are no conditions, God cannot divorce Himself from the Jews, He made a blood covenant with them.


Psalm 89:30-37. God says, “If his sons [Israel] forsake My law and do not walk in My judgments, if they break My statutes and do not keep My commandments, then I will visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes.”
“Nevertheless My lovingkindness I will not utterly take from him, nor allow My faithfulness to fail.” God is saying here that He will not break His covenant.



Amos writes concerning the restoration of Israel, “I will bring back the captives of My people Israel; they shall build the waste cities and inhabit them; they shall plant vineyards and drink wine from them; they shall also make gardens and eat fruit from them. I will plant them in their land, and no longer shall they be pulled up from the land I have given them, says the LORD your God” (Amos 9:14-15).


...for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable” (Romans 11:28–29, NASB).
Amen we also have the dry bones being restored t life in Ezekiel 37. The time of Jacobs trouble in Jeremiah 30, The restoration of Jer 16. So many more where God said after Israel is scattered through out the world in punishment, (which occured in 70 AD.) Where he would restor them, and the gentiles would praise God because of it..
 

rogerg

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Your right, God is the author of the Bible.

So when he made a claim in the OT. We listen to him. Not only one else

God made the nation of Israel a promise.
God's promise to the nation of Israel was conditional upon their fulfilling of the stipulations of the promise.
They failed. Because of that, all that remains (ed) of the promise is the fulfillment of the warnings God gave
to them to their evil and not to their good.

[1Ki 9:6-7 KJV]
6 [But] if ye shall at all turn from following me, ye or your children, and will not keep my commandments [and] my statutes which I have set before you, but go and serve other gods, and worship them:
7 Then will I cut off Israel out of the land which I have given them; and this house, which I have hallowed for my name, will I cast out of my sight; and Israel shall be a proverb and a byword among all people:
 

rogerg

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f God changed his mind and rejects his promise to them, What is keeping God from doing the same to us? That eternal life that he promised us based not on what we did. But on what he do.
:God didn't change His mind. God warned Israel about the evil He would do to them if they didn't meet His requirements.
His promise to them contained both good and bad parts. They failed by worshipping other gods, so all that is left to them are the bad parts of the promise
 

Everlasting-Grace

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God's promise to the nation of Israel was conditional upon their fulfilling of the stipulations of the promise.
They failed. Because of that, all that remains (ed) of the promise is the fulfillment of the warnings God gave
to them to their evil and not to their good.

[1Ki 9:6-7 KJV]
6 [But] if ye shall at all turn from following me, ye or your children, and will not keep my commandments [and] my statutes which I have set before you, but go and serve other gods, and worship them:
7 Then will I cut off Israel out of the land which I have given them; and this house, which I have hallowed for my name, will I cast out of my sight; and Israel shall be a proverb and a byword among all people:
Nope.

Gen 15:
17 And it came to pass, when the sun went down and it was dark, that behold, there appeared a smoking oven and a burning torch that passed between those pieces. 18 On the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying:

“To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates— 19 the Kenites, the Kenezzites, the Kadmonites, 20 the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Rephaim, 21 the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.”

No conditions given

Gen 17: 8 Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in[f] which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”

No conditions given

Period of time for both promises. ETERNITY.

He promised he would PUNISH them if they sinned, He never promised he would REMOVE HIS PROMISE if they disobeyed.

He also promised even after he punished them if they repented he would remember his promise

Lev 26:
40 ‘But if they confess their iniquity and the iniquity of their fathers, with their unfaithfulness in which they were unfaithful to Me, and that they also have walked contrary to Me,
41 and that I also have walked contrary to them and have brought them into the land of their enemies;
if their uncircumcised hearts are humbled, and they accept their guilt—42 then I will remember My covenant with Jacob, and My covenant with Isaac and My covenant with Abraham I will remember;
I will remember the land.
 

Everlasting-Grace

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:God didn't change His mind. God warned Israel about the evil He would do to them if they didn't meet His requirements.
His promise to them contained both good and bad parts. They failed by worshipping other gods, so all that is left to them are the bad parts of the promise
Nope. According to yu he changed his mind. His ETERNAL promise to them is no longer valid. He canceled his unconditional eternal promise he made to their fathers abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

He promised he would punish them, HE NEVER said he would cancel his promise
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
Nope.

Gen 15:
17 And it came to pass, when the sun went down and it was dark, that behold, there appeared a smoking oven and a burning torch that passed between those pieces. 18 On the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying:

“To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates— 19 the Kenites, the Kenezzites, the Kadmonites, 20 the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Rephaim, 21 the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.”

No conditions given

Gen 17: 8 Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in[f] which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.”

No conditions given

Period of time for both promises. ETERNITY.

He promised he would PUNISH them if they sinned, He never promised he would REMOVE HIS PROMISE if they disobeyed.

He also promised even after he punished them if they repented he would remember his promise

Lev 26:
40 ‘But if they confess their iniquity and the iniquity of their fathers, with their unfaithfulness in which they were unfaithful to Me, and that they also have walked contrary to Me,
41 and that I also have walked contrary to them and have brought them into the land of their enemies;
if their uncircumcised hearts are humbled, and they accept their guilt—42 then I will remember My covenant with Jacob, and My covenant with Isaac and My covenant with Abraham I will remember;
I will remember the land.


Exactly, that is called a blood covenant. It is unconditional,it is everlasting.
 

rogerg

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ope. According to yu he changed his mind. His ETERNAL promise to them is no longer valid. He canceled his unconditional eternal promise he made to their fathers abraham, Isaac and Jacob.

He promised he would punish them, HE NEVER said he would cancel his promise
I never said He changed His mind. I'm the one who posted about the stipulations of His promise, remember? Their failure
to meet those stipulation which stipulations they had agreed to, God, acting as He told them He would in punishing them, does not constitute a of change of mind - it is exactly God adhering to their agreement
If God had made eternal promises, and yet had also told Israel if they didn't keep the stipulations that
He would divorce them, then at face value, there would appear to be a contradiction between the two, and therefore, a contradiction within the Bible itself. Instead of a contradiction, there must be something between the two issues that you are not seeing which should be reconciled because there cannot be, nor are there, any contradictions within the Bible. What you don't see is that there is an Israel of God and a national Israel - two separate and distinct Israels. God's promises to the Israel of God are everlasting, the promises to the nation of Israel, conditional,

[Gal 6:15-16 KJV]
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace [be] on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
 

rogerg

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Exactly, that is called a blood covenant. It is unconditional,it is everlasting.
Blood covenant (Christ) with the Israel of God, not earthly Israel
There are two distinct Israels. If you aren't able to discern that, you will never be able to truly harmonize and understand the Bible regarding Israel and God. One Israel is earthly Israel, the other is spiritual Israel (the Israel of God)

[Gal 6:15-16 KJV]
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace [be] on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
 

Everlasting-Grace

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Dec 18, 2021
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I never said He changed His mind. I'm the one who posted about the stipulations of His promise, remember? Their failure
to meet those stipulation which stipulations they had agreed to, God, acting as He told them He would in punishing them, does not constitute a of change of mind - it is exactly God adhering to their agreement
If God had made eternal promises, and yet had also told Israel if they didn't keep the stipulations that
He would divorce them, then at face value, there would appear to be a contradiction between the two, and therefore, a contradiction within the Bible itself. Instead of a contradiction, there must be something between the two issues that you are not seeing which should be reconciled because there cannot be, nor are there, any contradictions within the Bible. What you don't see is that there is an Israel of God and a national Israel - two separate and distinct Israels. God's promises to the Israel of God are everlasting, the promises to the nation of Israel, conditional,

[Gal 6:15-16 KJV]
15 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
16 And as many as walk according to this rule, peace [be] on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
Yet you totally ignored his eternal promise. And lev 26 which states they will be punished. Yet if even after that tif they repent. He will remember his promise..

You continuing to try to relate the salvation promise to the land promise. Is not helping your case
 

rogerg

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You continuing to try to relate the salvation promise to the land promise. Is not helping your case
That's pretty arrogant, do you actually think I want, or care about making my case to you? Laughable. It is only because of my responsibility to make visible biblical doctrine as a defense of God's salvation and my Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. My responsibility ends there. Other than that, whatever you may choose to think or believe is of absolutely significance or concern to me
 

brightfame52

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Nov 21, 2020
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I would put you in that category,

But thats beside the point. Lets stick to the word and stop attacking each other with accusatory words which mean nothing.
I havent attacked anyone personally, but its a given fact people are deceived, and you just put me in that category, which was a personal attack my friend.
 

Everlasting-Grace

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That's pretty arrogant, do you actually think I want, or care about making my case to you? Laughable. It is only because of my responsibility to make visible biblical doctrine as a defense of God's salvation and my Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. My responsibility ends there. Other than that, whatever you may choose to think or believe is of absolutely significance or concern to me
Dude all I am doing is trying to show you the truth.

What you chose to do with it is up to you.

Arrogant? Yu have nerve my friend.

You are doing exactly what I am saying you are doing.

You are claiming Gods promise of land and peace to Israel is no longer valid. That is was conditional. And that in effect, Gods promise no longer stands.

You Show me verses where God said he punished them, Well I acknowledge those verses. And show you where God TOLD THEM he would do that. Then you call me arrogant?
 

Everlasting-Grace

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Dec 18, 2021
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I havent attacked anyone personally, but its a given fact people are deceived, and you just put me in that category, which was a personal attack my friend.
You just attacked people by calling them decieved. Look in the mirror dude,

And yes people are decieved. And anyone is foolish to think they may not be part of those decieved.

We ALL must be open.

again, Let’s stick to the word and stop with all the nonsense.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
Some people say that, but in reality they dont believe the word of God, and try to excuse it as not believing calvin.

Yeah, and some people follow Calvin and don't know the Word. If you knew the Word you wouldn't believe what you do.
 
K

kaylagrl

Guest
Blood covenant (Christ) with the Israel of God, not earthly Israel
There are two distinct Israels.
The blood covenant was made as an everlasting and unconditional promise to Abraham. God told him to look at the land, he told him he would possess the land, he told him the borders of the land he sealed his UNCONDITIONAL promise with the blood covenant. An actual place, with actual land. smh