Eternal Security - If saved, always saved! Part 1. - By David Stewart

[eternally-gratefull]

You're the one refusing to see anything else.

Ok so you deny Jesus said that the sign of one who BELIEVES IN HIM would be those things. Thanks. I know who not to listen to when it comes to scripture.

The book of Acts proves it, but of course you brush that aside. You don't get to "put me to the test" or any such nonsense. Jesus never commanded that we go out and drink poison, but yet, here you are, a professing Christian, demanding that another Christian go and drink poison.

No, the book of acts proves that SOME who believed in the name of Christ were able to do some of the things Jesus said we would all be able to do. You use it as proof because you do not want to see proof of your false gospel.

I already told you why I didn't answer. You can't carry on a civil discussion with the topics we already have. I already said I wasn't going to get into making long posts. You're free to keep boasting and puffing your self up by saying you're right becuase you assume you are, but that won't make it true. You've only gone to prove my point, which is that you don't care what answer I provided for your baptism question, you were only going to ignore it and carry on with your own assumptions and accusations, because that's what you just did.

How can we have a civil conversation when you continue to deny what Jesus supposedly said, and your only proof is a book where a few people out of the many many believers in Christ were given those signs, when jesus supposedly said we would all have them? Your not only taking something that is not scripture as truth, but your ignoring the things which would prove it is not true.

 

[feedm3]

@ChosenbyHim

Well, all that proof, and you didn't deal with any of it. Just said, see private interpretation. If your still saying Hebrews was not written to Christians, not dealing with the passages that prove they are Christians, (btw so was the twelve tribes scattered abroad) your not interested in understanding God's word. Your interested in only having an answer. Even if the answer is foolish. You acknowledge what you believe is contradicting, yet you say its because I dont understand, instead of revising your false view. So carry on, you win.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

@ChosenbyHim

Well, all that proof, and you didn't deal with any of it. Just said, see private interpretation. If your still saying Hebrews was not written to Christians, not dealing with the passages that prove they are Christians, (btw so was the twelve tribes scattered abroad) your not interested in understanding God's word. Your interested in only having an answer. Even if the answer is foolish. You acknowledge what you believe is contradicting, yet you say its because I dont understand, instead of revising your false view. So carry on, you win.

Feedm3, this is not about winning an argument. This is about defending the Biblical Doctrine of Eternal Security. It is sad that so many Christians actually think that they can lose their salvation when the truth of the matter is they are sealed by the Holy Spirit unto the day of redemption and that they are baptized into the Body of Jesus Christ our Lord.

And all these charismatics and candle lights out there who are falsely teaching new baby Christians that they can lose their salvation are just trying to keep them under their control. To the candle lights, it is all about works based salvation for them.

I did deal with it. The problem is most Christians cannot handle sound doctrine, so it does not surprise me that most Christians would not be able to handle the Biblical doctrine of Eternal Security. You see, if a Christian brother is not able to handle the truth of Scripture, then he'll question it.

Again Feedm3, your argument is simply flawed. What I told you is that if you do not rightly divide the Bible, then you'll end up with non dispensational contradictions. If you don't rightly divide your Bible, you'll simply make a mess; doctrinally speaking, and you will continue in your confusion. Anybody can get the Scriptures to say what they want it to say. It takes a real student of the word of God who will study and allow Scripture to interpret Scripture.

Wow, you actually think that there are going to be Christians in the time of Jacobs trouble? Please don't tell me you actually believe that. I told you before Hebrews and James is doctrinally for the Jews and tribulation saints in the 7 year tribulation. That is why if you read through the whole book of Hebrews, you'll notice that there is a huge emphasis on the Millennial Kingdom and Rest.

Now, what passages are there in the Bible which prove that the twelve tribes scattered abroad are Christians?



Again, at the Rapture of the Church, all Christians will be taken up to meet Jesus in the air. It is the catching away of the Body of Christ. That means there aren't going to be any Christians in the 7 year tribulation or the Time of Jacob's trouble. In other words, the Body of Christ is not going to go through the Tribulation.

In the time of Jacob's trouble, God is going to be dealing with the nation of Israel again.

Also, in the time of Jacob's trouble, there will be Jews and Tribulation saints.

NOT CHRISTIANS.

I am interested in the word of God and I am interested in understanding what it says and teaches. That is why I believe what it teaches in regard to eternal salvation to the Gentile believer. There is plenty that I have yet to learn about Scripture, and the journey is very exciting.

What looks foolish and silly is when a person does not rightly divide the Scriptures and a person who takes Scripture out of one dispensation and misapplies it over to another dispensation. Hence, the result is utter confusion. Which is what happens most of the time when someone takes Scripture out of context.

 

[feedm3]

well bud, you should listen to your own advise. Your rejecting many passages and not applying them where they should be. You really didn't even deal with them, just repeated what YOU believe is wrong, yet with no explanation of the wording, nor any valid arguments. So obviously this can go nowhere. I am not interested in just pointlessly arguing back and fourth. If you want to bring out a passage and discuss it that is fine, but if your going to just reject them with no basis or valid explanations, there is no point.

I showed you countless passages that all imply one can lose salvation. You rejected most by saying they dont apply, or that the wording does not mean what is says.

 

[megaman125]

Ok so you deny Jesus said that the sign of one who BELIEVES IN HIM would be those things. Thanks. I know who not to listen to when it comes to scripture.

No, I did not deny what Jesus said. Stop putting words in my mouth and stop making false accusations. The only thing I denied was your twisting of the scriptures.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

No, I did not deny what Jesus said. Stop putting words in my mouth and stop making false accusations. The only thing I denied was your twisting of the scriptures.

lol.. you said, that Jesus did not say everyone who believes in him will have those signs. thus if it is scripture. your saying Jesus did not say it.

don't try to back out of it now.

17 And these signs will follow those who believe:

pretty self explanitory. Any one who believes will be saved, and these signs will follow them. No chance to get out of it. He never said some of them, He never said will only follow for a short time, he never said some of these signs will follow. He said THESE signs WILL FOLLOW THOSE WHO BELIEVE. No twisting here, just taking him literally, that is if he said it at all.

 

[megaman125]

lol.. you said, that Jesus did not say everyone who believes in him will have those signs. thus if it is scripture. your saying Jesus did not say it.

don't try to back out of it now.

Problem is I didn't say that. I just refuse to foolishly drink poison because you're demanding me to the way Satan demanded that Jesus throw himself off a cliff in Luke 4.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

well bud, you should listen to your own advise. Your rejecting many passages and not applying them where they should be. You really didn't even deal with them, just repeated what YOU believe is wrong, yet with no explanation of the wording, nor any valid arguments. So obviously this can go nowhere. I am not interested in just pointlessly arguing back and fourth. If you want to bring out a passage and discuss it that is fine, but if your going to just reject them with no basis or valid explanations, there is no point.

I showed you countless passages that all imply one can lose salvation. You rejected most by saying they dont apply, or that the wording does not mean what is says.

Of course I have dealt with them Feedm3. And buddy, you really need to learn how to rightly divide your Bible. What kind of explanation did you want me to give you? I told you why you were wrong for trying to apply a Scripture in Hebrews to a Christian in the church age when it is referring to a tribulation saint (Jew) in the time of Jacobs trouble. You see, that is your problem. Your still misapplying Scriptures from one dispensation over to a different dispensation. Again, learn how to rightly divide your Bible. The arguments were valid. Did you even read the whole article I shared in the very first post by David Stewart? Probably not. A lot of the people that whine or start to get angry when they see a message on eternal security just shows their very own hypocrisy. And the modern professing Christians who usually have a problem with eternal security are the very same people who are counting on their own righteousness to save them.

You showed me passages where one could lose salvation. That is correct, but you misapplied that passage of Scripture to the Church Age. That passage in Hebrews applies to a Jew (Tribulation Saint) who takes the mark of the beast. That is why that passage applies to the Tribulation and not the church age in terms of Salvation. Again, who is Hebrews written to?

You showed me a passage where a Jew can lose his salvation in the tribulation, the time of Jacobs trouble. You did not show me one passage where a Christian could lose his salvation. In this dispensation of grace, the Church Age which is the dispensation that we are now living in, a Christian cannot lose his salvation. And I told you that a Christian cannot lose his salvation in this dispensation because

1) We are sealed unto the day of redemption by the Holy Spirit at the very moment we believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. (See Ephesians 1:13 and Ephesians 4:30)

And 2) When we do believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, we get baptized into the Body of Christ. We as Christians are in Jesus Christ. Therefore we cannot fall out of the Body of Christ, nor can we be UN born again. Once you are born again, you are sealed by the Holy Ghost.

In the Tribulation period, it will be different for a Tribulation Saint as he will have to endure unto the end by keeping the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus Christ (see Revelation 14:12)

The tribulation saints will also have to endure til the end by not taking the Mark of the Beast. So, again LET ME REPEAT MYSELF ONE LAST TIME. That passage that you took from Hebrews does not apply to the Church Age in terms of Salvation for the Christian believer. That very passage of Scripture applies to the Jew (Tribulation Saint) in the time of Jacobs trouble. I mean it is that simple. By you not rightly dividing that passage of Scripture, you are causing a contradiction.

I am simply showing you why you are wrong for misapplying a passage of Scripture in Hebrews to a born again Christian in the Church Age. When that Scripture in Hebrews is written to a Jew (Tribulation Saint) in the Time of Jacobs trouble.

Again, when you misapply Scripture and take one Scripture from one dispensation and misapply it to another dispensation, you yourself cause a contradiction. Ever wonder why there are so MANY denominations? Because most people just do not take the time, effort and due diligence to study the word of God and to RIGHTLY DIVIDE it!

 

[ChosenbyHim]

well bud, you should listen to your own advise. Your rejecting many passages and not applying them where they should be. You really didn't even deal with them, just repeated what YOU believe is wrong, yet with no explanation of the wording, nor any valid arguments. So obviously this can go nowhere. I am not interested in just pointlessly arguing back and fourth. If you want to bring out a passage and discuss it that is fine, but if your going to just reject them with no basis or valid explanations, there is no point.

I showed you countless passages that all imply one can lose salvation. You rejected most by saying they dont apply, or that the wording does not mean what is says.

One last thing though. Remember that Christian in the book of 1 Corinthians 5 who was committing fornication with his father's wife?

What happened to that very carnal Christian? Did he lose his salvation? Did the Apostle Paul say ever say that he had lost his salvation? Nope.

This is what happened:

It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed, In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.- 1 Corinthians 5:1-5

Now, did you get that? No where in that passage of Scripture did the Apostle Paul say that that man had lost his salvation. That man was still saved. Now, what Paul did do was have the congregants at the church at Corinth deliver that man over to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

And that is probably what happens to a Christian today who has become so carnal and worldly and is living in sin. There are probably a lot of carnal Christians in this country who are being delivered over to Satan for the destruction of their flesh.

Again, if a Christian can lose his salvation in the church age like you say he can. Then don't you think that man in 1 Corinthians 5 would have lost it?

Truth of the matter is that this man in 1 Corinthians 5 never lost his salvation. That man's flesh was destroyed for his wicked deed though. But he himself was still saved.

A Christian cannot lose his salvation in this dispensation, he/she is eternally secure. And just because a Christian is eternally secure does not give that Christian a license to sin.

 

[eternally-gratefull]

Problem is I didn't say that. I just refuse to foolishly drink poison because you're demanding me to the way Satan demanded that Jesus throw himself off a cliff in Luke 4.

we can't discuss anything, your stuck on one things and refuse to look at the rest.

 

[feedm3]

One last thing though. Remember that Christian in the book of 1 Corinthians 5 who was committing fornication with his father's wife?

What happened to that very carnal Christian? Did he lose his salvation? Did the Apostle Paul say ever say that he had lost his salvation? Nope.

This is what happened:

It is reported commonly that there is fornication among you, and such fornication as is not so much as named among the Gentiles, that one should have his father's wife. And ye are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he that hath done this deed might be taken away from among you. For I verily, as absent in body, but present in spirit, have judged already, as though I were present, concerning him that hath so done this deed, In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.- 1 Corinthians 5:1-5

Now, did you get that? No where in that passage of Scripture did the Apostle Paul say that that man had lost his salvation. That man was still saved. Now, what Paul did do was have the congregants at the church at Corinth deliver that man over to Satan for the destruction of his flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

And that is probably what happens to a Christian today who has become so carnal and worldly and is living in sin. There are probably a lot of carnal Christians in this country who are being delivered over to Satan for the destruction of their flesh.

Again, if a Christian can lose his salvation in the church age like you say he can. Then don't you think that man in 1 Corinthians 5 would have lost it?

Truth of the matter is that this man in 1 Corinthians 5 never lost his salvation. That man's flesh was destroyed for his wicked deed though. But he himself was still saved.

A Christian cannot lose his salvation in this dispensation, he/she is eternally secure. And just because a Christian is eternally secure does not give that Christian a license to sin.

No, he would not have lost anything IF and only IF, he repented, which was the reason of their withdrawing from him, to bring about repentance.

Now, we can ask,

1. what if he would have refused to stop committing adultery? Do you think he would have been saved in the end?

I dont mind you asking questions like that, because it was short and dealing with one thing at a time.

So let me now ask you this.

2. What makes you believe the unfaithful servant in Luke 12 was never really saved,

was it because he lived in sin?

Or because he received the same punishment as the unbelievers?


Thanks

 

[henrybest50]

How are you doing ,
hope you are doing great i saw Ur profile and photo you look so beautiful my name is Henry am from Nigeria but i live in Dakar Senegal by the grace of God i am 31 years old am single never married i am a God fearing man i do the things of God i am an evangelist by Gods help am searching for a honest caring understanding with a God fearing heart a woman that love God pls i would like to know you more better this is my email id [email protected] also this is my Facebook account [email protected] pls here is my phone number 00221777008200 am waiting to hear from you soonest God bless you peace in Jesus might name amen .

 

[feedm3]

How are you doing ,
hope you are doing great i saw Ur profile and photo you look so beautiful my name is Henry am from Nigeria but i live in Dakar Senegal by the grace of God i am 31 years old am single never married i am a God fearing man i do the things of God i am an evangelist by Gods help am searching for a honest caring understanding with a God fearing heart a woman that love God pls i would like to know you more better this is my email id [email protected] also this is my Facebook account [email protected] pls here is my phone number 00221777008200 am waiting to hear from you soonest God bless you peace in Jesus might name amen .

Sorry Henry, not interested

 

[Grandpa]

No, he would not have lost anything IF and only IF, he repented, which was the reason of their withdrawing from him, to bring about repentance.

Now, we can ask,

1. what if he would have refused to stop committing adultery? Do you think he would have been saved in the end?

I dont mind you asking questions like that, because it was short and dealing with one thing at a time.

So let me now ask you this.

2. What makes you believe the unfaithful servant in Luke 12 was never really saved,

was it because he lived in sin?

Or because he received the same punishment as the unbelievers?


Thanks

#2 is a great question! The unfaithful servant was not saved precisely because he had no faith!

Is salvation for right now, or does salvation delay its coming?
Will the Lord be here for us right now, or will He delay His coming?

I suppose if you have no faith that a person can be saved right now you would have to stand by the logical conclusion that a person could somehow lose the path that leads to salvation.

But if you have faith that you can be saved, right now, then there would be nothing that could stop that same salvation from happening tomorrow, or any other day.

Salvation is not a matter of work, but of faith.

Hebrews 4:1-11
1 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.
2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.
3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.
4 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works.
5 And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest.
6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
7 Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.
8 For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day.
9 There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.
10 For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

 

[feedm3]

Thanks for your input Grandpa. I believe "faith" is not simply a belief. It is an obedient action. Otherwise faith could not be obeyed, and there would be no such thing as "dead faith."

So using the correct interpretation of "faith" we can understand, the Christians who heard the gospel, "mixed with faith" means they obeyed what was required to become Christians, and continue to heed the warnings of disobedience, i.e. keeping his commands being obedient to the faith.

Rom 1:5 By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name

Rom 16:26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith

and since your in Hebrews, add this:
Heb 5:8 Though he were a Son, yet learned he obedience by the things which he suffered; 9 And being made perfect, he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him

 

[ChosenbyHim]

No, he would not have lost anything IF and only IF, he repented, which was the reason of their withdrawing from him, to bring about repentance.

Now, we can ask,

1. what if he would have refused to stop committing adultery? Do you think he would have been saved in the end?

Well, if he would have refused to stopped committing adultery, then I believe that his life would have been cut very, very short. Yet I still believe that he would be saved in the end. Here is why:

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. - 2 Corinthians 5:10 (KJB)

If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.- 1 Corinthians 3:14-17. (KJB)

And I am sure that very same man is going to have a very hard time at the Judgment Seat of Christ. Imagine many of the rewards that will be lost. And not only that, if this man were to continue in this sin, he would definitely lose his reign in the millennial kingdom of Jesus Christ when our Lord Jesus shall reign from Jerusalem and rule the while world with a rod of iron for a thousand years.
​

I dont mind you asking questions like that, because it was short and dealing with one thing at a time.

So let me now ask you this.

2. What makes you believe the unfaithful servant in Luke 12 was never really saved,

was it because he lived in sin?

Or because he received the same punishment as the unbelievers?


Thanks

That second question is a good one indeed. And I must give Grandpa his just dues, because he nailed it right on the head.

Now for me to answer your question: I believe the unprofitable servant was unsaved and that he was never saved to begin with because of two reasons:

1) He received the same punishment as the unbelievers just as you aptly pointed out.

2) Just because someone is a steward, does not mean that that person is saved. Remember it rains on the just and the unjust. And every man is a steward one way or another

 

[ChosenbyHim]

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QV_iiINWNBA[/video]

 

[ChosenbyHim]

Whose Mail? 2 By Dr. Douglas D. Stauffer

[video]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrXGyVaZTnY[/video]

 

[feedm3]

Well, if he would have refused to stopped committing adultery, then I believe that his life would have been cut very, very short. Yet I still believe that he would be saved in the end. Here is why:

Well then you directly disagree with God as he says adulterers will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Your saying we can live in adultery and still receive heaven. Now who should I believe here?

Gal 5:Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Mat 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.
Mat 15:19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:
Mat 15:20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

Your saying an adulterer can be saved, and a defiled man can enter heaven. This clearly is a contradiction no matter how you put the icing on the cake.

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. - 2 Corinthians 5:10 (KJB)

Great passage. Do you think when we receive the things done in the body that are evil, we will receive a reward, or God's wrath?

The Bible Already tells you:
Eph 2 says when we live fulfilling the flesh we were by nature the children of wrath.

Gal tells us what we reap we sow, if sow in the flesh, we reap the flesh.

You say we can live after the flesh, and still receive eternal life.

Yet you say the unfaithful servant was never saved. Why? because he lived in sin, which as grandpa said showed no faith. So if sin showed no faith, and he was never saved because of it, then how come we can live in adultery and still be saved?

Can you clear that up?

If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.- 1 Corinthians 3:14-17. (KJB)

This is a commonly misinterpreted chapter. You people love to run to this as if it's saying, are works fo evil, are going to burn up, but we will still be saved.

That is so far from what is being disccused here. The context is evangelsim. Paul is speaking to them about their work, their "work" meaning their convertes they helped to convert.

So some of our work, will not make it, as some will return to sin. Yet we will not suffer because they did not make it. This chapter is speaking about adding to the foundation of Christ, i.e. his body, his temple, which is made up of people.

Notice:
1Co 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. <-----here is the context, Paul planted the seed, Apollos watered (baptized) but God did the adding to the body (the increase) see Acts 2:47 "and the Lord added to the church..." yet Peter planted.

1Co 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.<----the teacher, the immerser are not anything without God giving the increase

1Co 3:8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour. <----what is the planting, and watering? So what is the labor? Evangelism

1Co 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
1Co 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. <---keeping in context, how are they building on the foundation? By planting and watering --- again evangelism


1Co 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
1Co 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire(see 1 PET 4:12); and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. <----now do you think the context just all of a sudden changed into works meaning our sins we live in?

Your saying the work here is not connected to the labor in the above passages speaking of planting and watering?

1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. <---rewarded according to our works Converts, better bear fruit huh? John 15:1-f.

1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.<---You will suffer loss because you work on this indivual was in vain, as he is going to be punished. Yet you are not going to be punished for his mistakes.

Now I remember you saying something about keeping things in context. Lets see if you practice what you preach.

This is the context, by how you tried to explain Hebrews in your last post, I am sure you dont get this, but you need to study and stop just throwing in things that are so far out of context the passage left my Bible!

​

That second question is a good one indeed. And I must give Grandpa his just dues, because he nailed it right on the head.

Not really. See my response to him, and his definition of faith is wrong.

Now for me to answer your question: I believe the unprofitable servant was unsaved and that he was never saved to begin with because of two reasons:

1) He received the same punishment as the unbelievers just as you aptly pointed out.

I asked this just to show motive. You are saying you dont believe he was ever saved because YOU dont like the punishment he received.

So is that an honest reason to reject Christ warnings, and say they dont apply to us, because you dont like the ending?

2) Just because someone is a steward, does not mean that that person is saved. Remember it rains on the just and the unjust. And every man is a steward one way or another

wrong again.

The text does not call him a almost servant, a false servant, a pretend servant, it simply says he was a servant.

If one is called a servant, you should assume he was just that.

As far as we know he was faithful up until the time his Lord left. Because then is when he thought the evil thought "my Lord delays his coming".

So then it says "he began" to live in sin. "Began" implies the time when he started doing the sin.

So nothing in the text is there for me to assume he was never saved.

Secondly, if he was never saved because he received the punishment as the unbelievers, my next question to you is.....

Why did the unfaithful servant receive the same punishment as UN-believers? Did his living in sin upon his Lords return have anything to do with that?

And also, what in the text warrants the conclusion he was never saved? If you say the punishment, then you admit, you believe this ONLY because of the punishment he received, and that is not a valid reason to assume or teach, it does not apply to us.

 

[ChosenbyHim]

Well then you directly disagree with God as he says adulterers will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Your saying we can live in adultery and still receive heaven. Now who should I believe here?


Gal 5:Gal 5:19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Gal 5:20 Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Gal 5:21 Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Mat 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come forth from the heart; and they defile the man.
Mat 15:19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:
Mat 15:20 These are the things which defile a man: but to eat with unwashen hands defileth not a man.

I know which Scripture you are referring to. No I am not disagreeing with God. I submit myself to God's perfect word, the King James Bible. I don't use the satanic modern versions like the NIV, ESV, NASV, etc.

Again, do you actually think that a true Christian will continue to live in adultery? Are you that desperate to try to convince a Christian that he can lose his salvation? I mean seriously kid, read all of what I wrote and don't just try to twist what I said. No where did I say that a person can live in adultery and inherit the Kingdom of God.

If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are. - 1 Corinthians 3:17 (KJB)

Your saying an adulterer can be saved, and a defiled man can enter heaven. This clearly is a contradiction no matter how you put the icing on the cake.

Of course an adulterer can be saved! That is if he repents sincerely and calls on the name of the Lord.

Great passage. Do you think when we receive the things done in the body that are evil, we will receive a reward, or God's wrath?

The Bible Already tells you:
Eph 2 says when we live fulfilling the flesh we were by nature the children of wrath.

Gal tells us what we reap we sow, if sow in the flesh, we reap the flesh.

You say we can live after the flesh, and still receive eternal life.


Yet you say the unfaithful servant was never saved. Why? because he lived in sin, which as grandpa said showed no faith. So if sin showed no faith, and he was never saved because of it, then how come we can live in adultery and still be saved?

Can you clear that up?

Okay, what is it that your not sure of again in regard to that parable?

We are not the children of wrath if we are saved by the blood of Jesus. If you don't even know that Scriptural truth, than your in bad shape.

Well, yes if we sow to the flesh, we will reap to the flesh. Exactly! If a Christian sows to the flesh. For instance if a Christian listens to rock music, reads the NIV (which is a satanic bible) and sows to his flesh continually, then he will reap corruption. And that corruption can include depression, loss of his joy and testimony, and other things.

Again, how does that prove that a Christian can lose his salvation? Can you answer that question at least?

Again, your asking all these questions just in an attempt of trying to justify your wrong position on this matter. If a Christian lives in sin and sows to the flesh enough, he may just cut his life short. But that does not mean he will not enter in heaven. Why? Because he has been given the righteousness of Christ. We are justified and sanctified. I see you also took that Scripture in 1 Corinthians 6:9 out of context. I am going to share with you an article that might help you out, well that is if you read the whole article.

This is a commonly misinterpreted chapter. You people love to run to this as if it's saying, are works fo evil, are going to burn up, but we will still be saved.

That is so far from what is being disccused here. The context is evangelsim. Paul is speaking to them about their work, their "work" meaning their convertes they helped to convert.

So some of our work, will not make it, as some will return to sin. Yet we will not suffer because they did not make it. This chapter is speaking about adding to the foundation of Christ, i.e. his body, his temple, which is made up of people.

That Scripture is about the Judgment Seat of Christ. Keep it simple, and don't try to complicate it by bringing in your private interpretation.

Notice:
1Co 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase. <-----here is the context, Paul planted the seed, Apollos watered (baptized) but God did the adding to the body (the increase) see Acts 2:47 "and the Lord added to the church..." yet Peter planted.

1Co 3:7 So then neither is he that planteth any thing, neither he that watereth; but God that giveth the increase.<----the teacher, the immerser are not anything without God giving the increase

1Co 3:8 Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour. <----what is the planting, and watering? So what is the labor? Evangelism

1Co 3:9 For we are labourers together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.
1Co 3:10 According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon. <---keeping in context, how are they building on the foundation? By planting and watering --- again evangelism


1Co 3:11 For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
1Co 3:12 Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
1Co 3:13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire(see 1 PET 4:12); and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is. <----now do you think the context just all of a sudden changed into works meaning our sins we live in?

Your saying the work here is not connected to the labor in the above passages speaking of planting and watering?

1Co 3:14 If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. <---rewarded according to our works Converts, better bear fruit huh? John 15:1-f.

1Co 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.<---You will suffer loss because you work on this indivual was in vain, as he is going to be punished. Yet you are not going to be punished for his mistakes.

Now I remember you saying something about keeping things in context. Lets see if you practice what you preach.

We as Christians will not be punished for our sins. The judgment of our sins were taken care of at the cross of Calvary. From hearing you talk, it seems like your trying to equate the Judgment Seat of Christ with the Great White Throne Judgment. One thing you better understand is that those two judgments are different. One is for the damned, the other is for the saved saints.

The lost souls will have their sins judged.

In contrast, we the saints, will have our works and our service judged. Our service will be judged. The Great White Throne Judgment is to determine the level of punishment for the lost, Christ rejecting sinner in the lake of fire. The Judgment seat of Christ is to determine the Christian's rewards for his service after the point he got saved.

This is the context, by how you tried to explain Hebrews in your last post, I am sure you dont get this, but you need to study and stop just throwing in things that are so far out of context the passage left my Bible!

Not really. See my response to him, and his definition of faith is wrong.
I asked this just to show motive. You are saying you dont believe he was ever saved because YOU dont like the punishment he received.

So is that an honest reason to reject Christ warnings, and say they dont apply to us, because you dont like the ending?

I am not rejecting Christs warnings. We as Christians should heed and take serious notice of Christs' commands and warnings. We should do what we can to keep the commands of Jesus Christ. Jesus said if a man love me, he will keep my words. What about my motive?

Now when we are reading the Gospels and studying the commands of Jesus Christ, one thing we must do is discern which commands are strictly for Israel and which ones are for the Christian. Remember that up until the time of the crucifixion, people were still under the Mosaic Law, that is why Doctrine from the Gospels is generally still in the Old Testament. Especially before the crucifixion.

The punishment that steward received was with the unbelievers. What does that tell you? That steward himself was an unbeliever! Again, you must let Scripture interpret Scripture. That is why he was never saved. Compare that Scripture with Matthew 7:21-23, where those unsaved people call Jesus Christ "Lord, Lord."

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. - Matthew 7:21 (KJB)

wrong again.

The text does not call him a almost servant, a false servant, a pretend servant, it simply says he was a servant.

If one is called a servant, you should assume he was just that.

As far as we know he was faithful up until the time his Lord left. Because then is when he thought the evil thought "my Lord delays his coming".

So then it says "he began" to live in sin. "Began" implies the time when he started doing the sin.

Again, that is you trying to apply this parable to a Christian who has been saved, and justified. Now let me ask you a question about that passage, don't you think that that passage is referring to a Jew in the time of Jacobs trouble? Or have you still not learned how to rightly divide the word of truth? You should watch those two videos on dispensation. I believe they will help you out a lot.

So nothing in the text is there for me to assume he was never saved.

Secondly, if he was never saved because he received the punishment as the unbelievers, my next question to you is.....

Why did the unfaithful servant receive the same punishment as UN-believers? Did his living in sin upon his Lords return have anything to do with that?

And also, what in the text warrants the conclusion he was never saved? If you say the punishment, then you admit, you believe this ONLY because of the punishment he received, and that is not a valid reason to assume or teach, it does not apply to us.

Well I'll say this Feedm3, if that servant's living in sin upon his Lords return did have something to do with his punishment, then one thing for certain is that that parable is a reference of what can happen to a tribulation saint in the time of Jacobs trouble.

It can't apply to a Christian if that is the case, because in the Church Age, the born again Christian is eternally secure and he cannot lose his salvation.