Falling away from the Faith (it's possible)

[Grace777x70]

Also 1 Corinthians 9:27 No, I strike a blow to my body and make it my slave so that after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified for the prize.

When we look at that scripture "in context" it Paul is talking about being disqualified from ministry - not getting kicked out of Christ.

Paul is talking about being rejected in ministry.

1 Corinthians 9:16-27 (NASB)
[SUP]16 [/SUP] For if I preach the gospel, I have nothing to boast of, for I am under compulsion; for woe is me if I do not preach the gospel.

[SUP]17 [/SUP] For if I do this voluntarily, I have a reward; but if against my will, I have a stewardship entrusted to me.

[SUP]18 [/SUP] What then is my reward? That, when I preach the gospel, I may offer the gospel without charge, so as not to make full use of my right in the gospel.

[SUP]19 [/SUP] For though I am free from all men, I have made myself a slave to all, so that I may win more.

[SUP]20 [/SUP] To the Jews I became as a Jew, so that I might win Jews; to those who are under the Law, as under the Law though not being myself under the Law, so that I might win those who are under the Law;

[SUP]21 [/SUP] to those who are without law, as without law, though not being without the law of God but under the law of Christ, so that I might win those who are without law.

[SUP]22 [/SUP] To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak; I have become all things to all men, so that I may by all means save some.

[SUP]23 [/SUP] I do all things for the sake of the gospel, so that I may become a fellow partaker of it.

[SUP]24 [/SUP] Do you not know that those who run in a race all run, but only one receives the prize? Run in such a way that you may win.

[SUP]25 [/SUP] Everyone who competes in the games exercises self-control in all things. They then do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.

[SUP]26 [/SUP] Therefore I run in such a way, as not without aim; I box in such a way, as not beating the air;

[SUP]27 [/SUP] but I discipline my body and make it my slave, so that, after I have preached to others, I myself will not be disqualified.

God has qualified us in Christ for salvation because of Christ's work on the cross and resurrection.

Colossians 1:12 (NASB)
[SUP]12 [/SUP] giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified us to share in the inheritance of the saints in Light.



The real question in salvation as in being one spirit with the Lord is - Can we actually trust what Jesus said? Is Jesus a liar?

Jesus said that the Holy Spirit will be in us forever. John 14:16

Jesus said that He would never leave us nor forsake us - Heb. 13:5

Jesus said that All that come to Me - I lose nothing but will raise them up" - John 6:39

Jesus said that no one ( no one means every one ) can pluck then out of My hands nor my Father's hands. - John 10:28-29

We all need to make the choice to believe the Lord Jesus Christ and determine if He is a liar or not. Me, I'm a believer in what He has said and I believe that he is faithful to all of us. Everyone needs to make their own choice.

He did say "Repent and believe in the gospel." Mark 1:15 The term "gospel" means "the nearly too good to be true news". News is something that has already happened.

Jesus said when He comes back will He find faith on the earth?

 

[PeterJens]

There is a simple principle to observe

A promise is about something that will happen in the future.
The future is the 2nd death, judgement. The promise is if you believe in Christ,
have faith in Him, follow Him, obey Him, you will not face the 2nd death.

Now each sentence spoken has a link to the concepts held elsewhere.
If you trust an engineer to do a job, you do not need to know the details,
you do what they say.

If you start questioning their methods or ways or reasons behind things, you
are taking responsibility away from them and wanting to control things yourself.

So do you trust Jesus. The do what He tells you to do.
He wants you to understand the why, but until you do the do, your heart will
never understand or be able to turn the crazy world into something sensible.

 

[Stephen63]

When we look at that scripture "in context" it Paul is talking about being disqualified from ministry - not getting kicked out of Christ.

Paul is talking about being rejected in ministry.

It seems no matter what, you are for the false teaching & the false teacher, no matter who they are.

The word "castaway" means rejected by God. A reject.

The "prize" is eternal life.

So the meaning is "rejected for eternal life."

As usual, you're for the side of the wrong.

Commentaries make this clear, & you belittle them.

Are you so much better than them?

 

[Grace777x70]

Commentaries.

I personally love to read from commentaries and have about 1/2 dozen or so that I regularly view on some subjects.

There is however an inherent problem with going by commentaries to determine truth - they can be giving out what their denomination has taught them in the past and so we "could be" in another church tradition type of situation be perpetuated.

Commentaries are basically what the author himself and most often the rest of his denomination thinks about a passage or certain doctrine which is absolutely fine. So, every commentary within the same denomination will express the very same belief.

For example - most Baptists ( and those with similar beliefs ) commentaries will say that the gifts of the Spirit are done away with including speaking in tongues when commenting on the scriptures that talk about the gifts of the Spirit.

I find that I get a part from one and a part from a different commentary and the Spirit of God uses them all in some aspect to reveal what He is speaking to me about.

About 1 Cor 9:27

1 Cor. 9:27 Disqualified or castaway has been used a few times in the NT and it means "rejected" or "unworthy" or "useless".

As can be clearly seen in the context of 1 Cor. 9 - Paul is talking about being rejected from being in the ministry - nothing to do with being kicked out of Christ.

[FONT="Galatia Sil" !important]ἀδόκιμος[/FONT] [FONT="Gentium" !important]adokimos[/FONT] adj

Rejected, depraved, disqualified, unworthy, useless.

Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary, The - The Complete Biblical Library Greek-English Dictionary – Alpha-Gamma.

 

[wolfwint]

[SUP]May the Spirit of God open your eyes to the below, so that if you are in error, you may repent and get onboard with the will of God and preach truth on this matter. Its not about pridefully defending your position. It's about the truth.

Colossians 1v21-23

21 [/SUP]And you, who once were alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now He has reconciled <become believers> [SUP]22 [/SUP]in the body of His flesh through death, to present you holy, and blameless, and above reproach in His sight— [SUP]23 [/SUP]if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Now what is plain to see is this:
-These were believers above
-They were to be presented holy, blameless and above reproach (no scope for unrepentant sin in a believers life)
-this is possible (IF THEY CONTINUED IN THE FAITH) - grounded, steadfast, not moved.

Other evidences:

Luke 22 v31-32

[SUP]31 [/SUP]And the Lord said,[SUP][c][/SUP] “Simon, Simon! Indeed, Satan has asked for you, that he may sift you as wheat. [SUP]32 [/SUP]But I have prayed for you, that your faith should not fail; and when you have returned to Me, strengthen your brethren.”


Now what is plain to see is this:
-If it were not possible for faith to fail, as the strong delusionalists claim, then it would not be necessary for Jesus to have had to pray to the Father this prayer above.

1 Timothy 2 v18-20

[SUP]18 [/SUP]This charge I commit to you, son Timothy, according to the prophecies previously made concerning you, that by them you may wage the good warfare, [SUP]19 [/SUP]having faith and a good conscience, which some having rejected, concerning the faith have suffered shipwreck, [SUP]20 [/SUP]of whom are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I delivered to Satan that they may learn not to blaspheme.


2 Timothy 2 v16-19
[SUP]16 [/SUP]But shun profane and idle babblings, for they will increase to more ungodliness. [SUP]17 [/SUP]And their message will spread like cancer. Hymenaeus and Philetus are of this sort, [SUP]18 [/SUP]who have strayed concerning the truth, saying that the resurrection is already past; and they overthrow the faith of some. [SUP]19 [/SUP]Nevertheless the solid foundation of God stands, having this seal: “The Lord knows those who are His,” and, “Let everyone who names the name of Christ[SUP][c][/SUP] depart from iniquity.”

Now what is plain to see is this:
-its possible to stray concerning the truth
-its possible to once have known the truth but to have strayed therefrom
-faith can be overthrown.
-these people are no longer saved. Because you can only receive salvation through faith.
-sin is still a factor " Let everyone who names the name of Christ depart from iniquity". Contrary to what the strong delusionalists say.

Jude
[SUP]3 [/SUP]Beloved, while I was very diligent to write to you concerning our common salvation, I found it necessary to write to you exhorting you to contend earnestly for the faith which was once for all delivered to the saints.

Now what is plain to see is this:
-contending for the faith - its a prize. It is to be protected, defended, fought for.
-by not contending for this, it can be lost.

2 Timothy 4v7-8

[SUP]7 [/SUP]I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith:

[SUP]8 [/SUP]Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.

Now what is plain to see is this:
-Paul, writer of most of the New Testament, fought the good fight. Finished the course. And KEPT the faith.
-why would it be necessary for him to write about "kept the faith" if it wasn't possible to have lost faith.

1 John 5v4
[SUP]4 [/SUP]For whatever is born of God overcomes the world. And this is the victory that has overcome the world—our[SUP][a][/SUP] faith.

Now what is plain to see is this:
-Our faith is what overcomes the world. We are supposed to OVERCOME THE WORLD.
-What is the world? (definition:1 John 2v16 [SUP]16 [/SUP]For all that is in the world—the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life—is not of the Father but is of the world).

Revelation 2v10b
10(b) Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.

Now what is plain to see is this:
-Faith is not a once off, momentary decision, applicable for all time.
-Faith, once received, once believed, is to be maintained.
-the corollary is this - if you are NOT faithful until death, or lose your faith, you shall not receive the crown of life.


The word is very clear - its to him who overcomes:
Revelation 2v7b To him who overcomes I will give to eat from the tree of life
Revelation 2v11b He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death.
Revelation 2v17b To him who overcomes I will give some of the hidden manna to eat.
Revelation 2v26 [SUP]26 [/SUP]And he who overcomes, and keeps My works until the end, to him I will give power over the nations—
Revelation 3v5 He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life
Revelation 3v12He who overcomes, I will make him a pillar in the temple of My God, and he shall go out no more.
Revelation 3v21 To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne


Now to those who lose the faith. Who once had the faith yet turned their backs on Christ, we have the subject matter of the 'other' thread. Which is clearly visible for all to see below:

Hebrews 6v4-6

[SUP]4 [/SUP]For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, [SUP]5 [/SUP]and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, [SUP]6 [/SUP]if they fall away,[SUP][b][/SUP] to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.


Now what is plain to see is this:
-Let there no no illusions that these were believers, and were once in the faith.
-once they "fall away" (and we can see that this is a very real risk warned about by the NT writers, as well as Jesus) to be renewed again unto repentance.

Its anyway Grace that God has chosen us. No one deserves it and is able to live a sin less live. So without His Grace nobody enter the heaven. On the other sideI dont think that God will bring somebody against his will to
heaven. And we cant look in somebodys heart, but God can. Finally God is the One who judges, not we.

 

[NetChaplain]

[SUP]Colossians 1v21-23 [/SUP][SUP]23 [/SUP]if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven

Hi Chris - I find the OSAS issue is always the most interesting subject concerning growth in our faith. My understanding here is that the mentioning of "if you continue" and "are not moved away" manifests a confirmation of those in the faith, for those who are only professedly in the faith will not remain, but will instead "manifest that they were not of us" (1 Jhn 1:19).

God bless and God be blessed!

 

[Rosemaryx]

ASSURANCE OF SALVATION
Some believers struggle with a lack of assurance of salvation. Reasons for this lack of assurance include spiritual immaturity and poor teaching. Some teachers and pastors believe that a Christian can lose their salvation, which is untrue and harmful to the growth of a new believer. Spiritually sensitive individuals, who realize their brokenness, tend to dwell in fear and self-condemnation if they lack assurance. Dwelling in fear and self-condemnation causes a lack of productivity, and hinders the believer’s relationship with God. God doesn’t want us to fear losing our salvation. Fear is the opposite of love, and it does not belong in a loving relationship (I John 4:8). Scripture is emphatic that God has steadfast love for those who are His, and that he will not leave or forsake us (John 6:35-40; Hebrews 13:5). We are not under God’s wrath and condemnation once we are saved (John 5:24;Romans 8:1), and God is totally for us. No force can separate us from his love (Romans 8:31-35).

An important reason for having assurance of salvation is that one cannot really love God in the fullest sense unless he is secure in his salvation. Those who deny eternal security feel like the threat of impending condemnation is still a reality. This handicaps their ability to truly do good works out of love rather than fear of condemnation.

Their view of salvation is like a father holding a pistol to his head and demanding that his son love him. How much love would be reflected if the son does acts to show love in such circumstances?

It is very helpful to understand ten major reasons why we should have assurance in our salvation.

The first point to understand is that we received eternal life at the moment of salvation (John 3:16; John 3:36; John 5:24; John 6:35-40; John 6:47; John 6:54; John 10:28-29; John 11:25; Romans 6:23; 1 John 5:11, I John 5: 13). Eternal means everlasting;without end. Eternal life is not probationary. It is nonsensical to claim otherwise.

The second point to understand is that salvation is God’s work. It is not our work (Psalm 3:8; Jonah 2:9; Matthew 19:25-26; John 6:39; Acts 28:28; Ephesians 1:11; Ephesians 2:8-9; Philippians 1:28 ; Philippians 2:13). If salvation is God’s work, then the completion of it is based on his competency, not our own. Perseverance is guaranteed because it is based on his competency, not ours (Philippians 1:6; Jude 24). This is why Scripture speaks of our salvation in the past tense (Romans 8:28-30).

The third point is that eternal life and salvation is a free gift from God (Rom 5:15-17; Rom 6:23). Would God give us a free gift, then take it back again? The gifts and calling of God are without revocation (Rom 11:29).

The fourth point to understand is that, when we are saved, God adopted us as children (John 1:12; Romans 8:14-17 ; Galatians 4:4-7; Ephesians 1:5; 1 John 3:1). God chastened his children; he does not cast them away (Hebrews 12:4-11). The goal of chastening is to correct us when we stray.

The fifth point to understand is that our salvation does not depend on our performance. It is about what Christ has done on the cross and our faith in his sacrifice and its sufficiency (Romans 10:13; 1 Peter 2:6). God has already qualified us for his Kingdom through the sacrifice of his Son (Colossians 1:12-14). We are more than conquerors through him (Romans 8:37). Christ is the source of our righteousness, and he has made us sufficient (1 Corinthians 1:30-31; 2 Corinthians 3:4-6). He made us perfect through his sacrifice (Hebrews 10:14). Our works do not add to what Christ did on the cross, and our salvation was earned at the cross (Romans 11:6).

The sixth point to understand is that you received a new nature at conversion that wants to obey God. We are a new creation in Christ (2 Corinthians 5:17). We are reborn when we are saved (John 3). Would a person with this new nature want to reject God? Those who claim you can lose your salvation are asserting that it is possible to go back to the old nature.

The seventh point to understand is that our assurance is based on Christ’s ministry of prayer and intercession on our behalf (Romans 8:34; Hebrews 7:25; I John 2:1). Note especially Hebrews 7:25 that it is Christ who “saves to the uttermost” those who draw near to God.
Examples of Christ’s prayers for us include the prayers of Christ for Peter in Luke 22:31-34. Christ prayed that Peter’s faith would not fail. Christ also prayed for believers, including us, in John 17:6-26. He specifically mentioned in this prayer asking God to keep us from being lost (John 17: 11-12). Can anyone be a more powerful prayer warrior to have in our corner?

The eighth point to understand is that we enjoy unity with Christ when we were saved (Romans 6:5). We are no longer separate from Him, and that is why Scripture says we are in Christ(John 6:56; Romans 8:1; 2 Corinthians 13:5). We were baptized into Christ (Romans 6:3-4; Galatians 3:27). We were crucified with Christ (Galatians 2:20). Christ lives in us (Romans 8:10-20; Galatians 2:20). We are identified with him totally. Scripture says that we died with Christ (Romans 6:8; Colossians 2:20), are buried with Christ (Romans 6:4), were made alive with Christ (Ephesians 2:5), were risen with Christ (Ephesians 2:6; Colossians 3:1) and are hidden in Christ (Colossians 3:3). We experience unity with Christ in many ways…we are inseparable from him.

Unity with Christ has importance with regards to security as well. Christ does not deny us because he cannot deny Himself (2 Timothy 2:11-13). Our unity with Christ is a powerful reason why he will not reject us.

The ninth point to understand is that God has covenanted with Christians in regards to eternal life, and that we can rely on God’s covenant love and loyalty, which endures forever. God’s covenant love is hesed in Hebrew. As an example of what God says about his covenant love, see Psalm 136. It repeatedly states that God’s steadfast love, or covenant love, endures forever. Another example of this covenant loyalty is found with ancient Israel. God has not given up on ancient Israel despite their lack of loyalty, as Romans 11 indicates.

This Hebrew word hesed is rendered steadfast love in the ESV. It would be a good exercise to scan through the Old Testament to see how often this word is mentioned in relation to those God has covenanted with. It is mentioned many, many times.

The tenth point to understand relates to God’s attributes. One of the attributes of God is omniscience. God knows everything, including all details about the future (Is. 46:10). How does this relate to assurance of salvation?

If God knows the details of the future, why would he bring someone to salvation, give them eternal life, and work within their life, then reach a point of giving up on them due to some sin? Is God schizophrenic? Why would he bother bringing someone to salvation if he knew the person was going to commit some sin that was going to cause them to reject Him totally and finally? As mentioned previously, he has not given up on ancient Israel, despite their sins (Romans 11).

Those who think a believer can lose their salvation don’t seem to understand God’s attributes. He knows the end from the beginning, and knows every sin the person will commit before they are saved. How would God be able to relate to a person honestly and in love if he knew that they were going to be lost at some point?

Only those who are saved should be assured of their salvation, though. Those who haven’t placed their faith in Christ are under God’s wrath. So, it’s important to know whether you are saved or not. How do you know if you’re saved? Scripture teaches that we should examine ourselves to see if we are in the faith (2 Cor 13:5).

We should examine the fruits of our salvation to see if they are present. Fruits are borne over time, so a new Christian may not be able to recognize these fruits earlier in their Christian walk. So, if you are young in the faith and don’t recognize these fruits earlier in your Christian walk, do not be discouraged. Over time, though, if you don’t observe these fruits in your life, you may have reason to consider whether you were saved. The fact that you are concerned is a good sign. Those who are not saved have little or no concern for their relationship with God.

1 John was written to give believers the assurance of their salvation (1 John 5:13). It gives signs of true believers. The first sign is that they have placed their faith in Jesus Christ, the son of God and his sacrifice for forgiveness of their sins (1 John 4:15; I John 5:1; 1 John 5:5). A second sign is that they do not practice a habitual lifestyle of sin (1 John 3:9; I John 5:2). This does not mean that Christians cease to sin at conversion; it means that they do not continue to practice their sin with no concern for their disobedience. A third sign is that they continue with the Christian faith; they persevere in the faith (Hebrews 3:14; 1 John 2:19). A fourth sign is that they love the brethren (1 John 3:14-16; I John 4:7-12;I John 4:21). A fifth sign is that they have the Holy Spirit, which is an internal witness that we belong to God (1 John 3:24).

Scripture is clear in teaching that believers have eternal security. It is also clear in teaching that those who are saved depart from evil (2 Timothy 2:19). Believers may experience long periods of spiritual fruitlessness, but they will never fall away from the faith completely and finally.

The fact that Christians struggling against a sin is a proof that they are saved. All believers struggle with such issues in their lives. Those who claim otherwise are either deceived or lying. The new believer should just keep on confessing the sin, and asking for cleansing, as I John 1:8-9 teaches.

Regular confession is very important. We never outgrow our need for God’s grace and our need for a Savior. Satan wants us to get frustrated, and to think that our situation is hopeless. There is no believer who wants to get back into close relationship with God who cannot do so.

What about Scriptures that seem to indicate you can lose your salvation? Addressing each individual Scripture would be time consuming. However, here is a few examples that are typical explanations of those Scriptures:​

• Those who leave the faith were never really saved to start with (I John 2:19). Examples of such individuals include Judas Iscariot. He is commonly used as an example of a saved person who left the faith. However, Scripture is clear in teaching that he was never a believer (John 6:64). In fact, Scripture calls him a devil (John 6:70-71).​

• Some Scriptures are talking about losing the ability to share the gospel message, rather than loss of salvation. Examples of this are in Revelation 2:5, where Christ said that the church at Ephesus was subject to having its lampstand removed. This removal was talking about the removal of their opportunity to preach the Gospel message, not loss of salvation.​

• There are warnings in Scripture concerning the need to persevere. These warnings are part of what God uses to keep us in the faith.
  ​

I view those who deny eternal security to be much like the ten Israelite spies, who were fearful and projected a negative view of God and his ability to deliver the Israelites, and the fearful Israelite army who faced Goliath, whereas the example of the faithful ones, Joshua, Caleb, and David, was much, much different....they were bold in God's strength and did not focus on themselves and their pitiful self-effort, which fails us constantly.  One set of individuals focuses on self-effort; the other focuses on the transforming power of God's Holy Spirit...these two mentalities are as far apart from one another as day and night.
​

Thank you for your explaining on this...I find it quite difficult to understand a lot of post that are written on this subject, salvation and being saved...I am a born again Christian, walking with the Lord just over a year now and have often wondered about the thing`s you have explained...Your writing explained it to my understanding and has helped me also in understanding about the fruit, and to check ourselves to see if we are walking with the Holy Spirit. Thank you once again...xox...

 

[BeyondET]

Romans 5:1
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

A mustard seed is enough...

 

[valiant]

It seems no matter what, you are for the false teaching & the false teacher, no matter who they are.

The word "castaway" means rejected by God. A reject.

actually it means tested and found wanting.

The "prize" is eternal life.

Who says so? You or Paul?

So the meaning is "rejected for eternal life."

no it means rejected after testing.

As usual, you're for the side of the wrong.

As usual you are bitter,

Commentaries make this clear, & you belittle them.

There is a wide view on this by commentaries.

Are you so much better than them?

At least I know that I have sought the Holy Spirit.

 

[Chris1975]

[h=3]2 Peter 3

Be Steadfast[/h][SUP]14 [/SUP]Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; [SUP]15 [/SUP]and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, [SUP]16 [/SUP]as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

[SUP]17 [/SUP]You therefore, beloved, since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked; [SUP]18 [/SUP]but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. <more confirmation of falling away, this time from the Apostle Peter>


- It won't go well for those who twist and distort the scriptures. These are untaught and unstable people. Their end is destruction. These are false prophets and teachers.
- Now addressing the brethren: (1) BEWARE (2) LEST YOU FALL (3) FROM THE STEADFASTNESS OF THE FAITH (4) BY THESE FALSE TEACHERS. (5) SO GROW IN GRACE AND KNOWLEDGE.

If you think you can divorce a Walk of holiness (in your conduct, not just lip-service) from Faith in Christ ----- then you are wrong train line. That light you seem to be approaching in the distance is a train heading towards you.

 

[valiant]

2 Peter 3

Be Steadfast

[SUP]14 [/SUP]Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; [SUP]15 [/SUP]and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation

'The longsuffering of our Lord is salvation'. This is one side of the equation. The other side is, 'whom the Lord loves He chastens', and 'He works in you to will and do of His good pleasure.'

He bears with us, He chastens us, and He fashions us. Because He never lets us go,.

—as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, [SUP]16 [/SUP]as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

But there are always those who will twist what Paul and the other Scriptures say to prove their own false position (eg universalism) because they are unsaved.

[SUP]17 [/SUP]You therefore, beloved, since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked;

The true Christian needs constantly to be aware of things which will (temporarily) lead him astray causing him to fall from his present steadfast position,.

[SUP]18 [/SUP]but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. <more confirmation of falling away, this time from the Apostle Peter>

As usual it is all clear until you put in your false interpretations. Every Christian through life will experience what it is to be in danger of 'falling away' for a time, and has to be exhorted to keep on stedfastly and grow in grace and knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. But they fall into grace, not from it. Falling from it is a doctrinal issue,

It won't go well for those who twist and distort the scriptures.

You mean those who put into Scripture their own views in red?

These are untaught and unstable people. Their end is destruction. These are false prophets and teachers.

you said it

- Now addressing the brethren: (1) BEWARE (2) LEST YOU FALL (3) FROM THE STEADFASTNESS OF THE FAITH (4) BY THESE FALSE TEACHERS. (5) SO GROW IN GRACE AND KNOWLEDGE.

By being led astray FOR A TIME.

If you think you can divorce a Walk of holiness (in your conduct, not just lip-service) from Faith in Christ ----- then you are wrong train line.

It is not talking about a walk of holiness. It is talking about false teaching. YOU are on the wrong train line.

That light you seem to be approaching in the distance is a train heading towards you.

we will watch out for you

 

[Chris1975]

It is not talking about a walk of holiness. It is talking about false teaching. YOU are on the wrong train line.

2 Peter 3
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness,

[SUP]14 [/SUP]Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless;


Choo Choo

 

[stonesoffire]

Romans 5:1
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

A mustard seed is enough...

Because the roots of the bush go down 20 some feet into the ground...and is impossible to stamp out. Read about it. Is interesting.

 

[stonesoffire]

Eph 3:16　 I pray that he would give you, according to his glorious riches, strength in your inner being and power through his Spirit,
　
Eph 3:17　 and that the Messiah would make his home in your hearts through faith. Then, having been rooted and grounded in love,
　
Eph 3:18　 you will be able to understand, along with all the saints, what is wide, long, high, and deep—　


Eph 3:19　 that is, you will know the love of the Messiah—which transcends knowledge, and will be filled with all the fullness of God.
　
Eph 3:20　 Now to the one who can do infinitely more than all we can ask or imagine according to the power that is working among us—　


Eph 3:21　 to him be glory in the church and in the Messiah Jesus to all generations, forever and ever! Amen.

I believe the goal of Paul was to carry the presence of Holy Spirit in fullness. Which is holiness. Not about what we do...but who our hearts are full of. 　

 

[Chris1975]

Eph 3:16　 I pray that he would give you, according to his glorious riches, strength in your inner being and power through his Spirit,
　
Eph 3:17　 and that the Messiah would make his home in your hearts through faith. Then, having been rooted and grounded in love,
　
Eph 3:18　 you will be able to understand, along with all the saints, what is wide, long, high, and deep—　


Eph 3:19　 that is, you will know the love of the Messiah—which transcends knowledge, and will be filled with all the fullness of God.
　
Eph 3:20　 Now to the one who can do infinitely more than all we can ask or imagine according to the power that is working among us—　


Eph 3:21　 to him be glory in the church and in the Messiah Jesus to all generations, forever and ever! Amen.

I believe the goal of Paul was to carry the presence of Holy Spirit in fullness. Which is holiness. Not about what we do...but who our hearts are full of. 　

If the above is what you carry, then the outcome will be certain. Because your holy conduct would align accordingly. Its when you are living in willful sin, can you testify to the above scriptures being in effect in your life? If you think so, then the above scriptures are not true in your life.

 

[BeyondET]

Because the roots of the bush go down 20 some feet into the ground...and is impossible to stamp out. Read about it. Is interesting.

Pando tree...

 

[valiant]

2 Peter 3
[SUP]11 [/SUP]Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness,

[SUP]14 [/SUP]Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless;


Choo Choo

Chew away. But that is a totally different section. Like Paul, Peter covers different things at different times. Verses 11-14 cover what he requires of them in behaviour in relation to His coming, verses 15-17 cover what he requires of them relating to false teaching.. No wonder you get it wrong, if you can't discern between the two.

 

[stonesoffire]

If the above is what you carry, then the outcome will be certain. Because your holy conduct would align accordingly. Its when you are living in willful sin, can you testify to the above scriptures being in effect in your life? If you think so, then the above scriptures are not true in your life.

Describe holy conduct Chris please...

 

[stonesoffire]

Pando tree...

I had to google it. What a tree! Thank you! Great example too..

 

[valiant]

If the above is what you carry, then the outcome will be certain. Because your holy conduct would align accordingly. Its when you are living in willful sin, can you testify to the above scriptures being in effect in your life? If you think so, then the above scriptures are not true in your life.

But NO ONE is suggesting a life of wilful sin, (although we all do it some times). It is not wise to judge our status by a period of backsliding. It is rather to be judged by when we walk with the Lord