Galatian Conundrums

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

Absolutely

Well-known member
Jul 23, 2018
9,154
2,359
113
After all my postings to you and others in this thread as well as in other threads, I lol when you asked me that question.

Don’t be misled by absolutely, he is a troll. 🤣
I engage you specifically.
Your juvenile mess is a dodge.
I can go toe to toe with you anytime,anyday.
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,548
10,534
113
He was supposed to come and sit on David's throne in Jerusalem instead, which will now happen only after the Tribulation ends, and the 1000 year millennial reign begins.
where will David be at this time?
still in his tomb?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,548
10,534
113
You mean when Jesus was born, he was already rejected by the Jews? Is that really what you are saying?
He was rejected already by the time of Samuel.

1 Samuel 8:7
And the LORD said to Samuel, "Heed the voice of the people in all that they say to you; for they have not rejected you, but they have rejected Me, that I should not reign over them."
 

Grandpa

Senior Member
Jun 24, 2011
10,822
2,721
113
Galatians 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:


I suppose if you have a literal view nothing will make sense unless you do some sort of mental gymnastics with the bible.

The problem with most peoples view of scripture is that they didn't make sure that scripture is reconciled with the rest of scripture. They take a concept they think they see in one area of scripture and run with it, even though some other scripture may contradict it.

Once you see the contradiction the concept is over. So you purposely have to NOT SEE what scripture states in order to continue on with your concept of the Kingdom of God only being to Jews.

This seems to be commonly held error. Kind of weird.


The Lord Jesus took the OT scriptures and showed people, after He resurrected, how it was all about Him. He showed how even the OT was pointing towards Christianity. I wish these teachings were part of the bible. Some of the most interesting things to me are seeing Christ and Christianity in the OT. The way someone who truly understands Grace shows it.
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,958
1,526
113
You are replying to my post and yet not addressing any of my points at all.

But its okay, your posts tend to be like that. Cheers.

I am not getting the idea that I read Paul into something .What does that mean ? Read Paul what? What was that point?

Then you mentioned something about a ceremonial law as shadow having to do with circumcision. It was fulfilled in the coming of Christ. and again this idea of lost tribes. Nothing is lost, no secret tribes or circumcisions.
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,958
1,526
113
Do you realize none of the apostles were asking about whether Jews and Gentiles can now be saved together? They were not told anything about the mystery of the body of Christ comprising of Jews and Gentiles living in equality, that was revealed specifically to the Apostle Paul in Ephesians 2 and 3.
The Jew and the gentile could always be saved together .

Its not about flesh as if God was respecter of corrupted creation (dead in its trespasses and sin) . Abel who was revealed the mystery of faith he was saved by grace. this is long before God took two nations the Amorites and Hittites Abraham lineage and created one to be used to represent the whole of mankind . Using their flesh as types and shadows to represent faith and unbelief.

As Christians we do not wrestle against flesh and blood and neither are we supported by it. Jesus said of his own Jewish flesh it profits for zero. We walk by faith not by sight.

What's your hope in eulogizing the flesh of nation against another? Find something lost ?
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,548
10,534
113
I have to admit my ignorance regarding the Paulines, it is a sect I am not familiar with with. Maybe you could fill in the gap for me. Thanks.
Another word for it, more common, which I learned this morning, is "hyper-dispensationalism"
 

PS

Senior Member
Jan 11, 2013
5,399
693
113
Another word for it, more common, which I learned this morning, is "hyper-dispensationalism"
Thank you. Christianity sounds much better. :)

How about banning it, the same as hyper-grace?
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
312
63
Jesus is the ONLY way, the ONLY Shepherd, the King, the Master:

Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My words (teachings) will not pass away.”

John 10:16, “And I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them also, and they will listen to My voice. So there will be one flock, one Shepherd.”

John 14:21, “he who possesses My commands and guards them, it is he who loves Me. And he who loves Me shall be loved by My Father, and I shall love him and manifest Myself to him.”

1 John 3:24, “And the one guarding His commands stays in Him, and He in him. And by this we know that He stays in us, by the Spirit which He gave us.”

John 12:48, “He who rejects Me, and does not follow My words has One Who judges him. The word that I have spoken, the same will be used to judge him in the last day.”
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
312
63
Galatians 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:


I suppose if you have a literal view nothing will make sense unless you do some sort of mental gymnastics with the bible.

The problem with most peoples view of scripture is that they didn't make sure that scripture is reconciled with the rest of scripture. They take a concept they think they see in one area of scripture and run with it, even though some other scripture may contradict it.

Once you see the contradiction the concept is over. So you purposely have to NOT SEE what scripture states in order to continue on with your concept of the Kingdom of God only being to Jews.

This seems to be commonly held error. Kind of weird.


The Lord Jesus took the OT scriptures and showed people, after He resurrected, how it was all about Him. He showed how even the OT was pointing towards Christianity. I wish these teachings were part of the bible. Some of the most interesting things to me are seeing Christ and Christianity in the OT. The way someone who truly understands Grace shows it.
If it's all about Jesus... Then why do so many toss out everything Jesus did, said and taught pre resurrection and say that is not the way now? Not saying you say this but a number of people here have been saying this.
 

TheDivineWatermark

Well-known member
Aug 3, 2018
7,431
1,441
113
Another word for it, more common, which I learned this morning, is "hyper-dispensationalism"
As I understand it, the term "hyper-dispensationalism" pertains ONLY to those who hold to the idea that the Church which is His body started LATER in Acts (like Acts 9,13,18, or 28 [or whatever]); but "Pauline Dispensationalism" believes the Church which is His body started in Acts 2 (Eph1:20-23 WHEN) and does not fall under the "hyper-" banner.

So there is a distinction here. One can be "Pauline Dispensationalist" without falling under the "hyper-" category.
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,958
1,526
113
Galatians 3:29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Ephesians 3:6 That the Gentiles should be fellowheirs, and of the same body, and partakers of his promise in Christ by the gospel:


I suppose if you have a literal view nothing will make sense unless you do some sort of mental gymnastics with the bible.

The problem with most peoples view of scripture is that they didn't make sure that scripture is reconciled with the rest of scripture. They take a concept they think they see in one area of scripture and run with it, even though some other scripture may contradict it.

Once you see the contradiction the concept is over. So you purposely have to NOT SEE what scripture states in order to continue on with your concept of the Kingdom of God only being to Jews.

This seems to be commonly held error. Kind of weird.


The Lord Jesus took the OT scriptures and showed people, after He resurrected, how it was all about Him. He showed how even the OT was pointing towards Christianity. I wish these teachings were part of the bible. Some of the most interesting things to me are seeing Christ and Christianity in the OT. The way someone who truly understands Grace shows it.

Amen, grace the revealer in the end . It is the only quailfer that if done despite to we can judge and know who needs to hear the gospel .all other opinions as heresy or our private interpretation fall under it.

Catholicism is one that clearly shows despite done the grace of God.

1 Corinthians 11:19 For there must be also heresies (sects) among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
 
Mar 28, 2016
15,958
1,526
113
As I understand it, the term "hyper-dispensationalism" pertains ONLY to those who hold to the idea that the Church which is His body started LATER in Acts (like Acts 9,13,18, or 28 [or whatever]); but "Pauline Dispensationalism" believes the Church which is His body started in Acts 2 (Eph1:20-23 WHEN) and does not fall under the "hyper-" banner.

So there is a distinction here. One can be "Pauline Dispensationalist" without falling under the "hyper-" category.
I think the church as the bride of Christ began with Abel in whom God betowed his grace upon him send him as a messenger by God.

Killed by his brother Cain that did not believe in God not seen. Abel the first martyr .

The reformation came restoring the government of God back to the period of Judges where men and woman prophets could celebrate together Not after the government of kings, men with a high wall separating the woman from the men and the gentiles from the apostate Jews.

Acts 2:15-17 King James Version (KJV) For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of
my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dream

The time of reformation came by the restoring authority. All things written in the law and prophets (sola scriptura) Or also called Moses and Elias to represent that authority as two witnesses.

Jesus three times when tempted with lying vison said. . as it is written. It representing the unseen faith of God

How could we say it had no effect before Acts?
 

PERFECTION

Active member
Aug 14, 2019
222
63
28
It took Christ Himself in direct communication with Paul and Peter to let them see their place in spreading the good news of the Kingdom of God.
Paul would see his ministry toward the gentiles.
Peter would see His ministry toward the Jews.
Peter however in his ministry toward the Jews could not bring Himself into the complete separation from the law.
This is where Christ came to Peter and through Peters dream showed Him that the jews and Gentiles where equal partakers in the Kingdom of God.
Peter was always known as the stubborn apostle. Even with that said it was also clear that for what ever reason Jesus held Him closer than the others.
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
312
63
I have a thought.

Hebrews 10:16-17, " 16 “This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds,” 17 then he adds, “I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more.”

If God writes His law, not traffic law, not local law, not international law, God’s law on the heart and mind who could say they are guided by His spirit and fight against His law? Accusing people and calling them names for saying it is right, it is what Jesus followed and it is not done away but it is written on the heart and mind.

I know so many have been deceived by false doctrine, from people Jesus did not choose, but from people that self testify and say Jesus chose them, the really odd thing is, many, not all Christians seem to disagree with everything Jesus said and claim that His words are abolished. Sad day indeed.

Matthew 24:12 And because lawlessness will be increased, the love of many will grow cold."

John 5:43, “I have come in My Father's Name, but you do not follow Me. Let another come in his own name; him you will follow.”

Mat 24:35, “Heaven and earth may pass away, but My teachings will not pass away.”
 

FollowtheShepherd

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2019
794
312
63
It took Christ Himself in direct communication with Paul and Peter to let them see their place in spreading the good news of the Kingdom of God.
Paul would see his ministry toward the gentiles.
Peter would see His ministry toward the Jews.
Peter however in his ministry toward the Jews could not bring Himself into the complete separation from the law.
This is where Christ came to Peter and through Peters dream showed Him that the jews and Gentiles where equal partakers in the Kingdom of God.
Peter was always known as the stubborn apostle. Even with that said it was also clear that for what ever reason Jesus held Him closer than the others.
Jesus sent all His disciple to the gentiles including Peter:

Matthew 24:14, “And this Good News of the reign shall be proclaimed in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end shall come.”

Acts 1:6-8, " 6 So when they had come together, they asked him, “Lord, will you at this time restore the kingdom to Israel?” 7 He said to them, “It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by his own authority. 8 But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you, and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.

Luke 24:44-49, “44 Then he said to them, “These are my words that I spoke to you while I was still with you, that everything written about me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled.” 45 Then he opened their minds to understand the Scriptures, 46 and said to them, “Thus it is written, that the Christ should suffer and on the third day rise from the dead, 47 and that repentance and forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem. 48 You are witnesses of these things. 49 And behold, I am sending the promise of my Father upon you. But stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high.”

Acts 15:6-7, “So the apostles and the elders met to consider this statement. After a lengthy debate, Peter stood up and said to them, “Brothers, you know that in the early days God chose me to be the one among you through whom the Gentiles would hear the message of the gospel and believe."



Only Paul says differnt and everyone siddes with Paul not Jesus:

Galatians 2:7-8, “In fact, they saw that I had been entrusted with the gospel for the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been entrusted with the gospel for the circumcised. For the one who worked through Peter by making him an apostle to the circumcised also worked through me by sending me to the Gentiles.”
 

posthuman

Senior Member
Jul 31, 2013
31,548
10,534
113
Only Paul says differnt and everyone siddes with Paul not Jesus:

Galatians 2:7-8, “In fact, they saw that I had been entrusted with the gospel for the uncircumcised, just as Peter had been entrusted with the gospel for the circumcised. For the one who worked through Peter by making him an apostle to the circumcised also worked through me by sending me to the Gentiles.”
That's not really different.
Peter says he was chosen that Gentiles heard through him. Paul says he was appointed to evangelize Gentiles and Peter to Jews. Yet Paul habitually went to Jews first as he traveled - no contradiction, no imaginary "different Gospels" just different primary ministries.