"God loves everyone" - false

[awelight]

A couple of thoughts to ponder on this Lord's Day.

For those who do not think that salvation is the free Grace of God. God plus nothing.

Ponder these two statements, if you will:


-- When a man teaches that Salvation is a cooperation between God and man......It is like teaching that the clay is in cooperation with the potter, as to how it will be formed.


-- Philosophers say: Free Grace makes man nothing more than a mere puppet on a string.....But the recipients of Grace reply, This is better than making God a puppet on a string, of man's free will.

 

[JBaptist]

Could I ask my brothers and sisters to faithfully read the whole post and seek to understand, rather than have a knee jerk reaction to the thread title.
Sorry that I feel I have to say this, but the reaction I've got in other threads has been as a result of a reaction to the thread title from people who haven't sought to understand the thread content

There are many generalised expressions within our faith, that if you take the time to pick apart, just aren't true.
"God loves everyone" is one such false expression.
"Jesus died for everybody's sins" is another one, which is covered in another thread.

John 3:16 is always cited as support for "God loves everyone", but the verse does not say these words.
Below is the full passage that shows the context of the often referenced verse:


John 3:16:
"That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten God. 19 And this is the condemnation that light is come into the world and men loved darkness rather than light because their deeds were evil. 20 For everyone that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved"


Notice that the verse does not say "God loves everyone".
It says that whosoever believeth should not perish but have eternal life.

Verse 15 always seems to be left out of the "God loves everyone" message because it is restrictive, and does not suit the purpose of those who push the "God loves everyone" message.

"For God so loved the world" refers to the fact that Jesus was speaking to a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews (John 16:1) who believed that only the Jews were saved to the exclusion of the rest of the world. John 3:18 and 19 clear up any question about the matter.

"God loves everyone" is straight from the mind of satan and the ministers that serve him. In essence it teaches that man can lead a sinful life, violate the commandments of God daily, not fear him and still go to heaven.


At this point there may be a few people who will equate having to keep the commandments of God with preaching a 'salvation by works' doctrine, but this is not the case. Those who say this do so because they have no intention of trying to keep God's commandments, and so they seek to accuse.

John 14:15
"If you love me, keep my commandments".

John 15:14
"You are my friends if you do what I command you".

Ecclesiastes 12:13
"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man".


"God loves everyone" doctrine implies that man does not have to be accountable for his/her sins. It teaches that because "God loves everyone", that there is no need to fear him.

"God loves everyone", aka
"God loves and accepts everyone no matter what", "God's attributes are ONLY love and forgiveness for all", "God has no anger and is accepting of all behaviors".
False:

Rev 14:10
Jeremiah 25:15
Jude 14-15
Rev 14:11
Deut 32:22
Isaiah 30:33
2 Thes 1:6
2 Thes 1:8-9
Matthew 10:34-35
Matthew 7:21
Matthew 7:22-23
Matthew 12:30
Matthew 12:34-35
Matthew 12: 36-37
Matthew 15:8-9
Matthew 23:14
Matthew 23:15
Matthew 23:29-33
Mark 9:42-48
Mark 16:16
Luke 13:23-28
Luke 16:19-31
Luke 18:6-8
John 8:44
John 17:9
Rev 21:8
Isaiah 13:9
Isaiah 66:24
Psalms 7:11
Romans 1:18
1 Thes 5:3
2 Peter 2:9-10
Rev 6:10
Rev 6:15-17
Rev 20:12-15
Psalms 55:15

I could continue quoting scripture in order to reveal the true nature of God, which flies in the face of the "God loves everyone" doctrine, but I think 36 verses will suffice for now

You did a very good job of speaking the unpopular truth. The other unpopular truth that goes along with this is the subject of repentance. And, since you are knowledgable about the content above, as it is written and there for all to read, but challenging to those who will not love God by changing their lives, you must be aware of the false teachings about forgiveness as well. I look forward to your response on this subject.

 

[MusicMan]

If this is true, then I cannot be saved at all since I am not saved to begin with. I do admit that I am not saved and reading this completely discourages me from getting saved because if God hates me, then he hates me forever (it is never only temporary). I only will only worship a God that is loving of everyone.

 

[MusicMan]

Also to add, If God hates me today, then he will hate me tomorrow and forever.

 

[throughfaith]

A couple of thoughts to ponder on this Lord's Day.

For those who do not think that salvation is the free Grace of God. God plus nothing.

Ponder these two statements, if you will:


-- When a man teaches that Salvation is a cooperation between God and man......It is like teaching that the clay is in cooperation with the potter, as to how it will be formed.


-- Philosophers say: Free Grace makes man nothing more than a mere puppet on a string.....But the recipients of Grace reply, This is better than making God a puppet on a string, of man's free will.

Free grace as taught in the scriptures looks nothing like the ' doctrines of grace ,calvinist have hijacked to place believers under bondage to Lordship salvation . The devil can't cause anyone to lose salvation, but he can certainly cause believers to be deceived into a different world view .

 

[infinitekhanol]

"DBurrage, posted

Could I ask my brothers and sisters to faithfully read the whole post and seek to understand, rather than have a knee jerk reaction to the thread title.
Sorry that I feel I have to say this, but the reaction I've got in other threads has been as a result of a reaction to the thread title from people who haven't sought to understand the thread content

There are many generalised expressions within our faith, that if you take the time to pick apart, just aren't true.
"God loves everyone" is one such false expression.
"Jesus died for everybody's sins" is another one, which is covered in another thread.

John 3:16 is always cited as support for "God loves everyone", but the verse does not say these words.
Below is the full passage that shows the context of the often referenced verse:


John 3:16:
"That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten God. 19 And this is the condemnation that light is come into the world and men loved darkness rather than light because their deeds were evil. 20 For everyone that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved"


Notice that the verse does not say "God loves everyone".
It says that whosoever believeth should not perish but have eternal life.

Verse 15 always seems to be left out of the "God loves everyone" message because it is restrictive, and does not suit the purpose of those who push the "God loves everyone" message.

"For God so loved the world" refers to the fact that Jesus was speaking to a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews (John 16:1) who believed that only the Jews were saved to the exclusion of the rest of the world. John 3:18 and 19 clear up any question about the matter.

"God loves everyone" is straight from the mind of satan and the ministers that serve him. In essence it teaches that man can lead a sinful life, violate the commandments of God daily, not fear him and still go to heaven.


At this point there may be a few people who will equate having to keep the commandments of God with preaching a 'salvation by works' doctrine, but this is not the case. Those who say this do so because they have no intention of trying to keep God's commandments, and so they seek to accuse.

John 14:15
"If you love me, keep my commandments".

John 15:14
"You are my friends if you do what I command you".

Ecclesiastes 12:13
"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man".


"God loves everyone" doctrine implies that man does not have to be accountable for his/her sins. It teaches that because "God loves everyone", that there is no need to fear him.

"God loves everyone", aka
"God loves and accepts everyone no matter what", "God's attributes are ONLY love and forgiveness for all", "God has no anger and is accepting of all behaviors".
False:

Rev 14:10
Jeremiah 25:15
Jude 14-15
Rev 14:11
Deut 32:22
Isaiah 30:33
2 Thes 1:6
2 Thes 1:8-9
Matthew 10:34-35
Matthew 7:21
Matthew 7:22-23
Matthew 12:30
Matthew 12:34-35
Matthew 12: 36-37
Matthew 15:8-9
Matthew 23:14
Matthew 23:15
Matthew 23:29-33
Mark 9:42-48
Mark 16:16
Luke 13:23-28
Luke 16:19-31
Luke 18:6-8
John 8:44
John 17:9
Rev 21:8
Isaiah 13:9
Isaiah 66:24
Psalms 7:11
Romans 1:18
1 Thes 5:3
2 Peter 2:9-10
Rev 6:10
Rev 6:15-17
Rev 20:12-15
Psalms 55:15

I could continue quoting scripture in order to reveal the true nature of God, which flies in the face of the "God loves everyone" doctrine, but I think 36 verses will suffice for now


I think you should go back and read the gospels to see how Jesus interacted with sinners in order to understand the love of God for all his offspring.

 

[infinitekhanol]

God doesn't love me, that's for sure.

Why do you say so?

 

[Bbrdrd]

If this is true, then I cannot be saved at all since I am not saved to begin with. I do admit that I am not saved and reading this completely discourages me from getting saved because if God hates me, then he hates me forever (it is never only temporary). I only will only worship a God that is loving of everyone.

While I disagree with the premise of this thread, I am comfortable with God hating some people. Though the ones that God's wrath is consistently directed against are not simply rule-breakers but abusers. It is the slavers and the powerful who abuse the poor that, if God hates anyone, God hates. The truly wicked who not only sin in ignorance but actively seek to destroy the beautiful creation He has made, and the Creator that made it.

Yet even in that the impetus is love, God's hatred is not directed at disobedient children sinning because they don't know better but is drawn from His jealous protection of the weak. It is an expression of His love not simply for Himself but for those who cannot defend themselves. God's hatred avenges the blood of the innocent.

In that, God doesn't hate those who simply reject Him but those that despise Him. One group there is hope for that they may one day lay down their rejection and embrace the glorious God of the universe, the other heaps up their own condemnation and deserve to be hated.

 

[Magenta]

Did Israel have a choice, in it becoming God's chosen nation?

Some rebelled. Did God compel them to do this?

 

[Magenta]

He Himself is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world. 1 John 2:2

 

[throughfaith]

Jesus died for the entire cosmos not just every man woman and child .

 

[throughfaith]

While I disagree with the premise of this thread, I am comfortable with God hating some people. Though the ones that God's wrath is consistently directed against are not simply rule-breakers but abusers. It is the slavers and the powerful who abuse the poor that, if God hates anyone, God hates. The truly wicked who not only sin in ignorance but actively seek to destroy the beautiful creation He has made, and the Creator that made it.

Yet even in that the impetus is love, God's hatred is not directed at disobedient children sinning because they don't know better but is drawn from His jealous protection of the weak. It is an expression of His love not simply for Himself but for those who cannot defend themselves. God's hatred avenges the blood of the innocent.

In that, God doesn't hate those who simply reject Him but those that despise Him. One group there is hope for that they may one day lay down their rejection and embrace the glorious God of the universe, the other heaps up their own condemnation and deserve to be hated.

I believe Hes not imputing their trespasses to them.

 

[Bbrdrd]

I believe Hes not imputing their trespasses to them.

The perverse in heart are an abomination to the LORD, but the blameless in their walk are His delight. 21Be assured that the wicked will not go unpunished, but the offspring of the righteous will escape.

 

[awelight]

Some rebelled. Did God compel them to do this?

With all do respect, your answer just muddies the waters. Man's own depraved nature causes one to rebel. The proper question would be, Why does God permit rebellion? Anything that happens in this creation, is either because of God's direct actions upon it or His permissive will, of it.

To say anything else, is to deny God's Sovereignty. This would not be heresy, this would be blasphemy.

Isa 45:4 For Jacob my servant's sake, and Israel my chosen, I have called thee by thy name: I have surname'd thee, though thou hast not known me.
Isa 45:5 I am Jehovah, and there is none else; besides me there is no God. I will gird thee, though thou hast not known me;
Isa 45:6 that they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none besides me: I am Jehovah, and there is none else.
Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness; I make peace, and create calamity. I am Jehovah, that is doing all these things.

 

[throughfaith]

"DBurrage, posted

Could I ask my brothers and sisters to faithfully read the whole post and seek to understand, rather than have a knee jerk reaction to the thread title.
Sorry that I feel I have to say this, but the reaction I've got in other threads has been as a result of a reaction to the thread title from people who haven't sought to understand the thread content

There are many generalised expressions within our faith, that if you take the time to pick apart, just aren't true.
"God loves everyone" is one such false expression.
"Jesus died for everybody's sins" is another one, which is covered in another thread.

John 3:16 is always cited as support for "God loves everyone", but the verse does not say these words.
Below is the full passage that shows the context of the often referenced verse:


John 3:16:
"That whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have eternal life. 16 For God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through him might be saved. 18 He that believeth on him is not condemned; but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten God. 19 And this is the condemnation that light is come into the world and men loved darkness rather than light because their deeds were evil. 20 For everyone that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved"


Notice that the verse does not say "God loves everyone".
It says that whosoever believeth should not perish but have eternal life.

Verse 15 always seems to be left out of the "God loves everyone" message because it is restrictive, and does not suit the purpose of those who push the "God loves everyone" message.

"For God so loved the world" refers to the fact that Jesus was speaking to a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews (John 16:1) who believed that only the Jews were saved to the exclusion of the rest of the world. John 3:18 and 19 clear up any question about the matter.

"God loves everyone" is straight from the mind of satan and the ministers that serve him. In essence it teaches that man can lead a sinful life, violate the commandments of God daily, not fear him and still go to heaven.


At this point there may be a few people who will equate having to keep the commandments of God with preaching a 'salvation by works' doctrine, but this is not the case. Those who say this do so because they have no intention of trying to keep God's commandments, and so they seek to accuse.

John 14:15
"If you love me, keep my commandments".

John 15:14
"You are my friends if you do what I command you".

Ecclesiastes 12:13
"Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man".


"God loves everyone" doctrine implies that man does not have to be accountable for his/her sins. It teaches that because "God loves everyone", that there is no need to fear him.

"God loves everyone", aka
"God loves and accepts everyone no matter what", "God's attributes are ONLY love and forgiveness for all", "God has no anger and is accepting of all behaviors".
False:

Rev 14:10
Jeremiah 25:15
Jude 14-15
Rev 14:11
Deut 32:22
Isaiah 30:33
2 Thes 1:6
2 Thes 1:8-9
Matthew 10:34-35
Matthew 7:21
Matthew 7:22-23
Matthew 12:30
Matthew 12:34-35
Matthew 12: 36-37
Matthew 15:8-9
Matthew 23:14
Matthew 23:15
Matthew 23:29-33
Mark 9:42-48
Mark 16:16
Luke 13:23-28
Luke 16:19-31
Luke 18:6-8
John 8:44
John 17:9
Rev 21:8
Isaiah 13:9
Isaiah 66:24
Psalms 7:11
Romans 1:18
1 Thes 5:3
2 Peter 2:9-10
Rev 6:10
Rev 6:15-17
Rev 20:12-15
Psalms 55:15

I could continue quoting scripture in order to reveal the true nature of God, which flies in the face of the "God loves everyone" doctrine, but I think 36 verses will suffice for now


I think you should go back and read the gospels to see how Jesus interacted with sinners in order to understand the love of God for all his offspring.

The perverse in heart are an abomination to the LORD, but the blameless in their walk are His delight. 21Be assured that the wicked will not go unpunished, but the offspring of the righteous will escape.

Isnt that before Jesus died for the sins of the world ? 2 cor 5.19
To wit, that God was in Christ, RECONCILING THE WORLD unto himself, NOT imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
Eph 2
15Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
col 2.14 .
Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

 

[Bbrdrd]

Isnt that before Jesus died for the sins of the world ? 2 cor 5.19
To wit, that God was in Christ, RECONCILING THE WORLD unto himself, NOT imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.
Eph 2
15Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;
16And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:
col 2.14 .
Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross;

So you think that God changes? That before the cross He was one way, but after it another?

 

[Magenta]

With all do respect, your answer just muddies the waters. Man's own depraved nature causes one to rebel. The proper question would be, Why does God permit rebellion? Anything that happens in this creation, is either because of God's direct actions upon it or His permissive will, of it.

How does it muddy the waters to point of that even the chosen of God chose to rebel against Him? Rhetorical question, really.

I highlighted a fact which you seem not to like.

 

[throughfaith]

So you think that God changes? That before the cross He was one way, but after it another?

Gods nature, being ect never changes thats why it says He's the same yesterday ,today and tomorrow. So did Jesus die for the sins of the world before or after the cross ? I'm being silly to make a point .

 

[throughfaith]

So you think that God changes? That before the cross He was one way, but after it another?

Just to help you out here ( with respect ) Did Jesus death burial and resurrection change anything? Anything to do with sin ? for example
or do you see it as just another day ?

 

[Bbrdrd]

Gods nature, being ect never changes thats why it says He's the same yesterday ,today and tomorrow. So did Jesus die for the sins of the world before or after the cross ? I'm being silly to make a point .

So since you seem to be implying that Jesus' death is an eternal reality, how does when God's eternal word was revealed to men make some of it relevant and some of it not? Was it not all written with the knowledge that Jesus would reconcile the world to Himself even if the human authors were not aware of that truth?

As for your question in your second post, Jesus' death burial and resurrection changes things within us, not God or God's relation to the world. It did end the covenant with the Jews, but that was never an eternal one just a long-lasting one. The promises given before are just as valid unless the context limits them to being tied specifically to the covenant with the Jews.