God or Guns?

[Kefa52]

Psalm 34:7
The angel of the Lord encampeth round about them that fear him, and delivereth them.

this angel should be camped around all the servants of God family and property.

correct?

so who can do us any harm with the Lord's angel their protecting us?

When we take up the sword by our own strength. Are telling God " Thats OK, I got it I don't need your help".

Zechariah 11 But they refused to pay attentionj Zch 1:4 and turned a stubborn shoulder; they closed their ears so they could not hear.k Isa 6:10
12 They made their hearts like a rock so as not to obey the law or the words that the Lord of Hosts had sent by His Spirit through the earlier prophets.l Jr 7:13,24 Therefore great anger came from the Lord of Hosts.

Daniel...OK God, "I got it". I have sunscreen SPF110.

 

[BarlyGurl]

Matthew 8:8-10

King James Version (KJV)

8 The centurion answered and said, Lord, I am not worthy that thou shouldest come under my roof: but speak the word only, and my servant shall be healed.
9 For I am a man under authority, having soldiers under me: and I say to this man, Go, and he goeth; and to another, Come, and he cometh; and to my servant, Do this, and he doeth it.
10 When Jesus heard it, he marvelled, and said to them that followed, Verily I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel.

he is a man under authority,
he came to the Lord believing the Lord would heal his servants
he had faith in Jesus, this man under authority to defend and kill.

You have demonstrated you know how to paste scripture... you have not demonstrated you can interpret it acurately.
as far as the thread its a choice
SO it took you this LONG to announce that the issue isn't "guns OR God" but is "guns AND GOD"???? FINALLY!!!!
personally i don't think Christians need a gun if they believe that the Lord is capable of protecting them and I have put enough verses to support this.
Please see first comment in PINK

police officers and military this is their job they are under authority
The reason police officers have guns is to protect THEMSELVES not defend others. The military as a whole... only have guns in there hands while either practicing or engaging in WAR... not for personal defense.

the christian that is not under authority to carry a gun who do you need a gun for if you are a servant of God.
Here you belie your poor scriptural understanding

as the hedges were around Job they should be around us.
THere is no evidence JOB KNEW about the hedge... why would he pray everyday if this was his mindset???

when the Lord remove the hedge around Job did he go get a weapon?
Hmmmm, what makes you think that Job didn't ALREADY OWN weapons???? And where does the scripture indicate that Job was INFORMED about God removing the hedge from him????

the Lord allowed his family to be wiped out and Job did not go get a weapon.

Again... WHere does it suggest that Job did not ALREADY own weapons??? and since Job's entire family was wiped out by a Tornado...how would an act of nature compel a person to get a new spear or bow????? Is it likely that Satan used a natural disaster of great size because had Job been attacked by animals or people... he would have taken up arms and possibly won based purely on his SKILL??? Thus demonstrating that Job served GOD because he LOVED him... not for the benefit of the hedge because had that happened the hedge clearly was NOT NEEDED???

 

[GRA]

YEAH - RIGHT!

("How dumb is this...?")



.

stilly - I sincerely hope you understand that I am agreeing with you whole-heartedly - that it is rediculous for people to think in the way that you have illustrated in your post. It is not your words that I am saying is 'dumb' - but, rather - the idea of some people that you have represented by/with those words...



.

 

[zone]

Thank you for offering your position here regarding your PARENTING PHILOSOPHY... as it turns out we do not agree on it as I do not allow my child to speak for me when I am in the room and discourage speaking for me at all. There is indeed a child's cause to feel offended for there parent and thus desire to defend them... in my experience that usually happens behind the parents' back and it is unknown to the parent. I do see that in your family, it is apparently permitted that the father speaks for the the son and visa versa... so in addressig you I get the son's interpretation and response and when addressing your son I get yours... hmmm. I find indirect "shell game" dialogues lacking in authentic communication since you can't really know who you are talking to. I am not sure if YOU felt degraded or you just support your son's intepretation. Whatever that "something" was that happened to you... Jesus CHrist can forgive it, heal it and cleanse it... so that you can be raised,restored, renewed to the man God created you to be... instead of the one who has made certain restraining impositions o himself to "live" with whatever that "something" was... God can set you free from the shackles of that "something" and also clear-up the conflicts the "onlookers" are noticing about you. It is your option...I don't see anyone degrading anybody here and hope you can recieve the GOOD NEWS...I urge you... Choose Jesus.

oh knock it off.
you're embarrassing yourself.
(i love being an old[er] woman - hint)

 

[MidniteWelder]

I did notice the mistake of context welder made using "At the same time I do understand where God tells us if someone steals from you offer them your cloak as well"...

The verse does not say that and is not talking about a "theft or mugging"... the verse is about lawsuits... being SUED... so in truth this verse has no use in discussing the use of "deadly force".

... I do thank Welder for taking the time to use scripture for his pesentation... since this is bible discussion forum <smile>.

Hey BarlyGurl, you're right I did misquote, it was if someone takes your cloak offer yout TUNIC as well.
But I fail to see where this is referring to a lawsuit.
Mainly I see the message is do not deprive those in need, but I dont really see where it is ok to permit injustice or enable the behaviors of those bent on evil strictly for evils motive.
Also...Id like to add we only have 2 cheeks

Love for Enemies
27“But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,</SPAN> 28bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.</SPAN> 29If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic.</SPAN>

 

[BarlyGurl]

Here I correct myself that Job did indeed lost his sons and daughters to a tornado but that same day there was also a military attack from two other tribes, a fire from heaven AND then the tornado... I surely hope GOD NEVER gives Satan that kind of license with my lfe... but if he did... a gun wouldn't be very effective and kinda makes that other argument look even more silly. Further, my outcome would be the same.... I would not renounce my JESUS.

 

[BarlyGurl]

oh knock it off.
you're embarrassing yourself.
(i love being an old[er] woman - hint)

You are welcome to your opinion. I, also, enjoy the age and level of maturity this season offers.
Blessings

 

[BarlyGurl]

But I fail to see where this is referring to a lawsuit.
Right... I notice you are reading Luke... I saw the difference after I posted my message. If you read the corresponding text in Mathew 5:40 it does specify lawsuit.
Mainly I see the message is do not deprive those in need, but I dont really see where it is ok to permit injustice or enable the behaviors of those bent on evil strictly for evils motive. Yes I like that you are saying about depriving those in need, but is it saying go naked in a snowstorm for a stranger? I understand the two correlated scriptures to be making distinctions about being wronged either by lawsuit or by manipulation as the previous verses in Luke say "despitefully use you". Both demonstrate some degree of relationship prior to offense... as opposed to being "mugged or robbed"... which are acts of violence against the person vs... against the pride... make sense?
Also...Id like to add we only have 2 cheeks LOL

 

[MidniteWelder]

police officers and military this is their job they are under authority

the christian that is not under authority to carry a gun who do you need a gun for if you are a servant of God.

.

My friend, this is something some of us are trying to help others understand,
Our Police officers and Our Military have been given Authority to carry guns yes.
But what is not being understood is that the Supreme Law of our land called the Constitution which governs them has given every Authority for its resident citizens to carry guns to govern the government because our Founding Fathers were wise enough to have the foresight of seeing the possibility of corruption taking over the Govt.
It is the governments agenda to incorrectly brainwash people into thinking the people dont have this right so it may then effectively disarm US citizens.
When Govt goes bad. It is The people as dictated by the Govts own laws which the supreme courts uphold, our Authority as US citizens to then Police the Govt. Its a very well thought out and effective system....IF the people participate.
A US citizen needs to first educate themself of the laws of their own country before arguing against the cold hard truth of the fact that it is actually the people who police the nation when the Governemnt who is appointed to protect them no longer does.
One downfall has been not educating the public with the proper use of firearms until people think guns are just for police and military.
I ask, who then polices those agencies?
The answer, us, we the people by the people of the country were so proud to live in.
But if some are no longer proud of their own nation, this would be so when nobody enforces their rights.
WE ARE the Authority over our Govt, how difficult is this to understand

 

[PS]

But I fail to see where this is referring to a lawsuit.
Right... I notice you are reading Luke... I saw the difference after I posted my message. If you read the corresponding text in Mathew 5:40 it does specify lawsuit.
Mainly I see the message is do not deprive those in need, but I dont really see where it is ok to permit injustice or enable the behaviors of those bent on evil strictly for evils motive. Yes I like that you are saying about depriving those in need, but is it saying go naked in a snowstorm for a stranger? I understand the two correlated scriptures to be making distinctions about being wronged either by lawsuit or by manipulation as the previous verses in Luke say "despitefully use you". Both demonstrate some degree of relationship prior to offense... as opposed to being "mugged or robbed"... which are acts of violence against the person vs... against the pride... make sense?
Also...Id like to add we only have 2 cheeks LOL

The left hand was only used for unclean purposes and there was a penalty of ten days penance for using your left hand. So if someone struck you on the cheek they used their right hand which would land on your left cheek, so if you turned the other cheek so that your right cheek was facing them, they couldn't hit you.

 

[iog]

Again... WHere does it suggest that Job did not ALREADY own weapons??? and since Job's entire family was wiped out by a Tornado...how would an act of nature compel a person to get a new spear or bow????? Is it likely that Satan used a natural disaster of great size because had Job been attacked by animals or people... he would have taken up arms and possibly won based purely on his SKILL??? Thus demonstrating that Job served GOD because he LOVED him... not for the benefit of the hedge because had that happened the hedge clearly was NOT NEEDED???

Yea you are correct job family was killed by nature

My fault job servant ate his family also but I guess you would not know this

So his servants were killed

Job 1:13-15,17 (KJV)
And there was a day when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother's house: [14] And there came a messenger unto Job, and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them: [15] And the Sabeans fell upon them , and took them away; yea, they have slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee. [17] While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands, and fell upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.

Yet job did not take up arm

Copy and paste works especially when the bible don't need to be interpreted but it need to be read

 

[iog]

Why are the police protecting themselves, you are saying that our tax dollar go to the p

 

[iog]

Matthew 5:9 (KJV)
Blessed are the peacemakers: for they shall be called the children of God.

It don't say blessed are the weapon owners

 

[BarlyGurl]

Yea you are correct job family was killed by nature

My fault job servant ate his family also but I guess you would not know this
Job 1:13-15,17 (KJV)
And there was a day when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother's house: [14] And there came a messenger unto Job, and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them: [15] And the Sabeans fell upon them , and took them away; yea, they have slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee. [17] While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands, and fell upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.

Please DO give us a bible study to help us better understand the scriptures you have indicated...

 

[iog]

Correction job servants are part of his family

 

[iog]

Yea you are correct job family was killed by nature

My fault job servant ate his family also but I guess you would not know this
Job 1:13-15,17 (KJV)
And there was a day when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother's house: [14] And there came a messenger unto Job, and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them: [15] And the Sabeans fell upon them , and took them away; yea, they have slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee. [17] While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands, and fell upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.

Please DO give us a bible study to help us better understand the scriptures you have indicated...

Satan asked Jesus to take away the hedges around Job

Job 1:8-10 (KJV)
And the Lord said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil? [9] Then Satan answered the Lord , and said, Doth Job fear God for nought? [10] Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.

 

[iog]

The Lord removed the hedges and gave satan access to Jobs family, servants and possessions

Job 1:11-12 (KJV)
But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face. [12] And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the Lord .

 

[iog]

Job 1:13-15 (KJV)
And there was a day when his sons and his daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother's house: [14] And there came a messenger unto Job, and said, The oxen were plowing, and the asses feeding beside them: [15] And the Sabeans fell upon them , and took them away; yea, they have slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.

Job servants and possession were killed

 

[iog]

Job 1:17 (KJV)
While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The Chaldeans made out three bands, and fell upon the camels, and have carried them away, yea, and slain the servants with the edge of the sword; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.

All because The Lord removed the hedges around Job

 

[iog]

What else did satan do to Job when the hedges were gone

Job 1:16,18-19 (KJV)
While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, The fire of God is fallen from heaven, and hath burned up the sheep, and the servants, and consumed them; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee. [18] While he was yet speaking, there came also another, and said, Thy sons and thy daughters were eating and drinking wine in their eldest brother's house: [19] And, behold, there came a great wind from the wilderness, and smote the four corners of the house, and it fell upon the young men, and they are dead; and I only am escaped alone to tell thee.