God or Guns?

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.
G

GRA

Guest
I 'really and truly' understand both sides of this issue.

I believe that the answer lies somewhere between the extremes.


I resist, refute, and rebuke - the following ideas / notions that seem to be coming across in some of the posts in this thread:

~ "It is clearly impossible for a gun to actually be used for any purpose other than to kill."

If you have to ask 'What other purpose is there?' - then, there is "a great deal" about the world that you do not understand...


~ "It is clearly factual that owning a gun will inevitably cause you to become a criminal / killer."

Otherwise, you would have agreed that it is actually possible to own a gun "all your life" - and never use it to hurt anyone...

~ "It is clearly evident that any 'average' / 'common' American citizen who owns a gun is very dangerous."

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: ** shakes head ** :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Some people have been very successfully 'brainwashed'...
:( :(

"No, it is not the gun owners..."

Yes - the day will come when we should "accept our fate" and not resist it - but instead, let it glorify God.

And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death. ~ Revelation 12:11

And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. If any man have an ear, let him hear. He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. ~ Revelation 13:7-10

The phrase "he that killeth with the sword" is not talking about self-defense - it is talking about premeditated aggressive action. Also, remember the context...

The phrase "the patience and the faith of the saints" is talking about the saints not becoming "aggressive" - but instead, remaining "as a lamb to the slaughter" - thus, allowing God to use them to glorify Himself.

Yes - it is instructing us to not take any "premeditated aggressive action" against anyone else. However, remember the context...

The phrase "it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them" clearly implies 'fighting' (even if short-lived).

However, until such a time as is necessary to do otherwise - we are to do what we are able where we are able - in the voting booth or on the battlefield (choosing the best possible option available, of course) - to "preserve the day" - for the sake of those who may benefit from it - and "with patience allow God to accomplish His will according to His timing"...

I do not believe that God wants anyone to not defend themselves in a scenario such as a thief breaking into their home...

Like I said above:

I believe that the answer lies somewhere between the extremes.

For the sake of "peace" in this thread - let every person:

~ judge by their own convictions and circumstances as to whether they should own / have / use a gun
~ apply whatever knowledge and understanding that they possess according to the measure of faith which they possess
~ dedicate themselves and their gun(s) to be servants of the Most High God


:)

.
 
P

peterT

Guest
Christians are getting mixed up, or mixing up themselves with this world.

The second amendment is a part of the system of man, man’s government, NOT Gods government.

The second amendment is for the unbelievers the people of this world, and we are not of this world but seek one to come how’s builder and maker is God.

Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

Are we nationalists and defending country’s that are dens of iniquity or are we supposed to be separate?

2 Corinthians 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
 
G

Graybeard

Guest
Originally Posted by BarlyGurl

the thread is about "Guns or/and GOD". Regarding fully automatic guns... I don't see any reason for how many bullets or how fast they shoot to be worth arguing about... a gun is a gun. Further... I am entirely unaware of any nuclear powered guns available... so nukes are kinda moot too.
I thought your second commandment, I mean amendment says "the right to bear arms"....which does not only refer to guns...
 
G

GRA

Guest
Christians are getting mixed up, or mixing up themselves with this world.

The second amendment is a part of the system of man, man’s government, NOT Gods government.

The second amendment is for the unbelievers the people of this world, and we are not of this world but seek one to come how’s builder and maker is God.

Romans 12:2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.

Are we nationalists and defending country’s that are dens of iniquity or are we supposed to be separate?

2 Corinthians 6:17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
In terms of 'chronology' - I was a citizen of my country first, and a Christian second.

In terms of 'priority' - I am a Christian first, and a citizen of my country second.

Nonetheless, I am still - both a Christian and a citizen of my country.

In terms of the 'spiritual' - this world is not my home.

In terms of the 'physical' - this world is my home.

Do not confuse the physical and the spiritual.

We should not be "of the world" (spiritually); however, we still have to live "in the world" (physically).

The fact that I live "in the world" does not make me 'worldly'.

As long as we live "in the world", we may be citizens...

The second amendment is for anyone who is a citizen of my country - believer or not.

:)

.
 
G

GRA

Guest
I thought your second commandment, I mean amendment says "the right to bear arms"....which does not only refer to guns...
The only correct definition of 'arms' is what it was considered to be by the people who wrote it at the time they wrote it. However, if I were to "extrapolate" from my understanding of the word as it was defined back then - into the broadest technically-correct modern-day-language definition - it would probably be something like:

"Any weapon designed to be carried, handled, and operated by a person for the purpose of defense."

and would include (not an exhaustive list):

~ knife
~ sword
~ spear
~ bow; crossbow
~ pistol
~ rifle
~ shotgun
~ bazooka
~ tazer (electronic shock device)
~ phaser (think Star Trek)

It would not include a tank or a nuclear missile.

.
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
Proverbs 16:4 (KJV)
The Lord hath made all things for himself: yea, even the wicked for the day of evil.
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
Proverbs 21:1 (KJV)
The king's heart is in the hand of the Lord , as the rivers of water: he turneth it whithersoever he will.

If the king says the guns must go , who put the thought there?

So who is he that is mad at the king or are you mad at The Lord
 
Sep 8, 2012
4,367
59
0
What idiocy.
It's hard to argue with.
America doesn't have a king.
So by your logic God put it in Hitler's heart to extinguish the Jewish race?
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
They know all about those verses. (and more... ;) )

That is why they are dedicated to preserving a free society originally built on peace and love - to maintain that cherished freedom - so that their children and others will have a greater opportunity to learn about Jesus.

:)

.
Free to whom?

2 Peter 2:18-19 (KJV)
For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error. [19] While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.

Psalm 116:10-11 (KJV)
I believed, therefore have I spoken: I was greatly afflicted: [11] I said in my haste, All men are liars.

Who is actually free an all men are liars
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
What idiocy.
It's hard to argue with.
America doesn't have a king.
So by your logic God put it in Hitler's heart to extinguish the Jewish race?
Why are you here it's obvious this topic is above your understanding
 

zone

Senior Member
Jun 13, 2010
27,214
164
63
Why are you here it's obvious this topic is above your understanding
i see you are married.
if a deranged murderer-rapist broke in and took hold of your wife, and there were a variety of things at hand to stop him by any means necessary - would you?
or would you allow him to have his way?
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
America has a king and he has been called the president

Stop being rockets scientist and humble yourself to the word of God
 
Sep 8, 2012
4,367
59
0
Why are you here it's obvious this topic is above your understanding
America is a republic.
At least I understand that.
Perhaps the depth of this topic has surpassed your understanding.....
 
Sep 8, 2012
4,367
59
0
America has a king and he has been called the president

Stop being rockets scientist and humble yourself to the word of God
You need to learn to read.
You know nothing about how America or it's three branches of government operate.
....You don't have to be a 'rocket scientist' to know that.
(Just able to cogitate the meanings of words strung together into a sentence.)
And then a paragraph.
And then a complex thought.
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
i see you are married.
if a deranged murderer-rapist broke in and took hold of your wife, and there were a variety of things at hand to stop him by any means necessary - would you?
or would you allow him to have his way?
Faith

It's not gonna happen because I serve The Lord and if The Lord wants to try me like he did Job what am I to do except do as Job did Take it like a servant of God should

Watch this

Psalm 34:7 (KJV)
The angel of the Lord encampeth round about them that fear him, and delivereth them.


Why is evil coming to your house in the first place

Amos 3:6 (KJV)
Shall a trumpet be blown in the city, and the people not be afraid? shall there be evil in a city, and the Lord hath not done it ?

Did you or your family make The Lord angry?

Now lets me ask you with your weapon or gun and 5 men come after your family in your house what are you gonna do?
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
You need to learn to read.
You know nothing about how America or it's three branches of government operate.
....You don't have to be a 'rocket scientist' to know that.
(Just able to cogitate the meanings of words strung together into a sentence.)
And then a paragraph.
And then a complex thought.
I know God set up kingdom as I shown as he remove kingdoms as I shown

I know all you put is your idle opinion

I know the next world empire or of the west will not be the United States but the European Union
 
Sep 8, 2012
4,367
59
0
What patent nonsense!
So those killed for their faith didn't have faith?
You construct a higher status of yourself than what is there.
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
America is a republic.
At least I understand that.
Perhaps the depth of this topic has surpassed your understanding.....
America covers the whole Western Hemisphere

The United States is as Egypt , Babylon, Greece and Rome were and is A Kingdom!

The Lord calls it nations or kingdoms

Republic is something man added!

Find republic in the bible!
 

iog

Banned
Jan 4, 2013
554
0
0
What patent nonsense!
So those killed for their faith didn't have faith?
You construct a higher status of yourself than what is there.
What faith are you being killed for ?

The word of God or to own your firearm?

Will you be killed for the ne of Jesus or smith and Wesson


Give me a break and post somewhere else