Gods Standard of Righteousness

  • Christian Chat is a moderated online Christian community allowing Christians around the world to fellowship with each other in real time chat via webcam, voice, and text, with the Christian Chat app. You can also start or participate in a Bible-based discussion here in the Christian Chat Forums, where members can also share with each other their own videos, pictures, or favorite Christian music.

    If you are a Christian and need encouragement and fellowship, we're here for you! If you are not a Christian but interested in knowing more about Jesus our Lord, you're also welcome! Want to know what the Bible says, and how you can apply it to your life? Join us!

    To make new Christian friends now around the world, click here to join Christian Chat.

justbyfaith

Well-known member
Sep 16, 2021
4,707
462
83
Jesus never sent Moses law into all nations he sent his word into all nations just what he said

“Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭28:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬
What did Jesus command us in Matthew 5:17-20?

Did He not say that we will be called great in the kingdom if we obey and teach the least of the commandments found in the Old Testament law?
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
The law of sin and death is the ten commands my friend/
The Lord wrote the law in our hearts, Jer. 31; 33 “This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time,” declares the LORD. “I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.

Do you think this is sin and death God put in our hearts?
 

justbyfaith

Well-known member
Sep 16, 2021
4,707
462
83
Thier law isn’t our law thier mediator isn’t our mediator the disposition of angels have zero to do with the gospel and everything to do with the law.

Jesus word is what needs to be on the heart Moses word won’t help
Hebrews 8:8-10 and 10:16 is related from the prophecy of Jeremiah; who is obviously referring to the law of Moses in his prophecy (Jeremiah 31:33).

It is the law of Moses that the world (including Gentiles) will be judged by and found guilty over (Romans 3:19-20).

All of it (Galatians 3:10, James 2:10, Matthew 5:48).
 

justbyfaith

Well-known member
Sep 16, 2021
4,707
462
83
The law of sin and death is the ten commands my friend/
Nope. It is what is found in the immediate context of Romans 8:2 where it is mentioned.

It is what is spoken of in Romans 7:14-25.

That is the bottom line.

If you reject this, you will be stuck in Romans 7:14-25 for the rest of your life and will never graduate into a Romans 8 lifestyle.

You may even be saved in that...

However, if I were you, I would not bet on it.
 
S

SophieT

Guest
Yes, your response is a popular one.
absolutely no idea what it is you are trying to say here

but I am pretty sure that you think you are somehow trying to say something negative
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
absolutely no idea what it is you are trying to say here

but I am pretty sure that you think you are somehow trying to say something negative
Anger is what I'm talking about! We see the anger of the Law/Grace issue in the book of Acts and Paul's letters.

It comes from the lack of understanding and rages in the hearts of man.
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
The law of sin and death is the ten commands my friend
This is correct. Every violating of any commandment is a death sentence, since "The soul that sinneth, it shall die". We even see the death sentence prescribed for many sins within the Law of Moses in accordance with this Law.
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
This is correct. Every violating of any commandment is a death sentence, since "The soul that sinneth, it shall die". We even see the death sentence prescribed for many sins within the Law of Moses in accordance with this Law.
The Ten Commandments are perfection! It's not being able to keep them that brings forth death, not the Commandments themselves.

Paul said that the Letter (the 10) brings forth death, (the curse). This is has nothing to do with the actual perfect Commandments, but the keeping of them that we can't do that brings forth death.
 
S

SophieT

Guest
Anger is what I'm talking about! We see the anger of the Law/Grace issue in the book of Acts and Paul's letters.

It comes from the lack of understanding and rages in the hearts of man.
yeah ok

I don't see that, but y'all feel free to get as angry as you want :rolleyes: :giggle:
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
yeah ok

I don't see that, but y'all feel free to get as angry as you want :rolleyes::giggle:
I admit my anger takes the better of me at times, I have to withdraw myself when I catch that happening.

Sometimes I don't catch that soon enough as many can probably say the same.

We are all a work in progress and fall short of our intensions from time to time.
 

Blik

Senior Member
Dec 6, 2016
7,312
2,428
113
This is correct. Every violating of any commandment is a death sentence, since "The soul that sinneth, it shall die". We even see the death sentence prescribed for many sins within the Law of Moses in accordance with this Law.
The moment Adam and Eve brought in death in our world, God immediately devised a way to take that death sentence away. God gave blood on the altar for our sins as Lev. 17:11 tells us.

For over 4,000 years of the earth, even the prophecy of Christ was so powerful that saints were preserved until Christ was cruicified. Please read the four gospels, it tells you all about salvation from the death sentence.
 

Pilgrimshope

Well-known member
Sep 2, 2020
13,947
5,648
113
What did Jesus command us in Matthew 5:17-20?

Did He not say that we will be called great in the kingdom if we obey and teach the least of the commandments found in the Old Testament law?
nope he told Jews that were born under the law that , because they had already been circumcised according to Moses law ( not it’s origin , but adopted by the law is circumcision as a sign that you have to obey all of it , that’s why he said that to them they were beholden to the law , born of the flesh Israelites he also told them to obey the preists scribes and Pharisees not our priesthood to obey but it was there’s until Jesus died.

“Saying, The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat: All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.”
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭23:2-3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

certainly you don’t think you have leviticle priests also do you ? And a temple for all the ordinances demanded by Moses law ?

“For the priesthood being changed, there is made of necessity a change also of the law.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭7:12‬ ‭KJV‬‬

your I don’t think understanding what I’m telling you everything changed from the Passover to the sin sacrifice , to the priesthood , to the ordination , to the mediator , to the law giver himself no longer Moses but rather Christ Jesus his words are the words Moses words arent Christian doctrine

he was meant to bring Israel to the promised land , his law was to be implemented in the promised land of Israel it would bless the land and they would eventually rule the earth or curse the earth by thier transgression we know what they did , thats what we’re being saved from through Christ and his testament

the trings Moses said are for sinners not children of God but those scriptures bounce right off of you plain ones like the apostles all gathering together and saying plainly we do not preach Moses law telling people they have to obey it and then saying plainly these three things from the law observe

but it’s like you know better to an what’s written and spoken by the foundations of Christianity watch

This is the apostles gathering to conclude what we’re talking about can you acknolwedge this ?

I recommend the whole chapter but


…But there rose up certain of the sect of the Pharisees which believed, saying, That it was needful to circumcise them, and to command them to keep the law of Moses.

And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.

And when there had been much disputing, ( like we’re doing ) Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us; And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith . ( Romans 10:17)

Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

Forasmuch as we have heard, that certain which went out from us have troubled you with words, subverting your souls, saying, Ye must be circumcised, and keep the law: to whom we gave no such commandment:

It seemed good unto us, being assembled with one accord, to send chosen men unto you with our beloved Barnabas and Paul, Men that have hazarded their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭15:1, 5-11, 24-26‬ ‭KJV‬‬

the only theee elements of Moses law approved by the apostles are the ones they specifically name on the letter

“Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God:

But that we write unto them, that they abstain from

pollutions of idols,

and from fornication,

and from things strangled, and from blood.”
‭‭Acts‬ ‭15:19-20‬ ‭KJV‬‬

You are talking about people like Peter , paul and the original church who were all under the law until Jesus died and rose now they are explaining it’s a yoke and burden to believers it’s not something we tell people they need to obey it’s not our doctrine it actually subverts a persons soul and weighs them down with a burden that no
One could ever carry that’s why he took it away and gave us the truth from heaven that can redeem us instead of condemn us

can you read acts 15 the whole chapter and accept it ? It’s just plain as day no matter what translation one uses it sort of settles the debate we’re having hen we could go further and maybe edify one another because you have a lot of understanding but also your not hearing what’s there out this subject so do this for me as a brother

read acts fifteen and see if we don’t find better agreement
 

Nehemiah6

Senior Member
Jul 18, 2017
26,074
13,771
113
The Ten Commandments are perfection! It's not being able to keep them that brings forth death, not the Commandments themselves.
Exactly. But why death and what is death? There is an awful lot of confusion regarding the meaning of death and the second death. So in order to understand why the violation of God's commandments is a death sentence we need to understand the following:

1. God and Christ are absolutely holy and righteous. God is Light and in Him is no darkness at all. And Christ loves righteousness but hates iniquity.

2. Nothing sinful, evil, corrupt, polluted, or abominable can exist before God or enter into His presence. And because God is a righteous Judge, every violation of His laws requires a just sentence.

3. Therefore death is ultimately banishment from the presence of God into outer darkness, where Hell, the Lake of Fire is located. Just as the death penalty still applies for heinous crimes, the death penalty applies to every transgression of the Law.

4. However physical death must come first, so that the soul and spirit are separated from the body. The body eventually becomes dust within the grave, but souls and spirits separated from God must be banished to Hades (in the heart of the earth) unless they have been saved by grace through faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption.

5. But since there is a second death -- eternal separation from God because of sin -- these souls and spirits must await their final judgment at the Great White Throne.

6. At the same time, since God is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance, He now commands all men everywhere to repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. And those who obey the Gospel receive the gift of eternal life, instead of the death sentence.

7. The only way that this was possible was for Christ Himself to become our Substitute and take the full death penalty upon Himself at the cross. This penalty included both the first and second deaths as revealed in Isaiah 53 and other passages. And Christ paid that penalty in full and rose again the third day for our justification.
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
Exactly. But why death and what is death? There is an awful lot of confusion regarding the meaning of death and the second death. So in order to understand why the violation of God's commandments is a death sentence we need to understand the following:

1. God and Christ are absolutely holy and righteous. God is Light and in Him is no darkness at all. And Christ loves righteousness but hates iniquity.

2. Nothing sinful, evil, corrupt, polluted, or abominable can exist before God or enter into His presence. And because God is a righteous Judge, every violation of His laws requires a just sentence.

3. Therefore death is ultimately banishment from the presence of God into outer darkness, where Hell, the Lake of Fire is located. Just as the death penalty still applies for heinous crimes, the death penalty applies to every transgression of the Law.

4. However physical death must come first, so that the soul and spirit are separated from the body. The body eventually becomes dust within the grave, but souls and spirits separated from God must be banished to Hades (in the heart of the earth) unless they have been saved by grace through faith in Christ and His finished work of redemption.

5. But since there is a second death -- eternal separation from God because of sin -- these souls and spirits must await their final judgment at the Great White Throne.

6. At the same time, since God is not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance, He now commands all men everywhere to repent and believe on the Lord Jesus Christ. And those who obey the Gospel receive the gift of eternal life, instead of the death sentence.

7. The only way that this was possible was for Christ Himself to become our Substitute and take the full death penalty upon Himself at the cross. This penalty included both the first and second deaths as revealed in Isaiah 53 and other passages. And Christ paid that penalty in full and rose again the third day for our justification.
Yes, I agree with this totally!
 

soberxp

Senior Member
May 3, 2018
2,511
482
83
Gods Standard of Righteousness
GIVES LIFE
LIFE FROM LOVE OF GOD
SO ALL LAW IN ONE WORD LOVE
 

Charlie24

Well-known member
Oct 31, 2021
998
270
63
Gods Standard of Righteousness
GIVES LIFE
LIFE FROM LOVE OF GOD
SO ALL LAW IN ONE WORD LOVE
Yes, Jesus said the Law and prophets hang on the two Great Commandments.

"Love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, soul and mind.

Love thy neighbor as thyself."

These two Commandments are the foundation of all the Law, as well, it applies to present day Grace.
 

justbyfaith

Well-known member
Sep 16, 2021
4,707
462
83
This is correct. Every violating of any commandment is a death sentence, since "The soul that sinneth, it shall die". We even see the death sentence prescribed for many sins within the Law of Moses in accordance with this Law.
However, there is a blessing on those who look into the perfect law of liberty and continue in it (James 1:25).

And clearly, two of the ten commandments are included as being in the law of liberty in holy scripture (James 2:10-12).

And therefore, the ten commandments are the law of liberty.

While the law of sin and death (Romans 8:2) is what was spoken of in the immediate context (Romans 7:14-25).